Proposal: Trade Rumours/Proposals PART XXXXX

[Cosmix]

I think the big splash will be Alfie as POHO followed by a recognizable GM, followed by a “name” coach.

Alfie has done little so far to earn a POHO position unless it is in name only as a PR person.

Trotz as both GM and head coach would be OK with me. He would need help of course and probably would hire an experienced assistant coach to be his assistant coach with the view of promoting him to head coach after a few years. Dorion and DJ would be goners.

 

[Cosmix]

Some people get REALLY defensive when it comes to EK.

I like EK and would welcome him back as long as SJ retained about $4M X 4 years of his salary and cap hit. Giving SJ Zaitsev for next season could knock about $4M off that. Then give SJ our #1 pick in 2023 (top 3 protected) and maybe a second rounder (or one of our Belleville boys) as well might get it done.

 

[GCK]

Alfie has done little so far to earn a POHO position unless it is in name only as a PR person.

Trotz as both GM and head coach would be OK with me. He would need help of course and probably would hire an experienced assistant coach to be his assistant coach with the view of promoting him to head coach after a few years. Dorion and DJ would be goners.

Trotz has zero experience as a GM. Pass.

 

[GoSenatorsGo]

I know I’ll get shot down mentioning this but I’d give Spezza a shot at GM, I know, I know he’s new to his position, but I’ve always thought he had such a smart brain for the game.

 

[Micklebot]

I know I’ll get shot down mentioning this but I’d give Spezza a shot at GM, I know, I know he’s new to his position, but I’ve always thought he had such a smart brain for the game.

He'll be a very good GM soon enough, I'd bet on him. Idk that he's ready yet though... Yzerman had a few years working under Holland with Nill before going to Tbay as I recall, I think Spezza would do well to learn the ropes before taking the helm.

 

[DJB]

Lol at questioning Karlssons competitive drive and desire to win.

No other Senator in history won the team more games and I doubt anyone sacrificed more of himself either.

And at the same time Brady is some ultra proven Jordan-esque alpha leader to the same people

You always gotta smear Brady any chance you get eh when he has no business in the conversation

Maybe in 2023 you will finally stop and move on with your life and not get so easily triggered lol

 

[Ice-Tray]

We’d have to woo Spez with an AGM position to get him away from Toronto, and even then it may not be possible if they have outlined a plan for him.

Alfie needs a role, but he has zero experience in any front office capacity and so he’s need a PR position to start.

In my opinion anyways. Trotz would be an experienced hockey guy that could be a GM candidate if new ownership does do a mass change over.

Like I said they should create a board and hire a POHO and let them sort out hockey ops.

 

[Nac Mac Feegle]

I like EK and would welcome him back as long as SJ retained about $4M X 4 years of his salary and cap hit. Giving SJ Zaitsev for next season could knock about $4M off that. Then give SJ our #1 pick in 2023 (top 3 protected) and maybe a second rounder (or one of our Belleville boys) as well might get it done.

Nah.

Even with retention and Zaitsev going the other way, I'm not handing over a 2023 1st round pick for Erik.

There's a decent chance Erik will play well this year and next season....then fall off a massive cliff. Hell, he might fall off that cliff by the end of this season. And then, even with max retention, that contract will look horrible. It's not worth killing our salary structure to 'catch the girl who got away,' if you catch my drift.

 

[Alex1234]

Right now? Yes.

In two seasons, that wouldn't be accurate at all.

We have to remember or window isn't even open yet. We need to focus on guys who will be at the top of thier game 2+ years from now.

Who is our 1RW in 2 years?

 

[Alex1234]

Some people get REALLY defensive when it comes to EK.

Like some people when it comes to Dorion

 

[Bjornar Moxnes]

Boqvist for Ostapchuk?

 

[The Devilish Buffoon]

Boqvist for Ostapchuk?

No thanks, but you can have Joseph and a pick/lesser prospect

 

[BondraTime]

I know I’ll get shot down mentioning this but I’d give Spezza a shot at GM, I know, I know he’s new to his position, but I’ve always thought he had such a smart brain for the game.

We should absolutely be offfering him a high end position with the promise of transitioning him to GM in 2/3 years.

