GDT: Trades & Free Agency -- Off-season edition

[HockeyVirus]

What is it you think the Agent is hoping to achieve? What is his strategy?

From everything we know he wants to be a Leaf more than anyone else on the team. That's a really bizarre statement, IMO.

Marner couldn't give a f*** about being a Leaf. What the agents leak is how he really feels, the rest is all PR shit all players say about loving the team and fans.

 

[Brobust]

What do you guys think or what would you guys give up for a 50% retained Gibson?

Woll + Hirvonen

I'm not interested in paying much for a guy who hasn't been performing for years.

 

[TMLAM34]

Woll + Hirvonen

I'm not interested in paying much for a guy who hasn't been performing for years.

I’m not as big on Woll as others, but I wouldn’t give him up for Gibson. Maybe 5 years ago.

 

[Torontonian]

I’m not as big on Woll as others, but I wouldn’t give him up for Gibson. Maybe 5 years ago.

Would not trade Woll in any deal, Maybe a few years ago, but as he's developed into a NHL goalie he's got good size, technically sound, and rarely is caught swimming around in his crease along with being a solid puck mover.

The only issue he's going to have is staying healthy, if he's able too he should be a quality goalie in the NHL for Toronto. You can get 3-4 more years of quality goaltending from him without having to break the bank, see Ottenger as a example.

 

[ACC1224]

Marner couldn't give a f*** about being a Leaf. What the agents leak is how he really feels, the rest is all PR shit all players say about loving the team and fans.

Probably going to regret asking this but what makes you believe that?
If anything he cares too much about it and it gets in his way.

 

[HockeyVirus]

So depressing. Leafs have 18M cap space to do the following

- Sign 3 RD, two of which top 4 D and at least 1 who can play on our top pairing
- Get a starting goalie
- Sign our RFAs

That breaks down to ~2.5AAV per hole. We're going to waste another season running back a worse roster. We could even miss the playoffs

Probably going to regret asking this but what makes you believe that?
If anything he cares too much about it and it gets in his way.

How he has acted in negotiations is a good way to tell. Matthews and Nylander both went out of their way to say they would not discuss it and keep things quiet. Marner goes out of his way to go into the media and make a shitshow and get everyone worked up to force overpayments.

He cares about his career earnings first, his image of a top 10 player 2nd (even if he is not one he wants to be paid like those guys) and after that I am sure he enjoys being a Leaf somewhat but any NHL team would do for him

 

[ACC1224]

So depressing. Leafs have 18M cap space to do the following

- Sign 3 RD, two of which top 4 D and at least 1 who can play on our top pairing
- Get a starting goalie
- Sign our RFAs

That breaks down to ~2.5AAV per hole. We're going to waste another season running back a worse roster. We could even miss the playoffs



How he has acted in negotiations is a good way to tell. Matthews and Nylander both went out of their way to say they would not discuss it and keep things quiet. Marner goes out of his way to go into the media and make a shitshow and get everyone worked up to force overpayments.

He cares about his career earnings first, his image of a top 10 player 2nd (even if he is not one he wants to be paid like those guys) and after that I am sure he enjoys being a Leaf somewhat but any NHL team would do for him

No idea what you're talking about, they haven't started any negotiations. Any examples?

Nylander missed half a season, that's an example of a guy just in it for the money.

 

[Magic Man]

I wouldn't take on Gibson even at 50% retention with the way he is trending. I could see him signed for up to 2.5M for one season and for 2M per on a 2 year deal after a buyout.

 

[HockeyVirus]

No idea what you're talking about, they haven't started any negotiations. Any examples?

Nylander missed half a season, that's an example of a guy just in it for the money.

How about his last negotiation?

Nylander was lowballed and held out for what turned into a steal of a contract. Marner was offered an overpayment day 1 and spent 3 months threatening offersheets and signing over seas.

Is your name Paul by chance?

 

[Punch Drunk Loov]

All of the core players prioritized money. Marner's negotiations were the most notably cutthroat via his agent. Ferris said all kinds of irritating things and I do hold Mitch responsible as if he didn't want him saying that, he could've told him, that's your agent and I'm sure he'd listen to you

 

[facelessjoe1990]

To all the people who say that have Marner and Tavares cap to spend elsewhere, who is available next summer? We could have the cap space and nothing to spend it on.

 

[TMLAM34]

To all the people who say that have Marner and Tavares cap to spend elsewhere, who is available next summer? We could have the cap space and nothing to spend it on.

Have you taken a look at the pending 2025 UFA list? Lots of good names on it.

