Proposal: Trade Rumours/Proposals PART XXXXX

[Senscore]

This team needs to sell if they have any takers.

Talbot, Hamonic, Motte, Holden, Brannstrom, Watson should go for whatever they can get. No point in bringing any of them back except maybe Hamonic if he is willing to take a massive pay cut.

Watson, Talbot, and Hamonic are guys that I truly think are not far from just hitting a wall in terms of their play.

Watson and Hamonic especially with the styles they play. But the benefit is that also means some team will covet them for depth spots and rightfully so. I think we can do well to move them and probably won't miss them a great deal.

 

[Cosmix]

I highly doubt we'd get much more than Whitecloud and a 1st, assuming I'm correct that Whitecloud is considered a solid 4/5 D on a steal of a contract.

Also if Roy is coming back the other way we'd probably need to be adding at that point. He isn't a cap dump at all. He's like their Nick Paul - a big two-way above-average 3rd liner that can play center or wing,

I know they were interested in Formenton so he could be thrown in but I don't know if that would be enough.

If Dorion trades Formenton for a bag of pucks, we should dump Dorion immediately.

 

[Hale The Villain]

If Dorion trades Formenton for a bag of pucks, we should dump Dorion immediately.

Unfortunately I don't think he'll be back in Ottawa or anywhere in Canada for that matter.

Could see him playing in the U.S where the Hockey Canada scandal wasn't major news.

I don't think his value will be high around the league. They were reportedly asking for a 2nd round pick around the November 1 deadline and no one was willing to pay it.

He makes a lot of sense as an acquisition for Vegas - a team that doesn't give a crap about off-ice matters and needs young cheap talent at forward, and Formenton likely out-performs his salary in coming seasons since he's obviously not going to get market value for himself given the allegations.

 

[Cosmix]

Unfortunately I don't think he'll be back in Ottawa or anywhere in Canada for that matter.

Could see him playing in the U.S where the Hockey Canada scandal wasn't major news.

I don't think his value will be high around the league. They were reportedly asking for a 2nd round pick around the November 1 deadline and no one was willing to pay it.

He makes a lot of sense as an acquisition for Vegas - a team that doesn't give a crap about off-ice matters and needs young cheap talent at forward, and Formenton likely out-performs his salary in coming seasons since he's obviously not going to get market value for himself given the allegations.

I am not ready to get rid of Formenton because the allegations of wrong doing have not been proven nor addressed in court as of this date.

The story so far is filled with uncertainties about what happened, why it happened, and who did what to whom.

It seems to me that the police are not proceeding quickly with laying of charges and I suspect the evidence may not support charges being laid.

 

[GCK]

I am not ready to get rid of Formenton because the allegations of wrong doing have not been proven nor addressed in court as of this date.

The story so far is filled with uncertainties about what happened, why it happened, and who did what to whom.

It seems to me that the police are not proceeding quickly with laying of charges and I suspect the evidence may not support charges being laid.

Honestly don’t see any way that Formenton is back even if he’s not charged or even suspended. Sucks to lose the hockey player but that’s how it goes.

 

[Samboni]

I am not ready to get rid of Formenton because the allegations of wrong doing have not been proven nor addressed in court as of this date.

Forementon’s NHL future is not entirely dependent upon whether or not charges are laid or convictions rendered. The NHL operates in its own world and can impose its own discipline based on a lower threshold of guilt. Although not the same, think of the OJ Simpson trials… not guilty in criminal court but guilty in Civil court.

 

[NyQuil]

Forementon’s NHL future is not entirely dependent upon whether or not charges are laid or convictions rendered. The NHL operates in its own world and can impose its own discipline based on a lower threshold of guilt. Although not the same, think of the OJ Simpson trials… not guilty in criminal court but guilty in Civil court.

Not even just that - but also the public scrutiny and optics in this market.

