VAN 3 - LAK 0 "It's only two, err three games"

[Ziggy Stardust]

It's usually a disaster when other fans come into our threads.

Hopefully nobody is offended, because this team completely sucks right now and they deserve every bit of criticism for being a bunch of slack offs.

No urgency, no second or third effort, undisciplined play, no fight in retrieving pucks -- this team has lost its identity.

 

[moosehead81]

Team surprised me last night- very little sustained pressure, particularly in the 2nd period, which I watched most of. If this goes to 3-7 or 2-7-1 in the first 10 games, I'd expect some sort of change. It's tough asking a team to play 4 straight years of Sutter style hockey with a lot of banging and defensive posture play even if it ended up with the prize at the end of 2 of them. Still time to turn it around dramatically but teams hate to lose 3 in a row, particularly at home.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

Team surprised me last night- very little sustained pressure, particularly in the 2nd period, which I watched most of. If this goes to 3-7 or 2-7-1 in the first 10 games, I'd expect some sort of change. It's tough asking a team to play 4 straight years of Sutter style hockey with a lot of banging and defensive posture play even if it ended up with the prize at the end of 2 of them. Still time to turn it around dramatically but teams hate to lose 3 in a row, particularly at home.

For me the problem is they don't seem to hate it enough.

Who knows, maybe they're just out of emotional reserves.

 

[Reclamation Project]

Hopefully nobody is offended, because this team completely sucks right now and they deserve every bit of criticism for being a bunch of slack offs.

No urgency, no second or third effort, undisciplined play, no fight in retrieving pucks -- this team has lost its identity.

I certainly wasn't, but it is irritating having other fans lecture us on the Kings. We watch the games. We analyze the games. We know what's going on. Plus the majority of their posts are delusional anyways.

 

[KINGS17]

Team surprised me last night- very little sustained pressure, particularly in the 2nd period, which I watched most of. If this goes to 3-7 or 2-7-1 in the first 10 games, I'd expect some sort of change. It's tough asking a team to play 4 straight years of Sutter style hockey with a lot of banging and defensive posture play even if it ended up with the prize at the end of 2 of them. Still time to turn it around dramatically but teams hate to lose 3 in a row, particularly at home.

Yeah, it's tough getting professionals to act in a professional manner.

I understand the waning of physical ability, but this mentally tired stuff is a player weakness, not a coaching problem.

I don't see this problem on the New England Patriots for example, and those players play for one of the biggest aholes in the NFL.

 

[YP44]

It just shows that Lombardi is a great builder for an organization, he builds teams very well. He did that with the Sharks and in the recent past with L.A.

The problem is this organization is reeling, and Dean's culture mantra got blown to smithereens in less than one year by reckless players he acquired.

Things are about to go off the rails pretty fast if things don't turn around. I'm not sure they can, the top teams in the league have adjusted and improved their speed lineups while the Kings stay with a heavy lineup. It's going to cause issues going forward, we look slow because we are. Has nothing to do with effort but the way the team was constructed by its architect.

My hope is that Dean starts returning to the blueprint he started out with. Acquiring draft picks and making low cost high risk trades. He's doing the opposite lately, draft picks are being sent out and making high cost and high risk trades. Go back to what got you here DL.

building from the net out. Our D is the most suspect it has been in 5 years

 

[Fat Elvis]

building from the net out. Our D is the most suspect it has been in 5 years

Bingo

 

[Reclamation Project]

I still believe this team is a top four defenseman away from being very, very good. Martinez needs to wake up and seize the opportunity. Greene belongs nowhere near this roster and I've been one of his bigger supporters for years. But all of that is not moot if the top players keep taking nights off.

I want -

Martinez - Doughty
Muzzin - Forbort
McNabb - Ehrhoff

I know it's wonky as Forbort is a leftie, but it's worth a shot. Shake it up.

 

[Herby]

It just shows that Lombardi is a great builder for an organization, he builds teams very well. He did that with the Sharks and in the recent past with L.A.

The problem is this organization is reeling, and Dean's culture mantra got blown to smithereens in less than one year by reckless players he acquired.

Things are about to go off the rails pretty fast if things don't turn around. I'm not sure they can, the top teams in the league have adjusted and improved their speed lineups while the Kings stay with a heavy lineup. It's going to cause issues going forward, we look slow because we are. Has nothing to do with effort but the way the team was constructed by its architect.

My hope is that Dean starts returning to the blueprint he started out with. Acquiring draft picks and making low cost high risk trades. He's doing the opposite lately, draft picks are being sent out and making high cost and high risk trades. Go back to what got you here DL.

Remember all the comments about building a decade long playoff team, not just having a few good years then collapsing like TB, Boston and Carolina after they won. About still building from within and not making shortsighted trades?

