Trades and Free Agency - 2022/2023 Trade Deadline Edition

[HockeyVirus]

I wish i felt that way. I probably would if they'd had previous playoff success rather than failing every time.
So i'm left with show me some return on the original investment before asking to pour considerably more resources into something that so far has failed to produce a single positive result.

If we don't we'd be left asking what if forever. We never went all in before. And no a first and 3rd during the covid year is not all in, that is a normal buy. All in is what the Panthers did or Tampa did.

 

[Contenderorpretender]

O'reilly is not a player I want to spend alot of assets on. This has foligno all over it.

 

[HomelessPepper]

Leafs should go after Henrique and Konecny with as much retention as they can get:

Bunting - Matthews - Marner
Jarnkrok - Tavares - Nylander
Knies - Henrique - Konecny
ZAR - Kampf - Anderson

Would finally have 3 legit lines.

If they cost 4M or less each, it's do-able under the cap

 

[Kiwi]

Everybody has their own idea. Lot's of people want the best player available, some because they are shiny new toys, big names... some because they might actually fill a need..

The reality is, no team is perfect, and all could use upgrading. We could use an upgrade at D, 2LW and 3C. That's just the reality. Here is the catch... while we all pontificate as to what we should do... we don't have the opportunity to really know what the costs are to obtain these players.

Plus there are so many combinations here... do we go all in for a Meier, or a Chychrun... or do we obtain smaller pieces... such as maybe McCabe/Henrique/Comtois type of pick ups? Or maybe a Jenner/Peeke/Comtois... Does that one very good player make us that much better, or does a collective of improvements?

There are plenty of options available, and we as fans have incomplete information here. Something is going to happen... and really, we need to start playing hockey games, and let this be.. as we really have no influence anyway... what will be, will be.

I'm no brain surgeon but I'm very confident in stating that any defenseman that improves the group is going to be extremely expensive (including the rentals) they always are especially in comparison to middle 6 forwards

Surprisingly enough I realize none of us are GM's but inside the trades thread I think it's fair to critique other people's ideas, especially when those ideas seem to be gaining a bit of a consensus

You spend a lot of time in this thread so the old our opinions don't mean **** so why bother seems a little strange

 

[Fogelhund]

That is an option, but if Leafs paid the first bonus I think the return would be greater, and it doesn't impact the Cap.

If you do a 8 x $8 mil contract, for $64 mil, and pay $4 mil of that... is it really all that material?

I think you'd want the draft pick, this year, in a better draft, and sooner.... Plus if you are making the deal now, you will know where you are picking... next year, send the team a top forward... and they are likely better.

 

[Schenn]

O'reilly is not a player I want to spend alot of assets on. This has foligno all over it.

Nah, ROR is the best chance at improving this team without blowing the farm. Not saying it's without risks, but I think it's a risk worth taking.

 

[showtime8]

O'reilly is not a player I want to spend alot of assets on. This has foligno all over it.

As purely a rental, he's a very good player with playoff pedigree.

But yeah, it seems like this trade is giving off major Foligno vibes.

 

[Fogelhund]

I'm no brain surgeon but I'm very confident in stating that any defenseman that improves the group is going to be extremely expensive (including the rentals) they always are especially in comparison to middle 6 forwards

Surprisingly enough I realize none of us are GM's but inside the trades thread I think it's fair to critique other people's ideas, especially when those ideas seem to be gaining a bit of a consensus

You spend a lot of time in this thread so the old our opinions don't mean **** so why bother seems a little strange

I enjoy talking about it as much as anyone... and really, our opinions mean nothing, as much as we enjoy talking about it. I talk about massive overpays, or underpays, or just trades that make us worse. I've kind of chilled a bit in making proposals though... because at this point, I've said my piece, and it's time for trades to happen, or not... but man, do we need some Leafs hockey again.

I also wanted to point out, that we as fans have some blind spots, as we don't know the actual prices...

 

[Peace Frog]

Why? The cost to move from what the 5th best defensive team to 2nd is worth it while we are middle of the pack offensively?

Are we middle of the pack offensively? Seriously asking, because I was under the impression we were upper echelon when it comes to offence.

 

[PROUD PAPA]

If we don't we'd be left asking what if forever. We never went all in before. And no a first and 3rd during the covid year is not all in, that is a normal buy. All in is what the Panthers did or Tampa did.

I understand what all in means.
My issue is i haven't seen enough from this same group we're running back to consider an all in strategy the correct one. Basically they'd have to show some sign they're getting close or at least closer to accomplishing something worthwhile in the postseason.
Maybe next year they'll have given me a reason to get onboard an all in plan.

 

[X66]

Chychrun is essentially worth any price IMO only because he's locked up for 2 more years after this at a great contract and he's young.

 

[stickty111]

Are we middle of the pack offensively? Seriously asking, because I was under the impression we were upper echelon when it comes to offence.

8th in goals
6th on the PP.
So we are good but not elite. There are also troubling signs our PP is falling apart again as it has for 2 years straight. We also can't score as the series goes longer

 

[thusk]

All I'm reading on here is people wanting defenseman

If you want maximum improvement without trading every future inside the organization you try to improve the forward group, our bottom 6 can't be relied on to score in any fashion

We either need top 6 talent to force guys down to the 3rd line or straight up better players for the 3rd line

Trying to get into 2-1 games when you don't have the best goaltender doesn't seem like a great strategy to me

Yes leafs having lack of scoring depht but how they will create offensive if they dont have the puck?