 

[ACC1224]

All of the core players prioritized money. Marner's negotiations were the most notably cutthroat via his agent. Ferris said all kinds of irritating things and I do hold Mitch responsible as if he didn't want him saying that, he could've told him, that's your agent and I'm sure he'd listen to you

He was a kid at the time, letting his agent take care for things for him.
Ferris is abrasive no doubt and has a unique way of handling things.
Had Dubas taken their initial offer things would have turned out so much better for all involved.

Have you taken a look at the pending 2025 UFA list? Lots of good names on it.

There always is a few years out.

 

[Punch Drunk Loov]

He was a kid at the time, letting his agent take care for things for him.
Ferris is abrasive no doubt and has a unique way of handling things.
Had Dubas taken their initial offer things would have turned out so much better for all involved.


There always is a few years out.

I'm good to accept him being a kid last time around. If this upcoming contract is comparable in abrasiveness I don't think you can give him the same grace. He is a man now and should reign in the agent and suppress the drama.

 

[ACC1224]

I'm good to accept him being a kid last time around. If this upcoming contract is comparable in abrasiveness I don't think you can give him the same grace. He is a man now and should reign in the agent and suppress the drama.

I don't really know that it was that 'abrasive' last time. He missed no time and both sides seemed happy with the outcome. I think alot of that is the media stirring the pot for attention.
If Treliving is interested in re-signing him I see no reason why they couldn't wrap that up fairly easily. Hopefully the sooner the better.

 

[hockeywiz542]

 

[rumman]

Hey Tom, say hello to my little friend, Mitch Marner. You know they guy who's ass, the coach you just hired, kissed for the last 5 years.

It would be interesting to hear whether Keefe would support a Marner trade or run for the hills………

 

[Kurtz]

So depressing. Leafs have 18M cap space to do the following

- Sign 3 RD, two of which top 4 D and at least 1 who can play on our top pairing
- Get a starting goalie
- Sign our RFAs

That breaks down to ~2.5AAV per hole. We're going to waste another season running back a worse roster. We could even miss the playoffs



How he has acted in negotiations is a good way to tell. Matthews and Nylander both went out of their way to say they would not discuss it and keep things quiet. Marner goes out of his way to go into the media and make a shitshow and get everyone worked up to force overpayments.

He cares about his career earnings first, his image of a top 10 player 2nd (even if he is not one he wants to be paid like those guys) and after that I am sure he enjoys being a Leaf somewhat but any NHL team would do for him

Your math is a bit off because you're resigning the RFAs while also adding UFAs on top of them without sending anyone down. Ie you're adding 3 dmen (don't all have to be RHD as Mccabe can play on the right) but also counting Timmins and Webber's cap and then also resigning RFA Lil'.

The 18.5mil in cap that we have includes 10 forwards, 5 dmen (incl Timmins and Webber) and a goalie, leaving us $18.5m to spend on a goalie, 2 forwards and 1dman. Assuming we carry one extra forward and dman this year, both at around 1m a piece, leaves us with $16.5 to spend on those 4 positions, or $4.15 AAV per hole.

Now if we want to bring in 3 dmen rather than one, that eats into that amount, but we would also be subtracting Webber and Timmins' salaries and dealing away Lil. We can also create additional ~$2.5m in space by dumping Kampf and Jarn and replacing them with our RFAs Dewar and Pontus or Cowan and Grebyonkin all around league min.

 

[JKG33]

If reports are true that Marner won't discuss an extension nor entertain a trade, and will likely want to play out the last year, then we're the unluckiest team out there.

We drafted and developed him, paid him a lot of money only to poop the bed come playoff time, and if he wants to go out like that, then it is his right. It's likely better for him to do that as this fanbase will very quickly turn on him, and it could happen in season next year which is toxic to say the least.

It's not luck at all, it was pure incompetence by the previous regime. Gave Marner the term, dollars, and NMC he wanted with 0 expectations for him or concessions from him

 

[Magic Man]

My favourite teams for a Marner trade are Utah, Seattle and Buffalo.

They have a good prospect or young player and a high 1st. If they could start the bidding around one of the packages below that would be a good exchange.

6th overall + Keller or Guenther
8th overall + Wright
11th overall + Cozens

Or Tkachuk straight up.

 

[Americanadian]

My favourite teams for a Marner trade are Utah, Seattle and Buffalo.

They have a good prospect or young player and a high 1st. If they could start the bidding around one of the packages below that would be a good exchange.

