DAChampion
Registered User
- May 28, 2011
- 30,774
- 22,501
I assume that Habs management is hoping for Guhle-Reinbacher as the future 1st pairing. Thus, if Guhle doesn't take a step forward it will be a significant problem for the organization.
HF Habs: Trade Proposal Thread #86: 2023-2024 Season
- Thread starter MarkovsKnee
- Start date
-
Xenforo Cloud will be upgrading us to version 2.3.5 on March 3rd at 12 AM GMT. This version has increased stability and fixes several bugs. We expect downtime for the duration of the update. The admin team will continue to work on existing issues, templates and upgrade all necessary available addons to minimize impact of this new version. Click Here for Updates
- Status
I assume that Habs management is hoping for Guhle-Reinbacher as the future 1st pairing. Thus, if Guhle doesn't take a step forward it will be a significant problem for the organization.
Kosseca
Registered User
- Feb 23, 2020
- 1,517
- 1,409
Let me put it this way, if he's MTL no1 Dman by default (i.e. MTL does not have a more complete guy) then this is a problem.
In an ideal world, I can see him being the "2nd" guy on the top pairing, or the main on the second with top PK time. So I'm hoping Reinbacher can be that no1 guys, be paired with him.
- Jun 24, 2012
- 86,613
- 161,686
Well, we do have depth on the left side. Not sure how much of it has first pairing ceiling.
Would anyone here go after Kuzmenko, given age and skill leve? Clearly out of favour in Vancouver.
Kosseca
Registered User
- Feb 23, 2020
- 1,517
- 1,409
1st pair vs no 1D is a different beast. For me, the biggest issue is that there is no clear cut future no1D. In the absence of that, we are are hoping for stars to align and can't really pencil guys in slots.
If you know, for example, that Reinbacher is a for sure future no1 D with good offensive instincts, then you build from there : he need a LD that can complement him, so either a Guhle or Stuble or Wifi for defensive help. From there the other paring are easier to draw.
But not knowing how can handle the top minutes or can drive the offense means you can't even make a trade as you are still hoping one emerge and you need option in case some fails. So, while we have a glut of LD.... it's kinda hard to trade some away.
Gaylord Q Tinkledink
Registered User
- Apr 29, 2018
- 36,194
- 40,284
I think Vancouver would rather sell him off in a trade for an upgrade on him.
He'd probably just struggle here, too with meh players.
- Jun 24, 2012
- 86,613
- 161,686
How is a first pairing D different than a 1D?
If you’re alluding to how someone projects as a first pairing D on a non-competitive team vs. a player who would be considered a first pairing D on a contending team, I don’t believe the designation of “first pairing” and “1D” evokes that distinction.
Edit: The way I saw it, a 1D was simply a first pairing D unless one provided additional qualifiers like “on a contending club” or “on this team”. I guess I was ill-informed.
Last edited:
Team_Spirit
95% Elliotte
- Jul 3, 2002
- 41,125
- 25,066
Allen made himself untradable/dumpable with his 7 straight Ls
DAChampion
Registered User
- May 28, 2011
- 30,774
- 22,501
The Markov-Komisarek pairing of yore is a good example of the distinction.
Kosseca
Registered User
- Feb 23, 2020
- 1,517
- 1,409
First Pairing can be the complement to a no1 D. Hedman, Makar or Josi's partner,
- Jun 24, 2012
- 86,613
- 161,686
I’ll beg to differ. W-L are a team-derived stat.
There are far better, more individualized metrics and analytical tools that teams will use to determine a player’s viability plus they’ll typically also value past playoff experience, attitude, projected role, injury history and propensity to get injured, and given his age and experience, ability to mentor, amongst other factors.
Allen remains a capable 1B in support of a young, developing no. 1 goalie who can shoulder responsibility provided his playing time is well managed.
That said, he is overpaid and several teams are cap-restricted, so something’s gotta give if he’s going to be moved.
lamp9post
Registered User
- Jan 28, 2007
- 4,466
- 1,796
Have you not encountered this distinction before?
#1D is the team's best defenseman, ideally a top-10 defenseman league-wide.
First pairing D is someone who is capable of playing on the first pairing alongside your #1D against the opposition's best players.
A recent example of this in Montreal would be Josh Gorges playing on the top pairing alongside #1D PK Subban. This is not a great example though, given that Gorges isn't ideally on your first pairing.
Ultimately it's about how players would ideally be slotted on a contending team.
- Jun 24, 2012
- 86,613
- 161,686
I thought those terms were interchangeable. I see what was meant — Markov is your 1D and Komisarek your first pairing. That means your first pairing is likely to be or risks becoming interchangeable.
In that scenario, a 1D on a non-contending team is not necessarily a 1D on a contending club, no?
The Great Weal
Phil's Pizza
- Jan 15, 2015
- 56,575
- 74,086
To me a #1 dman is a guy like Werenski who’s not top 10 in the league but is a beast. Guhle seems more like a #2 but of course that can change.
Kosseca
Registered User
- Feb 23, 2020
- 1,517
- 1,409
This maybe a me thing, but when I'm thinking no1 D, I'm thinking potential Norris winner. A guy that can put up numbers and hold his own on defense.
Given his development curve, I see Guhle being a good no2 or a top guy on the second pair. If he ever unlock a next level to his offense, then that would change things significantly.
Seems soft to me for that size.
Not on pp.
On league’s 30th pk
I call sophomore jinx and reserve judgement next year.
sampollock
Registered User
Gaylord Q Tinkledink
Registered User
- Apr 29, 2018
- 36,194
- 40,284
He doesn't seem to be working out.
He did amazing in his 1st year, but his shooting percentage was ridiculous like 25, or 30%
His shooting percentage dropped and he's a meh player.
Unless Hughes has a deal in the works that leverages our available cap space, I'd take a flyer on Vrana... Seems like a long shot (huge skill but big maturity issues)
Pick up Vrana off waivers and give him the upcoming 7-game road trip to show he wants an NHL career, if MSL doesn't feel like there's room for emotional maturity growth, waive him again in January.
gotta do something to address the complete funk our forward group is in offensively.
Pick up Vrana off waivers and give him the upcoming 7-game road trip to show he wants an NHL career, if MSL doesn't feel like there's room for emotional maturity growth, waive him again in January.
gotta do something to address the complete funk our forward group is in offensively.
- Jan 18, 2022
- 9,306
- 13,906
Sounds like a Bergevin scrap-heap move, non?
If Hughes wants to improve the roster (which he has shown zero inclination, thus far) then he should actually improve the roster. Otherwise he should expect the young players to step up and carry the team to the finish line and be done with this season without wasting a second thought.
yup. with probably less likely chance of it working out given how pronounced Vrana's personality seem to be...
Waste of time. Get Heineman here, see what he has. Give Farrell a few games. Waive Pezzeta.
Gaylord Q Tinkledink
Registered User
- Apr 29, 2018
- 36,194
- 40,284
Wouldn't mind him, but if I'm Hughes I'm not taking him on for free.
Getting some draft capital, or sending Armia their way.
- Status
