Post-Game Talk: We only need five players

[JayE]

Do Sheahan and Archibald really look like they can shelter and protect such a player. I like both of these guys but they have dirty GA rate themselves. We're asking bleeders to stop AA bleeding. Seems to me it looks like a lot of blood.

We're not a lineup that can hide things like that and we don't have D pairings that can.

Disconnected comment, and I love Bear, but my lord. 5 mistakes on one shift leading up to a GA. This is what you get sometimes leaning on a rookie D so heavily. Too bad Larsson is playing like crap. Bear needs to be getting less minutes.

Wait, what?

 

[StoveTopStauffer]

Did AA ever play C in the NHL?

 

[Senor Catface]

If McDavid hits 100 points this year, he'll be the first player to hit 100 points in 4 consecutive seasons since Yzerman did it around 25-30 years ago.

Someone can fact check this, but I think it's the case.

 

[Isaak16]

Nuge-Mcdavid-Kassian
AA-Draisaitl-Yamamoto
Ennis-Sheahan-Archie
Nygaard-Haas-Chaisson

Klefbom-Jones
Nurse-Bear
Russell-Larsson

When healthy please

 

[Dakinjor]

Nuge-Mcdavid-Kassian
AA-Draisaitl-Yamamoto
Ennis-Sheahan-Archie
Nygaard-Haas-Chaisson

Klefbom-Jones
Nurse-Bear
Russell-Larsson

When healthy please

Nuge-drai-yamamoto absolutely will not be broken up at the moment

 

[Jumptheshark]

I get the distinct impression some people do not like it when we win

 

[Cloned]

 

[Perfect_Drug]

 

[Fourier]

Wait, what?

Exactly.

Since Jan 1 when the team as a whole turned things around these are the GA/60 numbers:

Larsson 2.37 in 406 5 vs 5 minutes
Klefbom 2.68 in 313 5 vs 5 minutes
Nurse 2.47 in 462 5 vs 5 minutes
Bear 2.63 in 433 5 vs 5 minutes

Since Feb 1 the numbers are

Larsson 2.40 in 250 5 vs 5 minutes
Klefbom 3.3 in 143 5 vs 5 minutes
Nurse 2.83 in 75 5 vs 5 minutes
Bear 3.3 in 254 5 vs 5 minutes

Now these are not explicitly individual stats of course but even the eye test to me suggests that Larsson isn't fancy but he has been effective.

​

 

[5 Mins 4 Ftg]

Ennis has been better than AA, and should be on the top line.

I think he’s a better fit with Sheahan and Archi in a forechecking role. Get Kassian back w McDavid and AA.

 

[McCombo]

Klefbom and Yamo will be massive additions

They need Klefbom in a worst way. That lets Nurse-Bear pairing to play againts 2nd lines and gets Russell out of lineup goddamn fast (I hope). I wouldn't be surprised to see Russell stay in line-up because he is "veteran". Jones is way better than him. Jones actually has some skill to pass the puck up the ice. Russell "passes" the puck up in the air.

That happened at least 5 times in the game. He just cant make a pass and will just lobwedge it out and let other team have the puck most of the time.

Now that Jones has played top4 minutes and been decent. When Klef returns and Jones gets to play less minutes and easier match-ups (3rd pair) I think he could really thrive in that role and drive the play.

 

[McSuper]

AA Haas Nygard on the forth line to feast on lessors players. Speed to burn . 1/2 joking but it might be a good line .

I don’t get Oiler fans . They complain about coaches lines then they get a line that works (DRY) and fans want to break it up .

As for McDavids line . Ennis is a high energy smart player he needs to stay with McDavid . The RW is the question . Kassian looks great but then disappears for long periods. We need someone better . Neal is a pp specialist at this stage of his career . Hope Holland can move him in the off season and bring in a real good winger for McDavid . AA should get this season and the playoffs to buy into coach Tippett,s system if he does put him in the bottom 6 .

