GDT: Training Camp 2023

[Raccoon Jesus]

So you are saying that the Kings,who had QB in a first line role for the majority of last season, would have had Tim Stutzle on the 4th line?

Come on Kurri, that is the worst take I’ve read on this forum all year.

I don't think he means last year, but there's ample evidence that TS wouldn't have had the opportunity to break out the way he has here in LA

Imagine who a 19 year old Stutzle is playing next to here. Athanasiou stapled to him, only for Stutzle to get benched when he causes a "-". No PP time. Bounced back and forth to Ontario.

It's all fantasyland anyway, no one is saying TS isn't a fantastic player, it's a shot at the development staff, not Stutzle.

 

[Fishhead]

After Byfield's previous injury I'm glad he played through that. He really needed to be on the ice.

 

[KopitarGOAT420]

Dude playing in the NHL as a 20 year old while being 15 lbs under your usual weight and having 2 sprained wrists is absolutely insane.

Obviously yeah there's the "Excuses excuses excuses" reaction and we still need to see him prove how much of a hindrance those things were but damn... Can't wait to see what QB can do this year assuming he can stay healthy.

Edit: AND not just playing in the NHL but playing well enough to the point where you gain the coach's trust to play on the 1st line and help elevate the play of two top players?? That's almost unheard of.

 

[Sol]

I don't think he means last year, but there's ample evidence that TS wouldn't have had the opportunity to break out the way he has here in LA

Imagine who a 19 year old Stutzle is playing next to here. Athanasiou stapled to him, only for Stutzle to get benched when he causes a "-". No PP time. Bounced back and forth to Ontario.

It's all fantasyland anyway, no one is saying TS isn't a fantastic player, it's a shot at the development staff, not Stutzle.

Yeah but it comes off as disingenuous when you consider the fact that they’re completely different players. With what we’ve seen from both players now, regardless of usage, one player is far superior than the other. Sure would Stutzle not get the time he has on the Kings. Possibly. But would he most likely far exceed Byfield? Yeah. I think it’s just weird how people pull all the stops for Byfield when Kaliyev gets zero rope around here when he’s been far more productive with less usage.

 

[Statto]

They should have stepped in. He’s still young enough that he doesn’t know any better and it’s not like he was a big piece on the team, others could have filled that spot while he healed

Maybe TMac made the call? People make assumptions on medical decisions that aren’t necessarily true. Players/coaches frequently over-rule medical advice, it happens in many sports.

 

[Statto]

Bro how is all of this questionable medical shit happening all at once? Last year with Fiala ? The staff has got to go I can’t fathom this type of ineptitude. If byfield can’t feel his wrists why the f*** is he playing? To potentially make any possible damage worse or even permanent ?


It is an excuses for sure but if it’s actually that serious people need to fired ASAP and the fact that no one has gotten canned is suspicious

As above there’s a lot of assumptions getting made. It’s like with Vilardi getting injured and sitting.. playing a game or two and then sitting again. People assume it was a bad medical decision when we don’t even know it was the same injury.

Even with Fiala, you assume the medical team has final say on it. I have no idea but I do think it’s a big assumption to make. My money is that the pressure building meaning questionable calls are being made.

For the record I think the medical staff should have final say. They don’t always which is why concussion protocols became mandatory.

 

[YP44]

Stutzle is already arguably a top ten forward in the league.

That pick is going to hurt for a long, long time.

If QB can pass Laf then will it hurt worse for the Rangers?

 

[Sol]

As above there’s a lot of assumptions getting made. It’s like with Vilardi getting injured and sitting.. playing a game or two and then sitting again. People assume it was a bad medical decision when we don’t even know it was the same injury.

Even with Fiala, you assume the medical team has final say on it. I have no idea but I do think it’s a big assumption to make. My money is that the pressure building meaning questionable calls are being made.

For the record I think the medical staff should have final say. They don’t always which is why concussion protocols became mandatory.

