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Speculation: Why are the Leafs so hesitant to change the main pieces?

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notDatsyuk said:
Not just Nylander's new deal - the old deals for Tavares, Matthews, and Marner were all worse, and Matthews' new one is about as bad. If Marner gets anything more than $11 on his next, it will be worse.

Dubas was a total disaster, and we'll be suffering the repercussions for years.
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I agree that he gave out some bad deals but at some point you can't blame the guy who's not working here anymore... Even if you accept that the team's previous bad deals gave Nylander an anchor point to leverage, $11.5m is absurd. He should have been at $9m. $10m is maybe the "we overpaid everyone else so we'll overpay you" price. $11.5m is beyond the point where you can blame the previous regime.
 
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ToDavid said:
I agree that he gave out some bad deals but at some point you can't blame the guy who's not working here anymore... Even if you accept that the team's previous bad deals gave Nylander an anchor point to leverage, $11.5m is absurd. He should have been at $9m. $10m is maybe the "we overpaid everyone else so we'll overpay you" price. $11.5m is beyond the point where you can blame the previous regime.
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A bit hard to justify giving him only $9 or $10 when he's outperforming two players who are making $11, but I agree the madness instituted by Dubas has to stop.
 
Because they cant.

1. NMC/NTC
2. The cap hits are so big even without the NMC/NTC they are unmovable.

Pay attention.
 
They found out the market wasn't that great for Marner but they can still walk away if say they lose first round. We are now a better team that needs to replace Bert. Getting Kadri at 50 percent retention does that. Reeves Kadri Domi would be real havoc on other teams. Our d is better and so is goal.
 
We're keeping the two best.

Despite the obvious fact that they are the problem, and losing either or both will make us better, no GM in his right mind would trade for JT with his current contract, and it's going to be very hard to find one willing to give up very much for Marner with his (probable) future one.
 
While I don't think anyone is going to trade for Marner with a new $13 contract.... I do think we could sell him as a 1 year rental to someone. Problem is Marner probably blocks that. Marner camp probably still expects a cave and why wouldn't they? That's what Dubas would do for sure. 100% no doubt. I pray they are wrong though and we let him walk. I wish I could say I was confident but not even close to confident. The only thing is how do you pay a guy $12 million that you don't even really want on the team? That might save us. Because that is difficult.
 
notDatsyuk said:
A bit hard to justify giving him only $9 or $10 when he's outperforming two players who are making $11, but I agree the madness instituted by Dubas has to stop.
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JT's deal doesn't set the mark for what you should pay $11M for any more than Darnell Nurse's $9.5M contract does for D. And outperforming Mitch for 40 games at age 27 doesn't mean you should get paid as though you were doing this at age 20. Really bad deal by Tre and almost embarrassing for him now that the last of Willie's peers have resigned for under $10M. Treliving has taken the Dubas torch and run with it. Yes the Dubas culture has cast a long shadow but all Tre/Shanny had to do was say no at some point when their turn came. Can't win a trade so lets overpay. Thank god they have no more high end talent to get manhandled by.
 
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colchar said:
This is an idiotic position as it completely ignores the reality that they would make more money from winning a Cup.




No movement clauses.
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They had their window of opportunity though before it kicked in. 7 times wasn’t enough of a sample size though. Can’t fool them after 8 times though but it’s too late.
 
nuck said:
JT's deal doesn't set the mark for what you should pay $11M for any more than Darnell Nurse's $9.5M contract does for D. And outperforming Mitch for 40 games at age 27 doesn't mean you should get paid as though you were doing this at age 20. Really bad deal by Tre and almost embarrassing for him now that the last of Willie's peers have resigned for under $10M. Treliving has taken the Dubas torch and run with it. Yes the Dubas culture has cast a long shadow but all Tre/Shanny had to do was say no at some point when their turn came. Can't win a trade so lets overpay. Thank got they have no more high end talent to get manhandled by.
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I completely agree that neither should have set the mark, but neither should have been paid that much. But Willy's been the better player for a couple of seasons now, particularly in the playoffs.
 
Trapper said:
They had their window of opportunity though before it kicked in. 7 times wasn’t enough of a sample size though. Can’t fool them after 8 times though but it’s too late.
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It's all Shanahan, who was bringing Dubas back yet again before Dubas fired himself. If only there was someone to fire him, we would maybe see some changes around here. It was the clown show of Dubas and Shanahan. Now it's just Shanny's clown show.
 
