HF Habs: Trade Proposal Thread #86: 2023-2024 Season

[BenchBrawl]

I wouldn't trade Guhle for Zegras 1 on 1. Not even close.

 

[HomaridII]

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Insider Trading:

Gauthier's agent refuses to say why he didn't want to play in Philly. Says its a private issue. Briere and the Flyers do not have an answer. Gauthier's agent denies it has to do with Tortorella.

Zegras not being shopped.

 

[Boss Man Hughes]

ZEGRAS IS BETTER THAN DACH? Marmelade.

Zegras definitely has more talent. Whether he is a team player is questionable. I wouldn't offer much more than Barron and 1st (if it's lower than 15th)

 

[BenchBrawl]

I wouldn't trade Dach for Zegras 1 on 1. Not even close.

 

[Runner77]

Zegras isn't prime offensive talent. I love his skill level, but his defensive game/compete/softness is Drouin-like.

Obviously, doesn’t have to be Zegras. Target a better offensive forward who can be had, let’s hope they get him. I’m convinced they had their reasons not to have ended up with Gauthier — I believe he had the Habs blacklisted.

 

[Boss Man Hughes]

You want to trade for a prima donna type of player? Refusing to play with your drafting team? Did you learn nothing from Jonathan Drouin?

It didn't hurt Eric Lindros, Fox etc.

 

[sampollock]

We are talking, in 2024, about a draft of star defenders. Lots of defenders shooting from the left. We just saw one play with the United States, Zeev Buium, an interesting one. We can talk a lot about Sam Dickinson, who plays in London.

The Canadian risks drafting between, let's face it, 8 and 12, you risk finding a defender. You can find a defender like Kaiden Guhle in that range in this draft. You won't find a player like Trevor Zegras " - Marco D'Amico

 

[rahad]

It didn't hurt Eric Lindros, Fox etc.

So you would have traded Reinbacher for him?

 

[Estimated_Prophet]

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Insider Trading:

Gauthier's agent refuses to say why he didn't want to play in Philly. Says its a private issue. Briere and the Flyers do not have an answer. Gauthier's agent denies it has to do with Tortorella.

Zegras not being shopped.

It is 100% Torts but nobody on either side can come out and say it as it would only provide negative outcomes. If I was an agent I would advise my client to do the same thing as Torts pushes it too far with the psychological abuse and mind games. As much as I don't believe that coaches/management ruin careers........Torts is one of the few that can derail a promising career.

Gauthier can't say it because his agent has clients playing for Torts and Briere can't say it because it may cause a snowball effect and more young players will do the same.

 

[Boss Man Hughes]

I wouldn't trade Dach for Zegras 1 on 1. Not even close.

Ignoring injuries I agree. But I am very doubtful Dach will ever put in a full season. Zegras may be the safer player injury wise.

 

[Mrb1p]

Zegras definitely has more talent. Whether he is a team player is questionable. I wouldn't offer much more than Barron and 1st (if it's lower than 15th)

Zegras does not have more talent than Dach, no. Dach went 6 spots ahead of him in the same draft.

 

[Boss Man Hughes]

So you would have traded Reinbacher for him?

No. I would only be interested if he came relatively cheaply. Barron and a 2nd or a low 1st.

 

[Estimated_Prophet]

We are talking, in 2024, about a draft of star defenders. Lots of defenders shooting from the left. We just saw one play with the United States, Zeev Buium, an interesting one. We can talk a lot about Sam Dickinson, who plays in London.

The Canadian risks drafting between, let's face it, 8 and 12, you risk finding a defender. You can find a defender like Kaiden Guhle in that range in this draft. You won't find a player like Trevor Zegras " - Marco D'Amico

Zegras is not that special as he is soft and a turnover machine.......no way is he as valuable as Guhle.

 

[Mrb1p]

We are talking, in 2024, about a draft of star defenders. Lots of defenders shooting from the left. We just saw one play with the United States, Zeev Buium, an interesting one. We can talk a lot about Sam Dickinson, who plays in London.

The Canadian risks drafting between, let's face it, 8 and 12, you risk finding a defender. You can find a defender like Kaiden Guhle in that range in this draft. You won't find a player like Trevor Zegras " - Marco D'Amico

Zegras went 9, wtf is he saying ?

 

[McGees]

The Canadian risks drafting between, let's face it, 8 and 12, you risk finding a defender. You can find a defender like Kaiden Guhle in that range in this draft. You won't find a player like Trevor Zegras " - Marco D'Amico

Ummm..that is exactly where they found Zegras Marco.

 

[Habs]

i wonder if baldy and fatso knew Cutter was available? I would have made an offer for that kid

 

[Boss Man Hughes]

Zegras does not have more talent than Dach, no. Dach went 6 spots ahead of him in the same draft.

Dach was a reach there. Size was key. He had one relatively good season. I had Zegras 3rd for offensive ability and Caufield top 6.

 

[Estimated_Prophet]

Ignoring injuries I agree. But I am very doubtful Dach will ever put in a full season. Zegras may be the safer player injury wise.

Dach over Zegras all day.

It is not as though Dach has a chronic recurring issue. He has had some really bad luck and it is way too early to insinuate that he might be injury prone for the rest of his career.

