Proposal: Trouba Mega thread Part V

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CaptainChef

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Jan 5, 2014
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Well it is pretty obvious that if Chevy had an offer that interested him, Trouba would have been traded already.

This is a very complex situation and it sucks that Winnipeg has a player of Trouba's caliber that wants out. But this happens to teams all the time across all major sports. In a lot of cases we don't know about a trade request until after, or if at all. In this case the request had been made months ago, and the player and agent decided to go public as a negotiating tactic after giving Chevy what they felt was a reasonable amount of time to broker a deal.

Chevy has a premium asset that is currently at peak value. However, the interest is running and the value is declining. The big question is going to be how long is he going to be paying the interest and watch the value of his asset decline before he cashes it in.

Two things you don't understand. Chevy probably has had more than one offer already that have peaked his interest. But there hasn't been any that have been "sure thing" offers, so he waits. Chevy by nature is a plodder.

Second, his value has not yet peaked. Trades will not fall off the table in the next few weeks; instead a couple teams will realize they REALLY need him badly. These sort of opportunities don't happen very often & drafting a player of Trouba's stature is no guarantee.

At a certain point, two teams will be pitted against each other with a deadline & a trade will emerge. If it doesn't happen the way Chevy envisions, Trouba may have to crawl back & take whatever he can at the last minute.
 

Big Easy

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Jan 21, 2014
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Is the latitude of southern Ontario approximately 700 km south of Winnipeg?

Yes, it is.

One degree of latitude is 111 kilometres. Winnipeg sits at 49:54 latitude north. Toronto is located at 43:40 North. That is a difference of 6 degrees. 6 X 111 = 666 kms. Toronto is 666 kms further south than Winnipeg.
 

Liferleafer

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Feb 9, 2011
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If that's what you want to believe, then absolutely buddy.

Please explain how he can play elsewhere in the NHL right now? He can play in Europe...sure. But the only way he can leave the Jets organization right now (for another NHL team) is if the Jets trade his rights....or he signs an offer sheet which the Jets don't match (and then they receive compensation...much like trading him).
 

GoJetsGo55

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Apr 14, 2009
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I am always a tad confused when people spew this notion of "commitment" but then champion their GM if and when he trades a "committed" player out of town and they like the return

when is a commitment actually honoured and once you break, can you ever really stand behind those words

Because that's how spots work.

Athletes are assets. They are bought and sold like a commodity.

As fans, we see the human side of things but the age old saying rings true.....it's a business.
 

Gump Hasek

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Nov 9, 2005
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From my point of view, Winnipeg basically need help all over. Even at center, not overly sold on Little/Perrault as 2-3 centers on a contender. Scheleife is great, but is he the next Backes or the next Toews if you get what I mean? And like, its really really really tough in this league to go from being on the outside looking in to becoming a contender. The great teams has so many advantages to start with, being able to give kids a good environment etc that Winnipeg and the likes never have been able to do. Like there is a reason for why that franchise never even have had an OK season in this league.

Your point of view ignores the reality that the Jets are building a young roster designed to grow together going forward. They are stacked at forward with talented young players and a few good vets. They have arguably the best pipeline in goal in the league with Hellebuyck, Comrie, and Phillips. Their need is to replace Trouba's value in their d-core with a young player of a similar age, NHL experience, and skill-level, period.
 

GoJetsGo55

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Please explain how he can play elsewhere in the NHL right now? He can play in Europe...sure. But the only way he can leave the Jets organization right now (for another NHL team) is if the Jets trade his rights....or he signs an offer sheet which the Jets don't match (and then they receive compensation...much like trading him).

His whole point is that he doesn't have a contract with the Jets which means that he can go play for any other league. What he fails to understand is that any player in the NHL can do that. All they need to do is "retire" a la Kovalchuk.
 

Zetterberg4Captain

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Aug 11, 2009
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Because that's how spots work.

Athletes are assets. They are bought and sold like a commodity.

As fans, we see the human side of things but the age old saying rings true.....it's a business.

absolutely right

its a business

trouba owes nothing to winnipeg that chevy didnt and wont "owe" any player he trades away who WAS committed to winnipeg

it HAS to be both ways, not one or the other
 

Liferleafer

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Feb 9, 2011
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His whole point is that he doesn't have a contract with the Jets which means that he can go play for any other league. What he fails to understand is that any player in the NHL can do that. All they need to do is "retire" a la Kovalchuk.

Ah, of course. I thought he was arguing that the Jets didn't own his NHL ass.:laugh:
 

Stej

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Jul 28, 2006
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I am always a tad confused when people spew this notion of "commitment" but then champion their GM if and when he trades a "committed" player out of town and they like the return

when is a commitment actually honoured and once you break, can you ever really stand behind those words

I like to think of it more as a mutually beneficial agreement. The CBA may seem unfair to young players at first, until you realize that the number of available jobs and the amount of revenue is helped immensely by this structure,which is obviously beneficial to the players collectively.

