Trades and Free Agency Discussion - The Dog Days of Summer

[Stephen]

I tend to think it may be the coach that doesn't have it rather than miraculously all his players. Thats a good thing in a way because he has to be learning more each year, so he either gets over the hump, perhaps by finally having a lineup of his preference, or takes a dump like he started to last November and gets replaced by someone better, or they get to the playoffs and fizzle again. So thats two potential chances out of three they can have that different outcome.

One other huge thing is they did not get the goaltending in 22. 21 or 17. .898, . 897. .896. Three other years they had it. But in 2018 Kadri sabotaged them and in 2020 JT gets that knee to the head. Goalies that were discarded because they were not good enough may have been good enough. But for Kadri and JT two of those three strong goalie playoffs could have played out differently. When you are going into a game 7 without a key player the club is hobbled. When the club is missing these key players for multiple games in two series its worse because maybe neither even gets to the 7th.

This doesn't answer your question but it seems very reasonable that the outcome was not lineup or coach related on those two occasions. Just extremely shitty luck. To me that separates the team from being the same as a bunch of players that can't do in the post season it every year. There is strong evidence they were capable. The playoff runs are overdue but as a fan, those 2018 and 2020 playoffs tell me they may have actually figured it out but fate did a last minute claw back.

Long story short, I don't like the Islanders, the way they do business, don't want to do business with them, but going on an ECF run like they did a couple of years ago would have definitely been more enjoyable. I think the Isles tend to be stronger in the departments we aren't so good at and vice versa.

 

[Stephen]

I like him too but Lindholm is 29 so this deal is his final opportunity to cash out. There is a chance that you would be buying all declining years for that $8M per and thats a much better gamble if your other core players are not all stepping into their own max contracts. He was 2.11 pp60 in 22-23 and people want to run Tavares out of town for 2.09.

I'm very curious to see how Lindholm does with the Boston infrastructure disintegrating around him. Last year was a perfect season for them in the regular season and they had incredible depth up front.

How a team loses Hall, Foligno, Bertuzzi, Orlov, Hathaway, etc. maybe Bergeron, Krejci and doesn't take a step back, I have no idea.

 

[Menzinger]

He doesn’t need to repeat his first season. If he can put up 15ish goals and 30is point in a 3rd line roll it’s a great deal. Guys who are top level heavyweights and can actually contribute as effective players on the ice are incredibly rare. These guys will always be overpaid.
People are too hung up on the price Tampa paid to acquire him.

I'd expect he'll have a better offensive year than he just had, but there's equally a fair chance he ends up as a 20-30 point guy which hurts his value in terms of his caphit. He may plateau as more of a 4th liner than consistent top 9 player

It's a fair gamble to take for Tampa. But no winner on the deal just yet

 

[cyris]

I'd expect he'll have a better offensive year than he just had, but there's equally a fair chance he ends up as a 20-30 point guy which hurts his value in terms of his caphit. He may plateau as more of a 4th liner than consistent top 9 player

It's a fair gamble to take for Tampa. But no winner on the deal just yet

Yeah I wouldn’t have wanted the Leafs to have paid anywhere near what Tampa did to acquire Jeannot but if we had somehow signed him to this deal as a UFA we would all be super excited.
If he plateaus as 4th liner he is a bit overpaid but still an effective player. If he is a third liner it’s a great deal.

 

[ToDavid]

Trade: Maples Leafs have traded the 24th overall pick in the draft.​

The Toronto Maple Leafs' Kyle Dubas has reportedly been very active on the draft room floor and the Leafs have now made a trade. Toronto has traded their 24th overall pick in the 2015 NHL draft to the Philadelphia Flyers in exchnage for the 29th overall pick as well as the 61st overall pick in the draft. The Flyers obviously thought highly of the player they wanted at 24, and that player is Travis Konecny. We will continue to monitor the draft closely as trades continue to filter in.

Toronto Maple Leafs: Dubas looking to one-up 2015 in first draft as GM

If 2015 is any indication, Kyle Dubas will be working the phones hard to land the best talent available for the Toronto Maple Leafs in the 2018 NHL Draft.

tipofthetower.com

It’s been well documented that during the 2015 draft, Dubas — who was serving as the interim general manager — was the man who worked the phones and got the Leafs a few extra picks in the draft.

