HF Habs: Trade Proposal Thread #87: 2024 Season Finale

[CHarlie]

Whats the price for Zegras without giving up our first.....If we could aquire him before the draft that would give us more options if that top D is still available?

 

[BLONG7]

I don't see it absolute like this. I see many NHL Players who are late to the maturity and have very good age 25-30 prime years. KK maybe one of them.



Yes, the bold part is why we might be interested. Necas's trade value is lowered with KK in the package and then you wonder what kind of age 25+ years KK has. It could turn out very well depending on what we give.

Jets 1st, Kapanen, and Barron
for
Necas and KK

KK and Beck can be the bottom 2C's behind Dach and Suzuki. KK is 23 and soon to be 24. I bet you he has a much better prime (age 25-30) than what most can see today based on his current struggles with Brindamour.

If the cost is higher than what I posted above in bold, I pass.

This is a very interesting angle..................kinda like it, and then part of me says, let KK stay in Carolina with the big ego owner. Let them buy him out, and look at him at that point?

Their cap and miserable looking defense says they can't keep Necas, Geuntael and Jarivs.....and then somehow rebuild the D with some solid guys....and, they still don't seem to have a real goalie who can WIN in the playoffs.
Looks good on them,..............................they do however have their coaches all locked up!!

 

[Habs Halifax]

This is a very interesting angle..................kinda like it, and then part of me says, let KK stay in Carolina with the big ego owner. Let them buy him out, and look at him at that point?

Their cap and miserable looking defense says they can't keep Necas, Geuntael and Jarivs.....and then somehow rebuild the D with some solid guys....and, they still don't seem to have a real goalie who can WIN in the playoffs.
Looks good on them,..............................they do however have their coaches all locked up!!

If the cost to acquire Necas is manageable with KK added, I'm very interested.

 

[EveryDay]

In 3 years when Montreal is ready to compete, which player is more valuable, a 1M third line center strong on defense and faceoffs, or a 7M + winger who is defensively weak? Which will be easier to acquire? Take Beck out of any trade offer for what the team doesn't need in the next 2 years.

Does that winger produce 70+ pts per season? Does that center provide under 40 pts per season? If you say yes to both, I would take the 70+pts player who happen to produce as well in the playoffs.

I know that it's hard to project what will happen in the future with both Beck and Necas but right now we know that Necas can produce as the NHL level while Beck is unknown, it would be a really hard trade to make as I really like Beck but Necas would probably be MTL 2nd best forward at this moment.

 

[Habs Halifax]

If I'm landing KK it's to buy him out

Nah, you only buy out players if you have major cap issues. Habs do not. It's worth a shot to see how KK looks at age 24+. Many players like KK have great age 25-30 prime years.

This is about getting two young players who could really help our forward core and they both come just before prime. If you can get Necas's value lowered slightly with KK added, I don't consider this an automatic no reply.

 

[ReHabs]

Necas seems like a buy-low option. Guy seems set to break out.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Necas seems like a buy-low option. Guy seems set to break out.

It's not a buy low like Dach or Newhook. More like the Dach price but maybe a bit more.

I would like to add Necas but I get the feeling the Canes want sure shot top 6F trade value. And this talk might be all for not if Guentzel walks to UFA. No way the Canes loose both Necas and Guentzel.

 

[ReHabs]

It's not a buy low like Dach or Newhook. More like the Dach price but maybe a bit more.

I would like to add Necas but I get the feeling the Canes want sure shot top 6F trade value. And this talk might be all for not if Guentzel walks to UFA. No way the Canes loose both Necas and Guentzel.

I think "Dach price" is still a low price for a 25 year old 6'2" player with a ton of skill on the verge of hitting new heights.

 

[417]

If the cost to acquire Necas is manageable with KK added, I'm very interested.

Using Necas to get rid of Kotkaniemi by be an even more mad move than what they did to sign Kotkaniemi to an offer sheet purely out of spite.

 

[Habs Halifax]

I think "Dach price" is still a low price for a 25 year old 6'2" player with a ton of skill on the verge of hitting new heights.

