Why is Auston Matthews considered a top 10 player?

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joe dirte

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Lol Barkov. Woopty ****in doo. I've seen Barkovs statement used to justify Matthews generational status plenty, newsflash for you guys' when the entire league votes him as MVP, you know, like the Hart trophy McDavid won, then you have an argument.
hahaha.

your posts are absurd. "angry over losing the mcdavid draft",. what???? the leafs weren't close enough to the bottom to be in contention for that (hilarious that Jack attack the sabres fan likes that post). then you talk about leafs fans saying he is the greatest of all time. its oiler fans that lose their marbles when its said that mcdavid isnt all that much better than Matthews (which is true). they even sunk as low as trying "Matthews is closer to draisaitl than he is to mcdavid". lol.

this is very clearly a salty oilers fan that their team is garbage and Matthews has some parts to his game (like goal scoring and defensive play) that are better than mcdavids is and ever will be.
 
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TheNumber4

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hahaha.

your posts are absurd. "angry over losing the mcdavid draft",. what???? the leafs weren't close enough to the bottom to be in contention for that (hilarious that Jack attack the sabres fan likes that post). then you talk about leafs fans saying he is the greatest of all time. its oiler fans that lose their marbles when its said that mcdavid isnt all that much better than Matthews (which is true). they even sunk as low as trying "Matthews is closer to draisaitl than he is to mcdavid". lol.

this is very clearly a salty oilers fan that their team is garbage and Matthews has some parts to his game (like goal scoring and defensive play) that are better than mcdavids is and ever will be.

Lol. Leafs fans always with the lies to make their posts make sense. Leafs were 4th worst that year, and had the 4th best chance of getting McDavid, and had a worse chance of getting McDavid than the Oilers. That didn't stop them from crying tears en masse when their expectations of getting McDavid was shattered by logic and sheer odds. But knowing all that you are probably still going to lie and say "Leafs don't care about not getting McDavid" so I'll present you a video proof of the tears and disappointment to remind you of the pain:

And this same pissed off reaction was seen and read all over Hfboards at the time. So don't try and act like leafs fans weren't salty over it and still are.

The fact is, and you admit McDavid is better than Matthews (and so is about 15 other players in the league). But leafs fans salt-based narrative was that he was equal or better and every non homer fan knows that not to be true.

You can try all you want to make this about the Oilers and their season this year, fact is, the Oilers fan base and every other non-Leaf fan base was calling out this fake narrative last year when the narrative was at its peak starting with the draft, intensifiying with Matthews four goal game, and only now it's died off because it's looking more and more ridiculous and embarrassing to compare a player that can barely crack top 20 in league scoring to the reigning Hart, Art Ross, and Ted Lyndsay winner.
 
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joe dirte

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Lol. Leafs fans always with the lies to make their posts make sense. Leafs were 4th worst that year, and had the 4th best chance of getting McDavid, and had a worse chance of getting McDavid than the Oilers. That didn't stop them from crying tears en masse when their expectations of getting McDavid was shattered by logic and sheer odds. But knowing all that you are probably still going to lie and say "Leafs don't care about not getting McDavid" so I'll present you a video proof of the tears and disappointment to remind you of the pain:

And this same pissed off reaction was seen and read all over Hfboards at the time. So don't try and act like leafs fans weren't salty over it and still are.

The fact is, and you admit McDavid is better than Matthews (and so is about 15 other players in the league). But leafs fans salt-based narrative was that he was equal or better and every non homer fan knows that not to be true.

You can try all you want to make this about the Oilers and their season this year, fact is, the Oilers fan base and every other non-Leaf fan base was calling out this fake narrative last year when the narrative was at its peak starting with the draft, intensifiying with Matthews four goal game, and only now it's died off because it's looking more and more ridiculous and embarrassing to compare a player that can barely crack top 20 in league scoring to the reigning Hart, Art Ross, and Ted Lyndsay winner.


leaf fans never really expected mcdavid.

and why would we be salty? weve got a player not too far behind, and we are a WAY better team.
 
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BrannigansLaw

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Lol. Leafs fans always with the lies to make their posts make sense. Leafs were 4th worst that year, and had the 4th best chance of getting McDavid, and had a worse chance of getting McDavid than the Oilers. That didn't stop them from crying tears en masse when their expectations of getting McDavid was shattered by logic and sheer odds. But knowing all that you are probably still going to lie and say "Leafs don't care about not getting McDavid" so I'll present you a video proof of the tears and disappointment to remind you of the pain:

And this same pissed off reaction was seen and read all over Hfboards at the time. So don't try and act like leafs fans weren't salty over it and still are.

