We didn’t know what we had

[Gurglesons]

I can't think of another club who's cap allocation is more f***ed than the Leafs

Yes it must be awful to have Nylander, Matthews, Marner and Tavares signed to big ticket deals.

You guys really need to chill. Pens fans did this same shit with Malkin and Crosby’s contracts and they won back to back with them as well as Letang making 7+ and Fleury making 5.25 riding the pine.

 

[AvroArrow]

I'm the first one to critique Dubas lately but he didn't sign PM
And Zaitsev had what 5 years left? Connor Brown was another Soup here.

I'm talking about Lou screwing us with bad contracts that forced Dubas to make big trades to get rid of them.

 

[ShaneFalco]

Yes it must be awful to have Nylander, Matthews, Marner and Tavares signed to big ticket deals.

You guys really need to chill. Pens fans did this same shit with Malkin and Crosby’s contracts and they won back to back with them as well as Letang making 7+ and Fleury making 5.25 riding the pine.

Yes currently it is. See the last 4 years of playoff exits. No bacbone to this team, no compete when it matters. Money allocated to the wrong mix as we learn year after year. It can be fixed but Kyle won't do it
And you're going to compare to Pitts?

 

[ShaneFalco]

I'm talking about Lou.

ahhhhh sorry!

 

[egd27]

Calling that a small issue is a massive understatement. He gave Marleau the money we were supposed to give JVR. That's worse than the Kadri deal. At least we got Kerfoot back in that trade and used the free cap to get Brodie. We lost the 13th overall pick in last years draft AND had to let JVR walk because that Marleau deal and it screwed us for the cap. That's about as garbage as it gets.

I think if you stick to the facts, JVR's UFA money and needing to rid ourselves of Marleau can be directly linked to the $11M Tavares signing.

 

[AvroArrow]

I think if you stick to the facts, JVR's UFA money and needing to rid ourselves of Marleau can be directly linked to the $11M Tavares signing.

We could have extended him, then traded him for assets before signing Tavares. Rather than let him walk for free

 

[egd27]

We could have extended him, then traded him for assets before signing Tavares. Rather than let him walk for free

Sure, they could have done that, they had the cap space prior to signing JT, AM, & MM. The Marleau contract would not have been a factor in doing that.

 

[Rare Jewel]

Lou sucked while he was here lol. He prob would've done a better negotiation with 34/16 and Tavares but he was far from great when we had him. Signing Marleau to that deal was atrocious, we lost JVR for free because of it. The Zaitsev deal made us lose Connor Brown, just to get rid of that awful contract.

I seem to remember people being pretty ok with letting Bozak and JVR walk. Mostly to re-allocate the cap space to the Matthews, Marner and Nylander.

Brown also was fairly unwanted at the time seemingly. Likely not getting past at that time Kapanen on the 3rd RW spot and also being too much a of Babcock favorite sometimes displacing Nylander with Matthews.

 

[hotpaws]

Calling that a small issue is a massive understatement. He gave Marleau the money we were supposed to give JVR. That's worse than the Kadri deal. At least we got Kerfoot back in that trade and used the free cap to get Brodie. We lost the 13th overall pick in last years draft AND had to let JVR walk because that Marleau deal and it screwed us for the cap. That's about as garbage as it gets.

And having to give up Connor Brown just to get rid of Zaitsev.

If we re singed JVR how do they sign Tavares ?

Lou dumped worse contracts without giving up assets , trading the 13th pick is on Dubas’ incompetence

and best of all

how does trading Kari for Kerfoot plus about 1m in salary savings get you Brodie ?

 

[Bomber0104]

I'm talking about Lou screwing us with bad contracts that forced Dubas to make big trades to get rid of them.

Dubas forced himself to make his own trades by signing 4 players to half of his salary cap.

Once again, the existing contracts on the team had nothing to do with him doing that.

I really don't understand why people are struggling with this.

 

[ShaneFalco]

I seem to remember people being pretty ok with letting Bozak and JVR walk.