Fairly or not, there may be demands in the community for him to be turfed regardless of the outcome of any criminal proceedings.

We’ve had guys like Watson, Heatley and Corvo who came here for a fresh start under previously scandalous circumstances.

I could see the same for Alex elsewhere. It’s not as if the organization has publicly supported him in any fashion.

I can hardly imagine that this endears the Senators to him at this point.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Formenton so far is innocent. He is only guilty in public opinion.

Montreal drafted Logan Mailloux who was guilty of sharing sexually explicit pics without consent.
Not the same crime but still not nice.
Montreal took some flack and may still take a bit but its likely blown over buoyed by him being a RD 6'3 217 with 36 pts in 39 games .

If Formenton is cleared .. The team could support him and make this go away quick.

 

[PoutineSp00nZ]

I have zero interest in trading Cat, also, we need games!!!! Let’s go!

Yeah i dunno why people are down on debrincat. Sign the guy, and as long as it isn't an absurd contract they can always trade him in a couple seasons if they need to.

Keep talent

 

[Micklebot]

Yeah i dunno why people are down on debrincat. Sign the guy, and as long as it isn't an absurd contract they can always trade him in a couple seasons if they need to.

Keep talent

I don't think it's about being down on DeBrincat, anybody looking to trade him is doing so because they want to shore up another area.

You got to give to get and in a cap world you need to make tough choices.

 

[PoutineSp00nZ]

I don't think it's about being down on DeBrincat, anybody looking to trade him is doing so because they want to shore up another area.

You got to give to get and in a cap world you need to make tough choices.

Sure, but I'm not convinced that the Senators need to clear his cap hit to fit everyone else. Murray, Zaitsev and Ryan's buyouts and salary all come off the books in the next couple of seasons, which should give enough to sign Sanderson. Ontop of Debrincat.

I'm not sure the Senators need a top pairing defenseman, it would be nice, but if they can get a dude for around 5 million they should be able to keep everything going. I doubt Talbot comes back. Do the Sens decide to spend cap on a top end goalie, or do they get a backup for Forsberg and run with him? Could save another couple of million.

If and when they need to make space for guys like Greig and Pinto, decisions can be made. By then Giroux will be up for a new contract, and maybe losing him or signing him to a lesser contract is the play. Maybe Batherson is the guy they trade. Who knows. Its a decision to be made in a couple of seasons.

Debrincat is a proven star player. I think they sign him at all costs, unless his contract demands are unreasonable. But anything around 8 per season is an absolute no brainer in my mind.

 

[Micklebot]

Sure, but I'm not convinced that the Senators need to clear his cap hit to fit everyone else. Murray, Zaitsev and Ryan's buyouts and salary all come off the books in the next couple of seasons, which should give enough to sign Sanderson. Ontop of Debrincat.

I'm not sure the Senators need a top pairing defenseman, it would be nice, but if they can get a dude for around 5 million they should be able to keep everything going. I doubt Talbot comes back. Do the Sens decide to spend cap on a top end goalie, or do they get a backup for Forsberg and run with him? Could save another couple of million.

If and when they need to make space for guys like Greig and Pinto, decisions can be made. By then Giroux will be up for a new contract, and maybe losing him or signing him to a lesser contract is the play. Maybe Batherson is the guy they trade. Who knows. Its a decision to be made in a couple of seasons.

Debrincat is a proven star player. I think they sign him at all costs, unless his contract demands are unreasonable. But anything around 8 per season is an absolute no brainer in my mind.

We can fit two of DeBrincat, a good RHD addition and a legit starting goalie. I think if we opt for keeping DeBrincat, it likely requires filling a lot of the depth with ELC and cheap contracts.

Next year is the bottleneck. After that things should become a bit easier.

Personally, I think a good top 4 RHD does more for us than a 2nd line winger, even if he's a really good winger. Of course, that depends on the RHD but I like our top forwards, I think we can fill out the top 6 without DeBrincat if need be. On the other hand, I don't want to see another season of Hamonic or Zaitsev in the top 4...