I just can’t remember any of this happening with the last Kings team? Maybe Richards after he got killed by Bolland? Why does it seem so frequently that Kings are playing injured when there’s no reason to be? Fiala looked so f***ed up when he returned and so did Arvidsson last season. And now Byfield couldn’t feel his hands? How come no one is stopping these guys? Their jobs are on the line.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

Yeah but it comes off as disingenuous when you consider the fact that they’re completely different players. With what we’ve seen from both players now, regardless of usage, one player is far superior than the other. Sure would Stutzle not get the time he has on the Kings. Possibly. But would he most likely far exceed Byfield? Yeah. I think it’s just weird how people pull all the stops for Byfield when Kaliyev gets zero rope around here when he’s been far more productive with less usage.

But again, you're going on a tangent against the point.

You agree with every name replaced in there except "Stutzle."

The point is--no player is above our shitty development and deployment, especially as a teenager. That's it. It's not an indictment on him as a player in any way at all--if anything, it's flattering to him and even more damning to the devstaff, as we're saying even a player THAT good would be sitting on 10 minutes in Ontario as a teenager.

 

[kings11]

Before Rosen revealed that Yannetti wanted to take Zegras and was overruled by Blake, there was certainly a valid assumption that he shared significant blame for the blunders in 2019 and 2020. Now that we know he was pushing for Zegras, we can safely place 100% of the blame for that on Blake, both the poor evaluation in making the pick and the poor development decisions that came 10 months later, that’s all on Blake and Yannetti gets a pass (for 2019 at least)

We don’t have as much information as to what happened in 2020, only talk of the Euro scouts being heavily behind Stutzle. Since they didn’t take Stutzle the blame either again falls on Blake, or Yannetti might share some of that one.

Such a shame we will no longer be able to have this type of quality information reported to the fans. Rosen said that multiple sources told him that, so we can assumeThe Mayor of Pravda was also told that information, yet never once mentioned it to his listeners. Hmmm, wonder why? Sadly we lost the most professional and honest person we had covering the Kings (again). It really sucks.

I’m pretty sure there are quotes out there that Blake’s plan was for the Kings to do a slow rebuild but the mutiny happened and he accelerated the timeline.. hence, Blake went with the slow burn in Byfield rather than the more pro ready player in Stutzle

 

[bland]

Stützle would undoubtedly have played, the question is if the fraternity would make him "pay his dues" before being put into a position of importance.

The Kings developmental issues aren't really about keeping them out of the lineup, its keeping them out of the positions they were drafted to fulfill.

If you draft Stützle, it's to be a top 6 impact player, not a bottom sixer. You get him ready for that role ASAP so you can take advantage of the ELC cost-controlled production. You don't go out and sign other top sixers for the roster that just earned a top 3 pick to stand in his way just to chase a wildcard playoff spot when the team isn't ready to win.

If Blake had the cajones to tell Doughty, Kopitar and Quick to get stuffed at the end of 2021, the team would have been far better off for it.

 

[Statto]

I just can’t remember any of this happening with the last Kings team? Maybe Richards after he got killed by Bolland? Why does it seem so frequently that Kings are playing injured when there’s no reason to be? Fiala looked so f***ed up when he returned and so did Arvidsson last season. And now Byfield couldn’t feel his hands? How come no one is stopping these guys? Their jobs are on the line.

I agree it’s an issue I’m just not convinced it’s the medical team. I could be completely wrong though… I usually am LOL

 

[BigKing]

I’m pretty sure there are quotes out there that Blake’s plan was for the Kings to do a slow rebuild but the mutiny happened and he accelerated the timeline.. hence, Blake went with the slow burn in Byfield rather than the more pro ready player in Stutzle

They already had Byfield when the "mutiny" happened. Postseason quotes from Doughty about getting help etc...were after the 20-21 season. Blake then went out and got RV and Danault.

Blake already said the rebuild was "accelerated" by drafting Byfield. They thought he would be an impact player by now and anything they say contrary to that is a lie. Of course, I don't expect them to go out in the media and say that he sucks or something.

