HF Habs: Trade Proposal Thread #86: 2023-2024 Season

[Le Barron de HF]

I consider being available as the same thing as being shopped: the player is available for a traded. So if Zegras isn't shopped, that means he's not available either.

Friedman is supposedly the most reliable and we are still waiting for the imminent Markström to Devils deal to happen.

None of Hughes's trades were known until the papers made it to the NHL office. I think people should keep that in mind when insiders keep bringing up the Habs in every trade talks.

Also, nobody ever find it weird that's it is always 4-5 teams that are interested in a player in those insiders tidbits?

edit: For the record, I don't think the Ducks are planning to move Zegras at all. That all started with them acquiring Gauthier, but Gauthier doesn't replace Zegras on their line-up at all.

Not entirely true, some of it has been leaked given our position as sellers. Each rental has had talks with Hughes come deadline time so the player can know what to expect (Edmundson, Monahan).

 

[sampollock]

Different sources for different teams. There seems to be a lot of smoke for Zegras as a trade possibility. The Habs are just a logical destination for him: he fits the timeline, they need offence and he’s bff with one of our core players.

But players like Toffoli, Petry, Lehkonen, Chiarot, Kulak, Edmundson were all reported as being available before they were traded by Hughes.

who would be the best "insider" for the habs then??

they all blow smoke somewhat

 

[ML16]

Vegas has a lot of cap space now as they put Eichel on LTIR

If Vegas wants to leverage their cap space in yet another big game hunt - Guentzel, for instance - Habs should definitely use their last salary retention spot in a 3-way deal; collecting a 2024 2nd from Pittsburgh or Vegas would likely be the optimal way to extract a quality asset out of it.

Habs could also move Allen for a Johansen, using a 3rd round on a third party (Chicago?) to retain on Allen.

Finish the season with :

Caufield - Suzuki - Slafkovski
Newhook - Johansen - Anderson
Roy - Evans - Armia
Pearson/RHP/Pezetta - Gignac - Gallagher

Matheson - Guhle
Struble - Savard
Xhekaj - Kovacevic
Harris

Montembault
Primeau

 

[morhilane]

Not entirely true, some of it has been leaked given our position as sellers. Each rental has had talks with Hughes come deadline time so the player can know what to expect (Edmundson, Monahan).

I'm not talking about selling assets, everyone knows which players are available on the team, that's not hard to guess and Hughes pretty much reveals that info in interviews or to the players. The insiders aren't even relevant there.

I'm talking about players Hughes want after like Dach and Newhook. Even the PLD saga, insiders were claiming it was sure he was coming to Montréal, but the PLD camp post trade said Montréal never made any offers.

There is a huge gap between what the insiders claims and what actually happens and it seems to have grown even bigger over the last few years, not just with the Habs too.

 

[Habs Icing]

I thought this was a trade proposal thread

We decided it's a travel log now.

 

[Miller Time]

If Vegas wants to leverage their cap space in yet another big game hunt - Guentzel, for instance - Habs should definitely use their last salary retention spot in a 3-way deal; collecting a 2024 2nd from Pittsburgh or Vegas would likely be the optimal way to extract a quality asset out of it.

Habs could also move Allen for a Johansen, using a 3rd round on a third party (Chicago?) to retain on Allen.

Finish the season with :

Caufield - Suzuki - Slafkovski
Newhook - Johansen - Anderson
Roy - Evans - Armia
Pearson/RHP/Pezetta - Gignac - Gallagher

Matheson - Guhle
Struble - Savard
Xhekaj - Kovacevic
Harris

Montembault
Primeau

1st option is a great idea...
2nd not so much.

Not sure I get why we'd pay the pick to get retention on Allen for the Avs, while taking their cap dump in Johansen... He's been bad in Colorado & there's very little reason to believe he'll do anything but further regress next year, especially playing in a much weaker lineup.

