Proposal: Trade Rumours/Proposals [MOD - Stay on Topic]

[guyzeur]

Or they have $9ish million in cap space going into next year with 7-9 players to add, including a raise for Gustavsson based on his play this year, and don't want to lose an asset for nothing.

But, hey, it's a lot more fun to endlessly lampoon management, right?

You're suddenly in the shoes of the Sens GM Pierre Dorion. One evening walking the deserted roads of Orleans, you find a flashlight. Being in the dark you think it would be a good idea to turn it on.

Doing so a shadow emerge from the flashlight. You're even more surprise when the shadow start to say:
"I'm the Genie of the Flashlight, I'm all mighty and all knowing I can see your distress and I'd like help you. I'll give you 3 options but you can only pick one. The right one will bring joy and happiness"

Which one would you pick:
- Acquire an elephant named Dumbo
- Get a Chick(r)en" but you may loose a car (Pinto) or a turtle (Ridley) , and a '23 1st and another 1st equivalent
- Or trade your cat (DBC) in exchange for a beautiful dream

The Genie finally says: "1 option is the right one, if you choose wrong you'll be forever ridiculed"*

"You made you choice" the Genie says!

Before completely disappearing into his lamp you hear the Genie maniacally laughing and says"whatever your choice you'll be hated AND ridiculed anyway"!

 

[HSF]

He didn't really find them. The whole league knew who they were when they signed in Toronto. You mean sign guys that wanted to play in their hometown?

Assen na yo!

hoping for RR to rebrand the senators to making them an attractive market

Ottawa should be able to attract Ontario boys who want to play close to home

 

[Golden_Jet]

hoping for RR to rebrand the senators to making them an attractive market

Ottawa should be able to attract Ontario boys who want to play close to home

We have some and have had others in the past.
Giroux the obvious at the moment.

 

[Mingus Dew]

If your team loses in the first round every year, you haven't done everything you can. When Masai wanted to get the Raps over the hump, he went out and got Kawhi Leonard, traded away Demar and replaced Casey with Nurse. He didn't say "I've put this team in a position to succeed and it's their fault they can't get it done". What are you even talking about? They're in the same division as a team that's been to the Finals 3 straight times. That's a GM who's doing everything he can to get his team over the hump.

OK fair, he hasn't done "everything" and yes he's not as good of a GM as probably the best GM in the NHL. You are right.

My view is that Dubas is not to blame for Toronto's failure to win a cup in the last 5 years or at least not primarily to blame. And I also think he's a much better GM than Pierre Dorion.

The genesis of this whole discussion was the McCabe trade which I maintain was very solid for the Leafs and shrewd GMing from Dubas.

How on earth is Toronto competing for a cup “every year” when they can’t get past the first round. Lol the hyperbole is insane…

When you are a Top 5 team in the NHL pretty much consistently you are a cup contender. Past performance is not indicative of future results especially given how Toronto has been bounced previously.

There are a staggering number of variables that go into winning the cup and having playoff success. The best team does not always come out on top (sometimes they do). If you enter the post-season as a high seed with a great record you are a cup contender.

 

[HSF]

Or they have $9ish million in cap space going into next year with 7-9 players to add, including a raise for Gustavsson based on his play this year, and don't want to lose an asset for nothing.

But, hey, it's a lot more fun to endlessly lampoon management, right?

you do know they scratched Dumba for a few games last month cause he played poorly?

A playoff team looking to move one of their defensemen who we want to play with chabot in the top4 is concerning

Later that night, Darren Dreger revealed what happened with Dumba to miss the contest on Insider Trading on TSN:

“Well, it’s 100 per cent performance based, and the reality is Matt Dumba, as veteran defenceman for the Wild, hasn’t been good of late. And he was no good versus the Washington Capitals on Tuesday. So this is Dean Evason, the head coach – the latest head coach – to send the message to try and wake up a big name, big money player. We’ve seen it in Vancouver with Oliver Ekman-Larsson. We saw it in Philadelphia with John Tortorella and Kevin Hayes. So I don’t know if it’s trendsetting, but there’s more of a willingness to deliver that message. But there remains trade interest in Matt Dumba. He just has to get his game back on track.”​

 

[Sens Vader]

EDM cleared space with moving Puljujarvi to the Canes

Let’s see who they get, Chychrun or Ekholm

 

[Senscore]

How on earth is Toronto competing for a cup “every year” when they can’t get past the first round. Lol the hyperbole is insane…

They are one of the best teams in the league over the last 6 years.

