What is wrong with Mcdavid?

[Dieseloil]

Give Holland Eichel instead of McDavid and he would screw that up worse. Look at the money he’s blown on useless players. Instead of giving Kostin a bump and keeping Bjugstad if he could, he threw bad money at Brown and McLeod. So no, Eichel isn’t or ever will be as valuable as McDavid.

 

[AnInjuredJasonZucker]

The difference between Eichel and McDavid is a plug

If you think McDavid wouldn't have won with last year's Vegas team without a plug or/and Hague you're delusional

If you replaced Eichel with McDavid and then removed Brett Howden, VGK probably gets swept in the first round and then relegated to the defunct IHL.

 

[Video Nasty]

He’s back! Amazing numbers.
15 pts in the last 5 games.
They beat the cup champs and beat the hot Caps in those games.

But…they also lost 2 of the 5 and…

He’s just like he’s been at his peak last year. Crazy points but his +/- is 0

I know it’s not a league/team comparison stat but I do see it as an internal simple stat to understand.

He’s putting up crazy numbers but he’s on the ice for just as many even strength goals against as goals for.

I know I’ll get slammed but I’ll say it anyway.

This is not his peak to me. If he can tighten up defensively he’ll help his team points. Even if it costs him a few personal points

The guy is +110 for his career. He’s had 5 seasons of being +20. Guess how many a supposed two way wizard like Crosby has? 2.

 

[joestevens29]

Give Holland Eichel instead of McDavid and he would screw that up worse. Look at the money he’s blown on useless players. Instead of giving Kostin a bump and keeping Bjugstad if he could, he threw bad money at Brown and McLeod. So no, Eichel isn’t or ever will be as valuable as McDavid.

Erne is doing about as much as Kostin more a lot less money.

 

[Dieseloil]

Erne is doing about as much as Kostin more a lot less money.

And it’s nice to see him developing.

 

[Fataldogg]

If you can get a competent first line center who can contribute both in games that matter and games that don't for 10M or less. You get great value to better surround said player with competent players in all key positions. Sure. Campbell shitting the bed after they spent 5M on goal sucks. But so does their third line so does their defense.

The team has holes. The cap management creates those holes.

You can come up with every excuse in the book as to why this photo exists but the reality is under a cap system, cap management trumps prestige of any one player. Eichel at 10M is more valuable to building a team than McDavid at 12.5.

There is NO PLAYER IN THE LEAGUE worth 12.5M. And yes I absolutely put Matthews in there as well.

$2.5 million isn't the reason Eichel has a Cup and McDavid doesn't.

Its how teams management allocate funds in a cap system. The Golden Knights don't have the dead weight the Oilers do. The Oilers are paying Nurse $9 million to be the equivalent of a 2nd pair defense man and Campbell is getting nearly $4 million to not see the ice.

You can't win Cups when your GM handcuffs your ability to make moves with bad contracts.

 

[PensandCaps]

The guy is +110 for his career. He’s had 5 seasons of being +20. Guess how many a supposed two way wizard like Crosby has? 2.

+/- isn't a stat for defense.

lots of offensive only players have good +/- because they simply score alot.

Lot of Defensively responsible forwards have a negative +/- because they are put in Defensive situations and aren't much of a goalscorer.

 

[Drytoast]

1. If that’s your argument, I’m not going to engage in it. You can call it a win on your side, but it’s lunacy.

2. Players haven’t been making $10 million/yr for that long. 8 years I believe. Salaries and caps only go up, and the percentage hits for star players are all fairly similar. It’s like trying to draw any conclusions from shortly after Gretzky and Lemieux were the only players who made $1 million per year. There are none to be drawn.

I am saying since the invention of the cap. Paying a large percentage towards any one position is death.

 

[v00d00daddy]

The guy is +110 for his career. He’s had 5 seasons of being +20. Guess how many a supposed two way wizard like Crosby has? 2.

Awesome. Again…to me it’s an inner team stat. Not comparable to players on other teams.

I’m just saying that he can put up all the points he wants. It doesn’t mean he’s gonna make the oilers outcome better. He put a career season in points and goals last year. I think that’s great. I just think that he has more to do. And the more has nothing to do with points.

He put up 20 points in 12 games in the playoffs last year. Amazing numbers.

Unfortunately…he was -1 when even strength.

So what’s the easier way for him to help his team? Put up more points or tighten up defensively?

I think the latter will help both on the scoreboard and in the locker room. And he should be doing now. To make the playoffs and go deep once there

 

[Drytoast]

$2.5 million isn't the reason Eichel has a Cup and McDavid doesn't.

Its how teams management allocate funds in a cap system. The Golden Knights don't have the dead weight the Oilers do. The Oilers are paying Nurse $9 million to be the equivalent of a 2nd pair defense man and Campbell is getting nearly $4 million to not see the ice.