6th overall + Keller or Guenther
8th overall + Wright
11th overall + Cozens

Or Tkachuk straight up.

Any realistic proposals?

 

[LaPlante94]

1- no body know how much he wqnt on a new contract, all this are just specularion

2-Start to play when you're down 3-0 or 3-0, it is really better ?

3- a player who taking a lot of high risk an exemple scoring 6 pts but his team gave 10 goal because of his risky game, do he really help the team more than a player who will get just 4 points but gave up only 1 goal? Because at the end, yes the goal is to score goal and win game but you still need to score more than your opponent. So if the reason you are producing more is just because you're taking much more risk, 7•• youbreally better? I gave up nylander exemple and his 1st goal gm 6. It was a high risk play and do the same thing against a better player than Beecher and it's a breakaway unstead of leafs goal. Personally, that's remembered me the Galchenyuk breakaway gm 5 vs mtl when that play happened. Luckily with a better result but He took a high risk who paid off but who could at the same time hurt extremely hard his team. So i ask you, the fact exemple nylander looked better offensively, it is only result of nylander taking more risk or just the result he was better. If its just because he took more risk, doesn't mean Berube will still allowing nylander to play that way... It's not a simple thing. If they want to move a player from the core, they need to make the right choice, they will just gonna pay for it.

Well lets see here, straight out of his ELC with no individual trophies or team trophies to his name and I believe 1 90 point season after 2 60 point seasons he demands for just under 11 mil. So you're probably right that he's not gonna demand even more money now after not winning any individual trophies or team trophies, but we did win that 1 round and then lost in 5 so that probably put his price tag up. Don't forget he probably hits 100 points if he played all 82 games. Silly me for thinking he's gonna get more money.

I prefer to close out games and win series against teams we should beat and since we pay a lot of money to the top of our lineup and PP it shouldn't be asking too much.

Again though, we pay the top of our lineup 11 million each. They should be able to outscore everyone because they get paid more than everyone. Marner takes plenty of risk and it's why some people aren't too happy with him. He makes plenty of dumb mistakes that'll lead to goals against, odd man rushes that a defender or goalie has to bail him out on or it can lead to a penalty against us trying to recover. Nylander makes 6.9 and is scoring 40 goals and has been our only player who can consistently score 3 or more goals in the playoffs. A lot of skilled players will make higher risk plays ad nobody would give a damn about any of this is they actually won anything. 1st round exits their entire overpaid contracts and you want to deflect this onto Nylander who is the only one of the core not overpaid and Galchenyuk who was making what? League minimum? Both of which outperformed Marner offensively too.

How is not moving Marner the right choice? 1 year left on overpaid deal and if it makes the trade better I'm sure we'd eat some of that cap. Gonna ask for more money. Other core players locked up long term on new deals. Struggles to close out series and becomes a ghost. What more info you need to determine what the correct choice is. He's literally the only option and if you don't move him we're stuck with him long term or he's gone for nothing.

 

[Magic Man]

Any realistic proposals?

Mitch is 8th in points scored and PPG over the last 6 years sandwiched between Pastrnak and Matthews above him and Rantanen and Matt Tkachuk below him. He scored 509 points in 417 games in that time frame. He is one of the top producers in the league and he is consistent while being only 27 years old with a likely 9 year contract with a new extension.

They should make sure they get something back that will help on their end. Not just spare forgettable pieces. Why would Cozens be worth more than Mitch on his own or Keller? I look at those listed proposals as a star + star for superstar swap in terms of likely on ice impact.

 

[LeafsOHLRangers98]

I wouldn't take on Gibson even at 50% retention with the way he is trending. I could see him signed for up to 2.5M for one season and for 2M per on a 2 year deal after a buyout.

I would take the chance at 50%. He's faced a ridiculous amount of shots per game the last few years. I would think he would play better with a better team and better structure around him.

He could at least take on a large workload if Woll struggles.

 

[Americanadian]

Mitch is 8th in points scored and PPG over the last 6 years sandwiched between Pastrnak and Matthews above him and Rantanen and Matt Tkachuk below him. He scored 509 points in 417 games in that time frame. He is one of the top producers in the league and he is consistent while being only 27 years old with a likely 9 year contract with a new extension.

They should make sure they get something back that will help on their end. Not just spare forgettable pieces. Why would Cozens be worth more than Mitch on his own or Keller? I look at those listed proposals as a star + star for superstar swap in terms of likely on ice impact.

Contracts matter. No team is going to give up 2 premium assets for the privilege of overpaying.