Proposal: Trouba Mega-Thread Part III

[jay from jersey]

huh

LOL

Here we have an example of the sort of poster that views Trouba as if he exists within a vacuum. The Jets have 10 first round picks in their organization that are age-23 or younger; they can use one of those chips, or they can add a veteran or two in a move to further impact team culture and replace that vet in-house. Winnipeg don't need to simply settle for NYR's leftovers and accept a downgrade. In fact, they are more likely to patiently find a team with something they'd actually want in a return and make it happen by adding a sweetener to Trouba.

did i say he was getting dealt to NYR? i gave you an example of a deal from NYR. and a 1st Rd pick is self explainitiory, staal at 4 mill signed is good value. he has been shutting down the best for a long time and has looked great after a summer of rest and training following a down year. is signed long term. Skjei is the number 1 ranger d-prospect. and i'm not even sayin deal him to nyr but that is the type of deal WIN should expect under the circumstances. most likely they will want a signed player or ELC player back because WIN will want some control UFA's aren't exactly beating down the door to be a jet.

you are a poster who does not realize hockey is a business first. Some business decisions with franchises that have a hard time attracting UFA's or have internal budgets don't work like a video game at your house

 

[larmex99]

Trouba might see it like this is the cross roads of his career. If he leaves Winnipeg for a team that needs him more and will use him properly, he can turn into a top pairing Dman. If he stays with Winnipeg he may turn into an inconsistent D who plays up and down the lineup, and inevitably gets passed over. He could lose 5 million this year but gain all that back many times over by changing teams.

You are kidding yourself if you think he is being held back by the Jets. Big minutes and would have been on first D pair this year at 22 doesn't seem like he is being held back much. This is about him wanting to play where he chooses, or more likely where mommy and daddy want him to play. I don't even think it is him calling the shots. JMO. Losing $5 mil will hurt and most likely never be regained.

 

[Gump Hasek]

you are a poster who does not realize hockey is a business first. Some business decisions with franchises that have a hard time attracting UFA's or have internal budgets don't work like a video game at your house

No, I am a poster that owns and runs his own business [MOD]

I understand that Chevy is under zero pressure to move Trouba right now from either his ownership or the fans, and that he isn't likely to allow a 22 y/o RFA to dictate his roster decisions. He will only move the player on his own terms and timeline, if need be. I also understand that your initial wall of text suggesting the Jets should trade Trouba for a bunch of NYR flotsam was likely motivated by that the Rangers are currently getting shanked by the Devils tonight. Enjoy the game.

 

[R3DDRAG0N]

did i say he was getting dealt to NYR? i gave you an example of a deal from NYR. and a 1st Rd pick is self explainitiory, staal at 4 mill signed is good value. he has been shutting down the best for a long time and has looked great after a summer of rest and training following a down year. is signed long term. Skjei is the number 1 ranger d-prospect. and i'm not even sayin deal him to nyr but that is the type of deal WIN should expect under the circumstances. most likely they will want a signed player or ELC player back because WIN will want some control UFA's aren't exactly beating down the door to be a jet.

you are a poster who does not realize hockey is a business first. Some business decisions with franchises that have a hard time attracting UFA's or have internal budgets don't work like a video game at your house

Thanks, but as you will see and all fans familiar with the franchise know, we will wait this out until the cards are in the Jets favor. You can argue all you want to the contrary but we will not take a significant loss. Just like we didn't take a loss on Kane whom many said was worthless.

 

[Stej]

Trouba might see it like this is the cross roads of his career. If he leaves Winnipeg for a team that needs him more and will use him properly, he can turn into a top pairing Dman. If he stays with Winnipeg he may turn into an inconsistent D who plays up and down the lineup, and inevitably gets passed over. He could lose 5 million this year but gain all that back many times over by changing teams.

By all accounts, Trouba was already pencilled onto the top pairing with Buff for this season. Almost surely playing 25+ minutes per game. Unless it actually is about right vs left, I'm not sure where in the league he'd get a better opportunity than that.

In other words, if his concern is to turn into a top pairing defenseman, that dream could have been realized this year with Winnipeg.

 

[spaghtti]

If I were Trouba and the Jets wanted me to play my off hand I would want a max contract to do so, playing on the off hand and on a bridge deal would be a terrible idea for Trouba. If Trouba were to have a down year it would hurt his future contracts, in this case sitting out in favour of playing a role he is comfortable in and can excel only makes sense.

 

[Treb]

By all accounts, Trouba was already pencilled onto the top pairing with Buff for this season. Almost surely playing 25+ minutes per game. Unless it actually is about right vs left, I'm not sure where in the league he'd get a better opportunity than that.

