Line Combos: What happens when Lars comes back?

[Teufelsdreck]

DD benched and waived

You know that isn't so, especially the second part. At most, Des would sit out s few games.

 

[BigDaddyLurch]

You know that isn't so, especially the second part. At most, Des would sit out s few games.

...it almost ripped Therrien's heart out last year to sit li'l Davey in the pressbox for 1 game, no way he sits him for multiple...Therrien's way too stubborn for that...he'll only sit the kids for the most minute mistake...

 

[BaseballCoach]

DD benched and waived

Even if you don't want to play Eller or Galch on the wing, when a Center is injured, DD is a good option to have. I don't see why we would waive him. He has value as an NHL player, in a supporting role.

 

[Ohashi_Jouzu*]

Even if you don't want to play Eller or Galch on the wing, when a Center is injured, DD is a good option to have. I don't see why we would waive him. He has value as an NHL player, in a supporting role.

Sure does. $3.5 million...

 

[InControl]

I am fine with 27 at C.

This is not about DD being "safe". I am not one of the people who sees every decision through a DD lens, good or bad.

I want two things in the end. I want the top 6 forwards getting the most minutes. And I consider Eller to be in the top 6, unless and until we trade for an even better player without giving up one of our current top 5.

If we are running a top-6 who play 15-20 minutes each, and a bottom 6 who play 10-14 minutes each, then I don't want to do anything that puts a guy not ready for 15-20 minutes into the top 6, like Andrighetto or even Hudon, nor anyone not productive enough, like Desharnais, Bournival, Prust, Tangradi, Bowman or even Parenteau or Weise.

Once we have our top 6, who plays wing and who plays C can be situational decisions. Try different things to see what works best. Maybe the gain from 27 at C is greater than the loss of efficiency of 81 on wing. Or maybe it's the other way around. And if Gallagher can take some offensive-zone draws TODAY on the right side, and none of the Chuckie-vicarious-livers take offense, then why should anyone take offense if Eller takes defensive-zone draws? Hell, sometimes Malhotra takes defensive zone draws, while Galchenyuk plays wing or even sits on the bench, and no one complains much when it happens. So what is this THEORETICAL obsession with Galchenyuk having only one possible role and getting pigeon-holed into it?

Lemaire, Damphousse, Malkin, Sharp, J Staal, Stamkos, Marcel Dionne and even Guy Lafleur did/do all play wing some greater or lesser percentage of the time, but Alex Galchenyuk is not allowed to, even when only 20 years old and still learning, because fan-boys will go apoplectic? This may not be the most ridiculous notion I ever heard of, but it's close.

I don't care about only one player on a team. I care about the team winning. If there are games where the opposing teams' minute-eaters at C might over-match 20 year old Galchenyuk, then I would rather he play more minutes on the wing, than less minutes at C, and let Eller and Pleks handle the other teams' threats!

If using Malhotra to take a draw helps the team, I am for it. If using Eller to take a draw helps the team, I am for it. If using Eller and Plekanec to counter Crosby and Malkin helps the team, I am for it. If, in order to do these things, Galchenyuk must either play less minutes or play LW, I favour LW.

Why is saying these things controversial according to some here? Because Desharnais might play 10-14 minutes? If he does, because he EARNS that right, so be it! If he can't earn a support role, then bench him. In my book, DD has shown he is not a top-6 player, and it seems the coach sees that now. Good! But he deserves the chance for a lesser role, like any other player on the team, where he can contribute as much as he can. We don't need to pick on him anymore, or see EVERY DECISION as being "for or against DD".

This is the most complete and objective post on the subject! Therefore, I predict most people whose arguments were badly shaken by this message will ignore it.

 

[LyricalLyricist]

Sure does. $3.5 million...

I don't see what he said as ridiculous. DD is NHL caliber and going forward we might as well keep him until the offseason unless you can trade him for another useful player.

Most high ranked teams will add a 3.5 mil+ rental anyway at the deadline. We have one, let's keep him(or an equivalent player if traded) and then fix the team in off-season.

There's no reason to waive, he's NHL caliber.

 

[BaseballCoach]

...what's wrong with Eller's line playing alot of minutes??...we're a Top 9 team, not a Top 6/Bottom 6 team; we've got the depth to play any of our 3 lines in most situations...who cares if Chucky's line only plays 17 minutes, yet gets a handful of points cuz they got better matchup starts, as opposed to 20 minutes but had to play against the other guys' top players and got no points/a couple points...rolling 3 lines is more productive for our game than rolling 2 heavy & 2 light/sheltered...

Please tell me who else is on this shutdown line that Eller will center?

 

[LyricalLyricist]

Please tell me who else is on this shutdown line that Eller will center?

Logically, if Eller plays with Prust and PAP given that adrighetto stays up people will ***** about Eller's linemates.