So yeah they are competing for a Cup every year. Are they succeeding is a totally different question.

 

[Hale The Villain]

I said like five times that I think being a regular season power house that is in a position to contend for the cup every year is results lol. Winning a cup is certainly a better result than a first round exist but as a Sens fan I would be very happy if we were perennially competitive and I think many would be with me on that.

What exactly are we arguing about here? Dubas is a failure because he can't get them over the hump? He's done what he can as a GM.

You're arguing with people who are unable to separate the team from the GM.

Obviously a GM should be judged mainly on HIS contribution to the roster via trades, signings and hires, rather strictly on team success or failure.

Overall I'd say Dubas' record is mixed but he's done good work in 2022/23 and may save his job as a result.

 

[Relapsing]

Someone commented that it's hypocritical to bash Dorion for lack of results while simultaneously thinking that Dubas is a good GM.

I don't agree because I think most of us would kill to be where the Leafs are right now relative to the last 5 years of our franchise.

I'll gladly go on record to say I'll consider it a colossal waste of time, effort, talent and rebuilding years if we do what the leafs have done the last 5 years.

Wtf is the point of being at the top of the division if you can't make it over the hump. Playoff success - anything else is a rebuild bust.

 

[HSF]

edm taking one of chychrun gavrikov or ekholm iit seems

 

[DueDiligence]

Their core has 1 more year left. They have emptied the cupboards on a team with no playoff success. I'm honestly shocked that the organization continues to let Dubas man the ship. He's produced nothing. They've spent $90M+ on their roster 4 years in a row and are coming up on cap armageddon with Matthews and Nylander as pending UFAs at the end of next year. If they don't win a Cup this year, they'll have the most bleak outlook of any team in the league. How anyone can say they have a good general manager is honestly mystifying. Arguably one of the worst GMs in the league to have produced the results they've produced.

I agree considering the young core that Dubas inherited. Matthews, Marner, Nylander and Rielly were already on the team when he took over.

 

[Mingus Dew]

I'll gladly go on record to say I'll consider it a colossal waste of time, effort, talent and rebuilding years if we do what the leafs have done the last 5 years.

Wtf is the point of being at the top of the division if you can't make it over the hump. Playoff success - anything else is a rebuild bust.

What is the formula for playoff success then? What should they be doing that they are not doing or have not done? Does the McCabe trade add to or detract from their chances at making noise in the playoffs (which they are 100% going to make at this point)?

 

[Ice-Tray]

very concerning reading some Sens fans in here trying to praise Dubas and the leafs, in order to try and make our management look inept. Of all the teams to choose…

We need an intervention in here…

 

[Mingus Dew]

very concerning reading some Sens fans in here trying to praise Dubas and the leafs, in order to try and make our management look inept. Of all the teams to choose…

We need an intervention in here…

Sens fans have been unable to give the Leafs any credit for a long time. We are pretty insecure as a fanbase.

You can hate a team and still recognize that they are one of the better teams in the NHL. The whole "the Leafs actually suck" routine is just little brother syndrome.

 

[Senscore]

What is the formula for playoff success then? What should they be doing that they are not doing or have not done? Does the McCabe trade add to or detract from their chances at making noise in the playoffs (which they are 100% going to make at this point)?

The only real possibility is a massive blockbuster type deal that shakes things up.

But then that begs the questions, who is the one getting moved, and who could possibly be brought in?

Suddenly not so easy.

 

[HSF]

dont know how sens fans can not praise the mccabe move. It was really good.

2 mill for a top 4 for 2 more season. Our GM is still stuck on throwing 2nds away to fix his mistakes

 

[Relapsing]

What is the formula for playoff success then? What should they be doing that they are not doing or have not done? Does the McCabe trade add to or detract from their chances at making noise in the playoffs (which they are 100% going to make at this point)?

Bare minimum success = n+1 playoff series wins, every year.

Pretty simple equation.

If you dominate the leagues standings, you're a failure if you can't get past the first round. It would still be a failure if they can't make it to at least the ECF every one of those years, if less of one. And even less so if you're in the finals every year.