In other words, if his concern is to turn into a top pairing defenseman, that dream could have been realized this year with Winnipeg.

Unless he's worst as a LD than RD. Playing LD could hurt his value if he play way better as a RD, which would explain his stubbornness on playing RD.

EDIT: I.E. he could be a good top4 D on LD but be a top2 on RD. Playing LD in that case would hurt him a lot.

 

[Guffman]

I hate to brake it to you, trouba leaving is not about playing the left side or only wanting 7 mill. he wants out of winnipeg. he just can't come out and say it because he will be massacred by the media and fans. jets fans also have to come to the realization that they are not getting a number one LD on a sweet deal as a return. No team in the league is going to make another hole in their line up just to satisfy another need. Dougie hamilton will probably be the standard for a deal like this. Not saying this would happen, but as a NYR deal probably Skjei+2nd+3rd and some salary going back for trouba. or a 1st and roster player type deal like staal retained at maybe 4mill. I'm not saying it to be mean or that even NYR will get him, but this is the type of deal that usually happens and the team that trades the holdout is almost always upset with the return.. what was the return for kyle turris?? he had a lot of potential at the time of trade too. the longer this goes on the worse it is gona be for trouba, chevy,winnipeg, and the fans. It sucks for chevy because the best thing for him is to deal him, (to whoever). move on and use the assets to build the team going forward.. Also, there is no way they are letting him sit for the entire year out of spite. that would also be a disaster for all parties involved. You don't want a situation like this festering for an entire year, especially with a team full of young players. it sets up a bad aura. it's not like trouba is isolated on an island somewhere. he is in contact with his team mates and now the bad potato on the plate is out in the open for everyone to see and discuss . the best is to make a trade and put it behind you. if he has been working since december to trade him, it should be abundantly clear to chevy and the front office he is not getting a young stud LD for him if it didn't happen by now

If Trouba isn't traded signed by December 1, the Jets will still control him for four years, while Trouba has to wait one more year until he hits UFA.

Trouba will sign with the Jets if the Jets do not consumate a good deal.

It would be absolutely absurd to trade him for kitchen scraps and send a message to their other young players that they can have an easy time to move to other teams.

 

[BB88]

Trouba might see it like this is the cross roads of his career. If he leaves Winnipeg for a team that needs him more and will use him properly, he can turn into a top pairing Dman. If he stays with Winnipeg he may turn into an inconsistent D who plays up and down the lineup, and inevitably gets passed over. He could lose 5 million this year but gain all that back many times over by changing teams.

Or just wait a year or 2 and he could be the #1D for Winnipeg, and grow with Scheifele, Laine, Ehlers, Connor, Morrissey, Helle.
Today he's already a #2D for them.
Very few teams in the league can match that.

Reading his agent comments/interviews you get the feeling that Trouba simply doesn't want to be in Winnipeg, it's not about icetime, winning, or which side he plays, they want out.

 

[jay from jersey]

umm

No, I am a poster that owns and runs his own business [MOD]
I understand that Chevy is under zero pressure to move Trouba right now from either his ownership or the fans, and that he isn't likely to allow a 22 y/o RFA to dictate his roster decisions. He will only move the player on his own terms and timeline, if need be. I also understand that your initial wall of text suggesting the Jets should trade Trouba for a bunch of NYR flotsam was likely motivated by that the Rangers are currently getting shanked by the Devils tonight. Enjoy the game.

rangers have their scrubs in sans Zibby,Miller, kreider, and the devils have pretty much their entire team dressed so think again. Don't worry you might get to see your team play a playoff game within the next 3 years. Owning your own business and all, you must have someone else to the books and asset management because the last thing a team that has trouble bringing UFA talent in, is package more ELC "10 first RD picks" as you say, out of town with a 22 year old pissed off d-man with tremendous potential. don't be mad at me trouba dislikes the city of winnipeg. I didn't say anything bad about it. But all the posts on here trouba for lindholm, trouba for McDonuagh is just plain ridiculous.

 

[jay from jersey]

No

If Trouba isn't traded signed by December 1, the Jets will still control him for four years, while Trouba has to wait one more year until he hits UFA.

Trouba will sign with the Jets if the Jets do not consumate a good deal.

It would be absolutely absurd to trade him for kitchen scraps and send a message to their other young players that they can have an easy time to move to other teams.

Not kitchen scraps. No one is saying that. But a 1- 1 LD trade for a d-man as young as trouba with his similar potential is just not realistic. More then likely it will be a top 4 d-man prospect and Draft picks.. 1st 2nd etc. the 1 for 1 with lindholm caliber d-men is a fantasy

 

[Stej]

Unless he's worst as a LD than RD. Playing LD could hurt his value if he play way better as a RD, which would explain his stubbornness on playing RD.

