Nuge and Yak proved they were ready their first seasons, don't give me that.
News Article: Training camp starts. Camp discussion
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Mcnotloilersfan
I'm here, I'm bored
Your complaints are about ELC status. I'm talking about player readiness for this league and if that rushed. 2 different things. I'm sorry but you're off base in every case here. Nuge was on pace for 70 points in his rookie year for crying out loud.
Draisaitl played that long because he was physically ready. He simply wasn't ready mentally for the top 6 role that we were trying to force him into and they realized that and did the right thing for him.
Again. We have never hurt a player by rushing him into the league. We hurt players with poor coaching, development and veteran support.
McShogun99
Registered User
We burned a year of Draisaitl's ELC by keeping him past the 9 games when everyone knew he wasn't ready. With the cap those ELC years's are very valuable.
It was a mistake for sure but it seemed clear that the Oil wanted him on a good WHL team or here training with pros.
We can argue till we are blue in the teeth if it was bad for the org as a whole etc, but it sure seemed to not hamper his development at all.
That and if we postponed it a year then his cap hit comes into effect this year rather than last, really has no effect on the current team.
Last year he's not getting 8.5mill.
That said, he wasnt ready in his rookie year. You realise many teams deploy rookies who are big contributora right?
Which has zero effect on the team this year. Or last year for that matter.
Mr Positive
Cap Crunch Incoming
- Nov 20, 2013
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It didn't amount to much with Drai.
If we had kept that ELC year, he would have been cheaper last year, but last year we had all the cap space we could want with McDavid's 12.5 AAV coming so that space in reserve. The main important thing was keeping all our RFA years, which we did by sending Drai down before he played 40 games.
However I suppose it would have been nicer to have his 8 year deal starting now instead of last year, just for the far future when we have to re-sign him again. But remember that potentially, he could have increased his value from his current AAV amount. It didn't end up turning out that way though.
I do think that in a way, it is better to get the ELC over with quickly in some cases. The more you delay it's end, the more the player's stock will rise, and the higher the cap hit will be on the deal that really matters: the long term one where the player fits into the core.
Mcnotloilersfan
I'm here, I'm bored
Nugent-Hopkins and Yakupov both had very strong rookie seasons and both were in the conversation for the Calder. Saying they should've been sent back to junior is the lamest version of hindsight and not even worth discussing. 1st overalls never go back.
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Meh.
Nuge was 167 lbs and was carried by Hall. Also cheated a lot for offense.
It should have been obvious he was gonna get shredded going up against Kopitar and Getzlaf.
Nuge hadn't really contributed to wins. We basically ended up bottom 5 team whenever he was relied on to be our #1C.
Yak... well? His confidence was obliterated. What we did obviously did NOT work.
Kinda surprised you would double down on that option in a do-over.
The issue was he was not a contributor his first season, yet we kept him up for half the year.
The side-crappy issue was burning a year of his ELC. But him getting shelled in the NHL his rookie year was the issue.
Is that clear? Its 2 shitty issues that happened because we refused to develop him properly?
RNH's game was never built to go head on against those two. What were we going to do, wait until his mid twenties when he developed man-strength? Or waited until their games diminished? The only mistake we made was thinking he was capable of doing it all. That and paying him like a damn star before he accomplished anything.
I don't look back on these things because it's a pointless thought process. Teams with the 1st overall pick want a player ready to play immediately. If they don't, they should be trading the pick--which was the right thing to do at the Yakupov draft. Complaining that we 'rushed' either of them is ridiculous.
Both werent particularly polished and there was significant talk of sending RNH back as most scouts deemed he wasnt ready.
No rush for Ryan Nugent-Hopkins
He never put up astronomical numbers in junior. He wasn't even a Mitch Marner level prospect, yet we rushed him up (Marner was sent down).
And i dont care about draft position. Player development and wins should trump that.
Spezza was a 2nd overall (could have been 1st) who was sent down more than once and then spent a year in the AHL.
I like what Arizona has done with Dylan Stome. A LOT more than what they did with Max Domi or Tony Duclair. Lets see if he busts.
No rush for Ryan Nugent-Hopkins
He never put up astronomical numbers in junior. He wasn't even a Mitch Marner level prospect, yet we rushed him up (Marner was sent down).
And i dont care about draft position. Player development and wins should trump that.
Spezza was a 2nd overall (could have been 1st) who was sent down more than once and then spent a year in the AHL.
I like what Arizona has done with Dylan Stome. A LOT more than what they did with Max Domi or Tony Duclair. Lets see if he busts.
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Mcnotloilersfan
I'm here, I'm bored
We waited it out because the fear was that he would not learn more in Junior with his size and skill. If he had a better group of guys to play with, he would have been fine to stay up. There wasn't a bad call at all in terms of his development and the player that he became is certainly proof.