The fact is, and you admit McDavid is better than Matthews (and so is about 15 other players in the league). But leafs fans salt-based narrative was that he was equal or better and every non homer fan knows that not to be true.

You can try all you want to make this about the Oilers and their season this year, fact is, the Oilers fan base and every other non-Leaf fan base was calling out this fake narrative last year when the narrative was at its peak starting with the draft, intensifiying with Matthews four goal game, and only now it's died off because it's looking more and more ridiculous and embarrassing to compare a player that can barely crack top 20 in league scoring to the reigning Hart, Art Ross, and Ted Lyndsay winner.


If only we had generational McDavid, we could be sitting outside a playoff spot gearing up for the draft lotto as is tradition in Edmonton
 

TheNumber4

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leaf fans never really expected mcdavid.

and why would we be salty? weve got a player not too far behind, and we are a WAY better team.

Oh okay. So as predicted, continue to lie to make your point. LOL. I guess those leafs fans crying in that video and on Hfboards didn't really happen.

And lol at "not too far behind," maybe that's how it is in Leafs fans heads but it's not the case when you look at something objective likes stats, awards, and the scoring leaders chart.
 

TheNumber4

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If only we had generational McDavid, we could be sitting outside a playoff spot gearing up for the draft lotto as is tradition in Edmonton

You know how I know Leafs fans have given up on the ridiculous and embarrassing narrative that Matthews is better than McDavid, they deflect to talk about the Oilers season instead of actually talking about the subject of this thread: Matthews top 30 status in the league.
 

Nizdizzle

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Oh okay. So as predicted, continue to lie to make your point. LOL. I guess those leafs fans crying in that video and on Hfboards didn't really happen.

And lol at "not too far behind," maybe that's how it is in Leafs fans heads but it's not the case when you look at something objective likes stats, awards, and the scoring leaders chart.
A bunch of young kids recorded that video on purpose, of course they are going to make sure to have an over the top reaction. Do you think everything on Netflix is real life as well? I'm always surprised how amazingly naïve some folks can be.
 

Liferleafer

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You know how I know Leafs fans have given up on the ridiculous and embarrassing narrative that Matthews is better than McDavid, they deflect to talk about the Oilers season instead of actually talking about the subject of this thread: Matthews top 30 status in the league.
The subject of this thread, Ok, Matthews scored last night giving him 32 points in 32 games....a better pace than his rookie season....all while playing games post concussion as well as post ankle injury....not bad right?

Tbe reason we may not be talking about the theme of this thread is because the intent of it is quite clear. The reason some bring up the Oilers is because it's an Oilers fan who started this stupid thread.
 

joe dirte

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Oh okay. So as predicted, continue to lie to make your point. LOL. I guess those leafs fans crying in that video and on Hfboards didn't really happen.

And lol at "not too far behind," maybe that's how it is in Leafs fans heads but it's not the case when you look at something objective likes stats, awards, and the scoring leaders chart.

as a whole, no, they never expected mxdavid. you thinking we all thought he was ours is your narrative.

and yes, not too far behind at all. there are some pretty important elements of the game that hes far better at.

there have been segments on hockey broadcasts where they've talked about there being times Matthews would make GMs think twice, and isn't really behind at all.

but see, you're proving my point from my first post. oilers fans get all worked up and start the whole "no where close! closer to draisaitl!!!" nonsense. oilers fans come across as seriously rattled these days over the leafs and matthews.
 

BlueBaron

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hahaha.

your posts are absurd. "angry over losing the mcdavid draft",. what???? the leafs weren't close enough to the bottom to be in contention for that (hilarious that Jack attack the sabres fan likes that post). then you talk about leafs fans saying he is the greatest of all time. its oiler fans that lose their marbles when its said that mcdavid isnt all that much better than Matthews (which is true). they even sunk as low as trying "Matthews is closer to draisaitl than he is to mcdavid". lol.

this is very clearly a salty oilers fan that their team is garbage and Matthews has some parts to his game (like goal scoring and defensive play) that are better than mcdavids is and ever will be.

you seem insecure. is it because it looks like even mcdavid can't save the oilers?

in fact looking at all the posts, this thread is FULL of salty oiler fans. "he's 53rd in scoring!!!!". lol.
Lol. Leafs fans always with the lies to make their posts make sense. Leafs were 4th worst that year, and had the 4th best chance of getting McDavid, and had a worse chance of getting McDavid than the Oilers. That didn't stop them from crying tears en masse when their expectations of getting McDavid was shattered by logic and sheer odds. But knowing all that you are probably still going to lie and say "Leafs don't care about not getting McDavid" so I'll present you a video proof of the tears and disappointment to remind you of the pain:

And this same pissed off reaction was seen and read all over Hfboards at the time. So don't try and act like leafs fans weren't salty over it and still are.