Somewhere along the lines the Kings got away from that, they won, and that is great, but people need to accept the fact that the window is shut. We traded the chance to contend for a decade for 2 SC's, I think everyone makes that trade, but people need to wake and smell the coffee, we have serious roster issues and very little in the system right now that is close to making an impact at the NHL level.

The Lucic trade never should have been made knowing that this would be the roster. Unfortunately the Lucic trade looks like another example of a GM that just can't accept the fact that his beloved core is slowing down and no longer championship caliber. That is why I question whether Dean or Futa should be the guy to tear this down.

 

[mrkolice]

Yeah, it's tough getting professionals to act in a professional manner.

I understand the waning of physical ability, but this mentally tired stuff is a player weakness, not a coaching problem.

I don't see this problem on the New England Patriots for example, and those players play for one of the biggest aholes in the NFL.

sutter's system is unsustainable on a long-term basis, it was discussed here before, many times. your slaves will eventually die if you force them too hard, and then all you can do is bodycount. how many missing in action in last year?

old core with chromed balls looks tired after 3 games. a bunch of newcomers look like having a hard time to quickly adapt. and we are where we are, with 0-3 and with nothing to cheer about.

and in this regard coach and manager are professionals in the same manner as players are.

 

[KingsFan7824]

sutter's system is unsustainable on a long-term basis, it was discussed here before, many times. your slaves will eventually die if you force them too hard, and then all you can do is bodycount. how many missing in action in last year?

old core with chromed balls looks tired after 3 games. a bunch of newcomers look like having a hard time to quickly adapt. and we are where we are, with 0-3 and with nothing to cheer about.

and in this regard coach and manager are professionals in the same manner as players are.

Every coach has been fired, so every coach is unsustainable on a long term basis.

Does Sutter really push them too hard? His whole thing has been about puck possession. When you chase the game, as the Kings have been doing since the start of last year, that's when you get tired.

All any coach wants, and the only way any system works, is players going to the net, moving their feet, and making good passes.

 

[mrkolice]

Every coach has been fired, so every coach is unsustainable on a long term basis.

Does Sutter really push them too hard? His whole thing has been about puck possession. When you chase the game, as the Kings have been doing since the start of last year, that's when you get tired.

All any coach wants, and the only way any system works, is players going to the net, moving their feet, and making good passes.

so why do we suck? i guess that's the main question now. why?

system: Jason Lewis made a cpl of good articles on this subject not so long ago (e.g. http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog/Jason-Lewis/Size-and-the-Identity-Game/179/68842). one fine quote:

The Kings play a heavy game. A lot of it comes down to coaching, but some of it comes down to just plain having huge freaking players that grind you into dirt.


why the guys can't deliver it anymore? imo the root of the problem lies in coaching.

 

[KINGS17]

so why do we suck? i guess that's the main question now. why?

system: Jason Lewis made a cpl of good articles on this subject not so long ago (e.g. http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog/Jason-Lewis/Size-and-the-Identity-Game/179/68842). one fine quote:

The Kings play a heavy game. A lot of it comes down to coaching, but some of it comes down to just plain having huge freaking players that grind you into dirt.


why the guys can't deliver it anymore? imo the root of the problem lies in coaching.

Because the players, especially the team's best players, are not executing the system to the best of their ability. Actually, not even close to the best of their ability.

These guys had plenty of time off in the off season. It's the players that don't go to the net, it's the players that don't forecheck, it's the players that aren't putting in enough effort.

Maybe it's time to get some new players. I don't expect guys approaching 30 years of age or in excess of 30 years of age to be the main cogs of a system that demands players to be committed to puck possession and a heavy game.

 

[mrkolice]

Because the players, especially the team's best players, are not executing the system to the best of their ability. Actually, not even close to the best of their ability.

These guys had plenty of time off in the off season. It's the players that don't go to the net, it's the players that don't forecheck, it's the players that aren't putting in enough effort.

Maybe it's time to get some new players. I don't expect guys approaching 30 years of age or in excess of 30 years of age to be the main cogs of a system that demands players to be committed to puck possession and a heavy game.

in any case it probably means that someone will get fired soon. i've watched all the games so far and we need tectonic shifts, asap, to win just one game.

you're an expert: can kopi be traded this year, in 2015? i suspect he'll be traded on a deadline 29/feb if sutter survives until then.

 

[ScoreZeGoals]

This Kings team hasn't earned patience. We were all patient last season and the reward was a lackluster effort, a horrendous offseason and players moved. I'm not a GM, I'm not a scout, I'm not an accountant-I'm a fan of the Kings and what I'm watching is an awful hockey team, simple as that.

This is such a damn good post.

 

[Bandit]

Yeah, it's tough getting professionals to act in a professional manner.