That's the issue with Necas though. Is he on the verge of hitting new heights or is it what you see is what you get? With Dach, he was dealing with injuries and a badly managed Hawks team. Potential for Dach to hit new heights was higher than Necas today.

I'm interested in Necas but not desperate. Many are considering him a sure shot top 6F moving forward but I see middle 6F but at the top end of that waive. Some fans going to nit pick and laugh but I don't have definitive top 6 vs bottom 6 lines. So many players overlap it and I have Newhook as one of them. Necas to me is like Newhook but maybe slightly better. Necas is just putting up good numbers on a contender.

If the cost to acquire is manageable (parts we can spare like the Dach and Newhook trade), I'm interested. If the cost is greatly more than the Dach trade, I pass.

Using Necas to get rid of Kotkaniemi by be an even more mad move than what they did to sign Kotkaniemi to an offer sheet purely out of spite.

That's in the past now. Both GM's are not with the Habs or Canes anymore.

 

[Dichow Stopper]

Would you think that Owen Beck + Winnipeg 1st + 1 D(Struble/Harris/Barron) would be enough to get Necas from Carolina?

Value aside, I don’t think it fits their needs while they want to contend for the SC. Something around Matheson would make more sense. Or Xhekaj if they are really high on him? Hugues showed in the past with Romanov that he is not scared to make moves like that if he gets another player he wants at a position of need.

Whats the price for Zegras without giving up our first.....If we could aquire him before the draft that would give us more options if that top D is still available?

I think it would require to move up in the top 15. Something like we did for Dach.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Value aside, I don’t think it fits their needs while they want to contend for the SC. Something around Matheson would make more sense. Or Xhekaj if they are really high on him? Hugues showed in the past with Romanov that he is not scared to make moves like that if he gets another player he wants at a position of need.

Matheson would be attractive for them IMO. Two more years on a value contract but I think they would want the Jets 1st added.

Then the other layer would be Necas is a RFA for what? 1 or 2 more seasons? How much trade value does the Canes get for his UFA years?

 

[Habs Halifax]

In 3 years when Montreal is ready to compete, which player is more valuable, a 1M third line center strong on defense and faceoffs, or a 7M + winger who is defensively weak? Which will be easier to acquire? Take Beck out of any trade offer for what the team doesn't need in the next 2 years.

Who do you like more? Beck or Kapanen?

 

[417]

That's the issue with Necas though. Is he on the verge of hitting new heights or is it what you see is what you get? With Dach, he was dealing with injuries and a badly managed Hawks team. Potential for Dach to hit new heights was higher than Necas today.

Disagree here, there's much more of a proven record with Necas today, than there was with Dach when the Habs acquired him. That will be reflected in the contract Necas will received compared to the one that Dach eventually received.

Necas was fighting for icetime on a team with Seth Jarvis, T. Teravainen, Svechnikov and then Guentzel. He got pushed down the depth chart bit but still ended up with 53pts.

It's impossible for any forward on this team to achieve 50pts without copious amounts of icetime.

I'm interested in Necas but not desperate. Many are considering him a sure shot top 6F moving forward but I see middle 6F but at the top end of that waive. Some fans going to nit pick and laugh but I don't have definitive top 6 vs bottom 6 lines. So many players overlap it and I have Newhook as one of them. Necas to me is like Newhook but maybe slightly better. Necas is just putting up good numbers on a contender.

There's always a risk here, just like there was a risk with Dach and Newhook. Are these guys who are just underutilized and would blossom on a team with more responsibilities? I think the answer was a resounding yes for Dach, a bit less so for Newhook but overall he was pretty good.

The question/risk is less so with Necas because he's already proven, more than once, to be a more than capable top 6 player and his contract is going to be reflective of a top 6 winger.

If the cost to acquire is manageable (parts we can spare like the Dach and Newhook trade), I'm interested. If the cost is greatly more than the Dach trade, I pass.

Again, the reason why the parts were parts we could spare with Dach and Newhook was because they were/are inferior players to Necas. It won't be the same cost to acquire Necas, if it was, he'd be a Hab or playing for another team already.

