Proposal: Trade Rumours/Proposals PART XXXXX

[Ice-Tray]

I don't really get this reasoning from SJ's side other than maybe it gets them lower in the standings. Some money saved as well, but that only benefits one person, the owner, as Karlsson will expire by the time they look to turn the corner. They also ideally could give fans a reason to show up during lean years, so some of Karlsson's cost may be balanced out by keeping their best, most exciting player.

While potentially true, he may in fact be their best and most exciting player in hopes of enticing a team to make a trade. I doubt he has the desire to play at the top of his game consistently for an SJ team that looks to be rebuilding over the course of his contract, which is most of what’s left of his career.

 

[aragorn]

Who is our 1RW in 2 years?

Claude Giroux RW has a contract for another 2 yrs & should be somewhere in the top 9 in 2 yrs, but the yr after (2025-26) he's gone I think the 2nd line centre spot could be between Boucher, Petersson & Sokolov internally. DeBrincat is also a right shot & can play RW but then they would have to move someone to LW to replace him. Pinto could end up being the 2nd line centre with Stutzle on LW & DeBrincat on RW. They should have several options to fill out their top six & they could draft another RW this coming draft, I like Mathew Wood RW in 2023.

1. Drake Batherson RW
2. Tyler Boucher RW
3. Oscar Petersson RW (Mathieu Joseph RW)
4. Egor Sokolov RW
5. Carson Lattimer RW
6. Cameron O'Neill RW

 

[Tuna99]

Lol at questioning Karlssons competitive drive and desire to win.

No other Senator in history won the team more games and I doubt anyone sacrificed more of himself either.

And at the same time Brady is some ultra proven Jordan-esque alpha leader to the same people

If you punch people in the face you’re considered a great leader, if you don’t punch people in the face your commitment is questioned - see history of Alfie vs. Brady for truth.

Alfie took his team to the playoffs for 15 years after he arrived but for 10 of this years he was considered soft. Brady has a bad team but everyone seems happy becuase he punches people when they lose. It’s a strange culture hockey

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Claude Giroux RW has a contract for another 2 yrs & should be somewhere in the top 9 in 2 yrs, but the yr after (2025-26) he's gone I think the 2nd line centre spot could be between Boucher, Petersson & Sokolov internally. DeBrincat is also a right shot & can play RW but then they would have to move someone to LW to replace him. Pinto could end up being the 2nd line centre with Stutzle on LW & DeBrincat on RW. They should have several options to fill out their top six & they could draft another RW this coming draft, I like Mathew Wood RW in 2023.

1. Drake Batherson RW
2. Tyler Boucher RW
3. Oscar Petersson RW (Mathieu Joseph RW)
4. Egor Sokolov RW
5. Carson Lattimer RW
6. Cameron O'Neill RW

Looks like RW is still an area of weakness

 

[benjiv1]

Dorion is trying to swing for a Defensemen, because if he doesn’t and the Sens don’t make playoffs, he’s gone.

Probably gone regardless, but there’s no way a new ownership goes. Ah 6 years without playoffs, good job.

Alfie will be POHO, and will hire someone he already has report with to be GM. (Jarmo perhaps if he leaves or is fired from CBJ)

Sens need to give Mann a chance before searching for a DJ replacement IMO.

There aren’t a ton of options out there with a great resume anyways, so might as well see what we have in the organization, as he has done almost absolutely he can at the AHL level.

 

[Senscore]

Dorion is trying to swing for a Defensemen, because if he doesn’t and the Sens don’t make playoffs, he’s gone.

Probably gone regardless, but there’s no way a new ownership goes. Ah 6 years without playoffs, good job.

Alfie will be POHO, and will hire someone he already has report with to be GM. (Jarmo perhaps if he leaves or is fired from CBJ)

Sens need to give Mann a chance before searching for a DJ replacement IMO.

There aren’t a ton of options out there with a great resume anyways, so might as well see what we have in the organization, as he has done almost absolutely he can at the AHL level.

The shine on Jarmo has really worn off the past few years. Really hope it's not him.