I understand the waning of physical ability, but this mentally tired stuff is a player weakness, not a coaching problem.

I don't see this problem on the New England Patriots for example, and those players play for one of the biggest aholes in the NFL.

Not disagreeing with you that the onus is on the players, but football is a different animal. I'd be willing to bet that the number of players besides Brady that have been on the Patriots for more the 3-4 years is close to 0, and that's with a 50-something man roster.

 

[Bandit]

This Kings team hasn't earned patience. We were all patient last season and the reward was a lackluster effort, a horrendous offseason and players moved. I'm not a GM, I'm not a scout, I'm not an accountant-I'm a fan of the Kings and what I'm watching is an awful hockey team, simple as that.

Yup. Sometimes you win, sometimes you lose, but the bottom line is we are watching to be entertained, and there's been nothing entertaining about these first three games outside of the first three minutes of the San Jose game when there was still hope. There are a lot of better things I could have done with the 9 hours I've wasted on this season thus far.

At least I'm not paying for tickets... yikes.

 

[johnjm22]

Because the players, especially the team's best players, are not executing the system to the best of their ability. Actually, not even close to the best of their ability.

These guys had plenty of time off in the off season. It's the players that don't go to the net, it's the players that don't forecheck, it's the players that aren't putting in enough effort.

Maybe it's time to get some new players. I don't expect guys approaching 30 years of age or in excess of 30 years of age to be the main cogs of a system that demands players to be committed to puck possession and a heavy game.

Does the coach bear any responsibility for the product on the ice?

Sometimes you just need a new voice. I'm not saying we're at that point yet, but it's something that will be considered if things don't get turned around.

 

[johnjm22]

The Lucic trade never should have been made knowing that this would be the roster. Unfortunately the Lucic trade looks like another example of a GM that just can't accept the fact that his beloved core is slowing down and no longer championship caliber. That is why I question whether Dean or Futa should be the guy to tear this down.

I'm not comfortable with what he gave up for Lucic, but I still think this is an excellent roster that's capable of contending.

 

[Winger23]

I still hate the kings breakout and hated it even when they are winning. Watch when they get the puck to center ice they are forced to dump the puck in constantly because they only have at most 2 guys on the same side of the red line. They get control of the puck in their zone and allow for the opposition to get all 5 guys back in position. There is no counter attack and very few odd man rushes.

It's not surprising they can't score, they are always out numbered unless they get a turn over in the neutral zone.

They also lost guys that were good along the boards in Williams and yes even stoll. Add in the loss of king and I honestly believe they don't have the personnel to be a grinding defensive team any more. They also have lost bigger guys on D which hurts along the boards too.

All of this is just my opinion from watching the games, and not trying to say this is the only issue.

 

[Butch 19]

Only 7 points off the division lead boys. 0-3, got 'em where we want 'em!

ahhh... what a familiar place to be...

 

[KingsFan7824]

so why do we suck? i guess that's the main question now. why?

system: Jason Lewis made a cpl of good articles on this subject not so long ago (e.g. http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog/Jason-Lewis/Size-and-the-Identity-Game/179/68842). one fine quote:

The Kings play a heavy game. A lot of it comes down to coaching, but some of it comes down to just plain having huge freaking players that grind you into dirt.


why the guys can't deliver it anymore? imo the root of the problem lies in coaching.

They can listen to Sutter or not at this point, but if they're not going to, then at least then go out there and play some sort of hockey. Revolt as a team, that's fine. Go on the ice and do the exact opposite of what Sutter says, but do it with an effort. Do it with a purpose.

 

[mrkolice]

They can listen to Sutter or not at this point, but if they're not going to, then at least then go out there and play some sort of hockey. Revolt as a team, that's fine. Go on the ice and do the exact opposite of what Sutter says, but do it with an effort. Do it with a purpose.

yea, i've read about this "another revolt", "lock him out again" theory... but i'm not buying it until we get to the bottom of less speculative arguments, and at least some of these seem rational at this point.

 

[YP44]

I still believe this team is a top four defenseman away from being very, very good. Martinez needs to wake up and seize the opportunity. Greene belongs nowhere near this roster and I've been one of his bigger supporters for years. But all of that is not moot if the top players keep taking nights off.

I want -

Martinez - Doughty
Muzzin - Forbort
McNabb - Ehrhoff

I know it's wonky as Forbort is a leftie, but it's worth a shot. Shake it up.

I thought McNabb did alright with Drew and A-Mart had a crap game last night. Switch those tow and I would say it is worth a shot

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

I already pointed out our opponents were a combined 8-0-1; well, Minny is 2-0 as well

Something's gotta give because they play Arizona before us, just thought it was funny. Obviously we're contributing to their numbers, but our first four opponents have 0 regulation losses, 10 regulation wins and 1 OTL.