I don't know why people don't believe in depth. One long term injury at C and we're pretty ****ed in the playoffs. We have 4 top 9 Cs and suddenly it's end of the world.

Doesn't a top team like St Louis has much much more? Doesn't seem like an issue there. Not sure why it's a big issue in MTL.

 

[Habs13]

Move wee Davey boy for a defenseman that isn't about to become a senior citizen and who can actually be a competant defender. Problem is, who wants wee Davey?

 

[LyricalLyricist]

Move wee Davey boy for a defenseman that isn't about to become a senior citizen and who can actually be a competant defender. Problem is, who wants wee Davey?

If DD has the value people say here, why would you feel we'd get a competent defender?

It's either DD isn't that bad or DD is.

In any case, maybe with the right package we can get a steady top 4 D-man for him+ in the summer.

 

[BigDaddyLurch]

Please tell me who else is on this shutdown line that Eller will center?

...why would you label it a "shutdown line"; i never did...I said they're a good two-way line...Sekac - Eller - Bournival works well and are a two-way threat...Bournival - Eller - Gallagher would work as well...as would Prust - Eller - Bournival...Bournival - Eller - Weise...Bournival - Eller - Parenteau...this is the depth we have and it's awesome to have it...

 

[BigDaddyLurch]

If DD has the value people say here, why would you feel we'd get a competent defender?

It's either DD isn't that bad or DD is.

In any case, maybe with the right package we can get a steady top 4 D-man for him+ in the summer.

...it's not that he's terrible, it's that he's almost redundant; we have 4 better-suited centres for their roles...

 

[BaseballCoach]

Move wee Davey boy for a defenseman that isn't about to become a senior citizen and who can actually be a competant defender. Problem is, who wants wee Davey?

Anyone else see the irony in someone using a Beliveau avatar but acting so un-Beliveau-like by shooting insults at David Desharnais for being short? Can he help that? Is there something he can do about his height? What's next, calling Malhotra dark?

 

[BaseballCoach]

...why would you label it a "shutdown line"; i never did...I said they're a good two-way line...Sekac - Eller - Bournival works well and are a two-way threat...Bournival - Eller - Gallagher would work as well...as would Prust - Eller - Bournival...Bournival - Eller - Weise...Bournival - Eller - Parenteau...this is the depth we have and it's awesome to have it...

So you think Eller should play Bournival's minutes? Or Galchenyuk Weise's minutes?

Eller is our #4 or #5 forward and it seems to me like you either want him on a third line or want to give marginal players top-6 minutes at the expense of Pleks, Patches, Galchenyuk, or Gallagher. Why?

 

[BigDaddyLurch]

Anyone else see the irony in someone using a Beliveau avatar but acting so un-Beliveau-like by shooting insults at David Desharnais for being short? Can he help that? Is there something he can do about his height? What's next, calling Malhotra dark?

...internet message board, amigo...relax...people sling sarcasm and thinly veiled insults all the time...Wee Man doesn't mind...

 

[Ohashi_Jouzu*]

I don't see what he said as ridiculous.

Wait, what was ridiculous about saying Desharnais is worth $3.5 million? Better question, who said anything was ridiculous in the first place?

 

[BigDaddyLurch]

So you think Eller should play Bournival's minutes? Or Galchenyuk Weise's minutes?

...OK, no need to get seriously foolish here...we have quite a few players that can move up and down the lineup when needed/required without hurting the team...depth, it's called...didn't think this was new to you...sorry...

Eller is our #4 or #5 forward and it seems to me like you either want him on a third line or want to give marginal players top-6 minutes at the expense of Pleks, Patches, Galchenyuk, or Gallagher. Why?

...cuz Eller is most effective as our 3rd line centre...been paying attention the last few years, cuz he's shown as much on multiple occassions...and him taking some of the tough minutes away from the other lines isn't a bad thing...again, if we can get our Top Line out for more favorable matchups more often than not, we do it; just as if we can keep them away from prolonged unfavorable matchups, we do it...that's just basic coaching...

 

[ECWHSWI]

...cuz Eller is most effective as our 3rd line centre...been paying attention the last few years, cuz he's shown as much on multiple occassions...and him taking some of the tough minutes away from the other lines isn't a bad thing...again, if we can get our Top Line out for more favorable matchups more often than not, we do it; just as if we can keep them away from prolonged unfavorable matchups, we do it...that's just basic coaching...

this, and besides, Eller game is way too demanding, you can't have him play 20 minutes and be effective when you know his game is all about winning board battles.

 

[Lshap]

...it almost ripped Therrien's heart out last year to sit li'l Davey in the pressbox for 1 game, no way he sits him for multiple...Therrien's way too stubborn for that...he'll only sit the kids for the most minute mistake...

