HF Habs: Trade Proposal Thread #85 - Offseason Editon

[yianik]

Ottawa is struggling and they need to sort out this Shane Pinto situation. Oddly though, Dorion doesn't seem to have a sense of urgency.

I don't know if Pinto might be a difference maker but I do know he is a 6 foot 3/4 C who has some skill, can skate and scored 20 goals with a FOW % north of 50 in year 3. I also know he has missed training camp and no matter his training regime it will take him a while to catch up. And more delay makes it worse.

Dorion had no money to make a better offer, but by now he should have been able to offload a salary. There are teams with Cap space but obviously Ottawa hasn't offered enough to make the trade. Bizarre .Bold trades and Dorion also did a great job in signing his young guys. Now he sits.

Something has to give and whether it's it's Cap dump or Pinto trade, Hughes needs to try to be involved.

 

[RationalExpectations]

Ottawa is struggling and they need to sort out this Shane Pinto situation. Oddly though, Dorion doesn't seem to have a sense of urgency.

I don't know if Pinto might be a difference maker but I do know he is a 6 foot 3/4 C who has some skill, can skate and scored 20 goals with a FOW % north of 50 in year 3. I also know he has missed training camp and no matter his training regime it will take him a while to catch up. And more delay makes it worse.

Dorion had no money to make a better offer, but by now he should have been able to offload a salary. There are teams with Cap space but obviously Ottawa hasn't offered enough to make the trade. Bizarre .Bold trades and Dorion also did a great job in signing his young guys. Now he sits.

Something has to give and whether it's it's Cap dump or Pinto trade, Hughes needs to try to be involved.

The only player I see them being interested in an be able to onboard would be Monahan at 50% if he is healthy, i.e. TDL kind of deal

 

[calder candidate]

Ottawa is struggling and they need to sort out this Shane Pinto situation. Oddly though, Dorion doesn't seem to have a sense of urgency.

I don't know if Pinto might be a difference maker but I do know he is a 6 foot 3/4 C who has some skill, can skate and scored 20 goals with a FOW % north of 50 in year 3. I also know he has missed training camp and no matter his training regime it will take him a while to catch up. And more delay makes it worse.

Dorion had no money to make a better offer, but by now he should have been able to offload a salary. There are teams with Cap space but obviously Ottawa hasn't offered enough to make the trade. Bizarre .Bold trades and Dorion also did a great job in signing his young guys. Now he sits.

Something has to give and whether it's it's Cap dump or Pinto trade, Hughes needs to try to be involved.

Pinto as zero power in the situation, Dorion trying leverage that + the team situation to get him to take a low ball or team friendly deal. He can’t make any space before he get that done, because than Pinto would no reason to take such a low offer.

 

[ReHabs]

Much like Kotkaniemi was rushed, it's very possible Lafreniere was rushed to the NHL as well. Depending on the price it costs to acquire and re-sign him, he could turn out to be a great player once he figures it out. I'd be happy to take a gamble on him but unfortunately he's not a former client of Kent Hughes.

 

[Spring in Fialta]

Good. Now that you've spoken, I guess it's settled. Thanks for chiming in.

You've basically said nothing.

It's not against the player. I like Monahan and think he's useful and wouldn't even be against re-signing him if he shows continued health and usefulness.

It's more about the fact that he's got recurring health issues, his production has dipped in the last 3-4 years and he still hasn't shown he can play a full season. Unlike someone like Chiarot who someone mentioned previously, the latter had the shine of having been a key cog to a runner-up just the year before. If Monahan gets a 1st, fantastic. But I doubt it and I think any pick we get from him will come with conditions. I just struggle to imagine contenders not finding more sure things for their 1st rounder around the league.

 

[calder candidate]

The only player I see them being interested in an be able to onboard would be Monahan at 50% if he is healthy, i.e. TDL kind of deal

There lot of team that will be interested and most of them won’t even need us to retain…

It's not against the player. I like Monahan and think he's useful and wouldn't even be against re-signing him if he shows continued health and usefulness.

It's more about the fact that he's got recurring health issues, his production has dipped in the last 3-4 years and he still hasn't shown he can play a full season. Unlike someone like Chiarot who someone mentioned previously, the latter had the shine of having been a key cog to a runner-up just the year before. If Monahan gets a 1st, fantastic. But I doubt it and I think any pick we get from him will come with conditions. I just struggle to imagine contenders not finding more sure things for their 1st rounder around the league.

The rental market is pretty slim and most team done have any cap space. If Monahan is healthy he might be top 5 forward available. Trading for someone without any injury history isn’t that much of a garantie anyone is a hit or bad luck away from being injured. If he is at a 100% at the TDL there should not be any discount.

 

[Boss Man Hughes]

It's not against the player. I like Monahan and think he's useful and wouldn't even be against re-signing him if he shows continued health and usefulness.