I'd rather keep him than lose him, but im listening to options and deciding on a case by case basis.

 

[L'Aveuglette]

It's a little naive to think there isn't something up with Formenton considering both he and Batherson were involved somehow in that scandal, but only one of the two is around this season while the other one has been kept away.

I'm not convicting Alex by any means, but logic indicates the organization, as well as the league, must be aware of more serious implications otherwise he'd be with the Sens like Drake.

 

[Micklebot]

It's a little naive to think there isn't something up with Formenton considering both he and Batherson were involved somehow in that scandal, but only one of the two is around this season while the other one has been kept away.

I'm not convicting Alex by any means, but logic indicates the organization, as well as the league, must be aware of more serious implications otherwise he'd be with the Sens like Drake.

Batherson was under contract when everything started hitting the fan, Formenton was not. It's a lot easier to walk away under the guise of a contract dispute than it is to do anything with a player under contract.

I don't think you can equate their situations is all.

 

[Cosmix]

Formenton so far is innocent. He is only guilty in public opinion.

Montreal drafted Logan Mailloux who was guilty of sharing sexually explicit pics without consent.
Not the same crime but still not nice.
Montreal took some flack and may still take a bit but its likely blown over buoyed by him being a RD 6'3 217 with 36 pts in 39 games .

If Formenton is cleared .. The team could support him and make this go away quick.

Formenton is being presumed guilty by some people, but not by all people.

There is not a great deal of info available at this time to support a conclusion being drawn.

 

[GCK]

Formenton is being presumed guilty by some people, but not by all people.

There is not a great deal of info available at this time to support a conclusion being drawn.

IMO the org will choose to take the hit of losing the player for scraps over risking the bad publicity of bringing him back no matter the outcome. I can’t see new owners starting off with bad MSM coverage and alienating potential customers. Face it Formenton is gone.

 

[Good in Osgoode]

Formenton is being presumed guilty by some people, but not by all people.

There is not a great deal of info available at this time to support a conclusion being drawn.

Can we expect a conclusion to the Hockey Canada investigation anytime soon?
There was so much talk on all this through the Summer/early Fall and then it just kind of went away.

Where are things at right now? Is this with the London Police? Is it with Hockey Canada?
Is it with the Federal Gov't Department that was pressing Hockey Canada?
Will this thing ever get resolved one way or another?

 

[L'Aveuglette]

Batherson was under contract when everything started hitting the fan, Formenton was not. It's a lot easier to walk away under the guise of a contract dispute than it is to do anything with a player under contract.

I don't think you can equate their situations is all.

I can equate their situations fine.

You really think the Sens would be bold enough to keep Bath around if he's just as responsible as Formenton just because he already has a contract? You think that would somehow take the heat off of them if the investigation reveals he was an active participant?

I don't think so. No way the league would allow it.

 

[Cosmix]

Can we expect a conclusion to the Hockey Canada investigation anytime soon?
There was so much talk on all this through the Summer/early Fall and then it just kind of went away.

Where are things at right now? Is this with the London Police? Is it with Hockey Canada?
Is it with the Federal Gov't Department that was pressing Hockey Canada?
Will this thing ever get resolved one way or another?

If the evidence was compelling, I would have expected the police and crown attorneys to have acted by now to file charges.

The HC investigation has apparently been finished and a report provided to the HC Board.

I think the London Police requested a copy of that Report so they coulkd use any data in it as part of its evidence. The London Police and crown attorneys have not said anything yet as far as I know.

HC tried to address and resolve the issue with the lady making the allegations and got into political trouble because of it. The entire HC Board has been replaced.

I wonder if the new HC Board will attempt to recover the money paid to the lady making the allegations, who may have broken her settlement agreement, as many sponsors and government reps have criticized the HC Board for using its funds in that manner. I doubt that they will.

