HF Habs: Trade Proposal Thread #92: Waiting on the Draft edition

[Lafleurs Guy]

Wasn’t encouraging to hear Hughes said he didn’t had the munition to get a top 6 center for the futur today. Guess what, we won’t have more ammunition this summer lol

Hughes takes the L today. Statut quo is bad. Refusing to trade Armia for a second because you said so to suzuki, it’s sad. Either sell or buy a little at least to help them.

Hughes will have to get better pretty quickly at hockey trades. Trading a player for pick or negociating a contract, he’s good. But hockey trades? He takes the L pretty often since he’s here.

I don't know. We're on the bubble for a playoff spot. Suzuki and co. have been nagging the GM to get better and he said 'prove it.' Now we're on a nice little streak.

The way I look at it, those are rental players. No we didn't get a return but there's at least a shot at the playoffs and the guys finally get to play some meaningful games down the stretch. I'm fine with us doing nothing here.

In the offseason... we need a center for sure. That's now priority number one. RD is another one but I think RB coming will help take some pressure off there. Matheson should go... lots of stuff we could see.

 

[EveryDay]

Sign Sam Bennett this summer and trade for Pastrnak if available.

Dach + 2x 1st + Hage + Laine(cap)

Pastrnak-Suzuki-Slafkovski
Caufield-Bennett-Demidov

 

[Deebs]

I don't know. We're on the bubble for a playoff spot. Suzuki and co. have been nagging the GM to get better and he said 'prove it.' Now we're on a nice little streak.

The way I look at it, those are rental players. No we didn't get a return but there's at least a shot at the playoffs and the guys finally get to play some meaningful games down the stretch. I'm fine with us doing nothing here.

In the offseason... we need a center for sure. That's now priority number one. RD is another one but I think RB coming will help take some pressure off there. Matheson should go... lots of stuff we could see.

Absolutely agree that #2C is the priority this summer. Strength down the middle is a must

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

Absolutely agree that #2C is the priority this summer. Strength down the middle is a must

I've said this before and I'll say it again. I'd rather we look for a number one. Not to replace Suzuki - who has proven himself a no one - but to augment the lineup. When you've got two number ones you're a serious contender.

Now.... how the hell we do that I don't know. I love the idea of Crosby but that might be a nonstarter. If Demidov could slot in there that would be ideal. Beyond that the market for centers isn't great.

 

[Deebs]

I've said this before and I'll say it again. I'd rather we look for a number one. Not to replace Suzuki - who has proven himself a no one - but to augment the lineup. When you've got two number ones you're a serious contender.

Now.... how the hell we do that I don't know. I love the idea of Crosby but that might be a nonstarter. If Demidov could slot in there that would be ideal. Beyond that the market for centers isn't great.

Extremely unlikely a team is giving up their top Center, but ya never know. I'm more than ok to find a complimentary piece to Suzuki given the type of player he is. A lot more options for us.

Demidov isn't a Center and he's said so himself. Crosby....meh, can't see that happening but again, stranger things have happened.

 

[General Fanager]

I don’t know what you expect in return of Mailloux + a first but you wont have mason mctavish.

Mailloux and a first isn’t that much of a price. If we all have our reserve with Mailloux’s play, i think 31 other teams sees the same thing.

Well first of all the post you quoted said Beck, Mailloux+ and yes to me that's far too much to pay right now. They are not in a position to make a real run so there is no need to make a move like this. We also don't know what Beck and Mailloux can become because they are so young.

Next year or the year after would be a different story but for now there is no rush to pay the high prices.

 

[jellybeans]

Well first of all the post you quoted said Beck, Mailloux+ and yes to me that's far too much to pay right now. They are not in a position to make a real run so there is no need to make a move like this. We also don't know what Beck and Mailloux can become because they are so young.

Next year or the year after would be a different story but for now there is no rush to pay the high prices.

You guy are arguing with a couple fafan's that have no clue how a rebuild is done they cannot see the big picture of it they only live the moment they want everything right away.

 

[HabsCode]

Get high picks is the way for rebuilding team.

And how did you expect to get those high pick? Armia? Savard? Dvorak? You would have gotten mid to late pick just to make the team weaker not stronger.

At this point, I don’t want to see this team get weaker, I want them to get stronger.

Call me crazy, but I would resign Armia for a 4th line role, and make sure I can get Savard and Dvorak remplacement before letting them leave (could be internal but be sure to assess well before).

Demidov is your big add next year. Then maybe look at getting C help on the top 6 if a deal is there, or a RD. But the focus should be to build on top, not keep destroying like the past seasons.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

Extremely unlikely a team is giving up their top Center, but ya never know. I'm more than ok to find a complimentary piece to Suzuki given the type of player he is. A lot more options for us.

Demidov isn't a Center and he's said so himself. Crosby....meh, can't see that happening but again, stranger things have happened.

Demidov: "I am perfectly comfortable playing center or wing."

 

[Scriptor]

Demidov: "I am perfectly comfortable playing center or wing."

