HF Habs: Trade Proposal Thread #88: 2024-25 Season

[TheBuriedHab]

So what was his excuse for the 38 points in 58 games? Injuries prevented him from having over double the production that year?

Well you don't care about his injuries because you are deliberately choosing to ignore context. "Dach hasn't been a 70-90 point center because of injuries" yet "EP has 1 goal in 13 playoff games even if he was injured during that time". Odd how you didn't bring up his 18 points in 17 playoff games.

I'm going to refrain from participating in this conversation given how you only use the injury reason for Dach and cherry pick sample sizes to try and spin it off as Dach>Pettersson when the enormous sample sizes say otherwise.

You understand 38 points in 58 games is on pace for 53 points right? As a 20/21 year old? Why would I need to make an excuse for that lol??? That is good.

Brother you are putting some crazy words in my mouth. I never said Dach would have already been a 70 point player. I said that's what I see for him in his future. In terms of his style of play, of being physical and heavy on the cycle, yes we haven't seen that in long stretches because he get's injured.

You are making some crazy assumptions for...... reasons????

Yeah EP's soft, everyone knows it, it's not some wild revelation or anything to get emotional about.

 

[ReHabs]

Yeah lets trade Dach who was brought in to compliment our smaller skilled guys for a soft skilled player because he can score like 10 more points than Suzuki. Genius stuff.

10 more points than Suzuki is a massive, massive player. Dach does have physical gifts with his range but he's nowhere close to Pettersson as a talent and, frankly, it's not even a comparison between the two.

With EP40 I'm afraid of his speed and his cap hit. Canucks fans say he's lost his speed and that really pulls him down from PPG++ to whatever he is. His caphit is crazy too but that should only work to bring his acquisition price down.

Dach + Evans + Mailloux + XX as the base package for EP40 + YY is very interesting to me.

 

[sampollock]

Not for me - I ignored it. There's some threads, Slaf, Dach, Reinbacher that just don't deserve attention.

A bunch of people overreacting, trauma dumping and shitting on good kids.

smart
wish they would go there and post on each of these guys instead of here

 

[Habs Halifax]

I don't see any way Dach becomes a 70-90 point guy unless Montreal sub-optimally uses its PP1.

And all that is probably the only reason he's available in the first place. Montreal has almost never had good center depth and P/GP players in the last 30 years. Pettersson is a 26 year old two way center who has hit the century point mark and who was a P/GP in his first playoff run (2020). Dach hasn't hit 40 points and is two and half years younger.

I don't think there's a real way Montreal could swing a Pettersson deal without including a player they don't want to/shouldn't move (Suzuki, Demidov, etc.), but losing Dach shouldn't be a factor for them not making an offer.

Dach to me ends up around 60+ pts (in his prime). My problem is the time it takes for him to reach it. It's probably age 25+.

I will say it's a contract year for Dach next season so that usually means a better season. There is also Demidov who will be injected so our first two lines will be stacked and we probably will run two PP units equally.

The road is facilitated for Dach to have a good 2nd half and a great full season next year... a contract year for him. Of course we should still try to upgrade but if we can't, I do think we are still in good shape with Dach. Just can't have any more big injuries.

 

[Habnot]

Let's act like 11.6m for the next 7 years is great for EP.

 

[WeThreeKings]

remember when it was criminal we didn't sign this dude?

 

[Sterling Archer]

Sprong on waivers.

 

[yianik]

I'm thinking there is nothing there for us between EP and JT. JT is 31 and obviously an outspoken leader kind of guy and I could see our team chemistry going to hell with someone like him being added. EP would cost us Suzuki and it's a non starter for me.

No question, Hughes, like all competent General Managers, is always looking to improve the team. But over the long years that I have followed hockey and the repeated times that I witnessed efforts to rebuild, reconstitute and re-position my favorite team, I have come to embrace the old adage that the best deals are usually the ones that you don't enter into.

I remember a game us fans would engage in during/ after the Houle era. We would look at the team Houle inherited ( and add in the best of our draft picks during his time ) and compare it to the team on the ice. The inherited team plus picks was far superior to the on ice product. So if Houle only showed up for the draft each year and disappeared the rest of the year, we would have a much better team.

As the Hypocratic Oath goes" first, do no harm ".

 

[The Great Weal]

10 more points than Suzuki is a massive, massive player. Dach does have physical gifts with his range but he's nowhere close to Pettersson as a talent and, frankly, it's not even a comparison between the two.