 

[Sens Vader]

We’re scouting Chicago again, also has eyes on Vancouver last night

 

[Big Muddy]

Sure, but I'm not convinced that the Senators need to clear his cap hit to fit everyone else. Murray, Zaitsev and Ryan's buyouts and salary all come off the books in the next couple of seasons, which should give enough to sign Sanderson. Ontop of Debrincat.

Next year is the challenge if the cap is $83.5 m. There's been some good posts in here with detailed breakdowns of the numbers that are well worth looking at.

And as you noted, Ottawa needs to do more than just sign Debrincat for next year. They'll need to sign another goaltender and a good RD would also be a needed addition. Once again, money coming off the books 2 years from now does nothing to address these various needs/challenges. They can likely accommodate one or two of those needs for next year, but then they'd have to save some money in another need area.

 

[Micklebot]

I can equate their situations fine.

You really think the Sens would be bold enough to keep Bath around if he's just as responsible as Formenton just because he already has a contract? You think that would somehow take the heat off of them if the investigation reveals he was an active participant?

I don't think so. No way the league would allow it.

I suppose that depends on how responsible Formenton is or how sure the team is of their involvement. If the team isn't 100% sure but is worried it's possible, that's very different than if they know a player is at the center of the scandal.

The fact is the contract situations are different, and trying to take action on Batherson with no charges is dicey, you can't suspend him because he'll grieve and likely win, if he is known or even broadly suspected to be involved, you probably can't trade him for decent value, but you can play ignorant and hope it blows over.

Formenton on the other hand you can mitigate any risk by not signing him. If it blows over, you can weigh your options at that point and either sign or trade him, if he turns out to be guilty you easily wash your hands of him.

The situations are factually different, you can choose to ignore that if you want, but it doesn't change reality.

 

[Cosmix]

I can equate their situations fine.

You really think the Sens would be bold enough to keep Bath around if he's just as responsible as Formenton just because he already has a contract? You think that would somehow take the heat off of them if the investigation reveals he was an active participant?

I don't think so. No way the league would allow it.

I think the NHLPA would have something to say about it, given that Batherson has a contract.

 

[Ice-Tray]

Not even just that - but also the public scrutiny and optics in this market.

Fairly or not, there may be demands in the community for him to be turfed regardless of the outcome of any criminal proceedings.

We’ve had guys like Watson, Heatley and Corvo who came here for a fresh start under previously scandalous circumstances.

I could see the same for Alex elsewhere. It’s not as if the organization has publicly supported him in any fashion.

I can hardly imagine that this endears the Senators to him at this point.

Here’s the thing though. If they don’t lay charges, they won’t release the names of the accused.

This means that there won’t even be any evidence released that puts him in the room definitively.

No way the league could act on that, and I seriously doubt any market would hold on to the issue for very long at that point, let alone at this point right now.

If the evidence was compelling, I would have expected the police and crown attorneys to have acted by now to file charges.

The HC investigation has apparently been finished and a report provided to the HC Board.

I think the London Police requested a copy of that Report so they coulkd use any data in it as part of its evidence. The London Police and crown attorneys have not said anything yet as far as I know.

HC tried to address and resolve the issue with the lady making the allegations and got into political trouble because of it. The entire HC Board has been replaced.

I wonder if the new HC Board will attempt to recover the money paid to the lady making the allegations, who may have broken her settlement agreement, as many sponsors and government reps have criticized the HC Board for using its funds in that manner. I doubt that they will.

I believe HC has already announced that they wouldn’t enforce the NDA to prevent her from speaking again to police. She has already spoken about it to the media again.

At no time have the names of anyone been released.

 

[Que]

We’re scouting Chicago again, also has eyes on Vancouver last night

It has to be Kane. Jones would never come to Canada.

Just let me have this…

Wouldn’t be surprised if it’s actually Anaheim we’re scouting.