Overall the Oilers have been good this year . The still need improvements to become a true contender. Next year I like to see a line up like this

Ennis McDavid xxx
RNH Draisaitl Yamamoto
AA xxx Kassian
Nygard Sheahan Archibald
Haas

Klefbom Bouchard
Nurse Bear
Jones Larsson
Benning

Extend Larsson this summer at 3 million . He hasn’t earned his money 2 of the last 3 years . So he needs to take less money and have a reduced role

RNH has become the best winger we drafted but he still doesn’t drive his own line ! Extend him at 6.5 to 6.8

Extend Ennis at 1.1

Neal both Russell’s gone to open up cap

If Nurse wants 8 million he needs to go . He has value with 2 years left on his contract . He just isn’t a 8 million guy . If he goes hopefully he can be replaced by a better left D . I heard a guy in St Louis may be available . Get a couple of upgrade this team is going places

I would also try and Move Koskinen. I don’t think he that bad but going after Lehner would make a lot of sense . Keep Smith around as a bad up

 

[5 Mins 4 Ftg]

I get the distinct impression some people do not like it when we win

No question about that.

 

[BamaOil]

Draisaitl's development curve, even up until now, is just insane. He's improved draistically every year. He went from one of the worst players in the NHL to a 50 point player to a ppg player to a 100 point player to the best player in the world this year.

There is no telling when he will stop improving.

It's pretty crazy what he's accomplished, and he also seems very mature. I think he also brings leadership to the locker room. I mean, the way the team played without Davo was pretty inspiring, and I think Drai helped keep the focus both on and off the ice.

 

[BoldNewLettuce]

 

[tardigrade81]

Smith, Drai, McDavid, RNH and Melissa.

Lmao!!!


What a win!!! Smith was a beast last night too wow. Make a couple massive highlight type saves to win the game for us. Simply beautiful folks

Now then. As promised. Time to go to McDonald’s.

 

[tardigrade81]

It's pretty crazy what he's accomplished, and he also seems very mature. I think he also brings leadership to the locker room. I mean, the way the team played without Davo was pretty inspiring, and I think Drai helped keep the focus both on and off the ice.

Well said.

 

[Drivesaitl]

626 players in the NHL over the past 3 seasons with 1000+ TOI at 5 on 5...

AA ranks:

52nd in goals/60
4th in IPP (individual points percentage)
41st in shots/60
21st in penalties drawn/60


The guy has legitimate offensive skills and speed as evidenced by those numbers above.

The team/coaching just has to utilize him to the best of his abilities and he's going to be a valuable asset for this team.

Selfishness isn't a bad thing when you are a good offensive player.

He's had a shots/60 rate of 9.04 at 5 on 5 over the past 3 seasons and so far with the Oilers his shots/60 rate at 5 on 5 is only 4.71 shots/60 which lines up with the eye test that he's deferring and looking tentative... once he comes around and plays more "selfishly" and starts firing the puck more (closer to his career average) his effectiveness will increase as well.

Using Pts or G/60mins stats for a player that is often not in the lineup, scratched, and or not getting many minutes, and is always fresh as daisys is somewhat misleading. It is mostly because teams get the benefit of goals that actually occur, not goals that don't exist that are prorated. I mention this in situations where the real number ordinals would deviate substantially from the per/60mins rate.

So looking at actual Goals scored, and benefit accrued to team, AA has 57goals in those 3 seasons and falls back to 107th place. Also way back to 163 in pts in same span. So that paints a different picture in relation to an established unidimensional player that doesn't bag huge offense and yet has extremely bad GA #s, PLus AA is -63 in that span and an actual useful player, Tyler Bertuzzi is only -22 in that span with same accrued pts. So that with AA you are getting some production yes, but no intangibles, no other aspects of solid play, no defensive play etc.

So some moderate offensive blessings having this player, but superceded by nightmare negative differential with this player.

Seems like just a couple seasons ago the mantra regarding Yakupov was chasing bees. Despite Yakupov having some good stints, being elevated rarely, and looking good (ppg) in a 12 game stint where he was with McD. Really how worse would he be? The knock on Yak was he was too bad to put him on the ice due to GA. Well...

 

[Drivesaitl]

Exactly.

