Speculation: Trade Thread Part XII

[Inferno]

I still think Girardi for Connolly +2nd is a good deal.

I don't...at all.

Dan Girardi is a top pairing defenseman...even going into his UFA year I'd like more than that.

 

[Trxjw]

I don't...at all.

Dan Girardi is a top pairing defenseman...even going into his UFA year I'd like more than that.

Unless he agreed to an extension before the trade call was made, I highly doubt you'd get more than an A prospect and a 2nd round pick for a pending UFA.

 

[ArPanet]

With St. Louis and Colorado showing up soon we'll get a little look at what the Rangers may be, competitively. Plus the fabled Ryan O'Reilly will quite likely be fired up....

 

[Raspewtin]

I don't...at all.

Dan Girardi is a top pairing defenseman...even going into his UFA year I'd like more than that.

Connolly is destroying the AHL, and like it or not Girardi being a UFA hurts his value. I think we can change the 2nd to a 1st if he resigns, but it works great for both sides. Fills a need for both.

 

[BarbaraAlphanse]

Yep and these are the kind of moves that are the difference between perrenial contenders and middling teams. Smart drafting, smart trading and smart FA signings. Getting steals in trades or UDFA are almost a necessity to build a team with longevity.

Knowing when to trade players or sign them long term. Smart asset managment.

Much easier said that done.

 

[BarbaraAlphanse]

Connolly is destroying the AHL, and like it or not Girardi being a UFA hurts his value. I think we can change the 2nd to a 1st if he resigns, but it works great for both sides. Fills a need for both.

Cool. So did Newbury. Point is, doesn't matter what you do until you get to the big leagues. For Connolly, that's a step in the right direction, but doesn't mean anything unless he can repeat the success in the NHL.

 

[Raspewtin]

Cool. So did Newbury. Point is, doesn't matter what you do until you get to the big leagues. For Connolly, that's a step in the right direction, but doesn't mean anything unless he can repeat the success in the NHL.

Okay. And I believe he can. What's your point? Should we just not trade for players that aren't in the NHL?

 

[Ail]

Much easier said that done.

To me that depends on the circumstances. There's a big difference between a team like Chicago coming off a Cup win, up against the cap knowing they have to trade, or let players walk versus a team like the Rangers facing giving a FA a long-term deal that has considerable risks involved on both sides of the argument, for instance.

There probably aren't many easy decisions when it comes to being a GM, but some certainly lend themselves to be made easier depending on the surrounding conditions.

 

[BarbaraAlphanse]

I would be behind grabbing Yakupov, it just depends on what they are asking for. If they want to add another top-end talent who needs a better opportunity that would be the one to grab IMO.

They need to blow some of that team up. Eberle, Hall, Hopkins, Yakupov.

They just got their purported goalie of the future. The next step is to trade one of them for defense.

Yakupov is an unbelievable talent, but if he wants out he needs to force it. He began the steps earlier in the season but didn't persist. It would have to be a joint effort to force a trade specifically to the Rangers (like Tim Erixon) for us to get him at a bargain value.

By bargain value I mean something like Del Zotto and Kristo.

Without that pressure on Edmonton management they can choose to keep him or make him virtually untradeable by raising their demands for him for something like Kreider and a 1st.

 

[BarbaraAlphanse]

Okay. And I believe he can. What's your point? Should we just not trade for players that aren't in the NHL?

No, but hyping players up that are in the AHL as much as this board is doing for Connolly is a mistake.

 

[BarbaraAlphanse]

To me that depends on the circumstances. There's a big difference between a team like Chicago coming off a Cup win, up against the cap knowing they have to trade, or let players walk versus a team like the Rangers facing giving a FA a long-term deal that has considerable risks involved on both sides of the argument, for instance.

There probably aren't many easy decisions when it comes to being a GM, but some certainly lend themselves to be made easier depending on the surrounding conditions.

I agree. But I also think there is an added element of coach's input on personnel. Vigneault has 4.5 years left on his contract. He's going to have a big say in the assets we keep/trade who we sign/trade for.

 

[Ail]

I agree. But I also think there is an added element of coach's input on personnel. Vigneault has 4.5 years left on his contract. He's going to have a big say in the assets we keep/trade who we sign/trade for.

I would like to know his opinion because he should know his system the best and if he thought re-signing both Callahan and Girardi were the best option I would be okay with it. I don't trust Glen Sather.

 

[Raspewtin]

No, but hyping players up that are in the AHL as much as this board is doing for Connolly is a mistake.