Dubas had an extra pick in the back-end of the first round. He traded the 24th overall pick for the 29th and 61st overall selection. Dubas then moved the 29th pick to Columbus, for the 34th and 68th selections.

With those picks, the Toronto Maple Leafs selected Travis Dermott (34th), Jeremy Bracco (61st) and Martins Dzierkals (68th).

The praise/blame for the 2015 draft seems to bounce around depending on who the speaker wants to look good, which pick is being talked about, and what year it is, but I have a hard time believing that when you’ve got two co-interim GMs, the one who’s also the head scout is being overruled at the draft? Maybe Dubas makes the trade, but I doubt he’s doing it if Hunter has someone he wants at 24.

It seems no one has any problem giving Hunter credit for the Marner pick. Here’s Simmons calling Hunter the “Leafs draft-decision maker” in the lead-up to the 2015 draft.

Maple Leafs have tough decision for June draft

It is sounding more and more as though Dylan Strome will not be available when the Maple Leafs pick fourth in next month’s NHL draft.

torontosun.com

Simmons would later claim, with the benefit of several years of hindsight, that actually his buddy Hunter wanted Konecny all along. Convenient.

 

[fahad203]

He'll be an interesting one to follow. His late season injury definitely played a role in his playoff performance. With that said, he was having a pretty shit year prior to the injury as well.

Was very good the year before though.

He needs to calm down a bit and clean up his game.
But he needs to focus more on playing hockey and not always try to be the toughest guy on ice. Maybe won't be a 20 goal scorer but he can still should be able to get 15 goals a season with some physicality

 

[Duke16]

Speculation based on nothing, but I think Cal Foote (1-way) and/or Austin Strand (2-way) will be signed for RHD depth to start with the Marlies.

The main reason is that neither player counts as a vet on the AHL roster (either U25 or U 260 Pro GP) and TOR already has 6 signings that likely would in Shaw, Clifford, Blandisi, Gambrell, Lajoie, and Lagesson.

It's likely that any other depth addition on an AHL deal, other than a goalie, would be either under 25 or have less than 260 pro GP for that reason.

 

[LeafChief]

Speculation based on nothing, but I think Cal Foote (1-way) and/or Austin Strand (2-way) will be signed for RHD depth to start with the Marlies.

The main reason is that neither player counts as a vet on the AHL roster (either U25 or U 260 Pro GP) and TOR already has 6 signings that likely would in Shaw, Clifford, Blandisi, Gambrell, Lajoie, and Lagesson.

It's likely that any other depth addition on an AHL deal, other than a goalie, would be either under 25 or have less than 260 pro GP for that reason.

I think Foote would be a very good idea. Would rather give a guy like him a go to see if they can turn him around over guys like Dahlstrom/Benn. I understand that those two guys are meant to be AHL vets that can get called up in a pinch but Foote is intriguing is a reclamation project.

 

[dubplatepressure]

Travis Konecny a gritty local London Ontario born kid would have looked good in Blue and White..

Leafs should have drafted him with the 24th overall pick in 2015 draft, before Kyle Dubas traded the pick to Philly and started trading back and out of the 1st round to obtain (#34-Travis Dermott), (#61-Jeremy Bracco), (#68-Martins Dzierkals)

View attachment 729064

f***ing hated that trade down the moment it happened

 

[Taylor Halls Teeth]

Linholm is amount best defensive foward in NHL

At egal salary i taking lindholm over nylander anytime... so if leafs can get lindholm at 8 M unstead of nylander at 10 m, it would be a steal

Last 2 season
Pts/60 at 5v5
2'37 vs 2,29
goal/60
1,07 vs 0,98

One having a pretty huge defensive impact and the second one is trash

So sure youre losing some offensive but your drastically raising your defensive game

7 x 8? 7 x 8.5? Is there much chance he delivers $8.5M value at age 33? If you have him for maybe 4 years there is safety in that. He doesn't belong on a club with $26M committed to their top two players. The guy has mad skills but this deal looks a lot better if it was done a couple years ago. They need a guy cheaper than Willy this year.

