What probability do you feel Ovechkin has to catch Gretzky now?

[Leafs1991]

It seems that people can't see there was a difference between how the game was played in the 80s and now. To claim Gretzky could score 80+ goals in today's NHL is ludicrous.

 

[Amazinmets73]

You do realize that the equipment only helps so much? That without the training players aren't as strong and fast?

It wouldn't matter. The Great One wasn't the strongest or fastest then, either.

 

[Hatfield]

How do you know how many goals would Kurri score without Gretzky? His GPG average in the last Gretzky season was 0.53 and in the first post-Gretzky season was 0.58. Almost the same. It's not unreasonable to think that he scores over 400 goals in the 80s without Gretzky and then picks up another 100 after.

Maybe so. But for 80s/90s those are still borderline HOF credentials.

FWIW I’m a Caps fan and Ovie is my favorite player of all time. But having idolized Gretzky as a kid I just don’t like to see his achievements minimized to build up modern players.

 

[ALLCAPSALLTHETIME]

It doesn't matter if he was frontloaded. It has nothing to do with longevity. But in his early 20s, he could comfortably score over 80 goals per season more than once in today's NHL for all the reasons I listed. Bottomline: we'll never know. I'm done here.

I don't know about 80 but definitely 60+
People on here are criminally underestimating Gretzky. He is greatest all time for a reason and would have adjusted to any era as his hockey IQ was off the charts.

 

[illpucks]

I grew up watching Gretzky as well and was born and raised in his hometown, his game would not translate goal scoring wise. He's still be the best and contend every year for the Art Ross, his IQ would be unparalleled but goal scoring is just much, much harder and defensemen are infinitely better. This isn't disrespectful, it's just the truth and no game is as blind to nostalgia as the NHL is.

Gretzky in today's game would milk his slapshot picking talent over and over

Every game would be this

 

[HurricaneFanatic]

It seems that people can't see there was a difference between how the game was played in the 80s and now. To claim Gretzky could score 80+ goals in today's NHL is ludicrous.

We'll never know, but they don't call him the Great One for nothing. He was the greatest player ever.

 

[HurricaneFanatic]

At the end of the day, I can say Ovi or Mario is probably the greatest Goal Scorer ever without wanting Ovi to break the actual number. hell, to be honest, there are probably a handful of guys who were better goal scorers for longer than Gretzky. I am cool with that haha.
I don't even dislike Ovi, I think he's a cool guy. Even funny at times.

 

[HurricaneFanatic]

Here's another question. How many goals could Ovi have if he had a Gretzky passing to him?

 

[torniojaws]

How many goals could Ovi have if he had a Gretzky passing to him?

Yes.

 

[Leafs1991]

Gretzky in today's game would milk his slapshot picking talent over and over

Every game would be this

It wouldn't be that easy. Did you see the goaltending in the 80s?

 

[Beukeboom]

I mean, Asians historically do not excel at athletics that require size. There are outliers of course, but there aren't a ton of 6'2 225lbs Chinese males walking around. Unless genetically that changes in 20 years your example holds zero weight. They aren't going to be bigger, stronger or faster than what we have because genetically that isn't what constitutes the average Asian man, that's not changing. It makes far more sense that the Nordic and European infusion, along with even more American players is about as big of a talent infusion the game will ever see, for obvious reason.

Well, Wayne won an Art at the age of 33-34 with a broken back in a team that missed the playoffs. This was despite having all the greatest from the old CCCP team in the league, and the additional Bure, Jagr, Fedorov, Lidstrom, Mogilny, Sundin, Selanne, Hasek and so on and so forth...

I'm sure Ol' Wayne would be able to find himself on the scoresheet once or twice even in todays "competitive" environment.

Edit: Anyway, we have digressed. I'm surprised not more people here mention the olympics. I think that is the one thing he wants the most. If NHL won't allow their players to participate, I'm pretty sure he'll go for it five years from now. That means he has four seasons + the reminder of this one left.

 

[TheDawnOfANewTage]

Gretzky in today's game would milk his slapshot picking talent over and over

Every game would be this

..you’re saying Gretzky would be able to do what Cody Hodgson did.

ok, sarcasm! Got it- dude, it’s so tough to read sometimes. Almost got me, goddammit, had to spell it out for myself to get it.

 

[The Panther]

I will never understand this obsession so many fans have (see: this thread) with how Gretzky would do if playing today. It's 100% irrelevant to everything.

Also, why is this discussion always one-way and always with Gretzky? I've never heard someone repeatedly ask, "Would Steve Yzerman be able to score 155 points today?" "Would Fedorov be able to win a scoring race today?" "Would Mike Bossy be able to score 50 goals today?" "Would Patrick Roy be able to stop a puck today?" It's always Gretzky getting projected into the future.

(One exception is the 'dirty' skilled players like Clarke, Messier, Lindros... Sometimes, I hear, "Could they play today?")

Do baseball fans endlessly project Lou Gehrig and Ted Williams into the steroid-era to try to discredit the past of the game?

 

[Adamantoise]

I think it's fair to question whether the kind of competitive edge that Gretzky had over his peers is attainable today, due to more professionalized nature of the game, evolution of information technology and hockey development progarms world-wide.

I don't think that can be used to argue, fruitfully, that Gretzky isn't the GOAT hockey player. If he isn't GOAT, then there is nothing that anyone could've done in his era to become the GOAT, which is stupid.

 

[HurricaneFanatic]

Ovi goal streak stops at 6 games.

 

[ItWasJustified]

It seems that people can't see there was a difference between how the game was played in the 80s and now. To claim Gretzky could score 80+ goals in today's NHL is ludicrous.