 

[DoktorJeep]

It’s clear that the top management have no vision beyond extending the remaining core’s cup odds, one year at a time. It’s been over six years, and all the evidence shows the guiding philosophy is to manage things one day at a time.

When it comes to decisions that impact the next major game, the core principle is expediency. All other decisions are based on public relations. This is on and off the ice. It’s a strong recipe for consistent mediocrity and no championships.

Ownership is in caretaker mode and hires accordingly. Management are honorable time servers who are fan favorites. We are 3-5 years out from any legitimate contender. It’ll take that long for ownership to see enough failure to make a change and fans finally waking up after seeing a team built around paying major money to Kopitar and Doughty not being good enough.

 

[Sol]

Haven’t some people already started pedaling out rumors that Yanetti liked Stutzle more?

 

[KopitarGOAT420]

If Blake had the cajones to tell Doughty, Kopitar and Quick to get stuffed at the end of 2021, the team would have been far better off for it.

EDIT: No need to read the rest of the post below, I misunderstood the point @bland was making.

Brother................

In what universe are the Kings BETTER off without Kopitar???????? That is a certifiably insane take lol.

The guy is a Selke trophy candidate year in and year out and plays over 20 mins a night in all situations and has led the team in scoring like 15 years in a row. He also plays an insanely smart game and hardly takes any penalties despite constantly matching up against the best players in the world. He's also one of the classiest guys on the planet and a fantastic role model.

If you want to be mad at management for blocking roster spots for prospects then go ahead but getting rid of Kopitar has nothing to do with that - Complain about the Dubois trade and the Danault signing if roster spots / opportunities for prospects is what you're upset about.

I'm sorry but that's hands down the dumbest take I've ever heard on these boards (specifically talking about Kopitar being included in your list).

Also yeah Doughty might be a little concerning but he also just put up a 50+ point season and was a +12 while (like Kopitar) playing against the best players in the world and logging big minutes. He might not be the best defenseman in the world anymore (he was in his prime) and he might not be worth $11 million but he's still pretty damn good dude.

Y'all are ungrateful AF with some of the s**t you throw out there on these forums. Figure it tf out and put a little respect on the names of players that brought this city not one but TWO stanley cups - The only stanley cups this team has ever won by the way.

The Quick trade was unfortunate (given his legacy) but necessary - Kopitar and Doughty still play the game at a really high level. It's time for some of these young guys to step up and hopefully we see that this year. If that happens, the Kings will have an insane mix of young talent and veteran leadership with cup-winning experience.. that's HUGE and something virtually every other fanbase in the league would dream about. If the Kings had somehow managed to get rid of Kopitar, Doughty, and Quick in 2021 like you've so foolishly suggested we would still be YEARS away from even sniffing the playoffs.

 

[Sol]

Getting rid of Doughty and Kopitar is infinitely better than letting them take a spot that someone else should have by now. The Kings inability to allow that position to be available is what bottle necked this team. If the Kings got rid of Kopitar and Doughty then the future of this team would be brighter 100 percent because either players would blossom with more playtime or the Kings would rebuild a lot sooner rather than took away in the middle of nothingness.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

It is funny how at the time of the draft, Stutzle was viewed as a future top line winger, and Byfield was viewed as a potential #1 center who would succeed Kopitar. Fast forward to today, and Stutzle is now a premier center, and Byfield has shifted to left wing.

 

[King'sPawn]

Stützle would undoubtedly have played, the question is if the fraternity would make him "pay his dues" before being put into a position of importance.

The Kings developmental issues aren't really about keeping them out of the lineup, its keeping them out of the positions they were drafted to fulfill.

If you draft Stützle, it's to be a top 6 impact player, not a bottom sixer. You get him ready for that role ASAP so you can take advantage of the ELC cost-controlled production. You don't go out and sign other top sixers for the roster that just earned a top 3 pick to stand in his way just to chase a wildcard playoff spot when the team isn't ready to win.