Since Jan 1 when the team as a whole turned things around these are the GA/60 numbers:

Larsson 2.37 in 406 5 vs 5 minutes
Klefbom 2.68 in 313 5 vs 5 minutes
Nurse 2.47 in 462 5 vs 5 minutes
Bear 2.63 in 433 5 vs 5 minutes

Since Feb 1 the numbers are

Larsson 2.40 in 250 5 vs 5 minutes
Klefbom 3.3 in 143 5 vs 5 minutes
Nurse 2.83 in 75 5 vs 5 minutes
Bear 3.3 in 254 5 vs 5 minutes

Now these are not explicitly individual stats of course but even the eye test to me suggests that Larsson isn't fancy but he has been effective.

​

I gave no time frame for my comment, thus not alluding to the time frame that you just detail here. I was looking at what Larsson has been like in a stint the past half a dozen games in which he has hit hardly anything (despite the team really being outgunned and outmatched in that regard), or that he scored a goal in his own net with a perfect blade directed redirection, or that last night he was on for a clear breakaway in which neither he or his rookie D picked up a guy wide open behind them. Or getting hemmed in countless times, not moving the puck crisply and for instance last night having a bad pressure sequence only because he didn't decision puck movement quicker.

Do you think his play has been solid last 6 games?

Larsson by my eye has been pretty ordinary this season. Certainly nothing that suggests trading an MVP player for. Larsson is here to be the #1 D. Always. Simple as that. He's supposed to be that fish in the sea. He's rarely been that in assignments, minutes played, usage etc. He's a clear fallen back player that is undisputably behind the better contributions of Nurse, Klef, Bear, and with that list primed to increase as our platoon of D prospects develop.

Unfortunately other than 1 season we haven't got what was advertised out of this player.

 

[5 Mins 4 Ftg]

Lmao!!!


What a win!!! Smith was a beast last night too wow. Make a couple massive highlight type saves to win the game for us. Simply beautiful folks

Now then. As promised. Time to go to McDonald’s.

Sausage n egg McMuffin x 2 and a bottle of water for me please.

 

[Drivesaitl]

Injuries happen seeing as you are propping Hall up you should realize that a few times Hall's end of season stat totals weren't that great due to injuries. His last 2 seasons here and his first in Jersey were less than great compared to the lockout season and the one the next season. AA is a guy that should give us offense at a reasonable AAV. This trade maybe his reality check and it may take until next season for it to pay big dividends. Time will tell but we paid a lot to get him and should do our best to get him comfortable here and playing at his best.

Players requiring a reality check, and that have considerable known baggage, and awful corralary numbers need to come into a new team exhibiting a will to change like their NHL lives depend on it. Because they likely do. I've mentioned Spooner in this a fair bit because he was the other guy we brought in that had a suspect coach relationships reputation and with AA that started in Junior, and proceeded to his NHL era. When players have had multiple known differences with coaches, and say a respected team Captain, it raises flags for me. It definitely raises flags.

 

[5 Mins 4 Ftg]

Was at the game with a couple of business associates of mine from Winnipeg. It was their first time in our barn and they had a great time despite the loss. Smith had himself a game thank goodness (among notable others). That 2nd period was brutal for us. The MVP chants for Leon were great. Fun game, tough road trip ahead. Off to Nashville!

 

[Mr Positive]

Players requiring a reality check, and that have considerable known baggage, and awful corralary numbers need to come into a new team exhibiting a will to change like their NHL lives depend on it. Because they likely do. I've mentioned Spooner in this a fair bit because he was the other guy we brought in that had a suspect coach relationships reputation and with AA that started in Junior, and proceeded to his NHL era. When players have had multiple known differences with coaches, and say a respected team Captain, it raises flags for me. It definitely raises flags.

Spooner is a bit different though. With AA at least the fans get it, as well as all the analysts. It was no reach

AA is a player that many GMs could have agreed to trade for him, but it's just a fact that often moves are not made because of a lack of information. So, if GMs are familiar with a player beforehand, a move is more likely. Spooner was viewed as a disappointment by all

I like the AA trade because Holland bought a skillset. We realistically couldnt add a fully established player because of the asset cost and cap cost. So, AA was always going to be a project. He will likely improve over time for us, and the ceiling is high as a complementary player

 

[BamaOil]

IMO... AA is best when you stick him on his own line and let him be "selfish". He has speed, he has hands and isn't a defensive dynamo.