Dach is a player that could be a central piece on a cup contender whereas I see Zegras as a one dimensional regular season producer who is not built for playoff hockey.

 

[MarkovsKnee]

They'll lose out on that trade just like they did with Debrincat. Neither will have lasted a year & both traded for less than what they gave up.

Dorion was an awful GM.

 

[Twisted Sinister]

Does full rebuild = tear-down rebuild? Because that's not really the same thing.

Montreal is a bad team. They were a bad team in 2022, bad team in 2023 and are a bad team now. Their record was the worst in 2022, they had the 5th worst record in 2023 and didn't get lottery luck, but the biggest reasons there was separation between them and the bottom 4 teams was down to the randomness of hockey (San Jose probably deserved more points for instance and Montreal was bottom 1 to 4 in most team predictive stats). They've been boosted by goaltending and incredible scoring distribution (they have the 4th worst goal differential in the NHL), but could easily end up 5th worst.

Unfortunately, when it comes to lottery luck you need to be lucky both when you're bad and how you do in the draft lottery. And Montreal tearing down and being awful doesn't mean they'd finish worse than they have. Chicago had 11.5% odds for Bedard - Montreal had 8.5% odds. If Montreal wins that lottery (picking 1st two years in a row), precisely no one would be arguing about them half-assing it. And up until they went on their run, Montreal had better than 8.5% odds with Florida's pick.



1) Its xGF%, not GF%. They're at 50% GF%
2) xGF% is one advanced stat, not all of them - stats, whether we want to call them advanced or not, don't work that way
3) They're actually 18th in xGF% among lines with 100+ minutes together right now, not 10th.

Its still fair to say that Caufield-Suzuki-Slafkovsky has been one of the better lines in hockey.

Part of a full rebuild is tearing down the older components of it that make you win unnecessarily. I'm not saying "Go full Chicago and trade 22 year olds."

I'm saying trade Anderson, Trade Allen (both in 2022), trade Eddy or Savard. We could at least have had Fantilli or Carlsson instead of Defensey McMidton

If you want them to do what the Ducks have done, meaning Habs drafting at the top of the draft until 2027, and after all of that, they're still a bottom feeder, then you're not waiting for a team that will move forward, but left in a cycle.

So you want to trade a 30-year winless cycle for one where all they do every year is pick at the top of the draft yet the team continues to stay at the bottom of the standings annually.

I'd like to stop having to visit NHL Tankathon at some point real soon.

I didn't necessarily say I want them to suck till 2027. I want them to suck as long as is necessary to acquire gamebreaking talent. Otherwise, the 30 year winless cycle will start anew. look at the Wings. No gamebreaking talent in the most difficult division in the league. They're f***ed and so are we if we don't do something to be better than the teams ahead of us. But in any case, they've already been screwing it up by going half-ass with the rebuild anyway, in my opinion.

Well Anaheim is failing at that right now because they're once again a bottom feeder for a sixth year in a row.

Didn't they start their rebuild in 2019 with Zegras or am I misremembering? With the talent they have, I think this year's draft is probably a good time to use some capital to start surrounding your guys. If my memory serves me right, they need veteran help on defense, which is their glaring hole atm.

If all PHI was offering was Gauthier for the 5th OA selection, but also wanting to keep their 7th OA pick, then I don't blame Hughes for turning it down.

If it was to swap picks, so MTL gets Gauthier + 7th and PHI gets 5th + maybe another piece, then I would do that deal, depending of course what that other piece is. If it's Hutson, then no.

But reports seem to indicate that PHI simply wanted to add the 5th OA pick to their 7th.

If a swap was part of the deal, then MTL could have left the draft with Gauthier + whoever they took 7th + Newhook. That's more interesting as they leave with 3 pieces. But since PHI had no interest in swapping picks, then you would leave with 2 pieces no matter what, whether it be Gauthier & Newhook or as is the case, Reinbacher and Newhook.

I mean... If you weren't going to get an extra piece at 5, and wanted a big forward that's better than Gauthier in a lot of ways, you could just have drafted Leonard. As such, 5 for Gauthier straight-up just wouldn't make sense.

 

[Mrb1p]

Dach was a reach there. Size was key. He had one relatively good season. I had Zegras 3rd for offensive ability and Caufield top 6.

Dach was ranked 5th by Mackenzie. He wasn't a reach.

I had Zegras in the 20s and still stand by that.

 

[bsl]

5-8 overall + Hutson + Beck for 1 overall

Lol

 

[bsl]

Habs are in a weird position. Their worthwhile vets are Matheson and Savard but they are also the only vets on the defense. We got a ton of veteran forwards upfront but none of them are really worth much. We also have a ton of dmen knocking on the door.

It’s called being mediocre.

 

[HuGort]

lol ....there a number of posters on the main board, avowed habs haters, know-it-alls, who will double down with troll takes on literally anything habs-related. Their sanctimonious opinions are the poisonous equilibrium to some of the terrible trade takes our own members make

Anybody who don't know what they doing I place on my ignore list. This gets rid of the trash. Makes these boards more enjoyable

 

[habsfan891]

Marco is prepping you guys for the Zegras trade on Kent's orders