If Blake had the cajones to tell Doughty, Kopitar and Quick to get stuffed at the end of 2021, the team would have been far better off for it.

We're seeing this with Clarke, right now, literally.

He was talented enough to play in the NHL last year. He still got sent down and put up Bobby Orr type numbers in the OHL and playoffs.

This season, he's probably going to be sent down to the AHL due to a numbers issue.

Nobody's saying Stutzle isn't talented. But plenty are rightfully speculsting he'd be jerked around in different ways like Byfield. Heck, he was drafted in the CHL Import draft by the Seattle Thunderbirds. If not for COVID, he might have been sent down there for his D+1 season.

 

[bland]

Brother................

In what universe are the Kings BETTER off without Kopitar???????? That is a certifiably insane take lol.

The guy is a Selke trophy candidate year in and year out and plays over 20 mins a night in all situations and has led the team in scoring like 15 years in a row. He also plays an insanely smart game and hardly takes any penalties despite constantly matching up against the best players in the world. He's also one of the classiest guys on the planet and a fantastic role model.

If you want to be mad at management for blocking roster spots for prospects then go ahead but getting rid of Kopitar has nothing to do with that - Complain about the Dubois trade and the Danault signing if roster spots / opportunities for prospects is what you're upset about.

I'm sorry but that's hands down the dumbest take I've ever heard on these boards (specifically talking about Kopitar being included in your list).

Also yeah Doughty might be a little concerning but he also just put up a 50+ point season and was a +12 while (like Kopitar) playing against the best players in the world and logging big minutes. He might not be the best defenseman in the world anymore (he was in his prime) and he might not be worth $11 million but he's still pretty damn good dude.

Y'all are ungrateful AF with some of the s**t you throw out there on these forums. Figure it tf out and put a little respect on the names of players that brought this city not one but TWO stanley cups - The only stanley cups this team has ever won by the way.

The Quick trade was unfortunate (given his legacy) but necessary - Kopitar and Doughty still play the game at a really high level. It's time for some of these young guys to step up and hopefully we see that this year. If that happens, the Kings will have an insane mix of young talent and veteran leadership with cup-winning experience.. that's HUGE and something virtually every other fanbase in the league would dream about. If the Kings had somehow managed to get rid of Kopitar, Doughty, and Quick in 2021 like you've so foolishly suggested we would still be YEARS away from even sniffing the playoffs.

To save the rest of the board from having to reread something talked about ad nauseum for the last 8 years, I will just state that your obvious fanboy mentality has prevented you from reading that post correctly.

The point was telling those vets that their stated exit interview desires to compete immediately were no longer in the best interests of the organization and that a rebuild was necessary for the team's health.

Now go get your shine box.

 

[kingsfan28]

How is Yannetti even remotely responsible for the way the Kings have chosen to develop their prospects?? He drafted some really good players and was overruled on a few others. The guy is a keeper, Emerson and the whole AHL staff minus Stoll should be replaced

Exactly. all he can do is offer advice to the gm and then gm makes the call/ It's been documented that Blake has overruled his scouts several times, including Yanetti. So once again, its out of his hands.
With Blake having all his friends in position of development , its going to be damn hard to fire them for not doing a good job.

 

[Sol]

How is Yannetti even remotely responsible for the way the Kings have chosen to develop their prospects?? He drafted some really good players and was overruled on a few others. The guy is a keeper, Emerson and the whole AHL staff minus Stoll should be replaced

How can you be so certain though? Why would you stop at Yanetti? Wouldn’t you rather take a chance and get someone else as well? It’s nearly impossible to know how responsible Yanetti has been in all this. And when you consider the fact he’s a slick talker that doesn’t mean he’s going to come down hard on himself for some of the picks. I’d take the safe bet and can him as well. The kings have drafted duds during the most pivotal moment in recent history under his tenure. There’s something very rotten in his department and that stench is all over him as well whether he was an innocent bystander or not, he needs to go.