The fact is, and you admit McDavid is better than Matthews (and so is about 15 other players in the league). But leafs fans salt-based narrative was that he was equal or better and every non homer fan knows that not to be true.

You can try all you want to make this about the Oilers and their season this year, fact is, the Oilers fan base and every other non-Leaf fan base was calling out this fake narrative last year when the narrative was at its peak starting with the draft, intensifiying with Matthews four goal game, and only now it's died off because it's looking more and more ridiculous and embarrassing to compare a player that can barely crack top 20 in league scoring to the reigning Hart, Art Ross, and Ted Lyndsay winner.


You got us, those guys represent every single Leaf fan.

Your point is rather foolish, of course everyone wanted McDavid. That said after the lottery I did not see a lot of fuming over it, we talked about Strome,Hanifin and Marner.

The only people who think everyone is hung up on or out to get McDavid are a handful of paranoid Oiler fans which you appear to be one of.

A couple Leaf fans say he is equal or better. You know this is true but you are throwing integrity out the window in a feeble attempt to disparage a fan base you hate for some unknown reason. I hope it's worth it.
 

TheNumber4

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A bunch of young kids recorded that video on purpose, of course they are going to make sure to have an over the top reaction. Do you think everything on Netflix is real life as well? I'm always surprised how amazingly naïve some folks can be.

Lol so your argument essentially boils down to "don't beleive your lying eyes" haahaha. Well there's more than just that one video, YouTube has lots. But here, let me show you pages and pages and pages of leafs fans dreaming of McDavid, saying they'll tattoo the date on themselves if they get McDavid, trying to convince eachother how a big market like Toronto "deserves" McDavid, praying to GOD for McDavid, etc etc, then the thread devolves into pages of crying followed by more crying followed by more and more crying.

Was this thread a Netflix movie too?

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/threa...-7-30pm-edmonton-wins-mcdavid.1879337/page-40
 

joe dirte

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Lol so your argument essentially boils down to "don't beleive your lying eyes" haahaha. Well there's more than just that one video, YouTube has lots. But here, let me show you pages and pages and pages of leafs fans dreaming of McDavid, saying they'll tattoo the date on themselves if they get McDavid, trying to convince eachother how a big market like Toronto "deserves" McDavid, praying to GOD for McDavid, etc etc, then the thread devolves into pages of crying followed by more crying followed by more and more crying.

Was this thread a Netflix movie too?

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/threa...-7-30pm-edmonton-wins-mcdavid.1879337/page-40

I see a lot of posts there focusing not on the leafs not getting mcdavid, but pissed, and I quote "he's going to such a joke of an organization". the ire there was really about the fact that nobody believed the oilers deserved another number 1 puck that they would still fail to do a damn thing with.

its looking like they're right too.
 

Rants Mulliniks

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Oh okay. So as predicted, continue to lie to make your point. LOL. I guess those leafs fans crying in that video and on Hfboards didn't really happen.

And lol at "not too far behind," maybe that's how it is in Leafs fans heads but it's not the case when you look at something objective likes stats, awards, and the scoring leaders chart.

Oh it is objectivity you want.

OK first off it would be good if you learned that the Hart trophy is not awarded as follows: "newsflash for you guys' when the entire league votes him as MVP, you know, like the Hart trophy McDavid won". That's voted on by the Professional Hockey Writers' Association. If you want to play the champion of objectivity card, you should at least get your facts straight.

With that out of the way, let's delve. We are currently witnessing McDavid's third season and Matthews second. Their 82 game pace has them finishing with 91 and 82 points. A whole 9 point spread. I suppose in your mind that's a huge distance and must be all "in Leaf fans heads" despite that seeming like YOUR OPINION and flying quite directly in the face of the objectivity you so crave.

Now if we were talking some 20 or 30 point difference, there might be an argument to be made that it is too big of a gap to make up with other parts of your game but 9 points? The conversation sure gets a lot more interesting. There are a lot of numbers to go through where you will find Matthews comes out ahead and those are objective numbers but I am sure when brought up, you will toss them aside in favour of something non-objective.

