No because the idea is to increase the number of strong players under 26 (F) or 29 (D), not to shuffle them around.
HF Habs: Trade Proposal Thread #84: Off-Season edition
- Thread starter MarkovsKnee
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Lockin17
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- Jul 31, 2018
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I hope we don't trade our panthers pick for Dubois.
Maybe a package of Harris + Dvorak + Mesar/Kidney/Engstrom/Calgary first
That's it no more...
Maybe a package of Harris + Dvorak + Mesar/Kidney/Engstrom/Calgary first
That's it no more...
Panther pick will likely be a 25-30% shot of drafting a guy like PLD. So, take PLD.
Yeah there is this one the All Encompassing one the GDT and the OUT of Towner.
That wouldn't happen until draft day and the pick is to be made.
salbutera
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- Sep 10, 2019
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salbutera
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Of course - always take a proven NHL commodity over a draft pick, obviously depending on acquisition cost
calder candidate
Registered User
I would not trade Calgary pick that might end up being even better than the FLA pick
calder candidate
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MarkovsKnee
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We can only retain on one of them at the draft. The other will have to be post July 1st.
We already have 2 retainments. Max is 3.
New season is July 1st.
Hins77
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- Apr 2, 2013
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At this point, I hope Montreal won’t acquire Dubois. I mean, we arent on the spot like New Jersey devils, Buffalo, Ottawa where to bring that kind of player would be make a real push. Montreal rebuild, and I don’t see why we should give a guy like Kidney. Kidney could maybe become a top 6 player at 950k and it will more useful than Dubois at 8,5M.
Dubois fit on the timeline of Suzuki, Caufield, Dach. But, Montreal need to be patient on his case.
FF de Mars
Registered User
Insiders say 95% chances PLD signs in Montréal. So, wait for UFA.
Hins77
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And this is only, 1 year to wait. If he really want to come in Montreal, he is gonna wait the opening market. And if he sign with another team, so be it. I mean, this is a cap crunch era and every contract need to value every penny. I prefer don’t have Dubois, than paying him 9,5 millions/year.
If they could sign PLD next summer as a UFA, then I'd like to see them trade for Carter Hart too. They fit the rebuild and if they could add a Reinbacher, Benson and Caden Price in this draft plus their 2024 #1 as well, the rebuild would be complete.
Kudo Shinichi
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- Apr 20, 2012
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If the jets want a 1st round pick back for Dubois, we don't need to give the panthers pick.
We can use one or combine multiple of these assets to get another 1st: high 2nd, Edmundson, Dvorak, Anderson
We can use one or combine multiple of these assets to get another 1st: high 2nd, Edmundson, Dvorak, Anderson
The Great Weal
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BoneHutson
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- Mar 26, 2023
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I know this is aint CapFriendly, but this probably would be my ideal summer for this team (assuming we stay where we're at after the lottery).
Trade some veterans
Anderson to EDM for Yamamoto (cap dump + any short term salary) + Holloway + 2024 first (top 10 protected).
Edmundson to MIN for a 2nd and a 3rd in different drafts.
Allen to a team like TOR for a 3rd but ideally a 2nd (dont think its happening due to his contract).
Use our cap space like we did with Monahan
Apparently, WAS might be looking to shed some salaries this summer to make a push for the playoffs after this unfortunate season... Reading some post on their Reddit and on Twitter, and it's clear that Mantha is on his way out, and considering how bad he's been since joining this team, they will have to pay to get rid of him. So, something like this would make sense imo :
Mantha + 2024 first (top 10 protect) for Gurianov (they can sign him for around a million and hope he produces like he does rn for us). I could replace Gurianov with a 3rd.
Acquire a potential starter
Askarov would be my prime target and even though young goalie with his potential don't get traded very often, NAS is in a unique situation with Saros who's elite and still young. Plus, I don't think they want to rebuild. With Prime Josi and Forsberg on board (+Duchene who's taken a step up) they might just want to do a short retool an acquire some more young F (using Askarov for this my be a great way).
So I think an offer like this would work for them : Askarov for Yamamoto (we don't have a spot for him imo) + Holloway + 12-14th OA (FLA). They get a young skilled C with great potential and a guy like Musty, Cristall, Yager, maybe Leonard.
Acquire Dubois FOR THE RIGHT PRICE
IMO, paying what some fans seems to be willing to pay for a guy that wants (at 95% certainty) to come here, would be absolutely outrageous and crazy, especially considering the fact that we won't be ready to compete right away next year. The max Id do, and even then I think it's a lot considering it's more than what NYR paid a few years back for Trouba (same situation and even better player at the time) is :
Dvorak + Kidney (redundant prospect but great potential) + first in 2024 (they get the lowest between all three). I would also look if they'd be willing to take on Hoffman (his value went up since Christmas, but still a bad contract) and maybe up his value in order to ship him at the TDL to recoup a 3rd.