It's like saying you'd prefer PLD over Jack Hughes because PLD is bigger and more physical. Great, Dach is more physical when he's not injured and is on one of his consistent stretches. How does that trump Pettersson doubling his production? The answer is that it doesn't.

Pretending that Petterson is some pushover scrub when he had a better playoff appearance at 20 years old than Dach will ever likely have is also a really bad take.

I find it hard to believe that Pettersson all of a sudden stinks now but there has definitely been a drastic drop in his play since signing that extension. He would make an incredible top 6 C with Suzuki. There's no way the Canucks trade him for an Eichel-like package however.

 

[Vachon23]

Let's act like 11.6m for the next 7 years is great for EP.

I have no problem with EP from the last 2 years at 11,6m, that’s the price for that type of player

 

[Leon Lucius Black]

Sprong on waivers.

Dude gets passed around more than Joy Taylor at Fox Sports.

 

[Runner77]

remember when it was criminal we didn't sign this dude?

Sprong springs before spring has even sprung.

 

[FLHabs]

My armchair GM plan for the rest of the year/TDL and going on to the next few years would be this:

- Trade Dvo at the deadline, call up Condotta to end the year as 4th line center between Andy and Gally. Of course, the obvious call up to replace Dvo would be Beck, but I'd keep him in Laval to help their playoff push. Condotta looked really good during his last call up, I think he could handle 4th line duties. Keeping Dvo after the TDL is not the end of the world, but, imo, getting some assets for him is the best case scenario.

- Trade Savard at the TDL and pick up a younger bottom pairing RD UFA that can fill his role. I like Savard, but he's just too slow at this point in his career. Again, also keeping him wouldn't be the end of the world, but I'd much rather have a guy that has better mobility on that bottom pairing.

- Keep Armia and Evans for the playoff push, I think that's the best decision. Sign Evans in the summer and probably let Armia walk. Armia's player profile will be hard to replace, but he'll probably get overpaid as a UFA, especially if he plays this way all the way through the end of the season and also has an effective role on the world stage during the 4 nations cup.

- If Evans asks for too much and you got to let him walk, which would suck, then hopefully Beck would be ready to take his spot. With Demidov probably starting next season on the 2nd line, Newhook could also be able to fill that 3rd line center role. Best case scenario, if Evans is gone, would be Beck as 3c and Newhook taking Armia's spot. There's also Kapanen that would be in the mix for a bottom 6 role.

- Next year, Mailloux and Reinbacher will fight for Savard's spot. The loser will have to wait one more year until Matheson is off the books after the 25-26 season.

- Keep Hage and Fowler in the NCAA next year, and both get one year of AHL after that. Or give them both or 1 of them 2 years in the AHL. In 27-28 they'll both replace Newhook and Montembault whose contracts will expire at the end of the 26-27 season.

- When Andy and Gally's contracts expire after the 26-27 season (if they're not dealt before then), Xhekaj and Tuch are in waiting for their spots on the 4th line.

- Hopefully Laine is re-signed long term and becomes part of the core.

Imo, unless they go on a miracle run in the next few years, 27-28 is the year the cup window opens. Suzuki, Caufield, Dach, Guhle, Laine, etc will be right at the peak of their prime while Slaf, Hutson, etc will be entering theirs.

I'm not too big on predicting future rosters because so much can happen from now till then, but, if things go as planned, the line up in 27-28 should be looking something like this:

Slaf - Suzuki - Caufield
Laine - Dach - Demidov
Heineman - Beck - Hage
Xhekaj - Evans/Kapanen - Tuch

Hutson - Reinbacher
Guhle - Carrier/Mailloux/???
Xhekaj - Mailloux/Carrier/???

Dobes
Fowler

The big question marks in term of roster would be whether Dach is extended and remains in the team's future plans, if Laine is also extended, the composition of the 4th line as a whole, can Reinbacher be a top pairing D, and the RD situation as a whole. So yea, lots of question marks, but if things go as they should, imo, that looks like a group that can contend.

 

[JustAHabFan]

It's like saying you'd prefer PLD over Jack Hughes because PLD is bigger and more physical. Great, Dach is more physical when he's not injured and is on one of his consistent stretches. How does that trump Pettersson doubling his production? The answer is that it doesn't.

