Value of: Trevor Zegras this offseason

[Captain Mountain]

As a Habs fan the question you should be asking is why your GM keeps approaching the Ducks about Zegras. The interest is obviously more than just passing.

Care to elaborate on that? Because by all reporting, Montreal is pretty uninterested in paying what the Anahiem is asking for.

Its frankly malpractice if a GM from ANY team that needs more offense doesn't keep checking in on guys that may be available. That doesn't mean the interest is aggressive.

Especially if you're comparing it to Dubois, where the interest was almost definitely greater, but Montreal still wasn't willing to pay the price LA did.

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

Care to elaborate on that? Because by all reporting, Montreal is pretty uninterested in paying what the Anahiem is asking for.

Its frankly malpractice if a GM from ANY team that needs more offense doesn't keep checking in on guys that may be available. That doesn't mean the interest is aggressive.

Especially if you're comparing it to Dubois, where the interest was almost definitely greater, but Montreal still wasn't willing to pay the price LA did.

- 1 we don’t know what PV has asked for…. 1 report suggested Reinbacher/guhle +. That + could be a lot of things.

I think 3 separate times Montreal has been in rumors for zegras, maybe they arnt willing to meet PVs demands but they def are interested in him, maybe they are hoping pv price comes down(maybe pv is asking for 5th overall + Reinbacher/guhle…. We don’t know).

I don’t think tomd comment really needed expanding, it’s pretty evident that Montreal has a real interest in zegras, the question is does Montreal eventually crack and pay whatever PV wants, or does PV come down on his price…. Or does another team swoop in and pay the price…. Or does PV keep what he has and continues building.

The reports also say PV is just listening, never say that he is actively shopping zegras. Which means Montreal is initiating the conversations

 

[tomd]

Care to elaborate on that? Because by all reporting, Montreal is pretty uninterested in paying what the Anahiem is asking for.

Its frankly malpractice if a GM from ANY team that needs more offense doesn't keep checking in on guys that may be available. That doesn't mean the interest is aggressive.

Especially if you're comparing it to Dubois, where the interest was almost definitely greater, but Montreal still wasn't willing to pay the price LA did.

The interest has dated back to at least January if sources (including in Montreal) are to be believed. A simple internet search will confirm that for you.

 

[FiveTacos]

Its frankly malpractice if a GM from ANY team that needs more offense doesn't keep checking in on guys that may be available.

Yes but according to the folks who think he's not very good, apparently the Ducks don't want him, and the price should be pretty low. Amazing that no one has met the bargain basement value he supposedly has. Is Montreal in the habit of inquiring about players no one else wants?

Or perhaps more likely, many teams would be interested, indicating that he has good value, and the fact that Anaheim hasn't moved him suggests that they actually think he's good too and they don't want to give up on him cheap just because he was injured this year.

I mean really, if a mid to late 1st or B+ level prospect were all it took, I can think of several teams who could use a 23 yo skill guy (either rebuilding teams or teams who are getting older) who would have been all over that by now. The median mid 1st round forward is nowhere near as good as Zegras.

 

[HabsAddict]

As a Habs fan the question you should be asking is why your GM keeps approaching the Ducks about Zegras. The interest is obviously more than just passing.

EVERY GMs job is to look at what is offered or what he can get on the market.

 

[Captain Mountain]

- 1 we don’t know what PV has asked for…. 1 report suggested Reinbacher/guhle +. That + could be a lot of things.

I think 3 separate times Montreal has been in rumors for zegras, maybe they arnt willing to meet PVs demands but they def are interested in him, maybe they are hoping pv price comes down(maybe pv is asking for 5th overall + Reinbacher/guhle…. We don’t know)

"3 separate times" is kind of low tbh compared to, say, Dubois rumours. And from guys who appear to be close to the Habs FO, it sounds like its not really the direction Montreal would prefer to go right now. Obviously they'd hope prices would go down, but the sense appears to be that Montreal has other guys higher on their target list.

The interest has dated back to at least January if sources (including in Montreal) are to be believed. A simple internet search will confirm that for you.

You're severely underestimating how frequently NHL GMs check in on players if you think that qualifies as "obviously more than just passing". Especially since in at least one of those instances Verbeek said he didn't receive any calls on Zegras.

Yes but according to the folks who think he's not very good, apparently the Ducks don't want him, and the price should be pretty low. Amazing that no one has met the bargain basement value he supposedly has. Is Montreal in the habit of inquiring about players no one else wants?