If anything, Avs pay the 3rd to get the Hawks to retain 1M on each of Allen/RyJo... then we try to unload him this summer, hopefully finding a taker at 3M$ from a team that comes away empty handed post UFA frenzy

 

[Vachon23]

I consider being available as the same thing as being shopped: the player is available for a traded. So if Zegras isn't shopped, that means he's not available either.

Friedman is supposedly the most reliable and we are still waiting for the imminent Markström to Devils deal to happen.

None of Hughes's trades were known until the papers made it to the NHL office. I think people should keep that in mind when insiders keep bringing up the Habs in every trade talks.

Also, nobody ever find it weird that's it is always 4-5 teams that are interested in a player in those insiders tidbits?

edit: For the record, I don't think the Ducks are planning to move Zegras at all. That all started with them acquiring Gauthier, but Gauthier doesn't replace Zegras on their line-up at all.

There is a difference

Like in MTL, Monahan was shop so they where looking to trade him but Savard is more available so they are listing but they are not looking to trade him absolutely

 

[Sorinth]

I'm not talking about selling assets, everyone knows which players are available on the team, that's not hard to guess and Hughes pretty much reveals that info in interviews or to the players. The insiders aren't even relevant there.

I'm talking about players Hughes want after like Dach and Newhook. Even the PLD saga, insiders were claiming it was sure he was coming to Montréal, but the PLD camp post trade said Montréal never made any offers.

There is a huge gap between what the insiders claims and what actually happens and it seems to have grown even bigger over the last few years, not just with the Habs too.

Keep in mind there's a big difference between making an offer and discussing what you'd be willing to give up in a trade. We might not have made a formal offer for PLD but that doesn't mean we didn't let Winnipeg know who/what we'd be willing to give up in a trade.

Also a big reason why we probably didn't make a formal offer is that Winnipeg wanted NHLers, so there's no point in making an actual offer of picks/prospects. You just let them know your interested, the relative value you had in mind, and ask that if they change their focus of getting NHLers as a return to circle back.

 

[morhilane]

Keep in mind there's a big difference between making an offer and discussing what you'd be willing to give up in a trade. We might not have made a formal offer for PLD but that doesn't mean we didn't let Winnipeg know who/what we'd be willing to give up in a trade.

Also a big reason why we probably didn't make a formal offer is that Winnipeg wanted NHLers, so there's no point in making an actual offer of picks/prospects. You just let them know your interested, the relative value you had in mind, and ask that if they change their focus of getting NHLers as a return to circle back.

I know the difference, I don't think insiders do if they think Hughes calling in Winnipeg to ask about PLD price and bowing out is the same as "PLD is sure at 95% to end up in Montréal"...and that was Friedman who said it.

 

[Leon Lucius Black]

Great catch. Interesting.

So the media keeps talking about them shopping Zegras, but now they're NOT shopping Zegras... Hmmm.

It does sound like he's available though. Could be too rich for the Habs blood at this point depending on what they want

The media was more speculating he could be available, rather than him actually being shopped.

No smart GM would put word out they are shopping a young player like Zegras since teams wouldn't pay as much if they know a GM wants to move on. Given Verbeek didn't draft him and spent all off-season playing hardball with Zegras on a contract, I am sure he is definitely listening on offers though.

 

[Spring in Fialta]

I know the difference, I don't think insiders do if they think Hughes calling in Winnipeg to ask about PLD price and bowing out is the same as "PLD is sure at 95% to end up in Montréal"...and that was Friedman who said it.

That's because the Habs were clearly interested in him (Brisson doesn't go out of his way to bring this up at the draft if the interest is one way) and Dubois clearly had Montreal as his top spot until it became clear that he had to at least open up a little bit if he wanted his long-term deal right away.

 

[ML16]

1st option is a great idea...
2nd not so much.

Not sure I get why we'd pay the pick to get retention on Allen for the Avs, while taking their cap dump in Johansen... He's been bad in Colorado & there's very little reason to believe he'll do anything but further regress next year, especially playing in a much weaker lineup.