Pretending that Petterson is some pushover scrub when he had a better playoff appearance at 20 years old than Dach will ever likely have is also a really bad take.

I find it hard to believe that Pettersson all of a sudden stinks now but there has definitely been a drastic drop in his play since signing that extension. He would make an incredible top 6 C with Suzuki. There's no way the Canucks trade him for an Eichel-like package however.

Canucks fans have reported Peterson has lost some speed and he doesn't have the same shot as before. I have watched quite a few Canucks games because JT Miller was in my hockey pool and I can tell you Petterson was not the same player as before. It will be a big mistake to give players and draft pick for Petterson. He looked to be damaged good to me.

 

[junyab]

In no world does Dach (as a centerpiece) get you EP40.

I'd like to see what kind of offers Buffalo's receiving for Cozens. I love that kid, and I can see him turn things around in MTL.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Let's act like 11.6m for the next 7 years is great for EP.

Not ideal for sure but he is a legit talent who produces pt/game. It depends on the cost to acquire

 

[Habs Halifax]

In no world does Dach (as a centerpiece) get you EP40.

I'd like to see what kind of offers Buffalo's receiving for Cozens. I love that kid, and I can see him turn things around in MTL.

I bet you Dach and Cozens have similar numbers in the next 5-8 years. I bet you think Cozens is far better than Dach because he has more points up to this point. In case you didn't notice... Cozens is at 0.58 pts/game and Dach is at 0.45 pts/game with injury derails. Bookmark this... Dach will be just as good or better than Cozens when we look back in 5-8 years.

I understand how low you are with Dach and think that him being a centerpiece for EP40 is a reach but at the same time, you are lowering Dach's value in attempts to prove your point which is also a reach. Fair is fair

Dach and lets say the 12th pick (who knows) would be two center pieces (not just Dach). Are you really going to ignore the 12th OA pick (+/-) because you have focus at devaluing Dach? Come on man... that 12th OA pick could be another Hage and Petterson was drafted 9th which is not far off from the 12th pick.

 

[JeffreyLFC]

Dach/Matheson/1st is total crap for E.P.

They'd ask for at least one of Reinbacher / Hage / Demidov to be included, maybe even Slaf. And I'm not paying that.

Slaf 1 for 1, I say yes in an instant.
I would even consider adding Matheson.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Canucks fans have reported Peterson has lost some speed and he doesn't have the same shot as before. I have watched quite a few Canucks games because JT Miller was in my hockey pool and I can tell you Petterson was not the same player as before. It will be a big mistake to give players and draft pick for Petterson. He looked to be damaged good to me.

Tricky projection to talk about. Could be true or way off. Similar concerns was said about Eichel.

To trade for Petterson or not to trade for Pettersson depends on cost to acquire and how we feel he will perform. I doubt he is damaged goods at age 26... just my opinion.

We have to consider that Canucks fans can get just as frustrated with a player like we do. I'm not buying that EP40 is damaged goods one bit. I think it's due to a high cap hit and being soft in the playoffs.

 

[The Great Weal]

Canucks fans have reported Peterson has lost some speed and he doesn't have the same shot as before. I have watched quite a few Canucks games because JT Miller was in my hockey pool and I can tell you Petterson was not the same player as before. It will be a big mistake to give players and draft pick for Petterson. He looked to be damaged good to me.

Yes he's definitely not the same player since he signed his extension. He was also injured however and I still wouldn't put it past him to rebound. He's way too smart, skilled, and fast for me to throw in the towel. If you can get him with the likes of Dach/Newhook/Habs 1st/Flames 1st then it's worth pursuing, but the Canucks (rightfully) will want guys like Demidov/Suzuki.

His contract stinks, but we have the room and with the cap going up I don't see it being a problem for us unless he's permanently a 60-70 point forward.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Slaf 1 for 1, I say yes in an instant.
I would even consider adding Matheson.

Won't work even if the value is there. Canucks need to get a center in return. They clearly want to stay competitive with the time they have Hughes and would like him to stay so he's only staying if they are competitive.

Canucks needs are both Center and on D. They are likely looking for both in return and when you look at their center depth, it's much worse than their depth on D.

 

[JeffreyLFC]

We missed the boat on Eichel, if Pettersson is available we have to consider getting him. Perfect age, make us contender as soon as next season. Hardest position to fill in Hockey is #1 center and #1 RD. People also had their 'doubts' about overpaying for Eichel at the time and look how he has been for Vegas.