 

[thusk]

7 x 8? 7 x 8.5? Is there much chance he delivers $8.5M value at age 33? If you have him for maybe 4 years there is safety in that. He doesn't belong on a club with $26M committed to their top two players. The guy has mad skills but this deal looks a lot better if it was done a couple years ago. They need a guy cheaper than Willy this year.

Nylander is 27, lindholm is at 28... you can ask the same question about nylander, in 5 years do he stay deliver 10M value?

I have higher fate than lindholm by playing a complete 200 feet game will still provide his value at 33 than nylander

 

[Dekes For Days]

Too bad the right move was to draft Konecky at 24.

If we're playing the hindsight game, there were much better pathways than just drafting Konecny at 24.
It also seems odd that certain individuals suddenly value Konecny so highly, considering he's an undersized winger that's been horrific in the playoffs.

100% (kind of like when Anaheim moved down and took Rakell and Gibson) but when was the last time we hit that kind of a HR?

Our 2018, 2020, and 2022 trade downs all look like wins so far. Funny how that happens when you don't have Hunter screwing up the draft.

 

[Gabriel426]

1. I don't think Lindholm will ask for 8mil
2. Lindholm will be a good 2C behind AM
3. Won't do a WIllie for Lindholm 1 for 1 deal and will like to see what the Flames will add.

Ideally, it will be Willie plus TJ for Lindholm and Anderssen or Lindholm, Tanev plus a 1st rounder if Willie extend or a 2nd if Willie doesn't

 

[BertCorbeau]

Lindholm with an extension would be nice .. helps solidify the centre position for awhile as Tavares’ contract winds down

 

[andora]

1. I don't think Lindholm will ask for 8mil
2. Lindholm will be a good 2C behind AM
3. Won't do a WIllie for Lindholm 1 for 1 deal and will like to see what the Flames will add.

Ideally, it will be Willie plus TJ for Lindholm and Anderssen or Lindholm, Tanev plus a 1st rounder if Willie extend or a 2nd if Willie doesn't

How do you justify the extra added to lindholm for nylander?

 

[Fogelhund]

I'm very curious to see how Lindholm does with the Boston infrastructure disintegrating around him. Last year was a perfect season for them in the regular season and they had incredible depth up front.

How a team loses Hall, Foligno, Bertuzzi, Orlov, Hathaway, etc. maybe Bergeron, Krejci and doesn't take a step back, I have no idea.

On the flip side, we’ve been expecting a regression for years and yet last year was the squads best regular season yet.

At some point it will happen, but they just keep on succeeding.

 

[ULF_55]

How do you justify the extra added to lindholm for nylander?

Goals Trending?

I think a 1 for 1 would work. Be nice to see Lindholm and Nylander together. Think Tavares waive to go to Calgary ;-)

Maybe Extend Nylander and trade for Huberdeau retained? Treliving thinks he's worth his contract.

[TABLE=collapse]
[TR]
[TD]Sum of EVG[/TD]
[TD]Season[/TD]
[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Player[/TD]

[TD]

20192020​

[/TD]

[TD]

20202021​

[/TD]

[TD]

20212022​

[/TD]

[TD]

20222023​

[/TD]

[TD]Grand Total[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Auston Matthews[/TD]

[TD]

35​

[/TD]

[TD]

31​

[/TD]

[TD]

44​

[/TD]

[TD]

27​

[/TD]

[TD]

137​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Elias Lindholm[/TD]

[TD]

21​

[/TD]

[TD]

13​

[/TD]

[TD]

31​

[/TD]

[TD]

11​

[/TD]

[TD]

76​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]John Tavares[/TD]

[TD]

19​

[/TD]

[TD]

13​

[/TD]

[TD]

17​

[/TD]

[TD]

18​

[/TD]

[TD]

67​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Mitchell Marner[/TD]

[TD]

10​

[/TD]

[TD]

20​

[/TD]

[TD]

26​

[/TD]

[TD]

17​

[/TD]

[TD]

73​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Morgan Rielly[/TD]

[TD]

3​

[/TD]

[TD]

4​

[/TD]

[TD]

8​

[/TD]

[TD]

3​

[/TD]

[TD]

18​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]William Nylander[/TD]

[TD]

22​

[/TD]

[TD]

13​

[/TD]

[TD]

21​

[/TD]

[TD]

31​

[/TD]

[TD]

