Why is Auston Matthews considered a top 10 player?

[Hunter368]

I don't think so. OEL has been a fantastic player but there's just far too much competition for the Norris. Especially when the winners for the past 5 years are averaging an absurd 70 something odd points. OEL would've never put up remotely close numbers.

Contrary to popular belief being in TO as a good player doesn't win you personal accolades. Ask Phillip Kessel. He just got **** on for not doing more.

Kessel rightfully earned the reputation of elite or near elite offensive winger while playing with the Leafs......that's pretty good accolades. Yes he got critized for his defensive play....rightfully and like the other leaders/vets/good players received critism for not getting the team to the next level which is fair. Of course as I stated before bigger the media centre the highs & lows are exaggerated. At times Leafs players get far too much attn/accolades and at times the media is far too negative or goes too far in their critism. Both extremes are done knowingly to sell clicks/papers/story.

 

[Liferleafer]

If the Leafs & AM were as bad as the Sabres & Eichel yes they would get shredded in TO......this is what I agreed to above. If OEL played his career (not at this point perhaps) for the Leafs he would of won one or more Norris trophies already regardless of the team results.

Huh? This is not true at all. Do you know the last guy to win an individual award for Toronto before Matthews? I do, it was 2008, Sundin won the Messier. Here's another tidbit for you to prove your 'If he played in TO he would have won awards" fanrtasy. Before Matthews won his Calder...the last Leaf rookie to win was Brett Silby in 1966. Gilmour won the franchise's only Selke....the last winner of the Hart was Ted Kennedy in 1955....Molgilny won the Byng in 2003, before that, Keon in 1963...Bower and Sawchuck shared the Vezina in 1965....and that was with Leafs goalies dragging a bunch of geriatrics to the cup in 1967. To say anyone will win a trophy just because they play in TO is an absolute falacy.

 

[LeafFever]

If the Leafs & AM were as bad as the Sabres & Eichel yes they would get shredded in TO......this is what I agreed to above. If OEL played his career (not at this point perhaps) for the Leafs he would of won one or more Norris trophies already regardless of the team results.

This is complete nonsense. Until Matthews won the Calder last year the Leafs had the longest NHL drought of winning any major awards. (25 Years). Where do people come up with this stuff?
The Columbus Blue Jackets have won more major NHl awards than the Leafs since they entered the NHL.

 

[joe dirte]

Because Babcock is smarter than most and realizes that having one of the deepest offenses in the league and rolling that evenly allows him to exploit the majority of teams who do not have that luxury. What makes Pittsburgh so tough? It certainly isn't their D corps. It's rolling 3 lines that can kill you. What possible point is there in loading all the guns on one line to pad Matthews offensive stats? Isn't the goal to win? Haven't the Leafs done that more with Matthews than Edmonton has with McDavid? Isn't Matthews already more productive in the minutes he plays than McDavid, everywhere except on PP? It seems to be working wonders so far.

whyvdonyouvkeep saying except PP??? pastvi checked Matthews point per 60 is higher on the PP too.

 

[Hunter368]

Huh? This is not true at all. Do you know the last guy to win an individual award for Toronto before Matthews? I do, it was 2008, Sundin won the Messier. Here's another tidbit for you to prove your 'If he played in TO he would have won awards" fanrtasy. Before Matthews won his Calder...the last Leaf rookie to win was Brett Silby in 1966. Gilmour won the franchise's only Selke....the last winner of the Hart was Ted Kennedy in 1955....Molgilny won the Byng in 2003, before that, Keon in 1963...Bower and Sawchuck shared the Vezina in 1965....and that was with Leafs goalies dragging a bunch of geriatrics to the cup in 1967. To say anyone will win a trophy just because they play in TO is an absolute falacy.

Lifer,

Where did I say "anyone" will win a trophy as long as they play in TO? OEL has been over his career nothing short of a elite #1D.....he's no plug or average top 4 guy. The fact is if you play in a large media centre like TO (biggest hockey fan base in the NHL, only one close is Habs).....the players/team either get overhyped or over critized depending how the team is doing at the moment. In small media centres the players/team receive less hype and less critism regardless how the team does. That's just a reality of the media and media dollars......which of course just natural. So playing in small or large media centres both are double edged swords depending on your POV.

 

[Liferleafer]

Lifer,

Where did I say "anyone" will win a trophy as long as they play in TO? OEL has been over his career nothing short of a elite #1D.....he's no plug or average top 4 guy. The fact is if you play in a large media centre like TO (biggest hockey fan base in the NHL, only one close is Habs).....the players/team either get overhyped or over critized depending how the team is doing at the moment. In small media centres the players/team receive less hype and less critism regardless how the team does. That's just a reality of the media and media dollars......which of course just natural. So playing in small or large media centres both are double edged swords depending on your POV.

