Proposal: Trade Rumours/Proposals PART XXXXX

[Do Make Say Think]

Yup
Joseph is not top 6 material

He isn't based on skill/vision but he's been a solid fit for Brady and Timmy.

 

[aragorn]

that Anaheim team was ridiculously stacked

how many HHOF are gonna be from that team

So was Ottawa with the best top line in hockey, the two best teams were in the final.

 

[GCK]

Based off what metrics? He's still doing what he was signed to do, playing quality shut down defense. He's still 2nd in ice time on their D core and the Devils are firmly in a playoff spot

Since the new year he isn’t moving the puck as well, he’s getting pushed around and he has become an icing machine.

Yeah our third line looks like it’s gonna be greig pinto and Joseph. What more depth could we want?


Well looks like he’s been out of the lineup since Dec 20th.

He has played 46 of the Devils 49 games.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Keeping Brown and Formenton does nothing to resolve the issue we had at center, center depth is far more important than Winger depth. Having Brown or Formenton or both still has us struggling to figure out a 2nd line center while Norris was out. DeBrincat and Giroux weren't enough to mitigate that loss, why would Brown change anything?

Your right, we can fill depth with signings like Motte, or drafted players like Crookshank, Sokolov, or Jarventie.

Joseph is going to chip in here and there with two players like Stutzle and Tkachuk. He is not a top 6 player full stop. I agree balancing the top 3 lines was overdue because of the huge gap between the top 2 lines and the 3rd line for 1/2 the season. Motte outplayed Joseph pre injuries. Joseph has been the biggest disappointment re players on the team this year imo. He has some decent bottom six energy tools but is not a very high IQ player.

 

[JD1]

Since the new year he isn’t moving the puck as well, he’s getting pushed around and he has become an icing machine.

Hockey Reference shows him as injured with his last game played prior to Christmas

I haven't watched any Jersey games so I can't say that that information is accurate, but that's what is on their site.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

If Giroux was still able to play center, don't you think that would have been the first move after Norris went down?

Given they over slotted Pinto into the 2C role, either they're complete idiots or Giroux no longer moves well enough to play center. I'm going with the latter

Agree for 60 minutes. Maybe a few shifts .. but game after game he would not handle.

I’m not sure if you’ve been following the Devils but the bloom has been falling off the rise in terms of Marino. He had a great start but is looking more and more like a 3rd pair Dman as the season progresses. What top 4 RHD do you propose we target this summer that only costs a couple 2nd round picks and fits in under the cap ?

Marino has been out of the lineup for 17 games ...he is just coming back. He has been every bit of a top 4 D pre injury

 

[GCK]

Hockey Reference shows him as injured with his last game played prior to Christmas

I haven't watched any Jersey games so I can't say that that information is accurate, but that's what is on their site.

I’ve watched a lot, they’re a fun team but he’s definitely been in the lineup, he’s just not playing as well as he did through October-December. I’d still like to sign him to replace Brannstrom on as 3LD but he has likely priced himself out of our range.

Agree for 60 minutes. Maybe a few shifts .. but game after game he would not handle.


Marino has been out of the lineup for 17 games ...he is just coming back. He has been every bit of a top 4 D pre injury

What does that have to do with Graves ?

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

I’ve watched a lot, they’re a fun team but he’s definitely been in the lineup, he’s just not playing as well as he did through October-December. I’d still like to sign him to replace Brannstrom on as 3LD but he has likely priced himself out of our range.


What does that have to do with Graves ?

Nothing lol.
I thought you guys were discussing Marino... I had to jump back a few posts to even get that name mentioned ... by bad

 

[bicboi64]

Since the new year he isn’t moving the puck as well, he’s getting pushed around and he has become an icing machine.


He has played 46 of the Devils 49 games.

Any stats that verify that? I've been watching Devils games cuz Hughes is fun to watch and don't see any of that.

 

[GCK]

Nothing lol.
I thought you guys were discussing Marino... I had to jump back a few posts to even get that name mentioned ... by bad

NP. Happens to me all the time. Marino would have been a good get. No idea what Dorion was thinking there.

Any stats that verify that? I've been watching Devils games cuz Hughes is fun to watch and don't see any of that.

Eye test mostly. When the Devils couldn’t lose he looked amazing but he has reverted to his Avalanche self. I’d still take him at 3M this summer but he’s likely priced himself out. He does have experience playing his offside so that’s some nice flexibility

 

[Micklebot]

Joseph is going to chip in here and there with two players like Stutzle and Tkachuk. He is not a top 6 player full stop. I agree balancing the top 3 lines was overdue because of the huge gap between the top 2 lines and the 3rd line for 1/2 the season. Motte outplayed Joseph pre injuries. Joseph has been the biggest disappointment re players on the team this year imo. He has some decent bottom six energy tools but is not a very high IQ player.

Well the last 5 games and the 11 games he played on the top line last year were pretty effective as lines. He doesn't need to be a stand alone top 6 quality player, all he needs to do is use his speed to spread out the D and open things up for his linemates. People get hung up on top 6 players, but many coaches worry more about duo's. The third player just needs to compliment what the others bring and not get in the way. Joseph can do that, what he can't do is drive his own line.

 

[Cosmix]

Uh, so you think when Norris is back Greig will be in Belleville, or on the fourth line? Or is Pinto going to the fourth line?

More likely we'd see

Tkachuk-Stützle-Joseph
Greig-Norris-Giroux
Motte/UFA-Pinto-Batherson

Or alternatively Joseph and Bath could've swapped if we want to load up.

Motte has no place on the 3rd line. Hopefully Formenton is back next season. Plus I want to retain Debrincat as the LW on line 2.