Similar to Yzermam, cut his teeth for a couple of years, and move him into the position.

Don’t think it’s in the cards, whoever we hire after this season will be here with the intention of staying, not grooming Spezza.

He’s going to be a very good GM in a few years, for a very long time.

 

[Big Muddy]

Who is our 1RW in 2 years?

It was Batherson last year. This year's lineup has been juggled around a lot due to injuries.

As for the future, we don't know what our next GM is planning or will do. He hasn't even been hired yet.

The next ownership and GM will inherit an interesting situation. There will be some important decisions to make right away.

No thanks, but you can have Joseph and a pick/lesser prospect

That avatar (poster you responded to) looks familiar. Chantal Pinto maybe?

 

[Big Muddy]

Nah.

Even with retention and Zaitsev going the other way, I'm not handing over a 2023 1st round pick for Erik.

If the Sharks retain a reasonably hefty amount plus take Zaitsev off our hands, I'd wonder what the price (assets) would be? In a rebuild, it's the assets you get back (picks, prospects, young players) that are the key for the rebuilding team. That is much more important than saving money. Doesn't seem likely a rebuilding team would want a soft return when they move one of their best trading chips. Oh well, cue the Karlsson trade posts I guess.

 

[Nac Mac Feegle]

If the Sharks retain a reasonably hefty amount plus take Zaitsev off our hands, I'd wonder what the price (assets) would be? In a rebuild, it's the assets you get back (picks, prospects, young players) that are the key for the rebuilding team. That is much more important than saving money. Doesn't seem likely a rebuilding team would want a soft return when they move one of their best trading chips. Oh well, cue the Karlsson trade posts I guess.

The Sharks would want more, but that doesn't mean we should be giving it to them. We are still too far away from being contenders to make a move like that, especially considering the likelihood Erik regresses a lot in the near future.

 

[Big Muddy]

The Sharks would want more, but that doesn't mean we should be giving it to them. We are still too far away from being contenders to make a move like that, especially considering the likelihood Erik regresses a lot in the near future.

The only thing I was saying in my post was that the Sharks would probably expect a good return. The desired assets in a rebuild are typically draft picks, prospects, or good, young players. I say this because there doesn't seem to be as much focus on that element, or that some of the focus seems to be on the other team (Sharks in this case) saving money.

As far as whether that's a good move or not for the Senators, I didn't say anything about that.

Matching the age of our existing core would be one thing to bear in mind and look for in a trade imho.

The other thing would be doing an alternative analysis and looking at other alternatives. It could be that we just need a good partner & complimentary player to play with Sanderson. Of course, this assumes Zub will be paired with Chabot. That could end up being a much cheaper alternative in terms of both the player salary that needs to be paid, as well as the assets it takes to land the defender.

But ostensibly, this topic has been beaten to death and I doubt if anything I say will have any impact or change anybody's mind. People have hardened positions that rarely change when it comes to this kind of thing (and many others).

 

[JD1]

Absolutely it does and why I don’t want him here.

I posted weeks ago about knowing someone that’s spent time around Karlsson. He runs really hot and cold with his give a F meter when it comes to hockey. He doesn’t really love it he’s just really good at it.

I got crucified for my take but here we are

Something I've always wondered

How Does a young athlete stay motivated when they have a guaranteed contract worth 80 M?

For sure, some stay motivated. Others, for sure not

 

[DrEasy]

Something I've always wondered

How Does a young athlete stay motivated when they have a guaranteed contract worth 80 M?

For sure, some stay motivated. Others, for sure not

These guys are professional athletes, super competitive with a huge ego. That's the mentality it took to get them where they are. My default assumption for all of them is that they're always 100% motivated, and any dip in performance has to do with injuries/aging/health (including mental). I guess I'm not a believer in psychobabble and associated narratives.

I guess we see now that Karlsson probably was not 100% healthy when his play dipped, and now we're back to seeing what a healthy Karlsson can do. I'm sure not having to share minutes on the PP or in the o-zone with Burns helps too...

 

[JD1]

Wonder if any of Fabbro or Jokiharju would be available/worthwhile adds. I kinda like Jokiharju, I liked Fabbro a lot but haven't watched much of the Preds in a while.