 

[JustAHabFan]

Yes he's definitely not the same player since he signed his extension. He was also injured however and I still wouldn't put it past him to rebound. He's way too smart, skilled, and fast for me to throw in the towel. If you can get him with the likes of Dach/Newhook/Habs 1st/Flames 1st then it's worth pursuing, but the Canucks (rightfully) will want guys like Demidov/Suzuki.

His contract stinks, but we have the room and with the cap going up I don't see it being a problem for us unless he's permanently a 60-70 point forward.

Forget about Demidov. Right now, I am not sure Peterson is a better player than Suzuki. Something about Peterson's demeanor that I don't like. He kind of sulking when thing is not going well in the ice.

 

[Kimota]

My armchair GM plan for the rest of the year/TDL and going on to the next few years would be this:

- Trade Dvo at the deadline, call up Condotta to end the year as 4th line center between Andy and Gally. Of course, the obvious call up to replace Dvo would be Beck, but I'd keep him in Laval to help their playoff push. Condotta looked really good during his last call up, I think he could handle 4th line duties. Keeping Dvo after the TDL is not the end of the world, but, imo, getting some assets for him is the best case scenario.

- Trade Savard at the TDL and pick up a younger bottom pairing RD UFA that can fill his role. I like Savard, but he's just too slow at this point in his career. Again, also keeping him wouldn't be the end of the world, but I'd much rather have a guy that has better mobility on that bottom pairing.

- Keep Armia and Evans for the playoff push, I think that's the best decision. Sign Evans in the summer and probably let Armia walk. Armia's player profile will be hard to replace, but he'll probably get overpaid as a UFA, especially if he plays this way all the way through the end of the season and also has an effective role on the world stage during the 4 nations cup.

- If Evans asks for too much and you got to let him walk, which would suck, then hopefully Beck would be ready to take his spot. With Demidov probably starting next season on the 2nd line, Newhook could also be able to fill that 3rd line center role. Best case scenario, if Evans is gone, would be Beck as 3c and Newhook taking Armia's spot. There's also Kapanen that would be in the mix for a bottom 6 role.

- Next year, Mailloux and Reinbacher will fight for Savard's spot. The loser will have to wait one more year until Matheson is off the books after the 25-26 season.

- Keep Hage and Fowler in the NCAA next year, and both get one year of AHL after that. Or give them both or 1 of them 2 years in the AHL. In 27-28 they'll both replace Newhook and Montembault whose contracts will expire at the end of the 26-27 season.

- When Andy and Gally's contracts expire after the 26-27 season (if they're not dealt before then), Xhekaj and Tuch are in waiting for their spots on the 4th line.

- Hopefully Laine is re-signed long term and becomes part of the core.

Imo, unless they go on a miracle run in the next few years, 27-28 is the year the cup window opens. Suzuki, Caufield, Dach, Guhle, Laine, etc will be right at the peak of their prime while Slaf, Hutson, etc will be entering theirs.

I'm not too big on predicting future rosters because so much can happen from now till then, but, if things go as planned, the line up in 27-28 should be looking something like this:

Slaf - Suzuki - Caufield
Laine - Dach - Demidov
Heineman - Beck - Hage
Xhekaj - Evans/Kapanen - Tuch

Hutson - Reinbacher
Guhle - Carrier/Mailloux/???
Xhekaj - Mailloux/Carrier/???

Dobes
Fowler

The big question marks in term of roster would be whether Dach is extended and remains in the team's future plans, if Laine is also extended, the composition of the 4th line as a whole, can Reinbacher be a top pairing D, and the RD situation as a whole. So yea, lots of question marks, but if things go as they should, imo, that looks like a group that can contend.

I say we trade Evans + Reinbacher for JT Miller. Dach has skills but he's simply not a center to me. JT Miller a gamer would fill the number two center spot perfectly. Also you forgot to mention what you would do with Newhook. If you trade Evans, Newhook could slide into a third center position.

 

[Guy Larose]

I say we trade Evans + Reinbacher for JT Miller. Dach has skills but he's simply not a center to me. JT Miller a gamer would fill the number two center spot perfectly. Also you forgot to mention what you would do with Newhook. If you trade Evans, Newhook could slide into a third center position.

Miller would f*** up the chemistry and the room with his yelling at players all the time.