I won't argue that, but to say OEL would have a Norris as a Leaf is incorrect. The Norris is basically the defense version of the Richard...most points usually wins, unless you think Karlsson or Subban are defensive stalwards.

 

[96]

Lifer,

Where did I say "anyone" will win a trophy as long as they play in TO? OEL has been over his career nothing short of a elite #1D.....he's no plug or average top 4 guy. The fact is if you play in a large media centre like TO (biggest hockey fan base in the NHL, only one close is Habs).....the players/team either get overhyped or over critized depending how the team is doing at the moment. In small media centres the players/team receive less hype and less critism regardless how the team does. That's just a reality of the media and media dollars......which of course just natural. So playing in small or large media centres both are double edged swords depending on your POV.

Yep.

Just like Jay Bouwmeester and Keith Yandle were. Stop playing NHL 18 and watch the games, man.

 

[Hunter368]

I won't argue that, but to say OEL would have a Norris as a Leaf is incorrect. The Norris is basically the defense version of the Richard...most points usually wins, unless you think Karlsson or Subban are defensive stalwards.

Leafs (& many other teams) have never had a D as good as OEL over the period of his career. He’s been year after year in his career considered elite, easy top 10 and at times top 3-5. All of that while playing on a tire fire team and tiny hockey location. Place him on the Leafs or Habs in their huge media group (plus a much better teams over the years then Dogs).....it’s very possible he would of won one or more Norris trophies due to the combo of better teams and huge media exposure/hype.

 

[Panthaz89]

Matthews Points /60 is 3.24
McDavid Points/ 60 3.16

Matthews Point Shares (to team): 4.9 (In 9 less games played)
McDavid Point Shares (to team): 5.0


McDavid has PK time 53 minutes so far and he has 3 points. Matthews has had 1 minute on PK with 0 points.

Matthews Points/ 60 without PK: 3.25
McDavid Points/ 60 without PK: 3.15

McDavid has 127 minutes of PP time with 10 points so far. Matthews has 73 minutes of PP time with 6 points.

Matthews Points/ 60 at Even Strength: 3.01
McDavid Points/ 60 at Even Strength: 2.86

Matthews was dominating McDavid in Points/ 60 production before his injuries, tho it was a 16 game sample for both fellas.

Lol that argument is beyond stupid playing all those minutes doesn't mean more points.......if you play more than 18 minutes or more a game that doesn't magically make you get more points otherwise defenseman could easily be leading scorers. Most of the time that means those players have to deal with fatigue throughout the game and makes their points per minute look a lot worse I'm not sure how you can construe that so badly or not understand this. If anything 18-20 minutes is the best possible amount of time you can have for a forward to get their best points otherwise they are fatigued game to game and can't play effectively to get those points.

 

[joe dirte]

Lol that argument is beyond stupid playing all those minutes doesn't mean more points.......if you play more than 18 minutes or more a game that doesn't magically make you get more points otherwise defenseman could easily be leading scorers. Most of the time that means those players have to deal with fatigue throughout the game and makes their points per minute look a lot worse I'm not sure how you can construe that so badly or not understand this. If anything 18-20 minutes is the best possible amount of time you can have for a forward to get their best points otherwise they are fatigued game to game and can't play effectively to get those points.

so you're claiming there is no correlation between ice time and points???

and really, comparing dmen to forwards in that regard is obviously silly. you should be ashamed for posting that.

 

[Panthaz89]

so you're claiming there is no correlation between ice time and points???

and really, comparing dmen to forwards in that regard is obviously silly. you should be ashamed for posting that.

No there isn't when you already play 18 minutes a game that is enough...you don't see any if at all a change in points for players who play 18 or 20 for forwards. If someone is overplayed one game they aren't rested well enough for the next game especially when it comes to back to backs. Players are not robots.

 

[authentic]

Matthews Points /60 is 3.24
McDavid Points/ 60 3.16

Matthews Point Shares (to team): 4.9 (In 9 less games played)
McDavid Point Shares (to team): 5.0


McDavid has PK time 53 minutes so far and he has 3 points. Matthews has had 1 minute on PK with 0 points.

Matthews Points/ 60 without PK: 3.25
McDavid Points/ 60 without PK: 3.15

McDavid has 127 minutes of PP time with 10 points so far. Matthews has 73 minutes of PP time with 6 points.

Matthews Points/ 60 at Even Strength: 3.01
McDavid Points/ 60 at Even Strength: 2.86

Matthews was dominating McDavid in Points/ 60 production before his injuries, tho it was a 16 game sample for both fellas.

How dare you bring so much context into player analysis.

 

[authentic]

Lol that argument is beyond stupid playing all those minutes doesn't mean more points.......if you play more than 18 minutes or more a game that doesn't magically make you get more points otherwise defenseman could easily be leading scorers. Most of the time that means those players have to deal with fatigue throughout the game and makes their points per minute look a lot worse I'm not sure how you can construe that so badly or not understand this. If anything 18-20 minutes is the best possible amount of time you can have for a forward to get their best points otherwise they are fatigued game to game and can't play effectively to get those points.