You can't win Cups when your GM handcuffs your ability to make moves with bad contracts.

You are making a statement of two examples of piss poor cap management. Overpaying McDavid by 2 mil and overpaying Nurse by 8 mil. And yes...overpaying Campbell by 5 mil has also sucked.

A team that can play 3-4 solid lines with a solid defense with no real stand out star but of which is capable and competent and bought into a team mentality is going to trump any team built top heavy with top tier talent that of which has a weaker back end or bottom 6.

Except they didn’t build around him, he was put on a team with a better supporting cast than McDavid has had. Sure, his contribution to their cup win can’t be ignored, but let’s not pretend like their team situations are at all similar.

Oh Vegas was gifted a solid team out of the gate because of the change of the expansion rules. But we cannot ignore it's cap management. Which I believe is near top of the league.

 

[AvroArrow]

Awesome. Again…to me it’s an inner team stat. Not comparable to players on other teams.

I’m just saying that he can put up all the points he wants. It doesn’t mean he’s gonna make the oilers outcome better. He put a career season in points and goals last year. I think that’s great. I just think that he has more to do. And the more has nothing to do with points.

He put up 20 points in 12 games in the playoffs last year. Amazing numbers.

Unfortunately…he was -1 when even strength.

So what’s the easier way for him to help his team? Put up more points or tighten up defensively?

I think the latter will help both on the scoreboard and in the locker room. And he should be doing now. To make the playoffs and go deep once there

I have been making this point for god knows how long and I get attacked every time it's brought up. Even strength, where most of the game is played, especially in the playoffs.

 

[CantHaveTkachev]

I have been making this point for god knows how long and I get attacked every time it's brought up. Even strength, where most of the game is played, especially in the playoffs.

McDavid led the league in ES points in the 2022 playoffs, despite not playing the Finals
he was also 3rd in ES goal differential

 

[sepHF]

It’s never wise to assume. He obviously got hurt, whether he was playing injured or not is unknown.

what's the alternative? He just forgot how to skate, shoot and pass simultaneously?

 

[GreatGonzo]

Awesome. Again…to me it’s an inner team stat. Not comparable to players on other teams.

I’m just saying that he can put up all the points he wants. It doesn’t mean he’s gonna make the oilers outcome better. He put a career season in points and goals last year. I think that’s great. I just think that he has more to do. And the more has nothing to do with points.

He put up 20 points in 12 games in the playoffs last year. Amazing numbers.

Unfortunately…he was -1 when even strength.

So what’s the easier way for him to help his team? Put up more points or tighten up defensively?

I think the latter will help both on the scoreboard and in the locker room. And he should be doing now. To make the playoffs and go deep once there

McDavid focusing on defense won’t fix their defense overall or their goaltending. This whole “he can do more” idea makes zero sense. He already does so much for the team.

 

[McFlash97]

The guy is +110 for his career. He’s had 5 seasons of being +20. Guess how many a supposed two way wizard like Crosby has? 2.

Turn the lights out. Thread should be closed down. This is the winner.

 

[cupface52]

---

Awesome. Again…to me it’s an inner team stat. Not comparable to players on other teams.

I’m just saying that he can put up all the points he wants. It doesn’t mean he’s gonna make the oilers outcome better. He put a career season in points and goals last year. I think that’s great. I just think that he has more to do. And the more has nothing to do with points.

He put up 20 points in 12 games in the playoffs last year. Amazing numbers.

Unfortunately…he was -1 when even strength.

So what’s the easier way for him to help his team? Put up more points or tighten up defensively?

I think the latter will help both on the scoreboard and in the locker room. And he should be doing now. To make the playoffs and go deep once there

Maybe he should just become the goalie along with leading the league in scoring.

He was -1 last year, however the previous year he led(tied) the playoffs with +15 while scoring over 2ppg. The closest non cup winner was +10.

 

[mkatcherin00]

McDavid led the league in ES points in the 2022 playoffs, despite not playing the Finals
he was also 3rd in ES goal differential

Mic drop

 

[Coffey]

The guy is +110 for his career. He’s had 5 seasons of being +20. Guess how many a supposed two way wizard like Crosby has? 2.

Ya but +/- shouldn't be the end all be all for defensive awareness!

Also, how dare Draisaitl win the Hart with his lousy -7, can that idiot even play defense!

THE NARRATIVE ALWAYS CHANGES WITH THE SQUEALING, WRETCHED, PINHEAD PUPPETS OF GOTHAM... err HF

 

[Soundwave]

The guy is +110 for his career. He’s had 5 seasons of being +20. Guess how many a supposed two way wizard like Crosby has? 2.