87​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Grand Total[/TD]

[TD]

110​

[/TD]

[TD]

94​

[/TD]

[TD]

147​

[/TD]

[TD]

107​

[/TD]

[TD]

458​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

[TABLE=collapse]
[TR]
[TD]Sum of Goals[/TD]
[TD]Season[/TD]
[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Player[/TD]

[TD]

20192020​

[/TD]

[TD]

20202021​

[/TD]

[TD]

20212022​

[/TD]

[TD]

20222023​

[/TD]

[TD]Grand Total[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Auston Matthews[/TD]

[TD]

47​

[/TD]

[TD]

41​

[/TD]

[TD]

60​

[/TD]

[TD]

40​

[/TD]

[TD]

188​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Elias Lindholm[/TD]

[TD]

29​

[/TD]

[TD]

19​

[/TD]

[TD]

42​

[/TD]

[TD]

22​

[/TD]

[TD]

112​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]John Tavares[/TD]

[TD]

26​

[/TD]

[TD]

19​

[/TD]

[TD]

27​

[/TD]

[TD]

36​

[/TD]

[TD]

108​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Mitchell Marner[/TD]

[TD]

16​

[/TD]

[TD]

20​

[/TD]

[TD]

35​

[/TD]

[TD]

30​

[/TD]

[TD]

101​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Morgan Rielly[/TD]

[TD]

3​

[/TD]

[TD]

5​

[/TD]

[TD]

10​

[/TD]

[TD]

4​

[/TD]

[TD]

22​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]William Nylander[/TD]

[TD]

31​

[/TD]

[TD]

17​

[/TD]

[TD]

34​

[/TD]

[TD]

40​

[/TD]

[TD]

122​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Grand Total[/TD]

[TD]

152​

[/TD]

[TD]

121​

[/TD]

[TD]

208​

[/TD]

[TD]

172​

[/TD]

[TD]

653​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

[TABLE=collapse]
[TR]
[TD]Sum of EVP[/TD]
[TD]Season[/TD]
[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Player[/TD]

[TD]

20192020​

[/TD]

[TD]

20202021​

[/TD]

[TD]

20212022​

[/TD]

[TD]

20222023​

[/TD]

[TD]Grand Total[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Auston Matthews[/TD]

[TD]

55​

[/TD]

[TD]

53​

[/TD]

[TD]

77​

[/TD]

[TD]

57​

[/TD]

[TD]

242​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Elias Lindholm[/TD]

[TD]

35​

[/TD]

[TD]

30​

[/TD]

[TD]

61​

[/TD]

[TD]

40​

[/TD]

[TD]

166​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]John Tavares[/TD]

[TD]

39​

[/TD]

[TD]

38​

[/TD]

[TD]

50​

[/TD]

[TD]

41​

[/TD]

[TD]

168​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Mitchell Marner[/TD]

[TD]

42​

[/TD]

[TD]

51​

[/TD]

[TD]

68​

[/TD]

[TD]

58​

[/TD]

[TD]

219​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Morgan Rielly[/TD]

[TD]

20​

[/TD]

[TD]

22​

[/TD]

[TD]

42​

[/TD]

[TD]

24​

[/TD]

[TD]

108​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]William Nylander[/TD]

[TD]

42​

[/TD]

[TD]

31​

[/TD]

[TD]

49​

[/TD]

[TD]

59​

[/TD]

[TD]

181​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Grand Total[/TD]

[TD]

233​

[/TD]

[TD]

225​

[/TD]

[TD]

347​

[/TD]

[TD]

279​

[/TD]

[TD]

1084​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

[TABLE=collapse]
[TR]
[TD]Sum of Points[/TD]
[TD]Season[/TD]
[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Player[/TD]

[TD]

20192020​

[/TD]

[TD]

20202021​

[/TD]

[TD]

20212022​

[/TD]

[TD]

20222023​

[/TD]

[TD]Grand Total[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Auston Matthews[/TD]

[TD]

80​

[/TD]

[TD]

66​

[/TD]

[TD]

106​

[/TD]

[TD]

85​

[/TD]

[TD]

337​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Elias Lindholm[/TD]

[TD]

54​

[/TD]

[TD]

47​

[/TD]

[TD]

82​

[/TD]