"own rentals"

 

[gamer1035]

Dubas forced himself to make his own trades by signing 4 players to half of his salary cap.

Once again, the existing contracts on the team had nothing to do with him doing that.

I really don't understand why people are struggling with this.

Exactly this. Dubas signed rfa deals that had no comparable back then, and still don't today. I do not understand why all of Dubas; supporters ignore this. His mistakes destroyed our teams potential.

I thought Burkie was okay as a gm towards the end of his tenure, but that Kessel trade alone destroyed that teams future.

I don't want my gm's making any mistakes, let alone giant mistakes that ruin the direction of the franchise. Its a fireable offense. Dubas should be fired for those contracts alone, and anyone above him (Shanny) should be fired along with him for approving it.

 

[Cams]

We could have extended him, then traded him for assets before signing Tavares. Rather than let him walk for free

This pretty much never happens.

 

[ShaneFalco]

but that Kessel trade alone destroyed that teams future.

Making Kessel one of your leaders was never a good idea. It's like making Mitch one

 

[TOGuy14]

Why do people think Lou is this master negotiator? You guys ignore the Marleau contract? And no, I'm not some huge Dubas fan, because I know that's the go-to for Lou's fans here.

Seriously, the guy recently gave:

31 year old Matt Martin four years
Pageau 6 years @ 5M
Anders Lee 7 years @ 7M
Eberle 5 years @ 5.5M
Brock Nelson 6 years @ 6M
Komarov 4 years @ 3M

Let's not also forget he signed Marleau to 3 years @ 6.25M when even in the press conference Babs was talking about how the third year would hurt

Lou signed Kovalchuk to a contract so long and expensive that the NHL voided it for being too ridiculous even for their liking

This whole myth that Lou is this godfather figure that bullies players into basically signing for peanuts is so dumb

 

[AvroArrow]

If we re singed JVR how do they sign Tavares ?

Lou dumped worse contracts without giving up assets , trading the 13th pick is on Dubas’ incompetence

and best of all

how does trading Kari for Kerfoot plus about 1m in salary savings get you Brodie ?

JVR should've been extended prior to the 2018 UFA opening day, maybe a year in advance and Marleau never should've got that deal, especially not for 3 years. I'm Not suggesting we should've re-signed him on July 1st when we made a play for JT and at which point we were already stuck with Marleau, because at that point we couldn't. We could only afford to keep 2 of the 3 contracts, JVR/Marleau/JT. We obviously wanted JT so he's staying, Marleau was not moving due to his shit contract and ridiculous cost to move it. Marleau's contract never should've been on our books. That deal should never have been signed, and if it was it should've been 2 years tops. But since it was signed and was immovable (at least price wise at the time) we had to let JVR go and keep Marleau. JVR is only making 800k more than what we had Marleau signed for. But Marleau was essentially useless and eating cap for a team trying to contend so we had to move him for a ridiculous price of 13th overall pick + a little. We could've had JVR on the roster instead of Marleau had Lou not absolutely butchered that deal. And then also had the ability to trade him for something useful.

The decision was never Tavares or JVR, it was JVR or Marleau. We knew we were going hard after JT that summer and we knew JVRs ufa status. As soon as the deal for Marleau was made for that price and 3 years it was a known fact that JVR has to go, we couldn't afford to re-sign him AND make a play for Tavares the same summer, unless of course we get rid of that garbage Marleau contract.

And we got Barrie and Kerfoot for Kadri, Barrie walked in FA (THANK GOD) who had a 5.5M cap hit and once he left it gave us the cap space to sign Brodie.

 

[ACC1224]

Yes I'm sure he took the first deal that he got and didn't bother negotiating or making calls. Who the hell is gonna take on 6.9M for an old guy who can't even skate anymore. Imagine we had Thornton signed for 6.9M going into next year lol who on earth would take that deal without a massive payment. It was known he was shopping around looking for takers. And for us to have a decent roster under the cap, that's the price we had to pay. And since we couldn't afford to pay JVR because we locked up this old LW for 3 years, JVR went to Philly for ree.

Zaitsevs deal was awful too, there's no way you move that contract without adding.