EDIT: I.E. he could be a good top4 D on LD but be a top2 on RD. Playing LD in that case would hurt him a lot.

He looked fine to me on the left side last year, but your point is taken.

It's just funny to me that he finally gets to drop the Mark Stuart anchor this season to play with Buff and he won't even give it a chance. Shows that he must really want out if he won't sign a deal and let Chevy work quietly in private to move him. Ironically the public declaration makes it harder to trade him, so good luck playing chicken with Chevy. The guy has ice in his veins and is super patient.

 

[93LEAFS]

He looked fine to me on the left side last year, but your point is taken.

It's just funny to me that he finally gets to drop the Mark Stuart anchor this season to play with Buff and he won't even give it a chance. Shows that he must really want out if he won't sign a deal and let Chevy work quietly in private to move him. Ironically the public declaration makes it harder to trade him, so good luck playing chicken with Chevy. The guy has ice in his veins and is super patient.

Something had to be said post-WHC. Its not like they suddenly dropped the hammer on Winnipeg, they've given them since at least May (but may have notified other teams they want out, but not the public). I think at this point it really makes no difference, it was probably known to all teams that Trouba is willing to go to that he wasn't going to sign with Winnipeg. I guess they could pretend its a typical contract dispute into November, but this makes his intentions clear.

 

[Whileee]

How many teams can even afford Trouba?
No GM is going to give up premium cost controlled assets for a player thats asking for a huge raise and has requested a trade

There were tons of teams interested in Trouba before he requested a trade. I'm not sure how a trade request diminishes their interest in him.

What will a team have to pay to acquire Trouba? At least a bit more than the next highest bidder.

Chevy will set his minimum price, and then he'll take the best deal on the table that at least meets that price. If a team wants a "bargain" because Trouba has requested a trade, they'll be immediately out of the running. Teams that want Trouba, and have wanted him for some time, will remain in the competition.

 

[Whileee]

Something had to be said post-WHC. Its not like they suddenly dropped the hammer on Winnipeg, they've given them since at least May (but may have notified other teams they want out, but not the public). I think at this point it really makes no difference, it was probably known to all teams that Trouba is willing to go to that he wasn't going to sign with Winnipeg. I guess they could pretend its a typical contract dispute into November, but this makes his intentions clear.

Good points.

I would bet that any team that has a real interest in Trouba (and most others) have known for several months that Trouba wanted a trade, and I would bet that Chevy has been receiving trade offers for some time. He is patient (sometimes to a fault), but he also has an understanding of what value he wants to get for Trouba. Also, situations sometimes have to change in the market before the right deal can be made. This relates to salary caps, injuries, etc. The Jets retain Trouba's rights and they know exactly what's on the table for him at this point. They can afford to be patient to wait until the right situation emerges, including the possibility that Trouba rethinks his situation and decides to sign in Winnipeg (however unlikely).

 

[Mr Positive]

By all accounts, Trouba was already pencilled onto the top pairing with Buff for this season. Almost surely playing 25+ minutes per game. Unless it actually is about right vs left, I'm not sure where in the league he'd get a better opportunity than that.

In other words, if his concern is to turn into a top pairing defenseman, that dream could have been realized this year with Winnipeg.

being penciled in for the top pairing is not the same as being in the role. Maybe he doesn't trust that coaching will keep him there, or maybe he doesn't have faith in his own ability to become a left side D and play up to his potential.

His stated reason for wanting out is usage, and in the absence of a serious source otherwise that's what it is. I'm just saying that there is logic in him waiting this situation out if it costs him in the short term. He's not going to break down or take a bridge deal if he needs to be used in the correct way ASAP or his career could take a slide. Arguably that has already started happening last season.

 

[BB88]

being penciled in for the top pairing is not the same as being in the role. Maybe he doesn't trust that coaching will keep him there, or maybe he doesn't have faith in his own ability to become a left side D and play up to his potential.

His stated reason for wanting out is usage, and in the absence of a serious source otherwise that's what it is. I'm just saying that there is logic in him waiting this situation out if it costs him in the short term. He's not going to break down or take a bridge deal if he needs to be used in the correct way ASAP or his career could take a slide. Arguably that has already started happening last season.

He's been already playing 22mins per night, highest of these ELC kids.

 

[Hurt]

This will be the only warning. Any further rule breaking posts will result in threadbans and infractions.

