Speculation: Trade Rumor/Speculation Thread XXII: St Louis vs St Louis

[HFsNumber1Heel]

Trading a JT Miller for a St. Louis has worked so well for this franchise for like 45 years.

This whole anything can happen in the playoffs mentality, how often has that worked for the Rangers? 1986?

I can't name any time in Rangers history an older guy has single handedly put them over the hump.

1979 doesn't count because that team was just very good.

And do not trade Skeji. We've all seen how injuries can decimate a D core. Staal is now having back spasms, who says that isn't chronic? Having Skeji, Allen, and maybe even McLIrath if he amounts to anything (and I'm beginning to have my doubts) is essential for the long term health of this franchise.

 

[darko]

I would be so disappointed if they did that. That is giving away an awful lot of future that they've already invested a lot in for a player who could be here for less than two years.

I'd be filthy if they traded Miller/Skjei/McIlrath for MSL.

 

[aufheben]

It doesn't. Just a step closer.

Which would give Sather about 12 months, or until the next trade deadline, to put the rest of the puzzle together before MSL's contract is up. I would love to have St. Louis just for the fun of it, but I'm not sure it's a smart move.

 

[AHB*]

I don't like how people are so arrogant about their beliefs of this team like their opinion is the only one. I don't think the team is a contender, but it's quite arrogant to say "you're fooling yourself" if you do. Not everyone's opinion will be exact as yours. I personally think this team is more talented and play a style much more conducive to winning than that AMAZING 11-12 team.

It's a phrase. If you're getting up in arms over it, I don't know what to tell you. Would you be happier with "In my opinion, you're fooling yourself"....

I shouldn't have to put that in everywhere. It's a message board, it's obviously my opinion, you are clearly disagreeing, which you are completely entitled to do so.

Just because I'm firm in my post (because of my passion and the numerous times i've seen this teams management make mistakes) doesn't mean i'm trying to "run this board."

There's a difference, my post was fine. I re-read it three times. It was hardly offensive.

 

[LaffyTaffyNYR]

I'd trade Mcilrath for him in a heartbeat.. He does not impress me at all.

 

[RGY]

I'd trade Mcilrath for him in a heartbeat.. He does not impress me at all.

For who?

 

[HFsNumber1Heel]

I'd be filthy if they traded Miller/Skjei/McIlrath for MSL.

I'd honestly stop going to games. I went to less and less games during the early 2000s because I didn't support the product.

It's not going to happen though. Gordie Clark and Jeff Gorton would veto that nonsense.

 

[AHB*]

I'd trade Mcilrath for him in a heartbeat.. He does not impress me at all.

Based on what, his 3 NHL games?

Chris Pronger likely wouldn't have impressed you his first handful of years in the NHL either.

D-Men take longer to develop, we've been spoiled with young guys like McD stepping in at a young age and contributing immediately.

McIlrath who this team has put a ton of time and effort into developing, should not be traded for a player who is going to be half a century while McIlrath is in his prime.

 

[Hi ImHFNYR]

Wow, this isn't hypocritical at all.

Go aheqad and explain how it isn't misguided. Far as I know a hockey team is influenced more by the loss of two top 3 guys and 3 bottom 6ers plus a career ender to a top 4 Dman moreso than it would be influenced by two tweeners being replaced by a top 3 winger. But why use logic here on HF when we can attack people while presenting an opinion that deserves to be ridiculed.

 

[I Am Chariot]

I entirely disagree that St Louis would not make this team a contender. with the best goalie in the game, and a better offense, absolutely anything can happen in the playoffs.

People forget. This team is built around HENRIK LUNDQVIST. They have made that clear verbally and fiscally.

Get Lundqvist 3 goals and you are going to win the big games.

How many playoff games do they lose when they score 3 goals. Not many. Lots of 2-1 1-0 losses.

Team scores some goals, team has a excellent chance imo to go the distance.

St Louis is a more offensive skilled player and specifically he is a great playmaker. He's small, but slinky and sees the game like a playmaker.

Cally is awesome in the gritty heart n soul but can't be counted on as a playmaker. He will give you his all, but he will never have the skill of MSL. It's open for debate, but I think his kind of game is more easily replaced from within, the wire, the UFA summer then a skilled player like MSL

Infact we may already have a good Cally replacement in Hartford.