Again. ELC. Different issue.
Mcnotloilersfan
I'm here, I'm bored
You're quoting the hockey news? Talking about reaching. Yikes.
Nuge had one of the best 18 year old seasons of this century before he got injured. He was ready to play.
McShogun99
Registered User
RNH was having one of the best rookie seasons since Kane before he got injured. If he played the full season he would have had 70 points and then eventually lost the Calder due to intangibles.
Someone on /r/hockey mentioned that Ty Rattie may have had some bad off season habits in other years, but that he was taking this summer very seriously. Couldn't find a link, so take it for what it's worth.. good news if true though.
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BarDownBobo
Registered User
Wells lasting longer than Skinner is interesting. I'm still very interested in what happens with the goalies at the minor league level, I can't imagine having both of those two in Wichita while Montoya and Starett are in Bakersfield is best for development...
nexttothemoon
and again...
They had 62 in camp... released 15 and now are down to 45 so who are the 2 others that are not being counted? Sekera and ______?
The Edmonton Oilers have reduced their training camp roster, assigning the following players:
Mitch Callahan (F) - Bakersfield (AHL)
Braden Christoffer (F) - Bakersfield (AHL)
Marc-Olivier Crevier-Morin (D) - Bakersfield (AHL)
Logan Day (D) - Bakersfield (AHL)
Luke Esposito (F) - Bakersfield (AHL)
Dave Gust (F) - Bakersfield (AHL)
Cameron Hebig (F) - Bakersfield (AHL)
Jake Kulevich (D) - Bakersfield (AHL)
Colin Larkin (F) - Bakersfield (AHL)
John McFarland (F) - Bakersfield (AHL)
Evan Polei (F) - Bakersfield (AHL)
Stuart Skinner (G) - Bakersfield (AHL)
Ryan Van Stralen (F) - Bakersfield (AHL)
Tyler Vesel (F) - Bakersfield (AHL)
Jared Wilson (D) - Bakersfield (AHL)
The Oilers roster currently has 45 players, including five goaltenders, 15 defencemen and 25 forwards.
nexttothemoon
and again...
Ok so digging a bit deeper...
Samorukov, Maksimov and Rodrigue were previously released from the group of 62 as well:
http://downloads.oilers.nhl.com/pdfs/2018-OILERS-TRAINING-CAMP-ROSTER.pdf
Oilers cut three from training camp roster
...so they were down to 59 in camp and now 15 more are cut today and they say they still have 45 left so there's 1 extra player in camp somewhere unaccounted for (unless they simply miscounted and they are actually at 44).
Samorukov, Maksimov and Rodrigue were previously released from the group of 62 as well:
http://downloads.oilers.nhl.com/pdfs/2018-OILERS-TRAINING-CAMP-ROSTER.pdf
Oilers cut three from training camp roster
...so they were down to 59 in camp and now 15 more are cut today and they say they still have 45 left so there's 1 extra player in camp somewhere unaccounted for (unless they simply miscounted and they are actually at 44).
BarDownBobo
Registered User
Nurse wasn't on the original roster since he wasn't signed.
Del Preston
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- Mar 8, 2013
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nexttothemoon
and again...
5
Koskinen
Talbot
Wells
Montoya
Starrett
15
Nurse
Sekera
Russell
Gravel
Larsson
Jerabek
Garrison
Stanton
Lowe
Bear
Bouchard
Klefbom
Jones
Benning
Lagesson
25
Rattie
Upshall
Khaira
Strome
Rieder
Malone
Lucic
Draisaitl
Brodziak
Chiasson
Currie
Kassian
Gambardella
Aberg
Benson
Russell
Yamamoto
Safin
Marody
Vesey
McLeod
Caggiula
McDavid
RNH
Puljujarvi
That's my count of the 45 left in camp.
edited...
Thanks for pointing out they didn't add Nurse. Now it all adds up to 45.
Koskinen
Talbot
Wells
Montoya
Starrett
15
Nurse
Sekera
Russell
Gravel
Larsson
Jerabek
Garrison
Stanton
Lowe
Bear
Bouchard
Klefbom
Jones
Benning
Lagesson
25
Rattie
Upshall
Khaira
Strome
Rieder
Malone
Lucic
Draisaitl
Brodziak
Chiasson
Currie
Kassian
Gambardella
Aberg
Benson
Russell
Yamamoto
Safin
Marody
Vesey
McLeod
Caggiula
McDavid
RNH
Puljujarvi
That's my count of the 45 left in camp.
edited...
Thanks for pointing out they didn't add Nurse. Now it all adds up to 45.
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