If Gretzky would've played in today's NHL he would have today's sticks, skates, training, diet, etc etc etc. He would dominate any era.

 

[HurricaneFanatic]

If Gretzky would've played in today's NHL he would have today's sticks, skates, training, diet, etc etc etc. He would dominate any era.

yes. He would be the best player today too.

 

[JasonRoseEh]

Well, Wayne won an Art at the age of 33-34 with a broken back in a team that missed the playoffs. This was despite having all the greatest from the old CCCP team in the league, and the additional Bure, Jagr, Fedorov, Lidstrom, Mogilny, Sundin, Selanne, Hasek and so on and so forth...

I'm sure Ol' Wayne would be able to find himself on the scoresheet once or twice even in todays "competitive" environment.

Edit: Anyway, we have digressed. I'm surprised not more people here mention the olympics. I think that is the one thing he wants the most. If NHL won't allow their players to participate, I'm pretty sure he'll go for it five years from now. That means he has four seasons + the reminder of this one left.

Art Ross, we're talking goals.

 

[JasonRoseEh]

Gretzky in today's game would milk his slapshot picking talent over and over

Every game would be this

Again, laughable.

 

[JasonRoseEh]

It doesn't matter if he was frontloaded. It has nothing to do with longevity. But in his early 20s, he could comfortably score over 80 goals per season more than once in today's NHL for all the reasons I listed. Bottomline: we'll never know. I'm done here.

Goal scoring in terms of career has EVERYTHING to do with longevity and that's why Jagr was still effective later in his career when Gretzky wasn't in a higher scoring era late in his career. Gretzky would be lucky to get 40 in the NHL today even in his prime, your nostalgia glasses are truly embarrassing if you think a 180 lbs player is coming in and scoring 80 goals. That's absolutely ridiculous. He'd be a slower McDavid and that vast majority of his points would be assists. If you think Gretzky is getting 160-180 points in the league now you're nuts.

Ovechkin has concentrated mainly on scoring goals throughout his career. After his 84-85 season, Gretzky said he wanted to concentrate more on assists, particularly when he set the ridiculous mark of 163 assists in the 85-86 season. He was still a young man when he went in this direction. If it was the other way around, and Gretzky had to chase down an Ovechkin all-time goal total, I could see Gretzky going over 1,000 if that's all he wanted to do.

And I'm a Lemieux fan that thinks Lemieux is the best goal scorer of all time.

Gretzky's numbers dropped because goalies and defenses improved, you don't suddenly decide not to score 90 goals and if he could have, he would have. In today's NHL Gretzky would not be able an elite goal scorer and nothing in his game shows he would be able to do that. Lemieux on the other hand would be much better suited as a goal scorer in the modern NHL.

 

[JasonRoseEh]

It wouldn't matter. The Great One wasn't the strongest or fastest then, either.

The game was MUCH slower comparatively and defensemen/goalies don't fall down today with one simple move.

 

[BrannigansLaw]

20%

 

[Hatfield]

Gretzky's numbers dropped because goalies and defenses improved, you don't suddenly decide not to score 90 goals and if he could have, he would have. In today's NHL Gretzky would not be able an elite goal scorer and nothing in his game shows he would be able to do that. Lemieux on the other hand would be much better suited as a goal scorer in the modern NHL.

Gretzky’s goal totals went from 55 to 92 one year, then 87 to 73 to 52 (the same year he set the single season assists and points records), then back to 62. You think these numbers are dependent on the overall quality of goaltending in those years?

Gretzky’s goal production dipped in a way that’s very normal and expected as players age and deal with injury. Very few players are elite goal scorers in their late 20s and 30s. Ovie is actually a huge outlier in that sense.

I do think Gretzky made a conscious decision to be more of a setup man later in his career, because he was still the best in the world at it.

 

[Minar]

Goal scoring in terms of career has EVERYTHING to do with longevity and that's why Jagr was still effective later in his career when Gretzky wasn't in a higher scoring era late in his career. Gretzky would be lucky to get 40 in the NHL today even in his prime, your nostalgia glasses are truly embarrassing if you think a 180 lbs player is coming in and scoring 80 goals. That's absolutely ridiculous. He'd be a slower McDavid and that vast majority of his points would be assists. If you think Gretzky is getting 160-180 points in the league now you're nuts.

Gretzky's numbers dropped because goalies and defenses improved, you don't suddenly decide not to score 90 goals and if he could have, he would have. In today's NHL Gretzky would not be able an elite goal scorer and nothing in his game shows he would be able to do that. Lemieux on the other hand would be much better suited as a goal scorer in the modern NHL.

Goal scoring in terms of career has EVERYTHING to do with longevity and that's why Jagr was still effective later in his career when Gretzky wasn't in a higher scoring era late in his career. Gretzky would be lucky to get 40 in the NHL today even in his prime, your nostalgia glasses are truly embarrassing if you think a 180 lbs player is coming in and scoring 80 goals. That's absolutely ridiculous. He'd be a slower McDavid and that vast majority of his points would be assists. If you think Gretzky is getting 160-180 points in the league now you're nuts.

Gretzky's numbers dropped because goalies and defenses improved, you don't suddenly decide not to score 90 goals and if he could have, he would have. In today's NHL Gretzky would not be able an elite goal scorer and nothing in his game shows he would be able to do that. Lemieux on the other hand would be much better suited as a goal scorer in the modern NHL.

Gretzky scored less and less because of AGE. He himself has said it became harder and harder as you grow older to put your body through the wear and tear to score like that.

 

[VVP]

This may be a little off topic but Jagr still can score being this old