The Habs may not want to pay the price it will cost to acquire Necas but rest assured some other team will.

Necas is the 6th highest scorer from that excellent 2017 draft, everyone ahead of him has signed lucrative extensions and a few that are behind him as well.

That's in the past now. Both GM's are not with the Habs or Canes anymore.

Still, there's a sunken cost there. The Canes don't have to minimize the value of a very valuable commodity (Necas) just to get rid of a player whose value is lower today than it was 12 months ago.

The situation isn' that desperate.

 

[Adam Michaels]

https://x.com/i/web/status/1797663600687071556

 

[sampollock]

KK back to MTL?? why ????????? not a chance

 

[Habs Halifax]

Disagree here, there's much more of a proven record with Necas today, than there was with Dach when the Habs acquired him. That will be reflected in the contract Necas will received compared to the one that Dach eventually received.

Necas was fighting for icetime on a team with Seth Jarvis, T. Teravainen, Svechnikov and then Guentzel. He got pushed down the depth chart bit but still ended up with 53pts.

It's impossible for any forward on this team to achieve 50pts without copious amounts of icetime.

There's always a risk here, just like there was a risk with Dach and Newhook. Are these guys who are just underutilized and would blossom on a team with more responsibilities? I think the answer was a resounding yes for Dach, a bit less so for Newhook but overall he was pretty good.

The question/risk is less so with Necas because he's already proven, more than once, to be a more than capable top 6 player and his contract is going to be reflective of a top 6 winger.

Again, the reason why the parts were parts we could spare with Dach and Newhook was because they were/are inferior players to Necas. It won't be the same cost to acquire Necas, if it was, he'd be a Hab or playing for another team already.

The Habs may not want to pay the price it will cost to acquire Necas but rest assured some other team will.

Still, there's a sunken cost there. The Canes don't have to minimize the value of a very valuable commodity (Necas) just to get rid of a player whose value is lower today than it was 12 months ago.

The situation isn' that desperate.

It's a lot to reply too bud.

Dach vs Necas. I didn't say Dach had a more proven record. I actually said Necas did so not sure what you are trying to say other than what I said... but you disagreed. lol.

Cost to acquire Necas will be higher. Sligthly higher than Dach. What I said was Dach had more room to grow and it's possible Necas is who he is after showing his growth over the last 2 or 3 seasons.

KK back to MTL?? why ????????? not a chance

Because he comes with Necas and the trade value package is lowered with KK in it. That has clearly been stated. You asked why and there is your answer. Both GM's are gone for both teams and Ducharme is not our coach anymore. I bet you Brindamour goes Ducharme level on Caufield as well (if he had him)

Funny how things spin. Necas with KK added to lower his value and then fans go all nuts with just talking about KK.

 

[salbutera]

That's the issue with Necas though. Is he on the verge of hitting new heights or is it what you see is what you get? With Dach, he was dealing with injuries and a badly managed Hawks team. Potential for Dach to hit new heights was higher than Necas today.

I'm interested in Necas but not desperate. Many are considering him a sure shot top 6F moving forward but I see middle 6F but at the top end of that waive. Some fans going to nit pick and laugh but I don't have definitive top 6 vs bottom 6 lines. So many players overlap it and I have Newhook as one of them. Necas to me is like Newhook but maybe slightly better. Necas is just putting up good numbers on a contender..

The question I’d want answered is:

Probability & desire Necas performs even at existing levels in a high demanding market like Mtl - we know for a fact many players simply can’t take playing w demands of Cdn markets.

It is vitally important for Habs to acquire players who can feed off the frenzy of the Mtl market.

 

[Kosseca]

Would you think that Owen Beck + Winnipeg 1st + 1 D(Struble/Harris/Barron) would be enough to get Necas from Carolina?

For one, I dont think Carolina is looking for furure and I also think other team can offer better value.

I dont see a trade between MTL and CAR for Necas, not by lack of interest just because the fit is not there.

 

[WeThreeKings]

KK back to MTL?? why ????????? not a chance

To buy him out and save Carolina the financial penalty.

