Proposal: Trouba Mega Thread Part VII

[Romang67]

The GM is so spiteful that he would rather hurt his own team then help him so as to avoid setting a bad precedent. Meanwhile me fans of his team are ok with it, definitely very interesting.

You don't think it would hurt our small market team more if upcoming RFA's were under the impression that they could just refuse to sign in order to leave Winnipeg? I don't see what makes you call Cheveldayoff spiteful. Unless you truly feel that he refuses to trade Trouba because he wants to hurt Trouba personally?

 

[New York RKY]

Half the NHL has been linked to Trouba in last 1.5 months so what. All just rumours and people getting salty.....yikes

I'm not spiteful at all, I'm quite happy with how the Rangers are playing. I just think both parties are handling this situation awfully, moreso Chevy then Trouba, but they're both at fault.

You don't think it would hurt our small market team more if upcoming RFA's were under the impression that they could just refuse to sign in order to leave Winnipeg? I don't see what makes you call Cheveldayoff spiteful. Unless you truly feel that he refuses to trade Trouba because he wants to hurt Trouba personally?

He clearly has a player that doesn't want to be there and instead of working with other teams to get the best deal he can he'd rather have him sit out, suffer, and the team has nothing to show for a valuable asset.

I understand he doesn't want to sell for pennies on the dollar but when you know you have a player that won't come back he needs to work to get the best deal he can.

 

[Romang67]

I'm not spiteful at all, I'm quite happy with how the Rangers are playing. I just think both parties are handling this situation awfully, moreso Chevy then Trouba, but they're both at fault.



He clearly has a player that doesn't want to be there and instead of working with other teams to get the best deal he can he'd rather have him sit out, suffer, and the team has nothing to show for a valuable asset.

I understand he doesn't want to sell for pennies on the dollar but when you know you have a player that won't come back he needs to work to get the best deal he can.

Do you really understand that? Because it sounds like you think Chevy should sell off Trouba as quickly as possible, while having no idea what's been offered for him. And if the deadline passes, it sounds like you think that Chevy is just being spiteful, while still not knowing what's been offered for Trouba.

In short, it sounds to me like you're making a lot of assumptions regarding this entire situation, and your assumptions are what makes you think Chevy is being spiteful.

Apart from thinking that Trouba is acting like a petulant child, I have nothing against him, and I'd much rather see Trouba traded than lose him for nothing. But I wouldn't want to see him traded if that means that we're more likely to end up in a situation like this again. If that is the case, I personally believe that it's better for the Jets franchise if we lose Trouba for nothing, and he go play in another league for a few years.

 

[CaptainChef]

I'm not spiteful at all, I'm quite happy with how the Rangers are playing. I just think both parties are handling this situation awfully, moreso Chevy then Trouba, but they're both at fault.



He clearly has a player that doesn't want to be there and instead of working with other teams to get the best deal he can he'd rather have him sit out, suffer, and the team has nothing to show for a valuable asset.

I understand he doesn't want to sell for pennies on the dollar but when you know you have a player that won't come back he needs to work to get the best deal he can.

Don't you see. Its pretty easy for you guys to sit in your little ivory towers there in NY and declare "Boy, Chevy is sure shafting Trouba here".

I don't understand where this is being generated out there -- so many uninformed opinions coming in here out of your organization. As far as I know, we've never had issues between our clubs before, but the amount of uninformed crap being tossed from you guys on this one is utterly ridiculous.

 

[SCP Guy]

Like I said keep him, we will just keep winning hockey games.

Yawn your shtick is getting really old....I don't think you have much value left to add to this thread tbh

 

[Say What]

The GM is so spiteful that he would rather hurt his own team then help him so as to avoid setting a bad precedent. Meanwhile me fans of his team are ok with it, definitely very interesting.

The bolded is completely untrue. I'm guessing the "him" is Jacob Trouba.

IMO, the Winnipeg Jets/TNSE are honoring Kurt Overhardt's request. The Trouba Camp asked to be granted the right to negotiate on their own terms (find a suitable trade partner).

Unfortunately, this looks a lot like what happens, when people represent themselves in criminal cases (ill equipped for a complex endeavor).

As has been reported, it's business as usual for TNSE (not even trying to trade Jacob).
Hopefully Trouba's people figure it out soon.....as time is coming to a close.

 

[Jetsfan79]

The GM is so spiteful that he would rather hurt his own team then help him so as to avoid setting a bad precedent. Meanwhile me fans of his team are ok with it, definitely very interesting.