If anything, Avs pay the 3rd to get the Hawks to retain 1M on each of Allen/RyJo... then we try to unload him this summer, hopefully finding a taker at 3M$ from a team that comes away empty handed post UFA frenzy

Fair point; maybe the Avs should indeed be the one paying the incentive. My reasoning was that Johansen could temporarily replace Dvorak at C and let Newhook stay a winger - whereas Allen blocks Primeau.

Johansen could also give the Habs another option for a salary retention trade next year if Dvorak’s health doesn’t get better, or if Johansen simply outplays him.

 

[BLONG7]

That's because the Habs were clearly interested in him (Brisson doesn't go out of his way to bring this up at the draft if the interest is one way) and Dubois clearly had Montreal as his top spot until it became clear that he had to at least open up a little bit if he wanted his long-term deal right away.

Boy............did we dodge a bullet there.
Of all the guys in the league who make 8.5M, he has to be the most underwhelming this year.
His best years, are 60 pts..............another guy who demanded the money without proving he deserved it.
Case closed..............Kings fans are not happy with this guy...........lucky for them Byfield has arrived.

 

[nhlfan9191]

Keep in mind there's a big difference between making an offer and discussing what you'd be willing to give up in a trade. We might not have made a formal offer for PLD but that doesn't mean we didn't let Winnipeg know who/what we'd be willing to give up in a trade.

Also a big reason why we probably didn't make a formal offer is that Winnipeg wanted NHLers, so there's no point in making an actual offer of picks/prospects. You just let them know your interested, the relative value you had in mind, and ask that if they change their focus of getting NHLers as a return to circle back.

I think they probably heard how much he was asking for and thought he was smoking crack. Hughes is a former agent. He was never going to get beat down for the money Dubois was asking for. All those character problems that our fans confidently wanted to ignore in any conversation about him before last summer would’ve also played a big role in how much interest they actually had as it goes completely against what they’re trying to build right now.

 

[The Great Weal]

I know the difference, I don't think insiders do if they think Hughes calling in Winnipeg to ask about PLD price and bowing out is the same as "PLD is sure at 95% to end up in Montréal"...and that was Friedman who said it.

I do think this 95% thing comes from the fact that it was looking like Florida was going to miss the playoffs and that pick would have been used on PLD.

 

[Spring in Fialta]

I think they probably heard how much he was asking for and thought he was smoking crack. Hughes is a former agent. He was never going to get beat down for the money Dubois was asking for. All those character problems that our fans confidently wanted to ignore in any conversation about him before last summer would’ve also played a big role in how much interest they actually had as it goes completely against what they’re trying to build right now.

It was reported after the trade that HuGo were willing to at minimum give him Suzuki/Caufield money and pitch him on media opportunities to make even more money.

 

[nhlfan9191]

It was reported after the trade that HuGo were willing to at minimum give him Suzuki/Caufield money and pitch him on media opportunities to make even more money.

That’s far off from the $9 million he was reportedly asking for to come to Montreal or a “rebuilding team.” The whole aura was off about him and we’re seeing that on display again for a third team.

 

[Catanddogguitarrr]

Damn and to think people wanted to pay him more than Suzuki $$$ plus assets while he has less than 1/2 of the production on a better team.
We are well past the fool me once stage it's becoming fool me thrice.

But it tells that Kopitar today at 36y is better than Suzuki at 22.
What makes LAK a decent team ? (having a bad goalie and below average D except Doughty)
Is that every forward have enough skills and quality for his rank position? I think they have at least 3 good lines out of 4. And sometimes 4 good lines running.

Kopitar have 2 last seasons in the + stats while Suzuki is steady in the minus numbers. I guess that's his teamates ...

 

[kinghock]

Boy............did we dodge a bullet there.
Of all the guys in the league who make 8.5M, he has to be the most underwhelming this year.
His best years, are 60 pts..............another guy who demanded the money without proving he deserved it.
Case closed..............Kings fans are not happy with this guy...........lucky for them Byfield has arrived.