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ToDavid said:
I agree that he gave out some bad deals but at some point you can't blame the guy who's not working here anymore... Even if you accept that the team's previous bad deals gave Nylander an anchor point to leverage, $11.5m is absurd. He should have been at $9m. $10m is maybe the "we overpaid everyone else so we'll overpay you" price. $11.5m is beyond the point where you can blame the previous regime.
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Normally I'd agree with this reasoning but Dubas went utterly scorched earth on all of our draft picks, completely cleaned the cupboards out.

It's so insane how they just continually let him do irreparable damage to the organization before he "fired himself" (as someone above put it)
 
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Seems pretty childish to believe that if the Team doesn't do what you want them to do it's because they are 'scared', 'chickenshit' or 'hesitant'.
 
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Dekes For Days said:
Because they're not the problem, and it won't make us better. Pretty simple.
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Are you sure, because we have changed most of the surrounding players every year, the coaches and even the GM’s and we keep losing. The only consistent is the 5 person core.
Sounds kinda like a problem to me
 
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darrylsittler27 said:
They found out the market wasn't that great for Marner but they can still walk away if say they lose first round. We are now a better team that needs to replace Bert. Getting Kadri at 50 percent retention does that. Reeves Kadri Domi would be real havoc on other teams. Our d is better and so is goal.
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When did that happen?
 
BigHabs said:
Habs fan coming in peace. Not looking for drama, just a question since yesterday and this morning.

I look at the Bolts the last two days. They went to three Stanley cup finals and won 2 out of 3. They then lose two first rounds.

The team is not standing pat and riding with the same core after all their success.

Moving up a young dman who yes got injured in Sergachev. They cleaned up their mistake with Jeannot. Stamkos their captain coming off a 40 goal season is likely not to re-sign. They want to do what the fans of Toronto want with Marner to take a cap reduction with term. I know their ages and one is a UFA but they tend to want to move up unless getting the player for Pennie’s on the dollar over term.

But speaking of age the leafs then are trying to lock up 35 year old Tanev to term.

I just was wondering where I know Leafs fans are split on Marner and changes needed. Why is it the Lightning are willing to tear down a portion of their team to re-tool which they acknowledge they need to get better and this after 2 years removed from 3 consecutive years of Stanley cup appearances all the while keeping the same coach and such as well.

Again not looking for trouble just a honest question why the Leafs are hesitant to try something new to get over that potential hump.
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The NMC challenge aside (which is why the moves should have been made after the Habs series), in short, because they don't need to. You'll be here next week, on season opener, at the year end presser, right? They are a corporation that likes nice, comfortable, easy money. Their interest is in selling overpriced jerseys, mugs and carpets with a logo and big tickets to slow moving corporations. If you think otherwise you haven't been a Leaf fan for long.

Don't believe what they say or it reflects on your own cerebral capacity, believe what they DO. They are gaslighting their base of fans who enjoy losing. They probably laughed their assess off after the press conference "can you believe that they believe that B.S after eight years. LOL" Probably alot of back slapping and bent over holding their gut laughter before they hit the bar.

As Hayes said after the annual year end gaslighing session was complete when they told the world they would act like a U.S owner and make the deep changes needed, "I will believe it when I see it". The most succinct and accurate description of this franchise that is mocked around the globe along with the fanbase that are viewed as medicore, loyal, obedient losers. He earned some credibility with that response, he didn't drink the kool-aid again. Refreshing in sports media in T.O.

What other franchise in sport has one a single round of playoffs in 20 years, when half of the league gets into the playoffs. One...single...playoff round...in twenty full seasons...

They are like a political party or government living off of your taxes. They don't like change and they lack the leadership and courage to change, it's too risky to try to win when they can keep printing money due to the naive, ever hopeful public. Very Canadian actually.

At this point, surely ONE executive would say with a serious face, "you know, maybe, hear me out now; just maybe that player just doesn't have the DNA in him to win the Cup."

The response would be predictable, "who cares, he sells jerseys damn it!"
 
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I'm shocked they haven't made a trade. Extremely normal thing for a sports team to attempt after a decade of similar playoff loses. I'd like someone to convince me that this core is capable of winning round 2 at a higher salary than last year.
 
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