It's more about the fact that he's got recurring health issues, his production has dipped in the last 3-4 years and he still hasn't shown he can play a full season. Unlike someone like Chiarot who someone mentioned previously, the latter had the shine of having been a key cog to a runner-up just the year before. If Monahan gets a 1st, fantastic. But I doubt it and I think any pick we get from him will come with conditions. I just struggle to imagine contenders not finding more sure things for their 1st rounder around the league.

I doubt there will be better centres than Monahan available. Maybe one. But there isn't much point thinking about it until he shows he can make it through a whole season.

 

[HuGort]

Need 5.5m cap space and won t develop chemistry with anybody but I guess if he gets on a lucky streak on the third line it will be worth it. But then there are 3 more seasons where he won t be very consistent most likely…

Playoffs different see. It's more a grind them down. If Anderson piece you need for a cup run. Why he commands so much return

 

[waitin425]

Let's say we end up 8-10 this year. What would you package with that pick to move up to the top 5 and select Mack, Eiserman, Catton or Demidov?

Would you do Hutson + 10?

We have depth at D and I hope we can package something there for an elite forward.

 

[DiglettDangles]

Even if Monahan is the only cheap 2C-->3C on the market at TDL, it doesn't mean teams will be lining up to pay a first to get him.
If I'm a contending team, and the best option is a guy who hasn't played more than 65 games this decade, I just skip.
If the price tag is inflated as well, it just comforts me in my decision.

It's sad we have nothing left with a 1st round pick kind of value, but we have to accept it.
Yes that means I don't believe we'd get a straight 1st for Anderson either (maybe an A- prospect worth a low first).
That's unless we go the Romanov way and sell young redundant assets.

 

[Jaynki]

Much like Kotkaniemi was rushed, it's very possible Lafreniere was rushed to the NHL as well. Depending on the price it costs to acquire and re-sign him, he could turn out to be a great player once he figures it out. I'd be happy to take a gamble on him but unfortunately he's not a former client of Kent Hughes.

It all depends of the price to pay. He is also one or two bad season away from losing a lot of perceived value, even if there will always be a demand for a former 1st overall pick.

Personally, i would not aim for someone like Lafreniere. We will be good when we will have an offensive talent that is better than Suzuki/Caufield, This will have the domino effects of putting everyone in the right chair. Lafreniere is not this player and its dubious he becomes it.

 

[Jaynki]

We absolutely need a prime offensive talent to drop everyone else on the right chair. Its dubious Slafkovsky or Dach reach this level of talent.

Suzuki is nice but not as a 1C. Caufield is an awesome goal scorer but he does not do much else. We need someone like Elias Pettersson (the easy name, upcoming RFA) to have everyone in the right chair.

Would signing Elias Lindholm be enough? Steven Stamkos even if he is 35? Would Martin Necas(RFA) fill those shoes? Nylander?

 

[LaP]

Even if Monahan is the only cheap 2C-->3C on the market at TDL, it doesn't mean teams will be lining up to pay a first to get him.
If I'm a contending team, and the best option is a guy who hasn't played more than 65 games this decade, I just skip.
If the price tag is inflated as well, it just comforts me in my decision.

It's sad we have nothing left with a 1st round pick kind of value, but we have to accept it.
Yes that means I don't believe we'd get a straight 1st for Anderson either (maybe an A- prospect worth a low first).
That's unless we go the Romanov way and sell young redundant assets.

No you don't. If there's no other option and your best bet to help you win a cup is a healthy Monahan you do it. What you do is make the pick conditional to the amount of games he plays in playoffs.

 

[yianik]

The only player I see them being interested in an be able to onboard would be Monahan at 50% if he is healthy, i.e. TDL kind of deal

That would make sense they would be interested in him. In terms of Pinto they still have to offload a salary to sign him.

 

[yianik]

Pinto as zero power in the situation, Dorion trying leverage that + the team situation to get him to take a low ball or team friendly deal. He can’t make any space before he get that done, because than Pinto would no reason to take such a low offer.

But that offer is ridiculously low. Guy scored 20 goals, a million is just above league minimum. I think he offered it to qualify him and that's it. If he sticks with that Pinto does everything he can to get out of Ottawa as soon as possible.

 

[Scriptor]

It's not against the player. I like Monahan and think he's useful and wouldn't even be against re-signing him if he shows continued health and usefulness.

It's more about the fact that he's got recurring health issues, his production has dipped in the last 3-4 years and he still hasn't shown he can play a full season. Unlike someone like Chiarot who someone mentioned previously, the latter had the shine of having been a key cog to a runner-up just the year before. If Monahan gets a 1st, fantastic. But I doubt it and I think any pick we get from him will come with conditions. I just struggle to imagine contenders not finding more sure things for their 1st rounder around the league.

On an expiring deal, if he makes it to the trade deadline healthy, he'll be worth a late 1st rounder, at least, as a pure rental.