 

[Habs Halifax]

The question I’d want answered is:

Probability & desire Necas performs even at existing levels in a high demanding market like Mtl - we know for a fact many players simply can’t take playing w demands of Cdn markets.

It is vitally important for Habs to acquire players who can feed off the frenzy of the Mtl market.

Yes, this is a great point. Necas appears to set himself up to cash in and I wonder if he is the type to be complacent once he gets his deal. Hard to predict. I have him as a middle 6F type like Newhook but at the top end of this waive. Great skater and hard worker with a good shot. Doesn't suck in his own end but his defensive numbers are meh.

Interested in Necas and if the cost gets lowered with KK added, I'm very interested. But it's something like Jets 1st, Kapanen, and Barron type offers. Anything more than that, I pass.

I also reserve right to change my mind because as GM, I would be able to call Necas's agent right now to see what kind of 5, 6, 7, 8 year AAV's he would want. If he starts talking $8M+ for 8 years, I pass.

 

[vokiel]

Some funny rumors from Carolina with Waddel gone

 

[salbutera]

Yes, this is a great point. Necas appears to set himself up to cash in and I wonder if he is the type to be complacent once he gets his deal. Hard to predict.

Interested in Necas and if the cost gets lowered with KK added, I'm very interested. But it's something like Jets 1st, Kapanen, and Barron type offers. Anything more than that, I pass.

I also reserve right to change my mind because as GM, I would be able to call Necas's agent right now to see what kind of 5, 6, 7, 8 year AAV's he would want. If he starts talking $8M+ for 8 years, I pass.

I thought Friedman said on 32-Thoughts Necas is looking for longterm deal at $7M+, and wanting to play C & 1st PP

Necas strikes me as a player made for a non-traditional hockey market and Preds seem to be a good trading partner

 

[Habs Halifax]

For one, I dont think Carolina is looking for furure and I also think other team can offer better value.

I dont see a trade between MTL and CAR for Necas, not by lack of interest just because the fit is not there.

Depends a lot on the others things the Canes are trying to do. Signing Guentzel is one of them. If they are able to re-sign Guentzel before July 1st, it's possible they are open to futures for Necas to help their cap strategy moving forward.

I thought Friedman said on 32-Thoughts Necas is looking for longterm deal at $7M+, and wanting to play C & 1st PP

I'll see if I can find it but his agent has recently talked $8M x8

 

[417]

It's a lot to reply too bud.

Dach vs Necas. I didn't say Dach had a more proven record. I actually said Necas did so not sure what you are trying to say other than what I said... but you disagreed. lol.

You wrote that the potential for Dach to hit new heights at the time of his acquisition was higher than it is with Necas today.

That's the issue with Necas though. Is he on the verge of hitting new heights or is it what you see is what you get? With Dach, he was dealing with injuries and a badly managed Hawks team. Potential for Dach to hit new heights was higher than Necas today.

I disagree and explained why.

So not sure what you're saying here lol.

Cost to acquire Necas will be higher. Sligthly higher than Dach. What I said was Dach had more room to grow and it's possible Necas is who he is after showing his growth over the last 2 or 3 seasons.

ok??

Because he comes with Necas and the trade value package is lowered with KK in it. That has clearly been stated. You asked why and there is your answer. Both GM's are gone for both teams and Ducharme is not our coach anymore. I bet you Brindamour goes Ducharme level on Caufield as well (if he had him)

Funny how things spin. Necas with KK added to lower his value and then fans go all nuts with just talking about KK.

I get what you're trying to say...I just don't get what incentive the Canes would have to diminish the value of a very valuable asset, for the sake of trading a much less valuable asset.

You don't fix a mistake by doubling down on it.

To buy him out and save Carolina the financial penalty.

Still would be an odd move...you've got a super desirable asset (which Necas is/will be), it's not like Kotkaniemi has a super huge cap hit.

Seems like an extreme solution to fix something that isn't even prohibitive for them.

I think this is more Habs fans wishful thinking because we always want to acquire players at a discount.