Lol.

 

[joe dirte]

No there isn't when you already play 18 minutes a game that is enough...you don't see any if at all a change in points for players who play 18 or 20 for forwards. If someone is overplayed one game they aren't rested well enough for the next game especially when it comes to back to backs. Players are not robots.

right. I have nothing more to say to you.

 

[bionic]

No there isn't when you already play 18 minutes a game that is enough...you don't see any if at all a change in points for players who play 18 or 20 for forwards. If someone is overplayed one game they aren't rested well enough for the next game especially when it comes to back to backs. Players are not robots.

The more minutes you play the more chances you have to score. It's really not that hard to comprehend. When I read your post I seriously wasn't sure if you were joking or not.

 

[bionic]

No there isn't when you already play 18 minutes a game that is enough...you don't see any if at all a change in points for players who play 18 or 20 for forwards. If someone is overplayed one game they aren't rested well enough for the next game especially when it comes to back to backs. Players are not robots.

The more minutes you play the more chances you have to score. It's really not that hard to comprehend. When I read your post I seriously wasn't sure if you were joking or not.

 

[Sypher04]

No there isn't when you already play 18 minutes a game that is enough...you don't see any if at all a change in points for players who play 18 or 20 for forwards. If someone is overplayed one game they aren't rested well enough for the next game especially when it comes to back to backs. Players are not robots.

For point producers like McDavid and Matthews a couple extra minutes of ice time can absolutely make a difference.

 

[McDavidCrushedLarkin]

The more minutes you play the more chances you have to score.

Or more chances not to score. Some players handle the extra minutes better than others.

 

[Panthaz89]

The more minutes you play the more chances you have to score. It's really not that hard to comprehend. When I read your post I seriously wasn't sure if you were joking or not.

Ok its quite clear that neither of you guys understand that humans get tired and it affects them game to game treat the players like robots its why coaches usually tend to only give guys 20 minutes max at even strength not counting OT games and why b2bs hurt a team so much. You aren't going to get anything but a minus for letting a player sit on the ice for an extra minute tired. If a coach lets someone play an extra minute that typically means they can actually handle it, if anything that means Babcock knows Matthews isn't going to play well with another minute

 

[authentic]

Ok its quite clear that neither of you guys understand that humans get tired and it affects them game to game treat the players like robots its why coaches usually tend to only give guys 20 minutes max not counting OT games and why b2bs hurt a team so much. You aren't going to get anything but a minus for letting a player sit on the ice for an extra minute tired.

Lol yeah an extra minute and a half would just kill Auston pro athlete Matthews eh.

 

[96]

Or more chances not to score. Some players handle the extra minutes better than others.

Is it really handling the extra minutes better if you're still losing? I guess the guy that gets more minutes doesn't have the ability to dictate the result of the game, because he's given every chance to succeed and his team is still generationally terrible.

 

[nobody]

Lol that argument is beyond stupid playing all those minutes doesn't mean more points.......if you play more than 18 minutes or more a game that doesn't magically make you get more points otherwise defenseman could easily be leading scorers. Most of the time that means those players have to deal with fatigue throughout the game and makes their points per minute look a lot worse I'm not sure how you can construe that so badly or not understand this. If anything 18-20 minutes is the best possible amount of time you can have for a forward to get their best points otherwise they are fatigued game to game and can't play effectively to get those points.

Yeahhhhh, no. McDavid played 10 seconds less last season compared to so far this year and put up 100 points. I don't think I'm going to buy your argument. Sorry.

 

[Panthaz89]

Is it really handling the extra minutes better if you're still losing? I guess the guy that gets more minutes doesn't have the ability to dictate the result of the game, because he's given every chance to succeed and his team is still generationally terrible.

A team isn't made up of one player....the Leafs were winning with Matthews playing 0 minutes(when he was injured) more than the Oilers.

 

[The Grim Reaper]

Is it really handling the extra minutes better if you're still losing? I guess the guy that gets more minutes doesn't have the ability to dictate the result of the game, because he's given every chance to succeed and his team is still generationally terrible.

Crosby led the Penguins to dead last place his rookie season. Some teams are just bad, and not a reflection of any one player.

 

[nobody]

Ok its quite clear that neither of you guys understand that humans get tired and it affects them game to game treat the players like robots its why coaches usually tend to only give guys 20 minutes max at even strength not counting OT games and why b2bs hurt a team so much. You aren't going to get anything but a minus for letting a player sit on the ice for an extra minute tired. If a coach lets someone play an extra minute that typically means they can actually handle it, if anything that means Babcock knows Matthews isn't going to play well with another minute

I like the way you spin. Are you free to DJ my party next weekend?