If the Jets let players coming off entry level contracts push them around it will hurt the team more in the long run. They need to nip this in the bud. RFAS should not have de facto modified trade clauses. They should wait until they a UFA and then they can go wherever they want.

Jack Roslovic and Kyle Connor are both RFAs in 2019. Both are American. Connor is from the same area as Trouba. I'm not saying they will be wanting out like Trouba but we can't afford to set a precedent or give them any ideas.

And BTW, Jets fans are not the only ones with this line of thought. Various senior people within hockey circles are saying the same thing about the situation.

 

[WesMcCauley]

You don't think it would hurt our small market team more if upcoming RFA's were under the impression that they could just refuse to sign in order to leave Winnipeg? I don't see what makes you call Cheveldayoff spiteful. Unless you truly feel that he refuses to trade Trouba because he wants to hurt Trouba personally?

Do you guys really believe this will problem? I just dont agree with that.
Edm sucked for years, the young guys stayed. Its not a problem in the NHL. It happens now and again, i just dont think it is/will be a problem going forward. Jets had Kane(who is crazy, so he shouldnt really count), but you get a great return and got him off your hands. Buff signed longterm, Scheifele signed longterm, Perreault signed longterm. Wheeler signed longterm etc. Its not a problem, and probably never will be even if Trouba gets traded. 99% of the players are happy to play for the team that owns their rights, and a small % wants to get traded. This isnt a Winnipeg thing, look at the Drouin situation and he lives in Florida and plays for one of the best teams in the NHL. It happens now and again, its not a Jets thing because they arent a big market, it just happens now and again. All the talk about if Trouba gets traded everyone else wanna get traded aswell is pretty unrealistic....

 

[tbcwpg]

I'm not spiteful at all, I'm quite happy with how the Rangers are playing. I just think both parties are handling this situation awfully, moreso Chevy then Trouba, but they're both at fault.



He clearly has a player that doesn't want to be there and instead of working with other teams to get the best deal he can he'd rather have him sit out, suffer, and the team has nothing to show for a valuable asset.

I understand he doesn't want to sell for pennies on the dollar but when you know you have a player that won't come back he needs to work to get the best deal he can.

Chevy is a deadline guy. He'll wait until the 30th to see if the offers improve. There isn't an immediate rush to trade him until the time comes.

If he has a price, he won't move him until it's either met, or he has an offer on the 30th that's close enough.

 

[WesMcCauley]

Do you really understand that? Because it sounds like you think Chevy should sell off Trouba as quickly as possible, while having no idea what's been offered for him. And if the deadline passes, it sounds like you think that Chevy is just being spiteful, while still not knowing what's been offered for Trouba.

In short, it sounds to me like you're making a lot of assumptions regarding this entire situation, and your assumptions are what makes you think Chevy is being spiteful.

Apart from thinking that Trouba is acting like a petulant child, I have nothing against him, and I'd much rather see Trouba traded than lose him for nothing. But I wouldn't want to see him traded if that means that we're more likely to end up in a situation like this again. If that is the case, I personally believe that it's better for the Jets franchise if we lose Trouba for nothing, and he go play in another league for a few years.

I dont know what you are discussing but i have a pretty hard time believing no teams would offer anything close to what is "fair" for Trouba or even overpay a little. RH young defensemen with twoway top pair potential. Thinking Chevy is getting weak offers is unrealistic... Im not saying he should just take the first he gets, not at all, but i cant believe for one second he doesnt have some very solid offers on the table.

 

[WinnipegWinter*]

I'm not spiteful at all, I'm quite happy with how the Rangers are playing. I just think both parties are handling this situation awfully, moreso Chevy then Trouba, but they're both at fault.



He clearly has a player that doesn't want to be there and instead of working with other teams to get the best deal he can he'd rather have him sit out, suffer, and the team has nothing to show for a valuable asset.

I understand he doesn't want to sell for pennies on the dollar but when you know you have a player that won't come back he needs to work to get the best deal he can.

Your ignorance is humourous

 

[KingBogo]

I dont know what you are discussing but i have a pretty hard time believing no teams would offer anything close to what is "fair" for Trouba or even overpay a little. RH young defensemen with twoway top pair potential. Thinking Chevy is getting weak offers is unrealistic... Im not saying he should just take the first he gets, not at all, but i cant believe for one second he hasnt some very solid offers on the table.