Trouba seems to see himself as being above that structure. He and his agent have done nothing but tank his value, which adversely impacts the Jets. Trouba's correct course of action should be to sign a fair market value deal and bust his ass to increase his trade value. That could turn this into a win-win. Instead, he's doing what he's doing and hurting himself immensely.

Stay strong, Chevy.
 

CaptainChef

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Jan 5, 2014
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Hmm, what exactly is -- not -- a position of need for Winnipeg?

This is somewhat how I would rank them:

Between the pipes -- 30

LD- 25-30? Enström is getting older and is past his prime, Morrisey is ok as a youngster, but that left side is just weak...

RD- 20-25? Mobility must be a huge concern given the speed we are seeing in this league right now. If the LDs could make up for it, it would be one thing, but the balance is far from great at this point.

LW- Kind of meaningless to rank considering the potential is great, and no need for upgrades. OTOH, Connor looks a little weak for the NHL so far, a bit of a tweaner, even if he improves, is he really a good fit behind Laine and Ehlers?

C- 8-14?

RW- 25-30? //Wheeler can make fantastic plays, but not much of a factor overall. Or like, very good player, but not great. After him the RW depth chart must be the weakest in the league or among the weakest at least.

The Farm
There are a good number of B-C tier prospects on the farm (not looking at the kids in the NHL), but I just don't know. It doesn't feel like they will get any immediate substantial help from the farm the coming years, or am I missing someone? All the while, Winnipeg is currently build on a core that is getting up there in age. Wheeler, Enström, Buff and co. As kids come in, these guys will get worse. Or what do you think? Do you think I am mis-rating any area of Winnipeg's roster or farm?

From my point of view, Winnipeg basically need help all over. Even at center, not overly sold on Little/Perrault as 2-3 centers on a contender. Scheleife is great, but is he the next Backes or the next Toews if you get what I mean? And like, its really really really tough in this league to go from being on the outside looking in to becoming a contender. The great teams has so many advantages to start with, being able to give kids a good environment etc that Winnipeg and the likes never have been able to do. Like there is a reason for why that franchise never even have had an OK season in this league.

I wish some people who know very little about an organization would do a little homework before posting like they have all the answers:rant:

You are so off base its not even funny. Our needs are D & maybe C (that's basically it). The rest are so far down our needs list as to be hardly worth considering.

Not even going to bother telling you why that is; if you'd have followed any of the previous discussions related to this, you wouldn't bother posting such garbage
 

4thline

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Jul 18, 2014
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I agree, both clauses restrict movement. When was the last time an RFA signed an offer sheet and changed teams? RFA is really just window dressing.The NHLPA sacrificed RFA rights in exchange for UFA rights. RFA's have few rights and the only real way out for an elite RFA is the path Trouba is taking.

You're 100% right, RFA status is a complete paper tiger and players are getting bent over. Like I said it's overkill. One or the other would be fine, but as it is now it basically only keeps GM's from completely lowballing league wide.

He is a Free Agent who can sign with whichever team he pleases....that is correct.

However...the Jets can match that offer and then he's still with the Jets organization.

The Jets can choose to not match and receive compensation.


All of that is because he is currently under the Winnipeg Jets umbrella.

Also, if you remove the right to compensation, teams can lose players for nothing....that makes little sense to me.

None of that means that he has any sort of committment, legally, morally, whatever. It means they have the right to restrict his movement against his will or be compensated for it.


And depends. Take out compensation but leave right of first refusal, team keeps the player that they drafted and want but at a fair price dictated by the open market.

Take out RFR but leave compensation and teams don't lose players for nothing and second contracts stay artificially depressed.

Having both is letting the teams have their cake and eat it too, RFA's are "free" in name only.

But this is really a whole different discussion, I just take issue with the whole "he owes us/ committment/ let him rot" character assassination. Sure it sucks for your team now but I imagine there were a lot of similar reactions when players started fighting for any sort of Free agent rights.
 

varano

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Jun 27, 2013
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If that's what you want to believe, then absolutely buddy.

Hey tell me again how many points he has this season? Time on ice? Anything? I thought he was able to just put stickers on his jets helmet and walk into the rangers locker room and play?
 

aj8000

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Jun 5, 2010
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You're 100% right, RFA status is a complete paper tiger and players are getting bent over. Like I said it's overkill. One or the other would be fine, but as it is now it basically only keeps GM's from completely lowballing league wide.



None of that means that he has any sort of committment, legally, morally, whatever. It means they have the right to restrict his movement against his will or be compensated for it.


And depends. Take out compensation but leave right of first refusal, team keeps the player that they drafted and want but at a fair price dictated by the open market.

Take out RFR but leave compensation and teams don't lose players for nothing and second contracts stay artificially depressed.

Having both is letting the teams have their cake and eat it too, RFA's are "free" in name only.

But this is really a whole different discussion, I just take issue with the whole "he owes us/ committment/ let him rot" character assassination. Sure it sucks for your team now but I imagine there were a lot of similar reactions when players started fighting for any sort of Free agent rights.