6th overall in 2010, big, dynamic goal scorer in juniors, translating well to the pro level. I don't see this ultra hype you're talking about. He's a blue chip prospect buried behind Tampa's incredible offensive depth.

 

[BarbaraAlphanse]

I would like to know his opinion because he should know his system the best and if he thought re-signing both Callahan and Girardi were the best option I would be okay with it. I don't trust Glen Sather.

Me neither. I don't trust him any further than I can throw him.

 

[Leonardo87]

I agree. But I also think there is an added element of coach's input on personnel. Vigneault has 4.5 years left on his contract. He's going to have a big say in the assets we keep/trade who we sign/trade for.

Glad you said this. AV trusts Cally on the ice, gave him over 20 mins against the blackhawks in a one goal game. He was on the ice for the last 2 mins. When they are down by one goal, he is one of the extra attackers, and when they are up by one, he is defending. Stepan has been getting less time in those defensive situations.

 

[AlternateSideParking]

Connolly is a great prospect. Probably more ahead than people think. He fills a massive void this organization has.

 

[BarbaraAlphanse]

6th overall in 2010, big, dynamic goal scorer in juniors, translating well to the pro level. I don't see this ultra hype you're talking about. He's a blue chip prospect buried behind Tampa's incredible offensive depth.

Pavl Brendl was also a blue chip prospect. Filatov. Kadri.

The list of blue chip prospects that actually equate to something is smaller than the list of blue chip prospects that fail.

 

[BarbaraAlphanse]

Connolly is a great prospect. Probably more ahead than people think. He fills a massive void this organization has.

Again, great. But he's also just that. A prospect.

It's why when an established player gets traded for prospects the total package coming back needs to be more inflated. Prospects are greater risks than established players because they may never materialize.

 

[BarbaraAlphanse]

Can we swing a Brassard Del Zotto trade for Kessler?

Torts gets depth he's comfortable with in Vancouver. We get our 2nd line center moving forward. We add toughness and find a home for Del Zotto and Brassard. Don't have to deal with their Q.O's this offseason either and can focus on Callahan and Girardi.

It's a move that helps for the future and is a lateral move for this year. We remain competitive but help ourselves for the years coming.

 

[Raspewtin]

Pavl Brendl was also a blue chip prospect. Filatov. Kadri.

The list of blue chip prospects that actually equate to something is smaller than the list of blue chip prospects that fail.

Sounds like you just don't like Connolly.

 

[Bleed Ranger Blue]

Pavl Brendl was also a blue chip prospect. Filatov. Kadri.

The list of blue chip prospects that actually equate to something is smaller than the list of blue chip prospects that fail.

Im not really sure what point you're trying to make here to counteract the very good point that the Rangers need to do a better job of targeting younger players that are on their way to breaking out.

In fact, thats the only thing they can do to avoid paying insane prices if these guys establish themselves at the NHL level -- something you consider a prerequisite for even inquiring.

 

[BarbaraAlphanse]

Sounds like you just don't like Connolly.

Actually, I have no idea who he is. I'm just saying a general rule of thumb is to try and temper expectations for prospects. They tend to fail more than they succeed.

 

[Raspewtin]

Actually, I have no idea who he is. I'm just saying a general rule of thumb is to try and temper expectations for prospects. They tend to fail more than they succeed.

What do you mean temper expectations? Nobody here is saying he'll be a superstar. Nobody has said he'll be a savior. He's a good, young, cost controlled player that happens to be available to take a chance on.

 

[BarbaraAlphanse]

Im not really sure what point you're trying to make here to counteract the very good point that the Rangers need to do a better job of targeting younger players that are on their way to breaking out.

In fact, thats the only thing they can do to avoid paying insane prices if these guys establish themselves at the NHL level -- something you consider a prerequisite for even inquiring.

And if this guy Connolly comes in and doesn't live up to expectations? We just trade our captain for him.

We traded Gomez for McDonough. Gaborik for depth.

I understand the trend is to trade over the hill, overpriced free agents, for our future depth. I agree with that part.

But then there's Lisin for Korpikowski, Zherdev for Tyutin.

Not every prospect works out. Sometimes the best trades are the ones you don't make. In this case, trading for a guy who's value is an all time high while we give up our captain who is a rental and is publicly claimed as injury prone, seems like bad value.

We are trading low and buying high. Trading low on our captain who sets an example and buying high on some guy from the AHL. Not a good swap.

 

[BarbaraAlphanse]

What do you mean temper expectations? Nobody here is saying he'll be a superstar. Nobody has said he'll be a savior. He's a good, young, cost controlled player that happens to be available to take a chance on.

And that chance comes at the expense of Callahan?