Or perhaps more likely, many teams would be interested, indicating that he has good value, and the fact that Anaheim hasn't moved him suggests that they actually think he's good too and they don't want to give up on him cheap just because he was injured this year.

I mean really, if a mid to late 1st or B+ level prospect were all it took, I can think of several teams who could use a 23 yo skill guy (either rebuilding teams or teams who are getting older) who would have been all over that by now. The median mid 1st round forward is nowhere near as good as Zegras.

Or perhaps its that there are good reasons for the Ducks to consider moving him now (as he may not have the same opportunities going forward which may affect his value) and would be willing to move him at a certain price, but serious question marks about his overall game and recent play mean that no team thinks he's worth that price.

Very few people seriously believe a mid to late 1st and a B prospect is all it will take to get Zegras, but at the same time there are enough question marks right now that trading a young/blue chip D or super high pick is worth it given other players who may be available in trade or free agency.

 

[HabsAddict]

Care to elaborate on that? Because by all reporting, Montreal is pretty uninterested in paying what the Anahiem is asking for.

Its frankly malpractice if a GM from ANY team that needs more offense doesn't keep checking in on guys that may be available. That doesn't mean the interest is aggressive.

Especially if you're comparing it to Dubois, where the interest was almost definitely greater, but Montreal still wasn't willing to pay the price LA did.

After the DD...aka Dubois Debacle and the missed bullet, Hughes will be even MORE cautious about making a deal.

At this point, at the asking price of Rein/Guhle/5th, it's dead. Only think I can see is 26th and add ons like X and Beck. THAT wont fly either.

Last year I was nervous about Hughes getting Dubois but Hughes walked away from LAs over-payment, now I feel far safer that Z is not going to happen at that price. Besides, there are a lot more young top 6 one can trade for that doesn't have the concerns that this trade can bring.

When it comes to trades, this is a medium risk, but because of the high trade value asked for, relatively high risk.

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

After the DD...aka Dubois Debacle and the missed bullet, Hughes will be even MORE cautious about making a deal.

At this point, at the asking price of Rein/Guhle/5th, it's dead. Only think I can see is 26th and add ons like X and Beck. THAT wont fly either.

Last year I was nervous about Hughes getting Dubois but Hughes walked away from LAs over-payment, now I feel far safer that Z is not going to happen at that price. Besides, there are a lot more young top 6 one can trade for that doesn't have the concerns that this trade can bring.

When it comes to trades, this is a medium risk, but because of the high trade value asked for, relatively high risk.

Ya considering it seems like PV is asking for a lot I’m not sure zegras will ultimately be moved and we’re in no rush to move him

 

[FiveTacos]

Or perhaps its that there are good reasons for the Ducks to consider moving him now (as he may not have the same opportunities going forward which may affect his value)

What opportunities? To play with some of the worst PP1 teammates in the league his first few years? To play on a team that was getting out shot at historic levels and almost never had the puck? He's almost certainly going to see both situations improve going forward

Very few people seriously believe a mid to late 1st and a B prospect is all it will take to get Zegras,

Obviously not. But that's what most of these proposals degenerate down to.

but at the same time there are enough question marks right now that trading a young/blue chip D or super high pick is worth it given other players who may be available in trade or free agency.

Holding back trade ammo for a bigger package makes sense. OTOH if a star player comes available, the Ducks could likely trade Zegras AND some of their many picks and prospects and outbid most teams, and it'd be far more enticing than the kind of picks and prospects that some fans deem too valuable to trade for Zegras.

 

[Captain Mountain]

After the DD...aka Dubois Debacle and the missed bullet, Hughes will be even MORE cautious about making a deal.

At this point, at the asking price of Rein/Guhle/5th, it's dead. Only think I can see is 26th and add ons like X and Beck. THAT wont fly either.

Last year I was nervous about Hughes getting Dubois but Hughes walked away from LAs over-payment, now I feel far safer that Z is not going to happen at that price. Besides, there are a lot more young top 6 one can trade for that doesn't have the concerns that this trade can bring.

When it comes to trades, this is a medium risk, but because of the high trade value asked for, relatively high risk.

Hughes hasn't been shy about paying for young players with upside (a la Dach and Newhook). I don't think he'd have a problem paying (a high price in his mind) for Zegras, but I don't think Dubois factors in because it sounds like Montreal wasn't interested unless the price came down well below what LA paid.