He created all of that by maxing out the cap and leaving no flexibility.

 

[Bomber0104]

Exactly this. Dubas signed rfa deals that had no comparable back then, and still don't today. I do not understand why all of Dubas; supporters ignore this. His mistakes destroyed our teams potential.

I thought Burkie was okay as a gm towards the end of his tenure, but that Kessel trade alone destroyed that teams future.

I don't want my gm's making any mistakes, let alone giant mistakes that ruin the direction of the franchise. Its a fireable offense. Dubas should be fired for those contracts alone, and anyone above him (Shanny) should be fired along with him for approving it.

The retirement deal to Marleau, without a doubt, was signed under the assumption that rough half of the Leafs salary cap wouldn't be allocated to 4 players within three years.

That's an entirely reasonable assumption to make considering it's never before been done.

Only our rookie GM was dumb enough to do it.

 

[AllDay28]

The retirement deal to Marleau, without a doubt, was signed under the assumption that rough half of the Leafs salary cap wouldn't be allocated to 4 players within three years.

That's an entirely reasonable assumption to make considering it's never before been done.

Only our rookie GM was dumb enough to do it.

I mean it was only done with Crosby flower letang and Malkin but sure

 

[AllDay28]

I love the excuses. Oh they signed those horrid deals cause they didn’t expect good players to actually get paid. Good thing we allocated funds to scrubs like Zeitsev. Stupid Dubas doesn’t he know you give good rfas nothing and shit players undeserved contracts?

also if we’re speaking on deserved, what did Zeitsev do to deserve his??

and y’all think Lou wouldn’t of caved to the big 4. Laugh out f***ing loud. Guy gave a plug 5+/year. Marner would of got 13

 

[Clark4Ever]

I seem to remember people being pretty ok with letting Bozak and JVR walk. Mostly to re-allocate the cap space to the Matthews, Manrer and Nylander.

Brown also was fairly unwanted at the time seemingly. Likely not getting past at that time Kapanen on the 3rd RW spot and also being too much a of Babcock favorite sometimes displacing Nylander with Matthews.

Speaking of Kapanen, he produced at a 20 goal, 60 point pace for Pittsburgh this season. Great value for his contract.

We got a seemingly good return for him, but he is another recent example of a cap casualty on this team.

 

[Gurglesons]

Yes currently it is. See the last 4 years of playoff exits. No bacbone to this team, no compete when it matters. Money allocated to the wrong mix as we learn year after year. It can be fixed but Kyle won't do it
And you're going to compare to Pitts?

I get that it is frustrating losing multiple years in the 1st round, but that's the playoffs. Crosby and Malkin in their prime..

2012 - Down 3-0 against their biggest rival.
2013 - Swept in the ECF
2014 - Choke a 3-1 lead against the Rangers
2015 - 1st round exit.

It happens. It's part of the process. Believe me as a Penguins fan, the teams with the best players signed typically break through.

 

[Bomber0104]

Speaking of Kapanen, he produced at a 20 goal, 60 point pace for Pittsburgh this season. Great value for his contract.

We got a seemingly good return for him, but he is another recent example of a cap casualty on this team.

I'm sure that wasn't Dubas' fault either

 

[Rare Jewel]

We could have extended him, then traded him for assets before signing Tavares. Rather than let him walk for free

If they were going to re-sign, they would've surely got assurance that they would be staying beyond one season no?


I should say, that I'm not even really a fan of Lou TBH. But to pick that out does seem like cherry picking. If you want beat him with the Marleau or Zaitsev deals, I wouldn't disagree there actually. But they are made worst retrospectively by signing Tavares, which how were they to know that he was going to or willing to leave the Islanders 12 months before.

 

[ToneDog]

The retirement deal to Marleau, without a doubt, was signed under the assumption that rough half of the Leafs salary cap wouldn't be allocated to 4 players within three years.

That's an entirely reasonable assumption to make considering it's never before been done.

Only our rookie GM was dumb enough to do it.

He could and he did and he still has his job. Insanity.