The only measure of success for a team in Toronto's position is to win the cup. That's it. Anything else is platitudes and good feelings.

Frankly, f*** that.

McCabe may make them better. Enough to win? Let's see how he plays with the team.

As for what they should or shouldnt have done? It all comes back to signing Tavares at the expense of being able to significantly pay for talent elsewhere. For me, it all goes back to that. But that's just my opinion.

 

[Do Make Say Think]

Sens fans have been unable to give the Leafs any credit for a long time. We are pretty insecure as a fanbase.

You can hate a team and still recognize that they are one of the better teams in the NHL. The whole "the Leafs actually suck" routine is just little brother syndrome.

It because they are so good that seeing them continously choke is so satisfying

 

[Mingus Dew]

The only real possibility is a massive blockbuster type deal that shakes things up.

But then that begs the questions, who is the one getting moved, and who could possibly be brought in?

Suddenly not so easy.

I guess but I don't see how they can just abandon that core and try something new.

The sheer odds of losing as many sudden death games as they have are probably pretty amazing. I can't imagine you blow it up based on that. They're not getting swept every year.

 

[NB613]

would give a 2x 2nds + D prospect (ie Thomson) for Fabbro

 

[Relapsing]

Sens fans have been unable to give the Leafs any credit for a long time. We are pretty insecure as a fanbase.

You can hate a team and still recognize that they are one of the better teams in the NHL. The whole "the Leafs actually suck" routine is just little brother syndrome.

Yes they are a better team. Theyre one of the best regular season teams in the league right now.

And it's still not enough.

Regular season success means Jack if you can't find success in the post season.

 

[HSF]

never knew this many people would get butt hurt by saying that Mccabe was a great move and that their GM is good

sheeesshh I would take Dubas here over Dorion any day of the weekkk

 

[Mingus Dew]

It because they are so good that seeing them continously choke is so satisfying

With this I agree wholeheartedly.

Bare minimum success = n+1 playoff series wins, every year.

Pretty simple equation.

If you dominate the leagues standings, you're a failure if you can't get past the first round. It would still be a failure if they can't make it to at least the ECF every one of those years, if less of one. And even less so if you're in the finals every year.

The only measure of success for a team in Toronto's position is to win the cup. That's it. Anything else is platitudes and good feelings.

Frankly, f*** that.

McCabe may make them better. Enough to win? Let's see how he plays with the team.

As for what they should or shouldnt have done? It all comes back to signing Tavares at the expense of being able to significantly pay for talent elsewhere. For me, it all goes back to that. But that's just my opinion.

I don't really agree with this especially in the context of how the Leafs have lost their playoff series.

The cup is the ultimate measure of success for any team but there is a sliding scale.

 

[JD1]

Well it would certainly be a bigger success than what we did the last 5 years, no?

I suppose that's a matter of perspective

One perspective could be that it appears we're well positioned coming out of a full blown rebuild so it seems we've been successful

Another perspective might be that Toronto has blown a cup window without even so much as winning a round which is a total failure

And yet another perspective might be that their record has been better than ours.

For me personally 99-07 was a fabulous time, but we ultimately failed.

And 18-22 has been a fabulous time to be a Leaf hater because I've thoroughly enjoyed watching them snatch defeat from the jaws of victory

 

[The Devilish Buffoon]

you do know they scratched Dumba for a few games last month cause he played poorly?

A playoff team looking to move one of their defensemen who we want to play with chabot in the top4 is concerning

Later that night, Darren Dreger revealed what happened with Dumba to miss the contest on Insider Trading on TSN:

“Well, it’s 100 per cent performance based, and the reality is Matt Dumba, as veteran defenceman for the Wild, hasn’t been good of late. And he was no good versus the Washington Capitals on Tuesday. So this is Dean Evason, the head coach – the latest head coach – to send the message to try and wake up a big name, big money player. We’ve seen it in Vancouver with Oliver Ekman-Larsson. We saw it in Philadelphia with John Tortorella and Kevin Hayes. So I don’t know if it’s trendsetting, but there’s more of a willingness to deliver that message. But there remains trade interest in Matt Dumba. He just has to get his game back on track.”​

Dumba has since been their top D and, apparently, will not be moved.