 

[kingsfan28]

Stützle would undoubtedly have played, the question is if the fraternity would make him "pay his dues" before being put into a position of importance.

The Kings developmental issues aren't really about keeping them out of the lineup, its keeping them out of the positions they were drafted to fulfill.

If you draft Stützle, it's to be a top 6 impact player, not a bottom sixer. You get him ready for that role ASAP so you can take advantage of the ELC cost-controlled production. You don't go out and sign other top sixers for the roster that just earned a top 3 pick to stand in his way just to chase a wildcard playoff spot when the team isn't ready to win.

If Blake had the cajones to tell Doughty, Kopitar and Quick to get stuffed at the end of 2021, the team would have been far better off for it.

Something tells me Blake wasn't the only one calling the shots. AEG still runs the show, and with the amount of money he lost during covid could've stepped in and told him to accelerate it. Stützle in hindsight would've been the better pick for sure. But he really struggled year one with his defense, with no real guidence on a really bad team. In LA they preach defense, so who knows if he'd have the type of free reign he got in OTT. Pretty sure we all know the answer.

 

[KopitarGOAT420]

Getting rid of Doughty and Kopitar is infinitely better than letting them take a spot that someone else should have by now. The Kings inability to allow that position to be available is what bottle necked this team. If the Kings got rid of Kopitar and Doughty then the future of this team would be brighter 100 percent because either players would blossom with more playtime or the Kings would rebuild a lot sooner rather than took away in the middle of nothingness.

Idk if this is 100% true.

Look at the Dallas stars. They still have Benn and Seguin (and Ryan Suter actually although of course he's not a long time Star). Did those guys prevent young players like Heiskanen, Hintz, Robertson, Johnston, etc from moving up the lineup, breaking out as elite players, and taking on prominent roles?? No, they didn't. Management / coaching saw the talent and made room.

The fact of the matter is that A) Kings prospects haven't taken that next step forward yet and B) Management has chosen to fill roster spots with proven NHL talent as opposed to letting prospects have a chance.

Let's assume both of those things weren't true - And guys like Byfield and Turcotte looked absolutely phenomenal and were living up to their draft hype. Plus let's also assume the Kings had never added Dubois, Danault, Fiala, etc. There would 1000000% still be roster spots / opportunity for young players to take on key top 6 roles on this team. And those players would either force guys like Kopitar and Doughty down the lineup or provide insane depth themselves - Instead of that depth coming from outside the organization and those young players lacking opportunity.

To save the rest of the board from having to reread something talked about ad nauseum for the last 8 years, I will just state that your obvious fanboy mentality has prevented you from reading that post correctly.

The point was telling those vets that their stated exit interview desires to compete immediately were no longer in the best interests of the organization and that a rebuild was necessary for the team's health.

Now go get your shine box.

I'm a little embarrassed and owe you an apology. I'm sorry brother, my words were harsh and misguided. I misunderstood your meaning of the word 'stuffed' and the general point you were making.

So you were basically saying that King management should've ignored Kopitar and Doughty's pleas to add to the roster and instead let things ride with the young talent they had drafted. You weren't necessarily saying that those guys are the problem / those guys should've been traded.

I see your point now (I think). Part of me agrees with you and part of me also looks at this Kings roster and thinks damn, this is a REALLY good/deep squad that is going to be super fun to watch for the next couple years and could make some noise in the playoffs. I also stand by my point that if some of these young guys do take that next step forward, it makes the future outlook seem a LOT better.

Take Clarke for example.. If he's really as good as we hope he is, maybe he can force his way into the top 4 this year and push a guy like Roy down to the 3rd pair - Which would give the Kings insane defensive depth. And if he's as special offensively as he's advertised to be, maybe he even forces Doughty down to the 2nd PP unit this year or next. I guess we'll see. Anyways, enough boards for me for today. GKG

 

[Schmooley]

And if he's as special offensively as he's advertised to be, maybe he even forces Doughty down to the 2nd PP unit this year or next.

Haha!