Toronto lost their #1 defensive dman this season with no body to replace him for what he was doing...every time Muzzin lost 3 post season, leafs didn't look as good... and now you thinking leafs will start the playoff and we will not see the effect of muzzin... good luck

Unstead of losing a 7th game 2-1, why not just losing it in 5 or 6 game... or losing it 5-1 or 7-4 (like last 2 #7 game against boston)

 

[ULF_55]

If you do a 8 x $8 mil contract, for $64 mil, and pay $4 mil of that... is it really all that material?

I think you'd want the draft pick, this year, in a better draft, and sooner.... Plus if you are making the deal now, you will know where you are picking... next year, send the team a top forward... and they are likely better.

Yes, if you can find a team interested, you could then sign him to an amount that team wants to pay prior to the draft.

Actually, you make a good point.
Leading up to the draft you auction off one of, marner, Meier or Nylander.
Unless they do very well, you'd want to change the core anyway.
This should be the last time this core is unchanged unless they have succcess in the post season.

 

[notdoneyet]

My two choices
Jenner
Tarasenko

I like bertuzzi but when the hampster falls off the trolly he would be suspended like kadri was

 

[stickty111]

If you can get Meier without Knies included, you'd be crazy not to consider it. He would solve a huge need for this team. Extra firepower and adds a playoff style dimension up front.
I'd trade a 1st and Niemela pretty easily

 

[Peace Frog]

I understand what all in means.
My issue is i haven't seen enough from this same group we're running back to consider an all in strategy the correct one. Basically they'd have to show some sign they're getting close or at least closer to accomplishing something worthwhile in the postseason.
Maybe next year they'll have given me a reason to get onboard an all in plan.

This post has real merit to it, imo.

Usually a team goes “all in” when they are right on the cusp and have shown steady improvement. Unfortunately, our team has lots of talent , but we haven’t taken any positive steps forward.

Dubas has SO many decisions to make at this deadline. Does he go all in because he truly feels this team is ready to go all the way?

Or does he go all in to try to get this team over the hump of getting past the first round and perhaps save his job?

It’s not like getting past the first round means that the Leafs will break out and go on a run. In all likelihood, they would then have to slay the dragon that is the Bruins.

The road to the Cup is going to be a huge uphill battle. Especially for the first two series.

With Matthews’ contract ending after next season and perhaps not re-signing, is that reason enough to go all in? If we do and find some real success in these playoffs, perhaps that motivates him to re-sign?

Perhaps this is why Dubas seems so adamant about only giving up 1sts and prospects for players with term? Maybe he knows that putting all your pucks in one playoff basket, is a recipe for disaster?

Sorry for the long post. Just babbling out loud about my thoughts on this trade deadline.

 

[Morgs]

Can you answer who do you think is better offensively and then who do you think is better defensively right now between Sandin and Chychrun?

Offensively: Sandin > Chychrun
Defensively: Sandin << Chychrun
Transition: Sandin = Chychrun
Difficulty of Minutes: Sandin << Chychrun
Age: Sandin > Chychrun
Contract: Sandin > Chychrun

 

[BertCorbeau]

If you get Meier I consider moving Marner in the off-season, and use the cap savings to re-sign Nylander.

 

[Fogelhund]

Offensively: Sandin > Chychrun
Defensively: Sandin << Chychrun
Transition: Sandin = Chychrun
Difficulty of Minutes: Sandin << Chychrun
Age: Sandin > Chychrun
Contract: Sandin > Chychrun

You think Sandin is better offensively than Chychrun? 7 goals, 20 assists in 35 games for Chych vs. 3 goals and 13 assists in 45 games for Sandin... and Sandin is better?

 

[BertCorbeau]

Rumour on the mains from a STL source is that the Leafs are one of three teams in on ROR.

This has Foligno vibes all over again.. but if he’s healthy, what a get

 

[Morgs]

You think Sandin is better offensively than Chychrun? 7 goals, 20 assists in 35 games for Chych vs. 3 goals and 13 assists in 45 games for Sandin... and Sandin is better?

Yep. Drives play significantly better and you need to take into account minutes if you're going to talk poi ts, which is only part of the equation.

 

[dubplatepressure]

Again, this is not a real shot at the player (although I do think he's being somewhat overrated here - the Matt Stajan syndrome), but what the Leafs are paying for is the player he is AZ, which role/icetime/deployment will change/decline with the Leafs.

Overpaying like this is where the Leafs lose value. Their most immediate glaring need is bottom 6 scoring, not a 5% upgrade on D.

I don’t disagree. My ideal target is Meier followed by Tarasenko. But who knows how things will shake out and I do believe +Chych and -Sandin makes us better now. As to what that mean for the next 3-5 years who knows.

 

[showtime8]

I hope that there can be a trade where the Leafs actually acquire a player with some cost control beyond the 20 games that they'd get the player for.

O'Rielly would be good if they can lock him in on a reasonable deal. That seems very unlikely to happen though.

Chychryn makes a ton of sense because he's cost controlled for 2 more years. Kick the can down the road in terms of cap and re-assess the situation to see if you want to keep him or it's time to trade Rielly.

Meier being a RFA gives you some flexibility to either keep him or Nylander. But also gives you the chance to do a sign and trade in the off-season.

Jeannot makes some sense because he's an RFA and the increase in salary won't be significant.

Even a guy like Scott Laughton has cost certainty and would be a good fit on that 3rd line.

Ultimately, you have to look at getting some return on some trades and not just the deadline dud.

 

[Fogelhund]

Yep. Drives play significantly better and you need to take into account minutes if you're going to talk poi ts, which is only part of the equation.

Drives play better? They have nearly identical GF/60 Even Strength... meanwhile Leafs are top 10 offensive team, and Arizona is basically devoid of any offense.

I really like Sandin, but no... this isn't a very good take at all.