We said the same thing about Bouillon last year, and he ended up platooned with Murray for the rest of the season. Yes, Therrien has problems rewarding merit over age. But he comes around and does the right thing... eventually.

Sekac as a top-six, Galchenyuk at center, Andrighetto in the lineup, Beaulieu back up, and Desharnais given a new role on the 3rd line. It's almost like Christmas in December. Time to celebrate, not complain.

 

[BigDaddyLurch]

We said the same thing about Bouillon last year, and he ended up platooned with Murray for the rest of the season. Yes, Therrien has problems rewarding merit over age. But he comes around and does the right thing... eventually.

Sekac as a top-six, Galchenyuk at center, Andrighetto in the lineup, Beaulieu back up, and Desharnais given a new role on the 3rd line. It's almost like Christmas in December. Time to celebrate, not complain.

...there's always reasons to debate, amigo...hence the existence of the Boards...otherwise, you MODS would get bored...

 

[LyricalLyricist]

...it's not that he's terrible, it's that he's almost redundant; we have 4 better-suited centres for their roles...

That's a strange thing to say. He's not redundant to Malhotra, Eller or Plekanec in any way actually.

Saying we already have better fits in his position is one thing, I don't think redundant makes sense.

Either way, that's not what I referred to.

Take for example, this particular post:

There's nothing extreme about wanting your best players to play. He can be an injury fill in but he has no business being used ahead of Eller at centre. Nobody wants this guy and for good reason, he's better suited to the AHL.

Followed by "maybe we can get a good d-man for him".

Which is it? It seems a lot of people feel like LG but they want a miracle in terms of return.

 

[BigDaddyLurch]

That's a strange thing to say. He's not redundant to Malhotra, Eller or Plekanec in any way actually.

Saying we already have better fits in his position is one thing, I don't think redundant makes sense.
Either way, that's not what I referred to.

Take for example, this particular post:



Followed by "maybe we can get a good d-man for him".

Which is it? It seems a lot of people feel like LG but they want a miracle in terms of return.

...as a centre with the Habs, he is redundant, as in no longer necessary (the definition of redundant); Galchenyuk, Plekanec, Eller, and Malholtra are our 4 centres...Chucky's a better option @ #1, Pleks is a better option @ #2, Eller is a better option @ #3, and Manny's a better option @ #4...if he doesn't prove himself useful as a winger, do we sit a better-suited winger just to keep DD playing in case we need him as an injury replacement later??...

 

[Andy]

We said the same thing about Bouillon last year, and he ended up platooned with Murray for the rest of the season. Yes, Therrien has problems rewarding merit over age. But he comes around and does the right thing... eventually.

Sekac as a top-six, Galchenyuk at center, Andrighetto in the lineup, Beaulieu back up, and Desharnais given a new role on the 3rd line. It's almost like Christmas in December. Time to celebrate, not complain.

He does the "right thing" largely because he has no choice. Andrighetto and Galchenyuk's situation are the result from an injury to Eller. Beaulieu is only in the lineup because Allen and Weaver can't play and Sekac only drew back in because MT couldn't justify keeping Bourque in the lineup any longer with him absolutely sucking out there. He either waits until (1) his back is against the wall and (2) has his options taken away from him before he makes the "right choices". I fully expect Galchenyuk to move back to the wing when Eller comes back.

 

[MasterMatt25]

My guess is that Andrghetto is sent down, Chucky moved to wing and DD back to 1st line, leaving 3rd C for Eller

 

[LyricalLyricist]

...as a centre with the Habs, he is redundant, as in no longer necessary (the definition of redundant); Galchenyuk, Plekanec, Eller, and Malholtra are our 4 centres...Chucky's a better option @ #1, Pleks is a better option @ #2, Eller is a better option @ #3, and Manny's a better option @ #4...if he doesn't prove himself useful as a winger, do we sit a better-suited winger just to keep DD playing in case we need him as an injury replacement later??...

Since when is depth redundant? That being said, I agree he needs to cut it as a winger.

In my mind, Eller sucks on the wing and Plekanec isn't leaving center ever. Galchenyuk has proven to be versatile and now it's DD's turn to do the same. He may return as a C or may rotate in an out of the lineup and up and down the lineup but his calling will be his versatility. If DD continues adds versatility in his repertoire its better for everybody, including his own career long term.

As BaseballCoach said, I think we should give him that chance. It might pay dividends to have a player who is versatile and can fill in for C in a pinch.

While it's seen as 'redundant' many seem to suggest he should be on the waiver wire. I respectfully disagree with the notion because if any C gets injured, such as Eller right now, we have no real NHL caliber C to move up the line-up. Hudon looks good in the AHL but no NHL experience just yet.

I prefer to hold onto DD or an equivalent forward(if we trade) until the off season. Like I said, doesn't need to be DD but I think having the center depth would be important going forward.