We didn’t know what we had

[notbias]

Avs are learning how to lose before they can win it all. We can't even get past round #1 and are regressing. Now if Sakic paints himself into a corner negotiating new deals, and they regress, then sure fire him.

Why aren't the Leafs learning? They have a younger core.

Personally, I think Colorado is on the right path, and no need to blow up their team. Just trying to get an understanding of the difference. Is it just they are able to win a round before failing?

 

[ToneDog]

Lou sucked his last bit with us, and the Isles are going to get trounced by TB once again.

I do not expect the Isles to beat TB but they will not get trounced but if them getting trounced by TB makes you feel better about Lou losing, have at it. Out of curiosity will you feel better if Habs are trounced as well because Bergevin sucked as well until he and a rookie coach took down Dubas' mighty Leafs ??

 

[Garthinater]

I really thought after the 3rd embarrassing loss under dubas that his fan boys would've started to dwindle but they seem to be as rabid as ever.

The gm who inherited a 105 point team and has squandered 3 of the most promising seasons we've had in years.

Not a single team has won a cup with 50% of their cap tied up in 4 forwards.

Only 1 player making 10+ mil won even a single playoff round. We have 3.

Did dubas not know this?

I genuinely wonder how many times we need to lose for his fan boys to finally give up on him. Although they seem more like Kyle dubas fans than leaf fans which might mean they will root for him until he is gone.

 

[ToneDog]

Why aren't the Leafs learning? They have a younger core.

Personally, I think Colorado is on the right path, and no need to blow up their team. Just trying to get an understanding of the difference. Is it just they are able to win a round before failing?

The saying is teams have to learn to lose before they can win. Jays were a good example, as were TB, Caps, etc.

Colorado is definitely on the right track but the poster asked whether Sakic should be fired because they lost in round #2 again and we are calling for Dubas to be fired because we lost again (I assume that is what the poster was hinting). I say no.

 

[ottomaddox]

Kadri...

...maybe they knew a little bit of what they had.

Maybe...

 

[mydnyte]

Avs are learning how to lose before they can win it all. We can't even get past round #1 and are regressing. Now if Sakic paints himself into a corner negotiating new deals, and they regress, then sure fire him.

Sakic is deep into a corner already.
he has to resign his captain Landeskog up for a big jump
he has to resign his #1 D-man Makar likely want a Huge deal
he has to sign a starting goalie, AND a backup goalie
Saad is a UFA
Timmins is an RFA
Jost is an RFA (minor raise likely)
18 signed players and just under $20 mil of which Land/Makar may take 80-90% ...if they both get long term deals at $8mil which you could technically call decent deals even if one gets the 8.5 (Makar) and 7.5 (Land) ...leave under 4 mil for a starting goalie, a backup, and top 6 winger and still need to fill out the roster.

 

[57 Years No Cup]

True story...I was listening to 97.1 The Ticket out of Detroit this morning and even Stoney commented on the 'smarminess' of Leafs fans. I wanted to call in and tell him "I'm a Leafs' fan and I agree with you". The reputation is known far and wide.

Total arrogance and cockiness for absolutely no reason.

 

[Garthinater]

Bridge deals almost always come back to haunt teams. Barzal has significantly more leverage now unless he flopped through his bridge, which is also not good for the Islanders.

If he doesn't get an offer he likes, he takes his 10 mill QO and is a pending UFA in a year. If he does, it likely overpays him because he took less money earlier on. There are exceptions, but they are far less common than people think.

Dubas fan boys have been 100% wrong about the islanders over the last 3 years.

They have also been 100% wrong about the leafs.

Its almost like they are using emotions when judging and not facts / reality.

Being unbiased is a much more accurate way to evaluate.

 

[Garthinater]

One of my favourite parts was when lou won gm of the year and the dubas fan boys told us he didn't deserve it and is a terrible gm lmao

 

[ToneDog]

Sakic is deep into a corner already.
he has to resign his captain Landeskog up for a big jump
he has to resign his #1 D-man Makar likely want a Huge deal
he has to sign a starting goalie, AND a backup goalie
Saad is a UFA
Timmins is an RFA
Jost is an RFA (minor raise likely)
18 signed players and just under $20 mil of which Land/Makar may take 80-90% ...if they both get long term deals at $8mil which you could technically call decent deals even if one gets the 8.5 (Makar) and 7.5 (Land) ...leave under 4 mil for a starting goalie, a backup, and top 6 winger and still need to fill out the roster.

Yup he could be in cap hell if he tries to resign all his stars to what they are worth. The good thing for him is that he will most likely not have to overpay because he is in Colorado and they did not sign an $11m UFA. He could also move one or two of his stud RFAs for cheaper prospects and/or picks. He just needs to get in front of it and not let it swallow him up.