[TD]

64​

[/TD]

[TD]

247​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]John Tavares[/TD]

[TD]

60​

[/TD]

[TD]

50​

[/TD]

[TD]

76​

[/TD]

[TD]

80​

[/TD]

[TD]

266​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Mitchell Marner[/TD]

[TD]

67​

[/TD]

[TD]

67​

[/TD]

[TD]

97​

[/TD]

[TD]

99​

[/TD]

[TD]

330​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Morgan Rielly[/TD]

[TD]

27​

[/TD]

[TD]

35​

[/TD]

[TD]

68​

[/TD]

[TD]

41​

[/TD]

[TD]

171​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]William Nylander[/TD]

[TD]

59​

[/TD]

[TD]

42​

[/TD]

[TD]

80​

[/TD]

[TD]

87​

[/TD]

[TD]

268​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Grand Total[/TD]

[TD]

347​

[/TD]

[TD]

307​

[/TD]

[TD]

509​

[/TD]

[TD]

456​

[/TD]

[TD]

1619​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

 

[ULF_55]

Lindholm with an extension would be nice .. helps solidify the centre position for awhile as Tavares’ contract winds down

If there was some way without Nylander going the other way ...

Defensively though in the playoffs?

Maybe he was playing against Draisaitl?

 

[Avilaj07]

One has to think it's going to be an interesting week ahead. With Samsonov arbitration hearing at the end of the week. I think it's safe to assume we'll see some movement either in, buying out Murray or a trade. I believe we already have a deal in place with Samsonov, it's more of us trying to get rid of Murray without buying him out. Should be an interesting week.

 

[Sebastien]

1. I don't think Lindholm will ask for 8mil
2. Lindholm will be a good 2C behind AM
3. Won't do a WIllie for Lindholm 1 for 1 deal and will like to see what the Flames will add.

Ideally, it will be Willie plus TJ for Lindholm and Anderssen or Lindholm, Tanev plus a 1st rounder if Willie extend or a 2nd if Willie doesn't

Lol dude The Center position has more value and Lindholm is one of the best two way C in the game. It's actually laughable some like yourself thinking Calgary or aby other teams would trade a really good C like Lindholm and add for Winger whose a free agent to be

 

[TMLAM34]

Lol dude The Center position has more value and Lindholm is one of the best two way C in the game. It's actually laughable some like yourself thinking Calgary or aby other teams would trade a really good C like Lindholm and add for Winger whose a free agent to be

It’s also laughable when people completely dismiss that Lindholm is a free agent to be as well who may happen to be like half the Calgary roster wanting out.

Not saying Nylander for Lindholm would happen but there’s definitely an argument for both sides.

If Nylander is willing to re-sign in Calgary while Lindholm isn’t, I don’t think they really care what position he plays. You’re not getting a better return for a free agent to be like Nylander on an extension.

 

[Fogelhund]

Lol dude The Center position has more value and Lindholm is one of the best two way C in the game. It's actually laughable some like yourself thinking Calgary or aby other teams would trade a really good C like Lindholm and add for Winger whose a free agent to be

Of course Lindholm isn’t willing to sign in Calgary, and if Nylander is, it’s not a terrible trade for them at all. But that’s completely contingent on the willingness of both players to extend.

Goals Trending?

I think a 1 for 1 would work. Be nice to see Lindholm and Nylander together. Think Tavares waive to go to Calgary ;-)]

Zero chance Tavares waives.

 

[ULF_55]

Of course Lindholm isn’t willing to sign in Calgary, and if Nylander is, it’s not a terrible trade for them at all. But that’s completely contingent on the willingness of both players to extend.

What if Nylander won't extend at any amount?
This is possible, especially if he wants to pull a Matthews and have another UFA date in 3 years.

Would you do 1 year rental of Calgary Lindholm for 1 year rental of Nylander?

 

[fahad203]

I would have thought by now we would have wrapped up Matthews deal

I would rather it didn't drag during the season

 

[Fogelhund]

What if Nylander won't extend at any amount?
This is possible, especially if he wants to pull a Matthews and have another UFA date in 3 years.

Would you do 1 year rental of Calgary Lindholm for 1 year rental of Nylander?

No, I’d look for a deal from another team that gives me assets for the future