The only thing he said, assessing himself at C is that he hasn't taken many F/Os in years and doesn't consider himself on top of that aspect of the game if he is asked to play Center.

I have the feeling that Demidov acts as a C from the wing as far as puck distribution goes, so, other than working on F/Os, I'm not really concerned if he plays as the line's pivot. He's all over the place on the ice, has great hockey IQ and vision out there, plus his anticipation is rock solid.

Better to find a regular C than try to convert Demidov to C early on in his NHL career, though.

The point is to make him as comfortable as possible as he settles into the NHL so he can keep building his confidence in a new league at the pro level.

 

[Grate n Colorful Oz]

The only thing he said, assessing himself at C is that he hasn't taken many F/Os in years and doesn't consider himself on top of that aspect of the game if he is asked to play Center.

I have the feeling that Demidov acts as a C from the wing as far as puck distribution goes, so, other than working on F/Os, I'm not really concerned if he plays as the line's pivot. He's all over the place on the ice, has great hockey IQ and vision out there, plus his anticipation is rock solid.

Better to find a regular C than try to convert Demidov to C early on in his NHL career, though.

The point is to make him as comfortable as possible as he settles into the NHL so he can keep building his confidence in a new league at the pro level.

I'd still try him for a short stint at center early, just to see how he does.

 

[McGuires Corndog]

This summer I believe we should try for Bennett as a UFA or trade for Pavel Zacha as a stop-gap until Hage is ready.

I’d also consider going after Ehlers this summer for additional scoring depth.

 

[Anardil]

That’s an outlier for a team in a non-destination market. Would Rantanen have agreed to the same deal with Montreal?

We do have great player-friendly management that may be a convincing safety net if only we could at least get elite players to be on the fence about the city. Will that be enough?

Until a Rantanen level UFA signs here, I will never believe that free agency is a viable option for team building for the Habs.

This organization has to hit practically every early pick and not lose any important trades to compete with most of the NHL.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

The only thing he said, assessing himself at C is that he hasn't taken many F/Os in years and doesn't consider himself on top of that aspect of the game if he is asked to play Center.

I have the feeling that Demidov acts as a C from the wing as far as puck distribution goes, so, other than working on F/Os, I'm not really concerned if he plays as the line's pivot. He's all over the place on the ice, has great hockey IQ and vision out there, plus his anticipation is rock solid.

Better to find a regular C than try to convert Demidov to C early on in his NHL career, though.

The point is to make him as comfortable as possible as he settles into the NHL so he can keep building his confidence in a new league at the pro level.

If he can play center, our chances at winning a cup go up exponentially.

I’m not suggesting we force anything. But I have zero problem with us experimenting with this guy. Imagine if he is as good as we hope. Imagine him and Suzuki centering two differs lines… It’s a lot easier to find an extra winger than a center.

 

[Skip Bayless]

This summer I believe we should try for Bennett as a UFA or trade for Pavel Zacha as a stop-gap until Hage is ready.

I’d also consider going after Ehlers this summer for additional scoring depth.

I like Bennett, but I doubt he would wanna go from tax haven in Florida to communist Quebec. Unless we overpay the shit out of him. And that's not something I think we should entertain for a player of his calibre.

The trade avenue is more interesting, and some opportunities we don't see right now will open up to acquire that C.

Zacha is a good C too, but I think we can do better. Would be a plan B or C.

 

[CHfan1]

Until a Rantanen level UFA signs here, I will never believe that free agency is a viable option for team building for the Habs.

This organization has to hit practically every early pick and not lose any important trades to compete with most of the NHL.

How often does Rantanen level players actually hit free agency on July 1st? It’s very few. With the ability for teams and players to sign extensions one year prior to free agency (and ensure guaranteed contracts) most top level players never actually make it to free agency.

Then a lot of deals on July 1st turn out to be the wrong move in the long run. Look at Nashville last offseason. A lot of people were calling them the winners of the offseason and look where they are now.

 

[Deebs]

The only thing he said, assessing himself at C is that he hasn't taken many F/Os in years and doesn't consider himself on top of that aspect of the game if he is asked to play Center.

I have the feeling that Demidov acts as a C from the wing as far as puck distribution goes, so, other than working on F/Os, I'm not really concerned if he plays as the line's pivot. He's all over the place on the ice, has great hockey IQ and vision out there, plus his anticipation is rock solid.

Better to find a regular C than try to convert Demidov to C early on in his NHL career, though.

The point is to make him as comfortable as possible as he settles into the NHL so he can keep building his confidence in a new league at the pro level.

Exactly. He controls the line from the wing ala Kucherov. He's not a Center by posiion

 

[DAChampion]

I'm going to go against the grain.

Though 2C is the top priority, Hughes should not force an acquisition. If he does he may end up making a bad one. It is better to stand pat than to force an acquisition.