The draft
Assuming we stay put at 5 (which is less likely than falling to 6 or 7), my choice would absolutely be Benson. Smartest player in the draft, most intense guy alongside Leonard, elite skills and despite being 5'10'' seems to always win his board battles, and he's excellent at pokechecking and pressuring the opponents D. One year in the WHL putting over 2ppg and bulking up, and he could jump right in. This kid is the next Marner (except 2 inches smaller).
He might however be taken 4 OA by a team valuing him more than Michkov which imo is totally legit not simply because of the later's contract, but also because Benson projects to be a much more complete player and a guy who, despite not having that 100+ pts potential still will be a ppg minimum guy for the next 10 years. If that happens, take Michkov (either wait or try everything to bring him over before the end of his deal in Russia). The Askarov-Michkov thing would be amazing though ngl.
At 37th and with MIN 2nd rounder, Id definitely like to a D (ideally RHD) and a big guy (we pray Honzek falls).
The lineup
I expect Farrell to make the team and I definitely think both Roy and Beck will at least make a strong push. Roy probably is the prospect I watched the most this year and his game is now so mature and translatable. His skating absolutely won't be a problem and he could put up some solid offensive numbers right away playing on the PP (halfwall where he's so good and deceptive).
I don't like Mailloux's decision making and defensive game (though his aggressiveness which puts him out of position more often then not, is mostly due to his coaches who prefer their D to be aggressive), but considering how much praise he gets from the habs dev team, I guess they might see and know something that we don't. He might make the team, but there's already so many guys at D that it's hard to see it (baring injuries).
Id play Dach and Dubois together just to let Dubois take the faceoffs and some of the defensive responsibilites, but letting Dach be the C outside of that (and Dubois is a sublime power forward which fits a W more).
Hopefully, salary wise (and lineup wise), Gallagher and Armia are hurt and placed on LTIR (more likely with Gally).
Slaf-Zuke-The cock
Farrell-Kirby-Dubois
Roy-Beck-Mantha (trying him out)
RHP-Evans-Ylo
Heineman-Belzile-Pezz the preds
Matheson-Future president
Guhls-The Barron
The sherif-Savard
Kovacevic-Mailloux*
Askarov
Montembeault
Trade some veterans
Anderson to EDM for Yamamoto (cap dump + any short term salary) + Holloway + 2024 first (top 10 protected).
Edmundson to MIN for a 2nd and a 3rd in different drafts.
Allen to a team like TOR for a 3rd but ideally a 2nd (dont think its happening due to his contract).
Use our cap space like we did with Monahan
Apparently, WAS might be looking to shed some salaries this summer to make a push for the playoffs after this unfortunate season... Reading some post on their Reddit and on Twitter, and it's clear that Mantha is on his way out, and considering how bad he's been since joining this team, they will have to pay to get rid of him. So, something like this would make sense imo :
Mantha + 2024 first (top 10 protect) for Gurianov (they can sign him for around a million and hope he produces like he does rn for us). I could replace Gurianov with a 3rd.
Acquire a potential starter
Askarov would be my prime target and even though young goalie with his potential don't get traded very often, NAS is in a unique situation with Saros who's elite and still young. Plus, I don't think they want to rebuild. With Prime Josi and Forsberg on board (+Duchene who's taken a step up) they might just want to do a short retool an acquire some more young F (using Askarov for this my be a great way).
So I think an offer like this would work for them : Askarov for Yamamoto (we don't have a spot for him imo) + Holloway + 12-14th OA (FLA). They get a young skilled C with great potential and a guy like Musty, Cristall, Yager, maybe Leonard.
Acquire Dubois FOR THE RIGHT PRICE
IMO, paying what some fans seems to be willing to pay for a guy that wants (at 95% certainty) to come here, would be absolutely outrageous and crazy, especially considering the fact that we won't be ready to compete right away next year. The max Id do, and even then I think it's a lot considering it's more than what NYR paid a few years back for Trouba (same situation and even better player at the time) is :
Dvorak + Kidney (redundant prospect but great potential) + first in 2024 (they get the lowest between all three). I would also look if they'd be willing to take on Hoffman (his value went up since Christmas, but still a bad contract) and maybe up his value in order to ship him at the TDL to recoup a 3rd.
The draft
Assuming we stay put at 5 (which is less likely than falling to 6 or 7), my choice would absolutely be Benson. Smartest player in the draft, most intense guy alongside Leonard, elite skills and despite being 5'10'' seems to always win his board battles, and he's excellent at pokechecking and pressuring the opponents D. One year in the WHL putting over 2ppg and bulking up, and he could jump right in. This kid is the next Marner (except 2 inches smaller).