I would tend to agree, but then the best course of action is to hold tight to see what type of offer the Dec 1st pressure point will bring.

 

[wintersej]

You don't think it would hurt our small market team more if upcoming RFA's were under the impression that they could just refuse to sign in order to leave Winnipeg? I don't see what makes you call Cheveldayoff spiteful. Unless you truly feel that he refuses to trade Trouba because he wants to hurt Trouba personally?

You are right. As Trouba is the first RFA to ever ask to be traded and hold out in the history of RFAs, it is very important for Chevy to take a stand.

I mean, look at what happened with drafted players that go to US university. Blake Wheeler (what a scum bag) decides he doesn't want to sign for the team that drafted him, and now every single college player since has not signed with the team that drafted them. Every single one! The league has fallen apart and the fabric of the draft has been ruined!

Cleary, if the Jets gave into Trouba's demands to be able to live in a place his girlfriend is going to be living in the next half decade while in medical school, they would ruin the concept of RFAs for every RFA just like Blake Wheeler ruined the draft forever.

 

[heilongjetsfan]

That sure is an entitled opinion. His senses are:

• He isn't getting played where he should be (He's better than Myers).

• He was dealing with someone who was unwilling to sign him long term to terms that were similar to his peers, but gave Byfuglien crazy money

Chevy avoids this by moving Byfuglien, like Ladd, and giving that money to Trouba. Instead he paints himself into a corner where he'd be paying three right handed defenders a lot of money, on a budget team. He has only but himself to blame for this.

The only thing you said that isn't completely wrong is that he's better than Myers.

It's been stated numerous times by proper hockey reporters (Dreger, Friedman) that Chevy's offer was 5.5x6, which is more than Rielly, Ristolainen, Jones, Klefbom and Lindholm. More than fair, it's a bit of an overpay.
The team would be a lot weaker without Byfuglien. Trouba is very talented but I would rather play him behind a true number 1 for the next 2 or 3 years or at least in a pairing with someone better and more experienced.
The Winnipeg Jets are in no way a budget team. They're top 10 in revenue league wide and are owned by the 7th richest man on planet earth. When you consider that none of 1 through 6 own sports franchises, you could think of them as being the least budget team in any sport anywhere on planet earth.
Byfuglien's contract is entirely appropriate considering his output, ability to eat nearly 30 minutes per game and the ancillary benefits to the team related to his community presence, devotion to the team, and additional income related to his marketability. Do you think he'd have got less money as a UFA on the open market?

 

[Hank Chinaski]

I'm not spiteful at all, I'm quite happy with how the Rangers are playing. I just think both parties are handling this situation awfully, moreso Chevy then Trouba, but they're both at fault.



He clearly has a player that doesn't want to be there and instead of working with other teams to get the best deal he can he'd rather have him sit out, suffer, and the team has nothing to show for a valuable asset.

I understand he doesn't want to sell for pennies on the dollar but when you know you have a player that won't come back he needs to work to get the best deal he can.

You know, it's funny. I actually had a very similar view on this subject when Trouba's trade request first broke. I had a hard time believing that Chevy didn't know about this request at the draft, and resented the fact he didn't get it done.

What I overlooked, and what I think you're overlooking: there's realistically very little chance that Trouba sits out the entire year. I suppose it's possible, but it's irrational. Chevy has to assume rational behaviour in this case, and rational behaviour dictates that Trouba signs with the Jets prior to the December 1st deadline.

The bolded is completely untrue. I'm guessing the "him" is Jacob Trouba.

IMO, the Winnipeg Jets/TNSE are honoring Kurt Overhardt's request. The Trouba Camp asked to be granted the right to negotiate on their own terms (find a suitable trade partner).

Unfortunately, this looks a lot like what happens, when people represent themselves in criminal cases (ill equipped for a complex endeavor).

As has been reported, it's business as usual for TNSE (not even trying to trade Jacob).
Hopefully Trouba's people figure it out soon.....as time is coming to a close.

Yep, I think you're bang on here. It's unfortunate that Trouba seems to be taking advice from fools.

 

[Whileee]

You are right. As Trouba is the first RFA to ever ask to be traded and hold out in the history of RFAs, it is very important for Chevy to take a stand.

I mean, look at what happened with drafted players that go to US university. Blake Wheeler (what a scum bag) decides he doesn't want to sign for the team that drafted him, and now every single college player since has not signed with the team that drafted them. Every single one! The league has fallen apart and the fabric of the draft has been ruined!