3 goals


Yea Nash.... but what would a playmaker like MSL do for Hags or Krieder

 

[AHB*]

Go aheqad and explain how it isn't misguided. Far as I know a hockey team is influenced more by the loss of two top 3 guys and 3 bottom 6ers plus a career ender to a top 4 Dman moreso than it would be influenced by two tweeners being replaced by a top 3 winger. But why use logic here on HF when we can attack people while presenting an opinion that deserves to be ridiculed.

The fact that you used our retention of Mike Rupp and Brian Boyle as maintaining our depth, is the reason I ignored that post.

On top of that, you rip on my post for being hypocritical and literally go and tear my opinion to shreds, as if you are of some higher power. Quite ironic.

 

[aufheben]

Go aheqad and explain how it isn't misguided. Far as I know a hockey team is influenced more by the loss of two top 3 guys and 3 bottom 6ers plus a career ender to a top 4 Dman moreso than it would be influenced by two tweeners being replaced by a top 3 winger. But why use logic here on HF when we can attack people while presenting an opinion that deserves to be ridiculed.

You agree that people are being arrogant about their opinions, and then you refer to other's opinions as "classically misguided" in like...the same sentence. And I'm not going to explain it, because we've already had this discussion at least once.

 

[Hi ImHFNYR]

The fact that you used our retention of Mike Rupp and Brian Boyle as maintaining our depth, is the reason I ignored that post.

On top of that, you rip on my post for being hypocritical and literally go and tear my opinion to shreds, as if you are of some higher power. Quite ironic.

Funny bc I'm pretty sure I listed a lot of names not just two. You ignored it bc it pissed you off. Similarly, you presenting that argument while simultaneously attacking people for being fools pissed me off. Call it what it is. Try and justify your opinion that the Nash team "gutted" the team though. Compare it to what we retained AND compare it to what we let go for reasons that had NOTHING to do with nash. In other words focus on the actual point I made using logic and intellect

 

[darko]

Based on what, his 3 NHL games?

Chris Pronger likely wouldn't have impressed you his first handful of years in the NHL either.

D-Men take longer to develop, we've been spoiled with young guys like McD stepping in at a young age and contributing immediately.

McIlrath who this team has put a ton of time and effort into developing, should not be traded for a player who is going to be half a century while McIlrath is in his prime.

This. Plus a few other young D-men around the league establishing themselves at the ages of 19-22. Most D-men do need time to develop.

 

[Hi ImHFNYR]

You agree that people are being arrogant about their opinions, and then you refer to other's opinions as "classically misguided" in like...the same sentence. And I'm not going to explain it, because we've already had this discussion at least once.

It's not hard to get. The guy being an ass pissed me off and I had a pissed off reaction. If he hadn't been an ass then I wouldn't have reacted to it. Old cranky pants McFart here needs to go to bed though (Me btw). And what people? Just him in that quote specifically bc it also happens to be one of the opinions I hate the most. To have it served up with a plate of aggressive irony and with me being cranky and tired I suppose I must have gone overboard

 

[Hunter Gathers]

The fact that you used our retention of Mike Rupp and Brian Boyle as maintaining our depth, is the reason I ignored that post.

On top of that, you rip on my post for being hypocritical and literally go and tear my opinion to shreds, as if you are of some higher power. Quite ironic.

Why wouldn't we retain Brian Boyle?

 

[stan the caddy]

Obviously the Nash trade hurt depth but where would the Rangers be without Nash right now? People forget that Gaborik's disappearance was the major problem with the team last year.

 

[BobMarleyNYR]

Which would give Sather about 12 months, or until the next trade deadline, to put the rest of the puzzle together before MSL's contract is up. I would love to have St. Louis just for the fun of it, but I'm not sure it's a smart move.

I can tell you now, it's not.

 

[AHB*]

Funny bc I'm pretty sure I listed a lot of names not just two. You ignored it bc it pissed you off. Similarly, you presenting that argument while simultaneously attacking people for being fools pissed me off. Call it what it is. Try and justify your opinion that the Nash team "gutted" the team though. Compare it to what we retained AND compare it to what we let go for reasons that had NOTHING to do with nash. In other words focus on the actual point I made using logic and intellect

Lol, I don't get pissed off from a message board. Maybe you do. I'm not attacking anyone, you're just upset with my tone, clearly mistaking passion for aggression.