And your point is? You can try to twist it any way you want; however, in the end if Trouba wants to play in the NHL he will need to deal with the Jets. They own his rights and that will not change until they trade his rights or he hits 27.
 

garyturner3

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Jun 16, 2015
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His whole point is that he doesn't have a contract with the Jets which means that he can go play for any other league. What he fails to understand is that any player in the NHL can do that. All they need to do is "retire" a la Kovalchuk.

Would Trouba even have to fake retire like Kovy did if he wanted to play for a year in the KHL? I thought Kovy only had to because he was under contract at the time.
 

Maukkis

EZ4ENCE
Mar 16, 2016
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Hey tell me again how many points he has this season? Time on ice? Anything? I thought he was able to just put stickers on his jets helmet and walk into the rangers locker room and play?

I find the image of that happening absolutely hilarious for pretty much no reason. I hope I'm not alone. :laugh:
 

Gotta Jet

Registered User
Aug 25, 2011
55
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If Winnipeg caves to Trouba's demand of playing where he wants, this does not bode well for any team in any sport. There is a reason why CBA's exist. There is a reason why contracts exist. You cannot allow players to circumvent the system otherwise this will create major problems for all franchises. I am sure the Jets organization has the support of the NHL and all the other owners who wouldn't want to see a stream of young punks digging their heals in every time they want to go home to play. You want to play in the big leagues, you'd better be prepared to play to the best of your abilities in the market that selected you until such time that you are free to go elsewhere. It is that simple.
 

GoJetsGo55

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Apr 14, 2009
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Winnipeg, MB
absolutely right

its a business

trouba owes nothing to winnipeg that chevy didnt and wont "owe" any player he trades away who WAS committed to winnipeg

it HAS to be both ways, not one or the other

It is both ways but players are restricted for a period of time. This is to increase parity. Parity helps everyone involved.

Trouba doesn't "owe" the Jets anything but he is an asset that they have control of within the NHL domain.
 

aj8000

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Jun 5, 2010
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Would Trouba even have to fake retire like Kovy did if he wanted to play for a year in the KHL? I thought Kovy only had to because he was under contract at the time.

No he can go there if he wants, just cannot come back to the NHL with having to deal with the Jets
 

GoJetsGo55

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Apr 14, 2009
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Winnipeg, MB
Would Trouba even have to fake retire like Kovy did if he wanted to play for a year in the KHL? I thought Kovy only had to because he was under contract at the time.

Trouba can go play in the NHL right now as he does not have a contract.

The point that dude was making was that Trouba is not under contract and therefor is not a Winnipeg Jet "controlled" asset. He is free to sign with any league in the world and play his days out there.

My point is that Trouba is a Winnipeg controlled asset because he currently falls under the organizations umbrella. If that is not true because he can go play for any league in the world, well then no player is a controlled asset. Any play, at any time, can "retire" and go play for another league.
 

GoJetsGo55

Registered User
Apr 14, 2009
11,267
8,654
Winnipeg, MB
You're 100% right, RFA status is a complete paper tiger and players are getting bent over. Like I said it's overkill. One or the other would be fine, but as it is now it basically only keeps GM's from completely lowballing league wide.



None of that means that he has any sort of committment, legally, morally, whatever. It means they have the right to restrict his movement against his will or be compensated for it.


And depends. Take out compensation but leave right of first refusal, team keeps the player that they drafted and want but at a fair price dictated by the open market.

Take out RFR but leave compensation and teams don't lose players for nothing and second contracts stay artificially depressed.

Having both is letting the teams have their cake and eat it too, RFA's are "free" in name only.

But this is really a whole different discussion, I just take issue with the whole "he owes us/ committment/ let him rot" character assassination. Sure it sucks for your team now but I imagine there were a lot of similar reactions when players started fighting for any sort of Free agent rights.

There is logic and there is emotion.

It's very easy to be on the outside looking in and view it from a logical point of view.

Then...it's your player. The guy who everyone loved and was touted to be the biggest baddest d-man since Buff. Then he starts making demands under a smoke screen. Then the smoke screen is gone and all of a sudden the dude doesn't even want to be in the country you love.

Then.....then you start to think....."let him rot."
 

Dijock94

Registered User
Apr 1, 2016
1,454
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If Winnipeg caves to Trouba's demand of playing where he wants, this does not bode well for any team in any sport. There is a reason why CBA's exist. There is a reason why contracts exist. You cannot allow players to circumvent the system otherwise this will create major problems for all franchises. I am sure the Jets organization has the support of the NHL and all the other owners who wouldn't want to see a stream of young punks digging their heals in every time they want to go home to play. You want to play in the big leagues, you'd better be prepared to play to the best of your abilities in the market that selected you until such time that you are free to go elsewhere. It is that simple.

Put yourself in his shoes. He may really hate it in Winnepeg and be miserable. The Jets don't own him, and he doesn't owe them anything.
 
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