 

[Garthinater]

I am assuming everyone feels Colorado should fire Sakic too? The team is built for the regular season.

3 years in a row, second-round losers, stars disappear when they are needed, Colorado has some amazing contracts (that were signed before their stars broke out) and were not able to use that valuable extra cap space to build a winner.

Are you saying 3 series wins in 3 years is = to 0 series wins in 3 years?

I can tell you right now they are not equal lmao

 

[yubbers]

I really thought after the 3rd embarrassing loss under dubas that his fan boys would've started to dwindle but they seem to be as rabid as ever.

The gm who inherited a 105 point team and has squandered 3 of the most promising seasons we've had in years.

Not a single team has won a cup with 50% of their cap tied up in 4 forwards.

Only 1 player making 10+ mil won even a single playoff round. We have 3.

Did dubas not know this?

I genuinely wonder how many times we need to lose for his fan boys to finally give up on him. Although they seem more like Kyle dubas fans than leaf fans which might mean they will root for him until he is gone.

Social media trains ppl to be partisan lemmings. They choose a side and will lie through their teeth to defend it. They're incapable of admitting on ever being wrong. It's quite amazing to witness these days. Line they'll defend the undefendable and look you straight in the eye doing it. It's so weird.

 

[notbias]

Are you saying 3 series wins in 3 years is = to 0 series wins in 3 years?

I can tell you right now they are not equal lmao

No, so, really hard to understand, but a more mature team like Colorado is losing before they are expected to, consistently. They appear to be getting a free pass from people like you, but Dubas needs to be fired immediately. If next year we win a round and lose in the second, that is success in your eyes, right? We can do that for 3 years and it is fine.

 

[57 Years No Cup]

Are you saying 3 series wins in 3 years is = to 0 series wins in 3 years?

I can tell you right now they are not equal lmao

It's the new progressive math. You know, equity and all that.

 

[ToneDog]

True story...I was listening to 97.1 The Ticket out of Detroit this morning and even Stoney commented on the 'smarminess' of Leafs fans. I wanted to call in and tell him "I'm a Leafs' fan and I agree with you". The reputation is known far and wide.

Total arrogance and cockiness for absolutely no reason.

Last year they were laughing at us because somebody posted that we are the Yankees without the winning. I get what they were trying to get at but it was dumb. I liken us to being closer to the Cubs.

 

[Suntouchable13]

I wouldn’t get too attached to Dubas and Shanny. If the team doesn’t have some miraculous run to the East final next year, both of them are gone. It’s highly unlikely Leafs will even win a round, let alone 2. They are as good as gone. MLSE is just wasting our time.

 

[justashadowof]

Social media trains ppl to be partisan lemmings. They choose a side and will lie through their teeth to defend it. They're incapable of admitting on ever being wrong. It's quite amazing to witness these days. Line they'll defend the undefendable and look you straight in the eye doing it. It's so weird.

The evidence for what you're saying is the unanimity and predictability of the grouping of positions across subject matters. The vast majority of people seem to agree on one thing: there is only 2 positions on any specific subject. I think social media has accelerated this to an insane degree. There were once maybe 10-20% of the population who never stop talking about fricking politics and current events especially at inappropriate times like funerals, family picnics, the workplace, hockey dressing rooms, etc. now it seems like it's everywhere. I think everybody should get off social media and limit their consumption of the news. It's really really bad for us. I think in 10 years time if we survive the current unstable world we will all know that social media was as unhealthy as many other destructive addictions like gambling, drugs, porn, etc.

 

[hotpaws]

I really thought after the 3rd embarrassing loss under dubas that his fan boys would've started to dwindle but they seem to be as rabid as ever.

I genuinely wonder how many times we need to lose for his fan boys to finally give up on him. Although they seem more like Kyle dubas fans than leaf fans which might mean they will root for him until he is gone.

had you dealt with the Burke fan club you'd know they never stop supporting and they get more and more rabid with every failed season

the majority of Dubie's supporters truly believe the GM and the team are the same entity and it's impossible to be a fan of the team if you don't blindly support the GM

 

[mydnyte]

I really thought after the 3rd embarrassing loss under dubas that his fan boys would've started to dwindle but they seem to be as rabid as ever.

The gm who inherited a 105 point team and has squandered 3 of the most promising seasons we've had in years.

Not a single team has won a cup with 50% of their cap tied up in 4 forwards.

Only 1 player making 10+ mil won even a single playoff round. We have 3.

Did dubas not know this?