If that's all he's worth, though, I'd consider extending Monahan if he agrees to a 3-year, front-loaded deal at a 4.5M Cap hit that allows to trade him more easily years two and three.

If fetches a late 1st and a good prospect in a form of bidding war among rivals, I move him, for sure.

Thanks for explaining your position. That makes more sense than 'No way in hell' with nothing to justify that stance.

 

[Kobe Armstrong]

Taking a moral stance against Russians in Montreal might have actually been Hughes biggest blunder

Aside from the occasional French guy on a retirement tour of the league, Russians are some of the only players in the world who actually want to play in Montreal over other cities.

 

[calder candidate]

But that offer is ridiculously low. Guy scored 20 goals, a million is just above league minimum. I think he offered it to qualify him and that's it. If he sticks with that Pinto does everything he can to get out of Ottawa as soon as possible.

Pinto has no other option sign or sit out.
Dorion might trade him but he won’t do it unless it a trade that he can’t refuse.

 

[Tyson]

Pinto has no other option sign or sit out.
Dorion might trade him but he won’t do it unless it a trade that he can’t refuse.

I would go over seas and play in Europe. They threw truck loads of money at several players, signed Hamonic and Tarasenko and left nothing for a pretty promising young player.

 

[DiglettDangles]

No you don't. If there's no other option and your best bet to help you win a cup is a healthy Monahan you do it. What you do is make the pick conditional to the amount of games he plays in playoffs.

If you're going to market to buy a horse, and the only thing left is a 3-legged pony, you keep your money and you go home.
You don't pay the full market price for a horse unless you get an actual horse.
If that's all that is available, then your competitors aren't getting much better if you pass and they bite, anyways.

I don't disagree with the possibility of adding conditions based on games played, but that sort of seals the deal that we won't, in fact, get a 1st for him.

 

[calder candidate]

I would go over seas and play in Europe. They threw truck loads of money at several players, signed Hamonic and Tarasenko and left nothing for a pretty promising young player.

Ottawa still own is right not even sure he could go overseas before dec 1st without their permission, unless it is the KHL since they don’t having any agreement between the leagues.

 

[LaP]

If you're going to market to buy a horse, and the only thing left is a 3-legged pony, you keep your money and you go home.
You don't pay the full market price for a horse unless you get an actual horse.
If that's all that is available, then your competitors aren't getting much better if you pass and they bite, anyways.

I don't disagree with the possibility of adding conditions based on games played, but that sort of seals the deal that we won't, in fact, get a 1st for him.

Monahan healthy is not a 3 legged pony i mean like do you watch the games? He's a horse with a recurring problem to one leg. If that's your only option at the deadline and he is healthy you take a gamble and make your pick conditional. If Monahan is healthy at the deadline and KH is willing to trade him he'll have no trouble finding a taker. You can get a conditional first for a healthy Monahan no trouble imo.

 

[Victoire HuGo]

Even if Monahan is the only cheap 2C-->3C on the market at TDL, it doesn't mean teams will be lining up to pay a first to get him.
If I'm a contending team, and the best option is a guy who hasn't played more than 65 games this decade, I just skip.
If the price tag is inflated as well, it just comforts me in my decision.

It's sad we have nothing left with a 1st round pick kind of value, but we have to accept it.
Yes that means I don't believe we'd get a straight 1st for Anderson either (maybe an A- prospect worth a low first).
That's unless we go the Romanov way and sell young redundant assets.

HuGo is creative enough to add conditions to any trade to make it enticing for contenders to go for him. We've seen conditions based on games played in the past during playoffs so its not that uncommon.

 

[Kobe Armstrong]

Saying we're going to get a 1st for Monahan is super cringe and is just going to lead to us getting dunked on by fans on the main board when he is injured by game 20.

That said, he should have more value than last year just because he is cheaper. If they retain 50% and add conditions maybe they get a 1st, but idk

And if we do it will be like a 2029 first with a million conditions about lottery protections

 

[DiglettDangles]

Monahan healthy is not a 3 legged pony i mean like do you watch the games? He's a horse with a recurring problem to one leg. If that's your only option at the deadline and he is healthy you take a gamble and make your pick conditional. If Monahan is healthy at the deadline and KH is willing to trade him he'll have no trouble finding a taker. You can get a conditional first for a healthy Monahan no trouble imo.

I don't think you want to know what happens to horses with leg problems preventing them to do their job...

Jokes aside, I do like what Monahan is bringing to the Habs, and he is a good player when healthy.

Just take into consideration that the entire league knows we were PAID to take him on, so trying to sell him for the big bucks will be considered quite greedy by the other GMs. I don't think any GM wants to add "paid a 1st for a player that needed a 1st to be dumped" to their career log, especially if that player could realistically flop were he to get injured. It's irrational but very, very real.