The Gudbrandon signing is unforgivable.

 

[Ice-Tray]

Dorion is trying to swing for a Defensemen, because if he doesn’t and the Sens don’t make playoffs, he’s gone.

Probably gone regardless, but there’s no way a new ownership goes. Ah 6 years without playoffs, good job.

Alfie will be POHO, and will hire someone he already has report with to be GM. (Jarmo perhaps if he leaves or is fired from CBJ)

Sens need to give Mann a chance before searching for a DJ replacement IMO.

There aren’t a ton of options out there with a great resume anyways, so might as well see what we have in the organization, as he has done almost absolutely he can at the AHL level.

Not sure I like the sounds of this.

There is no need for a panic trade, they usually suck. I doubt PD is as panicky is people are hoping/thinking. As you said, there is a good chance that change is inevitable, no point in ruining what looks like a good core if you have hopes of being hired again elsewhere.

Jarmo is not a good choice as a GM in my opinion as he has been ineffective in CBJ. His loss of Pan and Bob was terrible asset management, and he has done very little since.

I want Alfie in a position with the team, but as a guy with next to no front office experience, I’m not sure he’s the right choice to hand the reigns to.

Specifically the idea that he would hire a GM based on his rapport with him is not great reasoning.

I think Alfie needs a VP job to learn the ropes like other player/front office moves.

I see no reason to move from DJ to Mann, sounds a lot like the same thing again where we try and go with an inexperienced coach, but don’t have the stomach to give them time to learn. Mann can be an assistant coach if they want to keep him. One promotion at a time would be nice to see.

If it’s a cleaning house, next season could start just as slowly as the entire new coaching staff will be implementing a new system….

I find this all potentially very exciting.

 

[aragorn]

Looks like RW is still an area of weakness

Mathew Wood RW might help in this yr's draft if we are picking somewhere between 10th to 15th. His brother is pretty good for NJD & he could be even better offensively.

 

[Wallet Inspector]

The shine on Jarmo has really worn off the past few years. Really hope it's not him.

The Gudbrandon signing is unforgivable.

It was doubly stupid since it forced Columbus to trade Bjorkstrand for next to nothing.

 

[Big Muddy]

Moving Karlsson for basically no return no retention would probably be a good return for SJ.

Some say so. I guess it depends on how you define "good". But, hard to do a successful rebuild when you don't get assets (picks, prospects) for your good trading chips.

What did we get when we moved Karlsson? Would it have been good to receive nothing but some cap relief? No Norris, no pick that became Stutzle. How would have that been viewed in here?

 

[Que]

The shine on Jarmo has really worn off the past few years. Really hope it's not him.

The Gudbrandon signing is unforgivable.

The Gudbransson signing might be the worst contract given out in the last decade. Unfathomably bad asset management.

They traded a 30 goal scorer on possibly the best contract in the league for a literal boat anchor. Net profit a 3rd round pick?

Makes the Mark Stone trade look good in comparison, and Nick Paul a home run.

 

[Alex1234]

Dorion is trying to swing for a Defensemen, because if he doesn’t and the Sens don’t make playoffs, he’s gone.

Probably gone regardless, but there’s no way a new ownership goes. Ah 6 years without playoffs, good job.

Alfie will be POHO, and will hire someone he already has report with to be GM. (Jarmo perhaps if he leaves or is fired from CBJ)

Sens need to give Mann a chance before searching for a DJ replacement IMO.

There aren’t a ton of options out there with a great resume anyways, so might as well see what we have in the organization, as he has done almost absolutely he can at the AHL level.

A desperate Dorion is a dangerous Dorion

 

[Burrowsaurus]

Something I've always wondered

How Does a young athlete stay motivated when they have a guaranteed contract worth 80 M?

For sure, some stay motivated. Others, for sure not

About 99% stay motivated.