Part of that is I remember Gainey going absolutely insane obsessively trying to get a 1C in the 2008-09 period. He went out and randomly acquired center prospects Johanson and Engvist. He drafted only centers in the 2009 draft. He went aggressively after Danny Briere and Brad Richards on the trade market offering contracts that would not have worked out, and he aggressively pursued trades for Lecavalier, Sundin, Gomez. Only one of those pursued options (achieved or not) would have been worth it, Mats Sundin, and that was declined. Team would have been better off not even considering the issue.

In my opinion it would be better off to run the bottom nine by committee (Dach, Newhook, Evans, Beck, Kappanen) than to overpay for a 2C. It should be fine to draft BPA with the 13th and 19th picks (or whatever), and that has to be considered as an option.

 

[JianYang]

Taxes are a huge problem. Generally guys that hit the market go for the most money.

There's more to it. New York is the most expensive place in the league yet it has always been the general destination of choice through good and bad.

 

[DAChampion]

There's more to it. New York is the most expensive place in the league yet it has always been the general destination of choice through good and bad.

I assume that a lot of the wives like the idea of New York.

 

[ReimanSum1908]

If he can play center, our chances at winning a cup go up exponentially.

I’m not suggesting we force anything. But I have zero problem with us experimenting with this guy. Imagine if he is as good as we hope. Imagine him and Suzuki centering two differs lines… It’s a lot easier to find an extra winger than a center.

Although it has no actual bearing on Demidov, who almost certainly has a greater chance to succeed given his talent level and greater defensive acumen, the experimental attempts to convert skilled wingers into sub-optimal centers over the last decade - see Domi and Drouin - has left me leery and dubious about the attempt

 

[SpeedyPotato]

This summer will be fun. There’s a difference between choosing to abstain because the only possible actions aren’t part of the plan vs being unwilling to act. To me that’s the difference between this management and the previous. They had their targets for this trade deadline but as Hughes said, the teams they talked to weren’t willing to move the players the habs wanted at this time but are open to talks this summer.

The habs just aren’t in a place where they absolutely need to make a move, they shouldn’t settle for a plan C or D right now. More options are gonna come at the draft and if they are to commit assets to get what they want, might as well be while they have the whole buffet in front of them.

 

[TomKosto]

There's more to it. New York is the most expensive place in the league yet it has always been the general destination of choice through good and bad.

Well It's New York, It's the biggest market in the NHL, there's a cachet to it. People want to play there in pretty much every sports, except the Giants maybe lol. Taxes are still lower than Canada and I have a feeling you can get a lot of money from publicity there. Getting a winning culture in Mtl will help, that's for sure, but taxes are a big disadvantage, always been.

 

[Sorinth]

I'm going to go against the grain.

Though 2C is the top priority, Hughes should not force an acquisition. If he does he may end up making a bad one. It is better to stand pat than to force an acquisition.

Part of that is I remember Gainey going absolutely insane obsessively trying to get a 1C in the 2008-09 period. He went out and randomly acquired center prospects Johanson and Engvist. He drafted only centers in the 2009 draft. He went aggressively after Danny Briere and Brad Richards on the trade market offering contracts that would not have worked out, and he aggressively pursued trades for Lecavalier, Sundin, Gomez. Only one of those pursued options (achieved or not) would have been worth it, Mats Sundin, and that was declined. Team would have been better off not even considering the issue.

In my opinion it would be better off to run the bottom nine by committee (Dach, Newhook, Evans, Beck, Kappanen) than to overpay for a 2C. It should be fine to draft BPA with the 13th and 19th picks (or whatever), and that has to be considered as an option.

It's also worth noting that if Demidov is all he's cracked up to be, and Laine gets a little better/healthier then the 2nd line will be productive even if it has a weak center. It would also almost certainly be a sheltered line in part to ease Demidov into the NHL, which again makes having a weak link like a weak C less of a problem. Teams rarely have 6 players who are all great top-6 players, teams often have one or two that are pretty so-so.

This year we are 14th in GF/G, we aren't really losing anyone offensively and are adding Demidov + whatever internal growth we get. So we are looking to be at a decent spot offensively even if we give Dach another chance. The issue we have is that we are 26th in GA/G, and we are likely losing a number of our main defensive players, now there's an argument we already lost them to age/decline, but even so cutting down on the goals against is the most important thing we could do to see immediate results. We likely have Reinbacher as the addition, but it's both questionable what his ultimate upside will be and even in the best of cases will likely take time to reach. And I suppose Beck/Kapanen as the Dvorak replacement, which sure they have much higher potential but will likely take time to reach.

I'd say getting a quality RD is probably the #1 need.

 

[Grate n Colorful Oz]

Well It's New York, It's the biggest market in the NHL, there's a cachet to it. People want to play there in pretty much every sports, except the Giants maybe lol. Taxes are still lower than Canada and I have a feeling you can get a lot of money from publicity there. Getting a winning culture in Mtl will help, that's for sure, but taxes are a big disadvantage, always been.

Max NY state income tax is 10%, add that to the fed, you get to 47-48%, which isn't far off from what you get in Montreal.