Imagine he actually had a goalie who could stop a damn puck to play in front of too like Crosby has had basically his entire career.

 

[Romang67]

Awesome. Again…to me it’s an inner team stat. Not comparable to players on other teams.

I’m just saying that he can put up all the points he wants. It doesn’t mean he’s gonna make the oilers outcome better. He put a career season in points and goals last year. I think that’s great. I just think that he has more to do. And the more has nothing to do with points.

He put up 20 points in 12 games in the playoffs last year. Amazing numbers.

Unfortunately…he was -1 when even strength.

So what’s the easier way for him to help his team? Put up more points or tighten up defensively?

I think the latter will help both on the scoreboard and in the locker room. And he should be doing now. To make the playoffs and go deep once there

Even strength here of course includes empty net situations, where McDavid was -2. Actual even strength, as in 5v5, 4v4, 3v3, McDavid was not a -1. He was a +1.

 

[nbwingsfan]

He costs too f***ing much which means he can't be surrounded with a competent team that consists of hard working, decently skilled 3 lines deep that can pull their weight and take pressure off of him.

Currently Edmonton, like Toronto...sucks both in goal and on the back end.

Solution? Stop overpaying talent because of prestige. And pay them to what their value actually is. McDavid isn't worth 12M+ The damage done to the cap by setting that bar as standard pay destroys your cap structure and the cap don't give two f***s about how good McDavid is.

Eichel at 10M is more valuable than McDavid at 12M+

Which player are you getting for $2.5M in savings that makes up for the 60-70pt gap in production between the two of them?

 

[CpatainCanuck]

+/- isn't a stat for defense.

lots of offensive only players have good +/- because they simply score alot.

Lot of Defensively responsible forwards have a negative +/- because they are put in Defensive situations and aren't much of a goalscorer.

Is McDavid really an "offensive only" player? There is truth to the saying that the best defence is a good offence. I think most people would agree that the Oilers are better off with McDavid taking a few offensive chances here and there rather than just grinding it out all game in his own zone. Maybe the Oilers will get a few more goals scored on them when McDavid is on the ice as a result in comparison to a player like Crosby or Bergeron, but the Oilers are scoring probably 50 more at the other end of the rink.

 

[nbwingsfan]

If you can get a competent first line center who can contribute both in games that matter and games that don't for 10M or less. You get great value to better surround said player with competent players in all key positions. Sure. Campbell shitting the bed after they spent 5M on goal sucks. But so does their third line so does their defense.

The team has holes. The cap management creates those holes.

You can come up with every excuse in the book as to why this photo exists but the reality is under a cap system, cap management trumps prestige of any one player. Eichel at 10M is more valuable to building a team than McDavid at 12.5.

There is NO PLAYER IN THE LEAGUE worth 12.5M. And yes I absolutely put Matthews in there as well.

If you can get a competent first line center who can contribute both in games that matter and games that don't for 10M or less. You get great value to better surround said player with competent players in all key positions. Sure. Campbell shitting the bed after they spent 5M on goal sucks. But so does their third line so does their defense.

The team has holes. The cap management creates those holes.

You can come up with every excuse in the book as to why this photo exists but the reality is under a cap system, cap management trumps prestige of any one player. Eichel at 10M is more valuable to building a team than McDavid at 12.5.

There is NO PLAYER IN THE LEAGUE worth 12.5M. And yes I absolutely put Matthews in there as well.

Do you really think Vegas wouldn’t win the cup if they traded Eichel and Brayden McNabb for McDavid?

 

[Mack a doodle doo]

Erne is doing about as much as Kostin more a lot less money.

Nah he definitely isn’t ,not even close

 

[Regal]

Awesome. Again…to me it’s an inner team stat. Not comparable to players on other teams.

I’m just saying that he can put up all the points he wants. It doesn’t mean he’s gonna make the oilers outcome better. He put a career season in points and goals last year. I think that’s great. I just think that he has more to do. And the more has nothing to do with points.

He put up 20 points in 12 games in the playoffs last year. Amazing numbers.

Unfortunately…he was -1 when even strength.

So what’s the easier way for him to help his team? Put up more points or tighten up defensively?

I think the latter will help both on the scoreboard and in the locker room. And he should be doing now. To make the playoffs and go deep once there

Eh, he had a 56% xGF% last year and was +1 5v5. He was only -1 at ES due to empty net goals against. His defensive numbers weren’t bad really, just mediocre, but his line didn’t score at their usual rate 5v5. I’m not sure if tightening up defensively is going to help his team too much from a personal standpoint. They need goals and he was a massive plus at 5v5 two playoffs ago while giving up far more goals against, but scoring way more as well. Small samples can lead to false narratives. I think over the long haul his game is a huge positive for the team at ES. And of course being part of one of the best PPs of all time is also a huge plus.