 

[Alex1234]

Claude Giroux RW has a contract for another 2 yrs & should be somewhere in the top 9 in 2 yrs, but the yr after (2025-26) he's gone I think the 2nd line centre spot could be between Boucher, Petersson & Sokolov internally. DeBrincat is also a right shot & can play RW but then they would have to move someone to LW to replace him. Pinto could end up being the 2nd line centre with Stutzle on LW & DeBrincat on RW. They should have several options to fill out their top six & they could draft another RW this coming draft, I like Mathew Wood RW in 2023.

1. Drake Batherson RW
2. Tyler Boucher RW
3. Oscar Petersson RW (Mathieu Joseph RW)
4. Egor Sokolov RW
5. Carson Lattimer RW
6. Cameron O'Neill RW

Almost ppg player
Most goals on the team
Ex 10-years captain
Best FO guy we ever had
Only + of the top 6
So so important to this team


We are going to see a big drop off at RW

 

[Micklebot]

The Gudbransson signing might be the worst contract given out in the last decade. Unfathomably bad asset management.

They traded a 30 goal scorer on possibly the best contract in the league for a literal boat anchor. Net profit a 3rd round pick?

Makes the Mark Stone trade look good in comparison, and Nick Paul a home run.

If he's on pace for ten goals, and has never hit 30 goals, is he really a 30 goal scorer? Is a guy marking 5.4 mil on pace for 41 pts really one of the best contacts in the league?

I'm not suggesting they got great value at the time they traded him, but maybe other teams were weary of giving much up for the guy with the third worst +/- in the league.

 

[BonHoonLayneCornell]

While potentially true, he may in fact be their best and most exciting player in hopes of enticing a team to make a trade. I doubt he has the desire to play at the top of his game consistently for an SJ team that looks to be rebuilding over the course of his contract, which is most of what’s left of his career.

Oh for sure, if they can get a decent return then they'll move him, but I was specifically responding to the idea that it would be a win for SJ to trade him for nothing with no retention involved. I dont see the reasoning there. The team is beginning rebuilding, so his contract won't matter, and he is leading the league in points for defensemen, the same guy that was talked about as a top 3 league talent at some point who is now playing at that level again. I just fail to see why it would help SJ in any way other than maybe dropping in the standings more.

 

[Que]

If he's on pace for ten goals, and has never hit 30 goals, is he really a 30 goal scorer? Is a guy marking 5.4 mil on pace for 41 pts really one of the best contacts in the league?

I'm not suggesting they got great value at the time they traded him, but maybe other teams were weary of giving much up for the guy with the third worst +/- in the league.

Honestly, technically no. But he was trending towards 30 goal territory.

He’s a more valuable asset than Gudbransson, imo, and all they profited from the difference was a 3rd round pick.

Mind you I’ve watched virtually nothing of Bjorkstrand and Gudbransson was quite good last season (Sutter effect).

I like Jarmo and I’m happy he’s succeeded but I’d rather keep Dorion than bring him in. I feel like Columbus’ success is more scouting related than managerial.

 

[Ice-Tray]

Oh for sure, if they can get a decent return then they'll move him, but I was specifically responding to the idea that it would be a win for SJ to trade him for nothing with no retention involved. I dont see the reasoning there. The team is beginning rebuilding, so his contract won't matter, and he is leading the league in points for defensemen, the same guy that was talked about as a top 3 league talent at some point who is now playing at that level again. I just fail to see why it would help SJ in any way other than maybe dropping in the standings more.

Agreed, can’t see him traded for ‘nothing’ either. Some team is going make it work I should think. That’s too much talent to waste away in a rebuild.

 

[Micklebot]

Honestly, technically no. But he was trending towards 30 goal territory.

He’s a more valuable asset than Gudbransson, imo, and all they profited from the difference was a 3rd round pick.

Mind you I’ve watched virtually nothing of Bjorkstrand and Gudbransson was quite good last season (Sutter effect).

I like Jarmo and I’m happy he’s succeeded but I’d rather keep Dorion than bring him in. I feel like Columbus’ success is more scouting related than managerial.

Yeah, I'm not saying Gudbranson is good or anything, I just don't see Bjorkstrand as a great contract, at least, it hasn't been a great one for Seattle.