I do not believe LA fans are not happy with PLD after change of coach.

Lak.Daily on X: "Jim Fox just stated on the broadcast the Kings have put together a grading system for PL Dubois consisting of 6 categories. Didn’t go into details but said it does not involve goals and assists, rather the other things. They go over this after every game. #GoKingsGo" / X (twitter.com)

The last 6 games PLD is second best player on the Kings after Byfield and he scores as well.

 

[Deus ex machina]

I consider being available as the same thing as being shopped: the player is available for a traded. So if Zegras isn't shopped, that means he's not available either.

Friedman is supposedly the most reliable and we are still waiting for the imminent Markström to Devils deal to happen.

None of Hughes's trades were known until the papers made it to the NHL office. I think people should keep that in mind when insiders keep bringing up the Habs in every trade talks.

Also, nobody ever find it weird that's it is always 4-5 teams that are interested in a player in those insiders tidbits?

edit: For the record, I don't think the Ducks are planning to move Zegras at all. That all started with them acquiring Gauthier, but Gauthier doesn't replace Zegras on their line-up at all.

Friedman can only report on discussions Calgary and NJ had.
It's not his job to close the deal for them.

There are ways for GMs to let it known that a player is available without hurting his trade value.
There's a reason Zegras' name is out there and not McTavish, for example.

Same thing is happening with Savard.

 

[Deus ex machina]

If Vegas wants to leverage their cap space in yet another big game hunt - Guentzel, for instance - Habs should definitely use their last salary retention spot in a 3-way deal; collecting a 2024 2nd from Pittsburgh or Vegas would likely be the optimal way to extract a quality asset out of it.

Habs could also move Allen for a Johansen, using a 3rd round on a third party (Chicago?) to retain on Allen.

Finish the season with :

Caufield - Suzuki - Slafkovski
Newhook - Johansen - Anderson
Roy - Evans - Armia
Pearson/RHP/Pezetta - Gignac - Gallagher

Matheson - Guhle
Struble - Savard
Xhekaj - Kovacevic
Harris

Montembault
Primeau

Has a 3rd team ever retained on a non-expiring contract?

 

[sampollock]

no true insider is a HAB for sure insider... guess work and rumors

 

[BLONG7]

I do not believe LA fans are not happy with PLD after change of coach.

Lak.Daily on X: "Jim Fox just stated on the broadcast the Kings have put together a grading system for PL Dubois consisting of 6 categories. Didn’t go into details but said it does not involve goals and assists, rather the other things. They go over this after every game. #GoKingsGo" / X (twitter.com)

The last 6 games PLD is second best player on the Kings after Byfield and he scores as well.

6 good games out of 55? Goals and assists don't mean anything? I thought they were used a metric to calculate a guys worth?
Glad PLD is working out then....my mistake....

Cheers...

 

[BLONG7]

Friedman can only report on discussions Calgary and NJ had.
It's not his job to close the deal for them.

There are ways for GMs to let it known that a player is available without hurting his trade value.
There's a reason Zegras' name is out there and not McTavish, for example.

Same thing is happening with Savard.

The reporters, all of them Friedman included, say things like, 95% certain, PLD to Montreal is done.

Zero credibility.......Zero.

They are not insiders, they are fed what the team wants them to know and then off they go.
We can all speculate as they do......it's crazy the networks pay them to do this stuff? They pay these guys, to say things, like, the leafs may or may not be making a splash today.....sit tight.

Grain of salt to be used, on anything coming out of these guys mouth's

Habs trades usually come out of no where........

 

[Ozmodiar]

There is a difference

Like in MTL, Monahan was shop so they where looking to trade him but Savard is more available so they are listing but they are not looking to trade him absolutely

The best predictor of players on the way out is their contract situation.

There hasn’t been a good predictor of players being acquired. Dach, Newhook - out of the blue. … well, maybe there’s something about the 2019 draft. Kakko, Zegras?