Sincerely,

Your local friendly moderator staff

 

[Guffman]

Not kitchen scraps. No one is saying that. But a 1- 1 LD trade for a d-man as young as trouba with his similar potential is just not realistic. More then likely it will be a top 4 d-man prospect and Draft picks.. 1st 2nd etc. the 1 for 1 with lindholm caliber d-men is a fantasy

Agreed that it is not realistic. I'd rather trade Trouba for a top flight forward and bundle our excess young, skilled forwards for a LHD.

I don't think we'll find a LHD equivalent of Trouba 1:1.

I guess we'll see how it plays out by mid-November. I wouldn't rule out Trouba staying with the Jets. Who knows what happens in Winnipeg and the rest if the league in two months? Opportunities might arise.

 

[Legend123]

There were tons of teams interested in Trouba before he requested a trade. I'm not sure how a trade request diminishes their interest in him.

What will a team have to pay to acquire Trouba? At least a bit more than the next highest bidder.

Chevy will set his minimum price, and then he'll take the best deal on the table that at least meets that price. If a team wants a "bargain" because Trouba has requested a trade, they'll be immediately out of the running. Teams that want Trouba, and have wanted him for some time, will remain in the competition.

The problem isnt who doesnt want Trouba its what they have to pay for him and how much they pay him in terms of money. That makes a trade very hard 12 days or so before the start of the season.

 

[Whileee]

The problem isnt who doesnt want Trouba its what they have to pay for him and how much they pay him in terms of money. That makes a trade very hard 12 days or so before the start of the season.

Absolutely. Salary and cap considerations will affect the market.

Trouba's agent has indicated that he would be willing to work with teams to facilitate a trade, suggesting that perhaps they'd be willing to work out an economical solution (i.e. good long-term deal or maybe a decent bridge contract). My guess is that the contract ask from a team that is highly desirable to Trouba (maybe Detroit or NYR) would be low, whereas the expected trade return would remain the same.

That's partly why I think that the Jets don't really get harmed by waiting. If Trouba is willing to sign a sweetheart deal with a new team to facilitate a trade before he is ineligible to play in the NHL at all this season (Dec. 1), that might actually enhance his trade value.

Having said that, I think there's a decent chance that Chevy will want to resolve things quickly and get the uncertainty out of the way. The Jets are likely pretty high on their roster going into this season, and might not want this to drag out too long. It's hard to say.

 

[Legend123]

Absolutely. Salary and cap considerations will affect the market.

Trouba's agent has indicated that he would be willing to work with teams to facilitate a trade, suggesting that perhaps they'd be willing to work out an economical solution (i.e. good long-term deal or maybe a decent bridge contract). My guess is that the contract ask from a team that is highly desirable to Trouba (maybe Detroit or NYR) would be low, whereas the expected trade return would remain the same.

That's partly why I think that the Jets don't really get harmed by waiting. If Trouba is willing to sign a sweetheart deal with a new team to facilitate a trade before he is ineligible to play in the NHL at all this season (Dec. 1), that might actually enhance his trade value.

Having said that, I think there's a decent chance that Chevy will want to resolve things quickly and get the uncertainty out of the way. The Jets are likely pretty high on their roster going into this season, and might not want this to drag out too long. It's hard to say.

Why would Trouba ever do that to an upcoming team is beyond me.

 

[Sam Spade]

I just realized Trouba and Turris have the same agent. Maybe Trouba will get his way after all.

 

[johna2626]

Trouba might see it like this is the cross roads of his career. If he leaves Winnipeg for a team that needs him more and will use him properly, he can turn into a top pairing Dman. If he stays with Winnipeg he may turn into an inconsistent D who plays up and down the lineup, and inevitably gets passed over. He could lose 5 million this year but gain all that back many times over by changing teams.

What's worse for development, playing top pairing minutes with Big Buff or sitting out the year? He might actually become inconsistent because of the sitting out!!!

 

[CREW99AW]

The problem isnt who doesnt want Trouba its what they have to pay for him and how much they pay him in terms of money. That makes a trade very hard 12 days or so before the start of the season.

Friedman: Winnipeg's asking price for Trouba is huge.
McKenzie: A lot of teams interested in acquiring Trouba..

Can the posters hoping that Trouba can be acquired cheaply, quit with the idea that NHL GMs are not aware that they will have to move top , young talent for him and that some are willng to clear out salary either during the season or next off season?
And looking at how quickly Overhardt clients RyJo and Turris reached agreements with their new teams, it does not look like GMs are overly concerned with reaching agreement with Trouba.

Not getting Trouba for 2nd tier talent and a 1st. Winnipeg is not under tremendous pressure to make a quick deal.