 

[aragorn]

Almost ppg player
Most goals on the team
Ex 10-years captain
Best FO guy we ever had
Only + of the top 6
So so important to this team


We are going to see a big drop off at RW

Yea, probably, he will be very difficult to replace.

 

[JD1]

Some say so. I guess it depends on how you define "good". But, hard to do a successful rebuild when you don't get assets (picks, prospects) for your good trading chips.

What did we get when we moved Karlsson? Would it have been good to receive nothing but some cap relief? No Norris, no pick that became Stutzle. How would have that been viewed in here?

The situations are quite different though. When we traded Karlsson he was 4 years younger than he currently is and he had one year left on a very good contract. Now he has 4 years left on a bad contract. He's putting up numbers this year but he's doing that on a lottery team and likely without much structure to team play. What value does he have to a contender at an 11.5 AAV?

About 99% stay motivated.

I don't think that's the case at all. That's why guys have contract years.

 

[Big Muddy]

The situations are quite different though. When we traded Karlsson he was 4 years younger than he currently is and he had one year left on a very good contract. Now he has 4 years left on a bad contract. He's putting up numbers this year but he's doing that on a lottery team and likely without much structure to team play. What value does he have to a contender at an 11.5 AAV?


I don't think that's the case at all. That's why guys have contract years.

Yes, I knew it would be the old "this is different though" (damage control) technique.

Again, thank god Dorion did the one thing that is paramount and necessary in a rebuild and that is getting good assets as a return versus just cap/$ savings. Can't imagine how much longer the rebuild would have been and how much more misery the Senator fans would have had to endure had he not done what he did.

I used our Karlsson trade as an example. There were plenty of others that could be used if you prefer a different example. In the Debrincat trade, Chicago got some nice assets back from us. The Hawks just didn't dump Debrincat to save $s/cap.

 

[JD1]

Yes, I knew it would be the old "this is different though" (damage control) technique.

Again, thank god Dorion did the one thing that is paramount and necessary in a rebuild and that is getting good assets as a return versus just cap/$ savings. Can't imagine how much longer the rebuild would have been and how much more misery the Senator fans would have had to endure had he not done what he did.

I used our Karlsson trade as an example. There were plenty of others that could be used if you prefer a different example. In the Debrincat trade, Chicago got some nice assets back from us. The Hawks just didn't dump Debrincat to save $s/cap.

Again the situations are quite different. DeBrincat was 24 with several prime years ahead of him. Karlsson was 28 with one year of a good contract.

Do you consider Karlsson a "good" trading chip with 4 more years of 11.5aav ? That's your phrase - "good" trading chip

Piss off with damage control technique. You initially responded to my post about Karlsson really having no value. If you want to debate that, fine. He's got 11.5 AAV for 4 more years. Feel free to articulate your thoughts on possible returns for him. But don't equate our initially moving him 4 years ago or Chicago moving DeBrincat because neither of those situations is at all similar to the situation SJ is in with Karlsson's contract

 

[bert]

The shine on Jarmo has really worn off the past few years. Really hope it's not him.

The Gudbrandon signing is unforgivable.

It's not his fault no one wants to play for Columbus. His drafting has been amazing and he even convinced a super star to sign there. I'd love if he got the job here. Their injuries have been worse than Ottawas. Outside of the Gudbranson signing I can't say I dislike anything he's done. Panarin, Duchene, Jones and Dubois refused to play for them.... He didn't commit to Anderson and Bobrovskys contracts.

Ya gotta look at the big picture.

 

[bert]

Honestly, technically no. But he was trending towards 30 goal territory.

He’s a more valuable asset than Gudbransson, imo, and all they profited from the difference was a 3rd round pick.

Mind you I’ve watched virtually nothing of Bjorkstrand and Gudbransson was quite good last season (Sutter effect).

I like Jarmo and I’m happy he’s succeeded but I’d rather keep Dorion than bring him in. I feel like Columbus’ success is more scouting related than managerial.

Dorion over Jarmo. Gross. Alfie won't see it like that thank God.