People underestimate the mental/habitual impact of playing way too much for 3 straight years.

Watch a few Habs games and you will see the brilliantly talented, wise-beyond-his-years, responsible C Nick Suzuki allowing bad, soft habits to creep into his game after just two months of consistent, 20+ min (and as high as 25.5 min) games.

Chabot is probably still physically rebounding from the last three years, and I am pretty confident that he is rebounding mentally/habitually. Not to say he's fed up and discouraged and broken, but you don't just unlearn bad habits.

Trading Chabot would be a very difficult move to win.

How would you know what that impact is? And what's way too much?

Since the 19/20 season, Chabot is 14th in total time played in the regular season

Also keep in mind that many of these top defencemen have also played in a lot of playoff games too. Some of these guys have played 50 or 60 or 70 more games over 3.5 years. I think they're experiencing just as much wear and tear as Chabot, in some cases quite likely more.

 

[JD1]

The only thing I was saying in my post was that the Sharks would probably expect a good return. The desired assets in a rebuild are typically draft picks, prospects, or good, young players. I say this because there doesn't seem to be as much focus on that element, or that some of the focus seems to be on the other team (Sharks in this case) saving money.

As far as whether that's a good move or not for the Senators, I didn't say anything about that.

Matching the age of our existing core would be one thing to bear in mind and look for in a trade imho.

The other thing would be doing an alternative analysis and looking at other alternatives. It could be that we just need a good partner & complimentary player to play with Sanderson. Of course, this assumes Zub will be paired with Chabot. That could end up being a much cheaper alternative in terms of both the player salary that needs to be paid, as well as the assets it takes to land the defender.

But ostensibly, this topic has been beaten to death and I doubt if anything I say will have any impact or change anybody's mind. People have hardened positions that rarely change when it comes to this kind of thing (and many others).

Moving Karlsson for basically no return no retention would probably be a good return for SJ.

 

[JD1]

These guys are professional athletes, super competitive with a huge ego. That's the mentality it took to get them where they are. My default assumption for all of them is that they're always 100% motivated, and any dip in performance has to do with injuries/aging/health (including mental). I guess I'm not a believer in psychobabble and associated narratives.

I guess we see now that Karlsson probably was not 100% healthy when his play dipped, and now we're back to seeing what a healthy Karlsson can do. I'm sure not having to share minutes on the PP or in the o-zone with Burns helps too...

I don't believe that. They're human beings. I think motivation likely comes and goes.

 

[Neiler]

If you had to pick one of these scenarios, which one do you take?

Scenario A: Ottawa acquires Karlsson (3M retained) and Neiderreiter, loses DeBrincat, Zaitsev and other smaller assets. Combined cap this year for the bolded: 12.5M. After this year: 12.5M.

Tkachuk - Stutzle - Giroux
Neiderreiter - Norris - Batherson
Motte - Pinto - Joseph
Brassard - Kastelic - Watson
Kelly/Gambrell

Chabot - Zub
Sanderson - Karlsson
Holden - Hamonic
Brannstrom

Scenario B: Ottawa acquires Dumba, keeps DeBrincat, loses Zaitsev and other smaller assets. Combined cap this year for the bolded: 12.4M. After this year: 14M-15M.

Tkachuk - Stutzle - Giroux
DeBrincat- Norris - Batherson
Motte - Pinto - Joseph
Brassard - Kastelic - Watson
Kelly/Gambrell

Chabot - Zub
Sanderson - Dumba
Holden - Hamonic
Brannstrom

 

[Cosmix]

Moving Karlsson for basically no return no retention would probably be a good return for SJ.

I doubt that SJ would get nothing back if they traded Karlsson and his full salary. I think a team might trade a late first rounder for him.

 

[BonHoonLayneCornell]

Moving Karlsson for basically no return no retention would probably be a good return for SJ.

I don't really get this reasoning from SJ's side other than maybe it gets them lower in the standings. Some money saved as well, but that only benefits one person, the owner, as Karlsson will expire by the time they look to turn the corner. They also ideally could give fans a reason to show up during lean years, so some of Karlsson's cost may be balanced out by keeping their best, most exciting player.