Logic and intellect? Mike Rupp, Gaborik (who we flipped a mere months later, admitting the error), etc.

Did you watch that team without Dubi and Anisimov. How about letting Prust go. I'm not even saying that these were all necessarily mistakes and I agree that 11-12 team certainly played above their heads, but the move was made in a vacuum and it set this team back.

We had a good thing going and instead of building on it opted to let our ENTIRE bottom 6 go. Look at every good team, they have a deep and high end bottom 6.

We retained Boyle, that was it. Feds, Prust, Dubi, Anisimov. We ended up rolling out 4th lines with Bickel and Newbury and bunch of AHL scrubs because we let go of those "tweeners."

The foolish comment was a saying. One i'm sure you've heard before, if you take a second and calm down enough to think about it with a clear head.

And for what it's worth, I think this team was better off with Dubi, Gaborik and Anisimov then Nash, Brassard, Dorsett and Moore. Not that that makes any difference at this point. But yes, it gutted our team somewhat, that's pretty clear when Torts and others addressed the issues with our depth shortly thereafter.

This is my opinion. You're welcome to disagree, without attacking me.

 

[HFsNumber1Heel]

Would rather get younger players for Cally if he has to be traded, however, if it really is just MSL for Cally, in theory Fast and Miller who are playing together in Hartford hopefully come up for the stretch run or next year to replace the grit and hustle.

By the way, not that he was ready, but I still think they should have given Lindberg a look during the Boston series as he was in North America, and J. Jokinnen should have been picked up off waivers.

 

[I Am Chariot]

And for what it's worth, I think this team was better off with Dubi, Gaborik and Anisimov then Nash, Brassard, Dorsett and Moore.

Not on the road to the cup. Dubi may even be out scoring NASH at the moment but ultimately this teams road to a "potential" cup is more likely with Rick Nash than Dubi.

Still need to tweak

 

[Punxrocknyc19*]

Would rather get younger players for Cally if he has to be traded, however, if it really is just MSL for Cally, in theory Fast and Miller who are playing together in Hartford hopefully come up for the stretch run or next year to replace the grit and hustle.

By the way, not that he was ready, but I still think they should have given Lindberg a look during the Boston series as he was in North America, and J. Jokinnen should have been picked up off waivers.

i hope Lindberg gets called up before Boyle is traded... Lindberg is awesome on the faceoff circle.. Rangers are not a great faceoff team...

 

[AHB*]

Not on the road to the cup. Dubi may even be out scoring NASH at the moment but ultimately this teams road to a "potential" cup is more likely with Rick Nash than Dubi.

Still need to tweak

Personally, I don't think a team with Rick Nash as your premier offensive player gets you near a cup.

But Dubi and Nash aren't comparables. They play completely different roles. It's who we'd have in Nash's spot, if he were not here, that is the question.

Honestly, it's all moot. This isn't a topic i wanted to discuss. I made a quick statement about this team being "gutted" and it blew up into something i didn't intend it to be.

My point the entire time is that I don't think you trade away more, young depth in Miller, Fast, McIlrath, etc for an aging vet, when we just did that for Nash.

We need to build around what is here. There are some good pieces, for sure. Partially gutting this team again for a guy like MSL isn't how a team is built.

 

[Leetch3]

Obviously the Nash trade hurt depth but where would the Rangers be without Nash right now? People forget that Gaborik's disappearance was the major problem with the team last year.

but we seem to be stuck in a never ending cycle...

team stinks cause we don't have another top end scorer...trade depth for nash

team stinks cause we have no depth...trade gaborik for depth

team stinks cause we need another scorer...trade depth for st louis

you can't just keep flip flopping between the 2 extremes cause neither works

 

[stan the caddy]

but we seem to be stuck in a never ending cycle...

team stinks cause we don't have another top end scorer...trade depth for nash

team stinks cause we have no depth...trade gaborik for depth

team stinks cause we need another scorer...trade depth for st louis

you can't just keep flip flopping between the 2 extremes cause neither works

A major reason why the team stunk was because Gaborik's play completely fell off a cliff.

If they hadn't traded for Nash we'd be sitting here talking about MZA being our best offensive player.