Cleary, if the Jets gave into Trouba's demands to be able to live in a place his girlfriend is going to be living in the next half decade while in medical school, they would ruin the concept of RFAs for every RFA just like Blake Wheeler ruined the draft forever.

Who cares?

Chevy is going to hold out for what's best for the Jets organization. That's what he's paid to do. It's not about preserving the principles of the CBA, but the CBA gives the Jets the levers to ensure that they protect their interests to the utmost.

 

[WesMcCauley]

Who cares?

Chevy is going to hold out for what's best for the Jets organization. That's what he's paid to do. It's not about preserving the principles of the CBA, but the CBA gives the Jets the levers to ensure that they protect their interests to the utmost.

And he should! But is it the best for Jets to hold out because of setting a precedence if thats the main reason?
Its not a problem in todays NHL, rarely happens, Drouin situation it happened for one of the best teams in the league etc. Its not a problem for small market teams, look at Florida. Everyone resigned longterm. I just dont believe that it will become a problem if they trade him...
With that said, Chevy shouldnt trade him before he gets what he feels he wants/needs etc. But i dont buy the precedence thing, i just dont believe for one second it will become a problem going forward.

Trouba has some decent reasons, his father, girlfriend going to medical school etc. Its not that he just said hey i hate Winnipeg, trade me. I still believe the Jets should do what they think its best and the Jets has all the power but sometimes the best thing is to talk together and find a solution that works for everyone. Kind of seems like Chevy has made this about Trouba not wanting to play for the Jets, when it atleast to a certain point is Trouba wanting to play another place because of some decent reasons. Not saying that is a reason to just trade him but i just think the whole thing could have been handled better, atleast it looks like that from the outside..

 

[Say What]

You are right. As Trouba is the first RFA to ever ask to be traded and hold out in the history of RFAs, it is very important for Chevy to take a stand.

I mean, look at what happened with drafted players that go to US university. Blake Wheeler (what a scum bag) decides he doesn't want to sign for the team that drafted him, and now every single college player since has not signed with the team that drafted them. Every single one! The league has fallen apart and the fabric of the draft has been ruined!

Cleary, if the Jets gave into Trouba's demands to be able to live in a place his girlfriend is going to be living in the next half decade while in medical school, they would ruin the concept of RFAs for every RFA just like Blake Wheeler ruined the draft forever.

That is precisely how the system was designed to work (the CBA at the time). Blake Wheeler never had a contractual commitment to that organization (chose to wait 4 years). He didn't receive any monetary compensation for his services, and was therefore, a Free Agent. That Organization hadn't invested a single penny into Blake's development.

Jacob Trouba, on the other hand, is the property of the Winnipeg Jets (as it pertains to the NHL). And this most recent CBA (unlike the previous K. Turris edition) prohibits Mr. Trouba from playing in the league, if he doesn't obey the terms of the ratified Agreement by Dec.1st.

 

[New York RKY]

The bolded is completely untrue. I'm guessing the "him" is Jacob Trouba.

IMO, the Winnipeg Jets/TNSE are honoring Kurt Overhardt's request. The Trouba Camp asked to be granted the right to negotiate on their own terms (find a suitable trade partner).

Unfortunately, this looks a lot like what happens, when people represent themselves in criminal cases (ill equipped for a complex endeavor).

As has been reported, it's business as usual for TNSE (not even trying to trade Jacob).
Hopefully Trouba's people figure it out soon.....as time is coming to a close.

"Him" in this case is actually Chevy.

Like I said both parties come off really bad here but it think WPG loses more if Trouba sits a year. Not only do they not get his services but they also don't get any valuable assets for him to help his team now.

You know, it's funny. I actually had a very similar view on this subject when Trouba's trade request first broke. I had a hard time believing that Chevy didn't know about this request at the draft, and resented the fact he didn't get it done.is

What I overlooked, and what I think you're overlooking: there's realistically very little chance that Trouba sits out the entire year. I suppose it's possible, but it's irrational. Chevy has to assume rational behaviour in this case, and rational behaviour dictates that Trouba signs with the Jets prior to the December 1st deadline.

Take a look at what I posted above, I agree with you. I think that both parties look awful here but with Chevy trying to play hardball, IMO, it hurts the Jets more then it helps them.

I understand they don't want to set a precedent here for future RFA's but with this particular RFA they not only don't get his services but they also don't get the pieces that they could use should they decide to trade him.