See I have heard very few people attempt to portray Matthews as better but many who have said the separation between them is not that great. 9 points plus analysis of all the other factors would seem to OBJECTIVELY lean in their favour. What we do get around here is a lot of people throwing stuff out without the context. Like for instance the insistence on comparing Matthews rookie year to McDavid's sophomore one. That's inherently biased and avoids context like playing on an all rookie line and 7 rookie team. When you compare year to year, McDavid still had far more production in his rookie year, though again, context is important in noting he spent the year stapled to a player who was a top 5 scorer in the entire league over the previous half decade (not Hyman/Nylander/Brown). Then it will be "my god...trophies". OK. Comparing rookie years Matthews won one trophy and finished 4 goals short of a second one. McDavid? That's a little tongue in cheek in that I realize Connor would have won the Calder if not injured but objectively speaking, that's how it played out. I don't expect Matthews will rack up the Hart and such this year. I do expect he'll be in the running for it for years to come. If not for injury, his G/GP pace has him once again in the hunt for that trophy.

Another objective measure you won't like is team winning percentages since they both entered the league. For the Leafs it is .516 and for the Oilers .468. Of course the first thing you are going to do is run to "you can't penalize Connor because he plays on a worse team". Here's the thing. Matthews walked onto the last place team in the league....a team that featured 7 rookies, which is literally 1/3 of the entire team, and you would want to make the argument he walked into a better situation? Moreover, Leaf fans have been told ad nauseum that every single player or person in their organization is inferior to what Edmonton has. Somewhere along the line you guys - if you are being objective - need to reconcile that something is not right. Whether that is that maybe the total package Matthews brings really IS more important than just points or whether it is your assessment of many of the other players. Regardless, the OBJECTIVE results tell you you need to rethink your analysis. The alternative of course is to continue onward with your heads implanted up your posteriors.

Lastly is this business of "generational". Since you want to be the champion of objectivity, I would suggest you look at how the actual generational talents (Gretzky, Lemieux, Orr) stacked up versus their peers three years into the league. Note when examining goals, assists and points how big the percentage gaps was between them and their peers as well as the names of the others involved. Do this and you will quickly realize that OBJECTIVELY McDavid has no business being mentioned in the same breath as the generational ones. Not to date anyways. He hasn't created the gap and in many cases is behind guys that wouldn't come within miles of the generational ones.
 
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TheNumber4

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The subject of this thread, Ok, Matthews scored last night giving him 32 points in 32 games....a better pace than his rookie season....all while playing games post concussion as well as post ankle injury....not bad right?

Tbe reason we may not be talking about the theme of this thread is because the intent of it is quite clear. The reason some bring up the Oilers is because it's an Oilers fan who started this stupid thread.

Actually the subject of this thread is does Matthews deserve to be recognized as a top 10 player. With the stats that you have so kindly provided, if he keeps up his point per game pace he'll have proven the OP correct. Because point per game pace should put him right around 20th in league scoring... again. But yeh, not bad, just not top 10 good.

So why is this a stupid thread? Because it hurts your whittle weafs feelings despite being entirely true?
 

The Hanging Jowl

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Just don't overrate the hell out of your players, then all is good! I love Auston and the way he plays, 99% of the time us 'Leaf Bashers' say anything against the leafs, it's not to bring down the player, its to question what you delusional fans say, and almost all of the time leaf fans say the most outlandish things

Fans from every team say outlandish things. There's just a lot more Leafs fans than pretty much every other team.
 

TheNumber4

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as a whole, no, they never expected mxdavid. you thinking we all thought he was ours is your narrative.

and yes, not too far behind at all. there are some pretty important elements of the game that hes far better at.

there have been segments on hockey broadcasts where they've talked about there being times Matthews would make GMs think twice, and isn't really behind at all.

but see, you're proving my point from my first post. oilers fans get all worked up and start the whole "no where close! closer to draisaitl!!!" nonsense. oilers fans come across as seriously rattled these days over the leafs and matthews.

Sure I'll admit that some leafs fans have some sense of what odds are. But my point still stands, you guys en masse cried over McDavid, many thought because "Toronto" you deserved McDavid, and many were bitter about losing that draft. Which then translated into an irrational overrating of Matthews and denigration of McDavid to an embarrassing point where other posters need to call out how stupid that narrative is all the time with objective stats.

See your still trying to make that point, citing stuff like Toronto based media hype machine segments, "other" parts of his game, etc etc. Citing everything BUT point production.

When Gretzky was winning his Art Rosses do you think Islanders fans cited islanders media reports on Mike Bossy and cited his defensive awareness to try to equate the 2 players? They didn't, because they weren't choking on salty tears for 2 years.
 

The Hanging Jowl

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Oh okay. So as predicted, continue to lie to make your point. LOL. I guess those leafs fans crying in that video and on Hfboards didn't really happen.