Tkachuk-Stützle-Joseph
Debrincat-Norris-Giroux
Formenton-Pinto-Batherson
Kelly-Greig-(Watson replacement)

Chabot-(UFA or trade for top RD)
Sanderson-Zub
Brannstrom/Kleven-JBD/Thomson

 

[Cosmix]

He's looked fine lately, his speed has opened things up for Stü and Brady to thrive and our 5v5 scoring has been much better since making the change.

The reality is duos are more important than the third piece on a line. I mentioned we should try Joseph with Tkachuk and Norris in the offseason to allow us to role 3 lines, and I still think spreading things out is the right move.

I think it is worth trying.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Well the last 5 games and the 11 games he played on the top line last year were pretty effective as lines. He doesn't need to be a stand alone top 6 quality player, all he needs to do is use his speed to spread out the D and open things up for his linemates. People get hung up on top 6 players, but many coaches worry more about duo's. The third player just needs to compliment what the others bring and not get in the way. Joseph can do that, what he can't do is drive his own line.

There are a lot of players that could play that spot and do it at least as effectively for a lot less $/pt than Joseph,
Joseph ranks 493 in cost per point league wide. Just a factor. He can play with Tkachuk and Stutzle as could many players and be a "pretty effective line"

 

[Hale The Villain]

Hopefully Stone being out until the playoffs makes a DeBrincat acquisition for Vegas more likely, since they can now fit him in without needing to offload cap.

Still think Whitecloud is the perfect finishing piece for the defense and while it's unlikely he's ever put on the block due to his age and fantastic contract, maybe he could be made available in a deal for a talent like DeBrincat, especially if adding him could mean saving their season.

 

[Micklebot]

There are a lot of players that could play that spot and do it at least as effectively for a lot less $/pt than Joseph,
Joseph ranks 493 in cost per point league wide. Just a factor. He can play with Tkachuk and Stutzle as could many players and be a "pretty effective line"

Does it matter how many of the goals Tkachuk and Stü score that he registers a point on or just that they score them? I'm of the opinion that the lines production is more important than the production of any individual player on it. That said, he's producing fine since the move.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Does it matter how many of the goals Tkachuk and Stü score that he registers a point on or just that they score them? I'm of the opinion that the lines production is more important than the production of any individual player on it. That said, he's producing fine since the move.

good place to hide him

 

[Micklebot]

good place to hide him

Is it really hidding him when the line has been so effective with him?

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Is it really hidding him when the line has been so effective with him?

You seem to ignore that
He is not really effective on the 3rd line and that numerous players could play that spot with Stutzle and Tkachuk and be more effective.

Not only more effective but more effective cheaper.

So they are hiding him despite being effective as a line.

 

[bicboi64]

Hopefully Stone being out until the playoffs makes a DeBrincat acquisition for Vegas more likely, since they can now fit him in without needing to offload cap.

Still think Whitecloud is the perfect finishing piece for the defense and while it's unlikely he's ever put on the block due to his age and fantastic contract, maybe he could be made available in a deal for a talent like DeBrincat, especially if adding him could mean saving their season.

I'm tryna think what kinda of deal would be fair. Not sure if Vegas would deal with us especially if they're still salty over them mishandling the Dadanov trade from us but they have some pieces that might make us better if management decides to move Cat

Whitecloud, Dean, and a 1st would have to be the start but I think Vegas would want to send more cap over. Maybe Nic Roy, in which case we better be getting another prospect like Chayka thrown in for taking on a bottom 6 centre making $3million for 4 more seasons.

 

[GCK]

You seem to ignore that
He is not really effective on the 3rd line and that numerous players could play that spot with Stutzle and Tkachuk and be more effective.

Not only more effective but more effective cheaper.

So they are hiding him despite being effective as a line.

Joseph is an odd situation. He has been completely ineffective on the 3rd line, doesn’t use his speed, doesn’t hit, etc…. When he has played with Stu and Brady he uses his speed and his body, he’s not just a passenger, he actually provides something than complements them. All in all he is a frustrating player. Maybe he just needed the healthy scratch to wake him up and it’s not related to the line he is playing on.

I'm tryna think what kinda of deal would be fair. Not sure if Vegas would deal with us especially if they're still salty over them mishandling the Dadanov trade from us but they have some pieces that might make us better if management decides to move Cat

Whitecloud, Dean, and a 1st would have to be the start but I think Vegas would want to send more cap over. Maybe Nic Roy, in which case we better be getting another prospect like Chayka thrown in for taking on a bottom 6 centre making $3million for 4 more seasons.

Debrincat for Whitecloud + 1st would be a great return.

 

[JD1]

Nothing lol.
I thought you guys were discussing Marino... I had to jump back a few posts to even get that name mentioned ... by bad

So did I. Hmmm. Sorry @GCK

 

[bicboi64]

Joseph is an odd situation. He has been completely ineffective on the 3rd line, doesn’t use his speed, doesn’t hit, etc…. When he has played with Stu and Brady he uses his speed and his body, he’s not just a passenger, he actually provides something than complements them. All in all he is a frustrating player. Maybe he just needed the healthy scratch to wake him up and it’s not related to the line he is playing on.


Debrincat for Whitecloud + 1st would be a great return.

I'm prolly just a greedy SoB

 

[JD1]

There are a lot of players that could play that spot and do it at least as effectively for a lot less $/pt than Joseph,
Joseph ranks 493 in cost per point league wide. Just a factor. He can play with Tkachuk and Stutzle as could many players and be a "pretty effective line"

I don't think it's really fair to look at Joseph's pre injury production. He was the only guy on the line that belonged on the line.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

I don't think it's really fair to look at Joseph's pre injury production. He was the only guy on the line that belonged on the line.

Motte was a more effective player on the 3rd line.