With Zegras, part of the cost is that he has two 60 point seasons already. It just doesn't sound like Montreal is interested in paying more for a young player who has already produced/performed in the NHL, and would prefer to pay less for someone who hasn't, but who they believe has high upside.

 

[Ianturnedbull]

Reasons to keep Zegras:

The Michigan

Reasons to trade Zegras:

Everything else

 

[Captain Mountain]

What opportunities? To play with some of the worst PP1 teammates in the league his first few years? To play on a team that was getting out shot at historic levels and almost never had the puck? He's almost certainly going to see both situations improve going forward

Yes, Being handed prime PP1 minutes and getting opportunities that teams with more talent wouldn't give him are exactly the kind of opporunities we're talking about, and most looking in wonder if he'll get those same opportunities when considering McTavish and Terry are unquestionably better, Carlsson having more upside, Gauthier playing a far more complete game and Verbeek's stated intention to add another top-6 winger.

Obviously not. But that's what most of these proposals degenerate down to.

This is HFBoards, most proposals from other fanbases are underoffers and most proposals from the fanbase are overdemands.

Holding back trade ammo for a bigger package makes sense. OTOH if a star player comes available, the Ducks could likely trade Zegras AND some of their many picks and prospects and outbid most teams, and it'd be far more enticing than the kind of picks and prospects that some fans deem too valuable to trade for Zegras.

Maybe. I don't think Zegras is the NHL piece a team would want for a star player unless that star player was similar to Zegras.

 

[Rooch]

This guy actually works for TSN.

https://x.com/i/web/status/1800164755992461775

 

[Rooch]

Reasons to keep Zegras:

The Michigan

Reasons to trade Zegras:

Everything else

 

[tomd]

Well it appears that the HF fans have reached an impasse on Zegras trade talks. Will the Habs GM follow suit and stop calling PV about him?

 

[HabsAddict]

Ya considering it seems like PV is asking for a lot I’m not sure zegras will ultimately be moved and we’re in no rush to move him

You are one of the more reasonable fans.

I can't lie, I have hockey porn fantasies....

Draft for Sennecke, trade for Z and with Hutson, we may have a highlite reel machine of a team. Imagine the OT with those 3 on the ice.

On the other hand, we may also have all flash and no substance team...that will never get us to a cup.

I go back to the Hab teams of the 70s. They had guys who were flashy scoring machines like LaFleur, Shutt, F Mahovelich but they also had a LOT of gritty players.

We're weeks away from getting answers...or nothing.

 

[FiveTacos]

Yes, Being handed prime PP1 minutes and getting opportunities that teams with more talent wouldn't give him are exactly the kind of opporunities we're talking about,

He's had PP1 minutes, but they were far from prime. Terry is a rush player, but not particularly good on the PP. Fowler in his prime wasn't a good PP1 guy, now he shouldn't even be a PP2 dude. Who else was there? Milano? Henrique? Zegras wasn't "handed" squat, he was by far their most effective player at actually doing something on the PP. Maybe on a better team he isn't the best guy, but he sure as hell would have played with better teammates even on most PP2 units around the league.

and most looking in wonder if he'll get those same opportunities when considering McTavish and Terry are unquestionably better

McTavish has yet to consistently produce as much, and is far less attentive defensively ... not kidding. He flashes potential, but no he's not unquestionably better. Terry is more developed, but I daresay he's regressed or plateaued the last couple years, not improved.

Carlsson having more upside

Yes, although he would be no better off going forward if there weren't young guys with talent in place. Zegras was unfortunately one of the first pieces to arrive in the rebuild.

, Gauthier playing a far more complete game

At this point that is pure projection. But we do know he was acquired by trading a less valuable player than Zegras.

and Verbeek's stated intention to add another top-6 winger.

Why wouldn't he? The Ducks have promising young guys but some might fail.

Maybe. I don't think Zegras is the NHL piece a team would want for a star player unless that star player was similar to Zegras.

Zegras plus one of their dmen plus a 1st would be a far better package than the crap most fans want to offer for a legit star.

 

[Ducks DVM]

This guy actually works for TSN.

https://x.com/i/web/status/1800164755992461775

If anything, he’s telling you that he has no faith in the RD situation going forward, and that Zegras is the chip most likely to rectify that situation.

Weird take.

 

[tomd]

If anything, he’s telling you that he has no faith in the RD situation going forward, and that Zegras is the chip most likely to rectify that situation.

Weird take.

Yeah, seems like trading from a position of relative strength to get something that fills a relative weakness is what teams have been doing for a hundred years. That is obviously lost on Eric.