I genuinely wonder how many times we need to lose for his fan boys to finally give up on him. Although they seem more like Kyle dubas fans than leaf fans which might mean they will root for him until he is gone.

these are such a meaningless points

#1 how many teams in the Cap era have had 4 forwards that were by far the best players on their team. ...most have 2-3 at most and a dman as their best players. So, until there is another team that can say it's 4 best players are all forwards, its impossible to occur.

the 2nd point is a false narrative. players getting paid over 10 million (list from lowest to highest paid) Ovechkin, Burns, Aho, Josi, Rantanen, Backstrom, Vaselvski. ...they may have lower cap hits than 10 mil, but, all are making 10 or more.

Did any GM know that Covid would hit, and create a 'flat cap' for a number of years, when the average growth was 6-8% per year, and now every team in the league is in a cap mess (save 4 bottom dwelling teams).

None of what i said 'defends' Dubas, they are only statements of fact.

 

[613Leafer]

If you could somehow take Lou's ability to negotiate with RFAs, his no nonsense attitude, and ability to get guys to buy into a strong TEAM mentality, and then never let him sign a UFA and instead have that decision go over to an assistant GM, you'd have a pretty good management group.

Lou's downfall are the Clowe, Marleau, Komarov, etc type of contracts.

 

[socko]

Jason Spezza finished 3rd on the team in P60 during the regular season.

 

[Superstar]

Sakic is deep into a corner already.
he has to resign his captain Landeskog up for a big jump
he has to resign his #1 D-man Makar likely want a Huge deal
he has to sign a starting goalie, AND a backup goalie
Saad is a UFA
Timmins is an RFA
Jost is an RFA (minor raise likely)
18 signed players and just under $20 mil of which Land/Makar may take 80-90% ...if they both get long term deals at $8mil which you could technically call decent deals even if one gets the 8.5 (Makar) and 7.5 (Land) ...leave under 4 mil for a starting goalie, a backup, and top 6 winger and still need to fill out the roster.

Kadri really screwed up...last year and this year was the Avs best chance to win a Cup...last year, Kadri's bad defensive play led to Dallas' OT goal to eliminate the Avs...this year? Well, we know happened this year, lol...

 

[hotpaws]

If you could somehow take Lou's ability to negotiate with RFAs, his no nonsense attitude, and ability to get guys to buy into a strong TEAM mentality, and then never let him sign a UFA and instead have that decision go over to an assistant GM, you'd have a pretty good management group.

Lou's downfall are the Clowe, Marleau, Komarov, etc type of contracts.

yup , Komo's deal has completely destroyed the powerhouse team he took over . lol

 

[mydnyte]

Yup he could be in cap hell if he tries to resign all his stars to what they are worth. The good thing for him is that he will most likely not have to overpay because he is in Colorado and they did not sign an $11m UFA. He could also move one or two of his stud RFAs for cheaper prospects and/or picks. He just needs to get in front of it and not let it swallow him up.

Sakic got lucky he signed Mac before he was 'good' ...his first 3 years he was not very good, and signed a deal that was better than his play, and then he broke out HUGE the season After he signed. had Mac broke out 1 year earlier he'd be at 9+
nobody can say anything about that deal other than Sakic got very lucky.
Mac's stats the season he signed at 6.3 cap hit
Season before contract 72GP 21G 31A 52P -4
First contract season 82GP 16G 37A 53P -14
Now, if he continued on the 50 point path, that deal was a huge overpay, and he's a bust, but, he got to another level, and has stayed there.
now, after 2 more seasons he'll be looking for 11-12+ on a long term deal, so Sakic has to keep that in mind, with this flat cap, or he loses Mac or has to trade a core player to fit the salary.
trade one of his stud RFA's ...he has ONE stud RFA Makar, best hope he has is to bridge him, but then, he'll need to sign Makar and Mac to much bigger deals, and Bowen cones off his entry level deal too.
...unless they lose Landeskog, but, he's just as important to that top line as Mac is, and prob moreso than Rantanen.

Its sucks for the Leafs now, but, we dont need to make space for our stars, the salary is already allocated during the flat cap era.

 

[mydnyte]

Kadri really screwed up...last year and this year was the Avs best chance to win a Cup...last year, Kadri's bad defensive play led to Dallas' OT goal to eliminate the Avs...this year? Well, we know happened this year, lol...

Well, if Kadri doesnt get suspended twice, would the Leafs have won a playoff series by now, likely yes.
does he get traded, perhaps, but, perhaps not.
Now he's killing Colorado's chances while they had cap flexibility, but, thats gone now too, and only going to get worse in 2 years when Mac needs to be re-upped at max $$.