And lol at "not too far behind," maybe that's how it is in Leafs fans heads but it's not the case when you look at something objective likes stats, awards, and the scoring leaders chart.

You forgot the standings. Whoops.
 

bionic

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Actually the subject of this thread is does Matthews deserve to be recognized as a top 10 player. With the stats that you have so kindly provided, if he keeps up his point per game pace he'll have proven the OP correct. Because point per game pace should put him right around 20th in league scoring... again. But yeh, not bad, just not top 10 good.

So why is this a stupid thread? Because it hurts your whittle weafs feelings despite being entirely true?
First of all with the way Babcock coaches and the fact Matthews gets fewer mins then other stars around the league it's amazing he is at a point per game pace. Scoring 18 goals in 32 so far is pretty awesome in itself.
Second of all being a top ten point getter does not always mean being a top ten player.
 

Brock Radunske

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All the stuff in here to say that Matthews isn't a top 10 player can be applied to McDavid not being the best player in the league.
Let that sink in.

8th in points
48th in goals
1/3 of points from the PP
Team at the bottom of the standings.


Doesn't sound like the best player in the world to me :sarcasm:
 
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TheNumber4

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You got us, those guys represent every single Leaf fan.

Your point is rather foolish, of course everyone wanted McDavid. That said after the lottery I did not see a lot of fuming over it, we talked about Strome,Hanifin and Marner.

The only people who think everyone is hung up on or out to get McDavid are a handful of paranoid Oiler fans which you appear to be one of.

A couple Leaf fans say he is equal or better. You know this is true but you are throwing integrity out the window in a feeble attempt to disparage a fan base you hate for some unknown reason. I hope it's worth it.

Lol no not just those guys how these guys?

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/threa...-7-30pm-edmonton-wins-mcdavid.1879337/page-40

Is it really just a "couple" leafs fans? I dunno I don't keep count. But if I go by these main boards I'd say it's about 50/50. Which is enough for me to address it.
 

Liferleafer

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Actually the subject of this thread is does Matthews deserve to be recognized as a top 10 player. With the stats that you have so kindly provided, if he keeps up his point per game pace he'll have proven the OP correct. Because point per game pace should put him right around 20th in league scoring... again. But yeh, not bad, just not top 10 good.

So why is this a stupid thread? Because it hurts your whittle weafs feelings despite being entirely true?
Go find 1 post where i ever called Matthews top 10. My feelings are just fine thanks. Why is it a stupid thread? Because an Oiler fan picked 1 plsyer...and it's no mistake that it's a Leaf one.....to make this thread about. It's the same as if i would make a thread titled "Are the Oilers the worst run franchise in the last 20 years?". You see i am a Leafs fan, i don't know the inner workings of another team...so i shouldn't target them with a thread...well unless my intent is to get Oilers fans bashed and pissed off, but nobody would do something like that...right?I will post this question to my fellow Leafs bretheren...are you happy with Matthews? My answer is yes......i will let the rest of the doults in this thread debate what number they put him at.
 

Rants Mulliniks

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Actually the subject of this thread is does Matthews deserve to be recognized as a top 10 player. With the stats that you have so kindly provided, if he keeps up his point per game pace he'll have proven the OP correct. Because point per game pace should put him right around 20th in league scoring... again. But yeh, not bad, just not top 10 good.

So why is this a stupid thread? Because it hurts your whittle weafs feelings despite being entirely true?

If the season ended today, are we good to say McDavid is not a top 8 player in the game (actually not even top 10 as his Pts/GP puts him 13th)? Heck are we good to say he might not even be a top 20 player in the game (once we factor in d-men and goalies)?
 

joe dirte

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Sure I'll admit that some leafs fans have some sense of what odds are. But my point still stands, you guys en masse cried over McDavid, many thought because "Toronto" you deserved McDavid, and many were bitter about losing that draft. Which then translated into an irrational overrating of Matthews and denigration of McDavid to an embarrassing point where other posters need to call out how stupid that narrative is all the time with objective stats.

See your still trying to make that point, citing stuff like Toronto based media hype machine segments, "other" parts of his game, etc etc. Citing everything BUT point production.

When Gretzky was winning his Art Rosses do you think Islanders fans cited islanders media reports on Mike Bossy and cited his defensive awareness to try to equate the 2 players? They didn't, because they weren't choking on salty tears for 2 years.

again, I don't think it was about the leafs deserving mcdavid. it was about thevoiler s not deserving it. and that sentiment was not restricted to leaf fans. it was all teams. there has even been talk about a rule stopping teams from getting too many number 1 picks. that's what the oiler track record has spurned in duscussion.
 
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