 

[ohcomeonref]

I mean if you want to ignore examples you can do whatever you want. Just like Hawks/Wild fans ignored all the examples of recent trades. Fans ignore it because it hurts the narrative that they are getting back a kings ransom or a better player. You even had Laine for PLD. But his name is Patrick and not Trevor so I guess it's not a good example for you. They were also 22. So can't use that example. Too much a difference between 22 and 23 years old.

Cutter never played in an NHL game when he got traded. Full stop. He's a magic bean. You could talk up any prospect available with the 17th pick.

"If all it takes for a 23 (not 24/1/2, not 26, not forcing their way out of town) 60-65 point player is a mid 1st, or another player and a pick, you should be able to find them."

Or a guy coming off an on pace for 40 point season making 5.75M & why teams might be hesitant to even trade a pick in the teens for him. That's reality. I do believe Verbeek will move on quickly from him though. That's my position. Doesn't fit with the tough two way team he's interested in building. Same with Drysdale. Guys who aren't tough to play against.

Gauthier >>>> 17th overall.

And Zegras > Gauthier.

 

[ohcomeonref]

Reasons to keep Zegras:

The Michigan

Reasons to trade Zegras:

Everything else

Reasons to post about Zegras:

I don't know anything about him but EA cover and Michigan

Reasons not to post about Zegras:

I don't know anything about him but EA cover and Michigan

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

You are one of the more reasonable fans.

I can't lie, I have hockey porn fantasies....

Draft for Sennecke, trade for Z and with Hutson, we may have a highlite reel machine of a team. Imagine the OT with those 3 on the ice.

On the other hand, we may also have all flash and no substance team...that will never get us to a cup.

I go back to the Hab teams of the 70s. They had guys who were flashy scoring machines like LaFleur, Shutt, F Mahovelich but they also had a LOT of gritty players.

We're weeks away from getting answers...or nothing.

Ya ultimately the worst case is we keep zegras(from our perspective is also the best case) … which is what most duck fans want anyway…. And when healthy he’s been arguably our best player the last couple years…. Sucks that these rumors turn up and we even have to have these discussions.

Pv is pretty closed lipped so we have no idea where his head is

 

[HabsAddict]

Ya ultimately the worst case is we keep zegras(from our perspective is also the best case) … which is what most duck fans want anyway…. And when healthy he’s been arguably our best player the last couple years…. Sucks that these rumors turn up and we even have to have these discussions.

Pv is pretty closed lipped so we have no idea where his head is

PV is old school, tough, hard nose guy who likely prefers players like him. I'm pretty sure he wouldn't have a problem trading Z, but of course, at the value and type of player he wants.

Hughes is also a sharp GM that values grit AND talent. So I don't think there is a high probability of a trade between our teams, BUT, I think that other GMs might bite. Might...or lot's of dead cyber trees for nothing.

 

[dracom]

PV is old school, tough, hard nose guy who likely prefers players like him. I'm pretty sure he wouldn't have a problem trading Z, but of course, at the value and type of player he wants.

Hughes is also a sharp GM that values grit AND talent. So I don't think there is a high probability of a trade between our teams, BUT, I think that other GMs might bite. Might...or lot's of dead cyber trees for nothing.

Not sure why people keep saying Pat only wants guys like him. That’s not how gms work. Hell Pats never been a GM before so there’s no gming history people can look at.

He’s trying to build a competitive roster, and a 23 year old who put up 60+ point seasons in his first two years helps you be competitive.

 

[FiveTacos]

PV is old school, tough, hard nose guy who likely prefers players like him. I'm pretty sure he wouldn't have a problem trading Z, but of course, at the value and type of player he wants.

Then he should have traded both him and Terry instead of re-signing them. Heck, he should have traded them together, since neither is this supposed player like Verbeek himself. Then again, maybe he's been around long enough to know there's more than one type of player you need to win games, and he's not just looking for clones of himself.

Even tough, grindy teams that are successful usually have at least a couple guys who aren't necessarily that exact same type of player. Otherwise you end up with those teams that are tough, gritty ... and lack that little extra creativity or speed to get over the top.

If a GM prefers to build powerhouse offenses, does that mean he doesn't want any tough gritty checkers, stay at home dmen, or power forwards? Of course not. Just because you build a particular type of team doesn't mean you think all other types of players are disposable.

And honestly, I doubt anyone is untouchable on the Ducks. Unless you have a generational guy there is no such thing. Better players than anyone they have have gotten traded in this league before.