That type of player belongs... in the middle/bottom 6.

He can feast on lower quality of competition and 2nd/3rd pairing D coverage... and add some MUCH needed scoring boost to the Oilers bottom 6... which would actually be monumentally valuable.

Here's an interesting stat for AA...

Over the last 3 seasons he's had 1.77 pts/60 at 5 on 5 while his team has scored just 2.14 G/60 while he's on the ice.

That shows he absolutely can drive offense on his line... as his IPP (Individual Point Production percentage) is 82.61%.

That rate is up there in the top 5 IPP rates in the NHL over the past 3 seasons along with players like Malkin/McDavid/Barzal/Kucherov/Kane etc. (among players with 100+ games played).

Basically shove him on a line with a couple decent defensive forwards who don't have a lot of offense in their games ("luckily" there's several that fit that mold on the Oilers)... and let AA feast on the lower level of competition down there.

I've read some of the back and forth regarding this, and I think you're on to something here. McD needs a shooter with at least enough hands to catch his passes and quickly fire the puck on net. Is that AA? I'm really not sure that he is that kind of player (as in I'm actually ignorant on his skillset, I haven't watched him prior to him playing here), but it does seem that he would be most comfortable being the "Davo Light" by being the guy who gains solid zone entries and keeps the opposing team's depth sweating. I also think Archie/Sheahan are good enough to keep up while mitigating any of AA's defensive deficiencies.

Going back to McD needing a high slot/top of circle shooter with good enough hands, let's see what our options are:

Drai - holy God yes but obviously he needs to drive his own line, which by now the debate has been settled - he IS the man.
Nuge - to me this is a really ideal fit. His wrister is dangerous on either side of the ice, but again obviously at this point you don't break him apart from Drai so that's out.
Kass - doesn't really fit this need at all. He's a grinder with decent IQ and surprisingly decent passing, but shooter and hands he is not.
Neal - Man this guy has the potential to be the shooter, but IDK, he just doesn't have it 5v5 or on the rush at all. Love what he has given us this season on the PP though.
Yamo - don't think he has much of a shot, but could be wrong there. I think he's fantastic behind the net, in the corners, and in tight. Really a perfect complimentary player to feed Drai in the high slot.
Tennis - Ignorant to his ability as a shooter. Maybe, maybe not?
Chia - What a frustrating player. I actually think he can rip the puck, we've seen it before last season and in snippets this season, but the guy just doesn't have it really in any scenario. Also, my God does he ever have stone hands. I've only been playing hockey for 5 years myself and, not shitting you, I have better hands than he does.
Archie - Great grinder/clock killer, doesn't fit this need whatsoever.
Sheahan - Similar to Archie, but a little worse in every way.
Haas - No. Needs to be on the 4th and kill clock.
Khaira - LOL. Another super frustrating player. This guy has all the tools to eat up clock and do the dirty work in the corners, but he doesn't even do that anymore. Stone hands; might actually be worse than Chia. It's actually comical how many wide open nets from 5 feet out he's biffed throughout his career.
Nygard - Not sure this guy even makes the roster when he gets back.
PRuss - No. Send him back to AHL for life, like ASAP.
Granlund - I think his NHL career is about over. Just don't see much out of this player.
Jurco - This guy has the potential to be a slippery and shifty player, but don't see him ever filling this role. Hard to tell obviously from the injury before the season even started.
Benson - Not a shooter. Will be a decent depth playmaker at some point.


That's (I think?) every winger we have. Not really a single compelling choice to fit this role for Davo...so for right now -- right right now -- I think ultimately, we have to put AA with Davo and see what he can do. If AA just never gets it together for the rest of this season, then I'm all for throwing him to depth and letting him be Davo Light next season, and then we go out in the summer and go hunt for a shooter (I'll give my left nut for Hoffman).

 

[tardigrade81]

Sausage n egg McMuffin x 2 and a bottle of water for me please.

Alright, give me a minute. My stomach isn’t doing great things right now lol. I went to a location I usually don’t. They were pretty greasy today ugh.