 

[heilongjetsfan]

Wrong again. Keep trying.

Fact of the matter is we have Jimmy Vesey who looks like a really promising young player. Kevin Hayes struggled a bit last year but is showing better signs this year. We traded away some draft picks but still recoupped great young assets in other ways. Sounds like fantastic management to me.

It's not my fault players want to come to this organization and not demand trades/refuse to sign with the club.

Because of the salary cap, no we cannot fit Blake Wheeler in replacement of Grabner. I wouldn't want to cut cap elsewhere for the purpose of making that swap work. Wheeler is a top 6 forward and barring injury wouldn't make our top 6 right now. Grabner is fine in his role at his cap hit.

Its easy to say playoff wins don't matter if you don't win the cup when you haven't even enjoyed the pleasure of winning a playoff game. It means something, a playoff run. We may not have won the cup the last couple seasons but the joy and excitement of a playoff run is what you should live for as a fan. 3 rounds including two great game 7 wins in 2014 but yeah it means nothing. I wish we finished bottom 5 and looked forward to the draft instead of enjoying playoff hockey. Like you expect to throw your prospects together one year and just make a cup run out of nowhere. Playoff wins and experience do matter. Getting wins under your belt but losing to a better team. Building for the next year off that success. It's not about finshing bottom 10 every season and then all of sudden winning a cup.

And we aren't "blossoming" we're there every year, as a contender. Status quo. Still with a great young core and hope for the future with young players that have proven it or are proving it right now at the NHL level. Keep praying all your shiny prospects actually get to the NHL and reach their projections

Blake Wheeler is a top 6 forward? 78pts last season, THAT Blake Wheeler? Did you hear that whoosh? Pretty sure that was your credibility taking flight toward the nearest open window.

 

[tbcwpg]

"Him" in this case is actually Chevy.

Like I said both parties come off really bad here but it think WPG loses more if Trouba sits a year. Not only do they not get his services but they also don't get any valuable assets for him to help his team now.



Take a look at what I posted above, I agree with you. I think that both parties look awful here but with Chevy trying to play hardball, IMO, it hurts the Jets more then it helps them.

I understand they don't want to set a precedent here for future RFA's but with this particular RFA they not only don't get his services but they also don't get the pieces that they could use should they decide to trade him.

There's no deadline until Dec 1. If he hasn't got his asking price yet, he's got 24 days left to get it.

 

[wintersej]

You know, it's funny. I actually had a very similar view on this subject when Trouba's trade request first broke. I had a hard time believing that Chevy didn't know about this request at the draft, and resented the fact he didn't get it done.

What I overlooked, and what I think you're overlooking: there's realistically very little chance that Trouba sits out the entire year. I suppose it's possible, but it's irrational. Chevy has to assume rational behaviour in this case, and rational behaviour dictates that Trouba signs with the Jets prior to the December 1st deadline.

I think you are totally and 1000% right that Chevy can force Trouba into signing. There is a lot of calculus that has to go into what you think will happen after you force Trouba to sign, though. It could be toxic. It could be fine. I'd put more money on the former than the latter.

 

[New York RKY]

There's no deadline until Dec 1. If he hasn't got his asking price yet, he's got 24 days left to get it.

That's perfectly fine, I'm not telling WPG to settle for a deal right now.

But if the calendar turns to Dec 2nd and Trouba is neither traded nor in a Jets jersey then that is the worse decision for all involved parties.

 

[tbcwpg]

That's perfectly fine, I'm not telling WPG to settle for a deal right now.

But if the calendar turns to Dec 2nd and Trouba is neither traded nor in a Jets jersey then that is the worse decision for all involved parties.

I agree. I don't see it going there though.

 

[Hank Chinaski]

That's perfectly fine, I'm not telling WPG to settle for a deal right now.

But if the calendar turns to Dec 2nd and Trouba is neither traded nor in a Jets jersey then that is the worse decision for all involved parties.

Not true. It's the worst decision for Trouba, it may or may not be the worst decision for the Jets. The latter depends entirely on what is being offered as the deadline approaches. If the best offers for Trouba are built around futures, they're better off letting him sit the season and waiting until the draft. If the best offer for Trouba brings back a similar quality player, it probably makes sense to deal him.

It's likely that Trouba fetches more at the draft than he does in late November. Chevy needs to weigh that versus what they're losing in 2016-17 by not replacing him.