He might however be taken 4 OA by a team valuing him more than Michkov which imo is totally legit not simply because of the later's contract, but also because Benson projects to be a much more complete player and a guy who, despite not having that 100+ pts potential still will be a ppg minimum guy for the next 10 years. If that happens, take Michkov (either wait or try everything to bring him over before the end of his deal in Russia). The Askarov-Michkov thing would be amazing though ngl.
At 37th and with MIN 2nd rounder, Id definitely like to a D (ideally RHD) and a big guy (we pray Honzek falls).
The lineup
I expect Farrell to make the team and I definitely think both Roy and Beck will at least make a strong push. Roy probably is the prospect I watched the most this year and his game is now so mature and translatable. His skating absolutely won't be a problem and he could put up some solid offensive numbers right away playing on the PP (halfwall where he's so good and deceptive).
I don't like Mailloux's decision making and defensive game (though his aggressiveness which puts him out of position more often then not, is mostly due to his coaches who prefer their D to be aggressive), but considering how much praise he gets from the habs dev team, I guess they might see and know something that we don't. He might make the team, but there's already so many guys at D that it's hard to see it (baring injuries).
Id play Dach and Dubois together just to let Dubois take the faceoffs and some of the defensive responsibilites, but letting Dach be the C outside of that (and Dubois is a sublime power forward which fits a W more).
Hopefully, salary wise (and lineup wise), Gallagher and Armia are hurt and placed on LTIR (more likely with Gally).
Slaf-Zuke-The cock
Farrell-Kirby-Dubois
Roy-Beck-Mantha (trying him out)
RHP-Evans-Ylo
Heineman-Belzile-Pezz the preds
Matheson-Future president
Guhls-The Barron
The sherif-Savard
Kovacevic-Mailloux*
Askarov
Montembeault
Depends if it wins lottery.
What I really like with PLD Dach is that you have center / wing flexibility but what I don t like is the ceiling in terms of point production and injury history.
General Fanager
Registered User
or use the pick and then get PLD for free next summer?
He wants to be here, The Habs want him.....whats the rush???
With PLD he started the year on fire but has dropped back to his career averages, about 25 goals and 60 points. Which are okay, but not great. The MSL effect help that ?Depends if it wins lottery.
What I really like with PLD Dach is that you have center / wing flexibility but what I don t like is the ceiling in terms of point production and injury history.
As to Dach, we don't know his ceiling yet. Everybody was injured this year.
Both guys need to get better in the circle, especially Dach, but PLD is barely adequate.
Agree on the wing / centre flexibility, but Dach is a centre 100%.
Sh#t happens.
Galchenyuk15
Registered User
- Jan 2, 2013
- 170
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We would never find someone better or close to PLD at this range, more 5% than 25-30% but I still didn't make the trade because it's like burning free assets. To acquire PLD this year with a trade it's like buying the new PS5 at the start of December at 1000$ when you know it will be at 335$ after Christmas! Non-sense for parents, GM, but all good for kids, us! I hope Hughes will not feel like a Santa Claus with Winny and be a smart dad!
We need a lot of new toys and if we can add some without paying the full price it will be a lot better than the other way. PLD it's not a case like everyone else, everyone know he want to play here. Without having the guarantee he will be here at some point, I believe more than ever we can really add him via UFA versus all the things made over the years.
The Habs are not anymore what it's use to be at the time but Montréal is still something special and some people, like us and some players, know they represent way more than only a hockey team, a thing no other team can't offer and can be a "dream" for a player who understand that.
Hughes and PLD know a lot more than us about what the future could be and without having discuss about term or money, I'm pretty sure they know already if they can work something together in a near future and they know the interest of each one: Hughes want PLD and PLD want to be in Montréal. Hughes already know at the moment if he need to make a trade to obtain him or to wait at the UFA market of the summer 2024.
If the 2 guys work for the same case, for the benefit of the Habs, it's only common sense from the two parts to wait until PLD hit the UFA market because the Habs and PLD himself will benefit about that decision for the next few years with a better chance to win on paper with having more assets; we never have too much and it's harder than ever to win something.
If the goal of PLD is to win something with the Habs, I don't think he would want to be acquire at a premium price or for some pretty good assets or some assets at all if we can do otherwise! What make the Habs successful in their glory years it's how the players put the logo infront of everything else instead than the name behind the jersey; they play for the team not for themselve and in that case of PLD it would be something special if he are already willing to take a bullet for us without being with us for the moment in making the better decision for the Habs! Maybe we need a guy like that to broke the "malediction" we seem to have; bring back the old habit and the culture of what I can make for the Habs to win more hockey games like before!
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Let me show a example of how I would "burn" my assets if I decide to go that way. Just to show how much this assets can be very useful in another way! Everyone know we need a young goalie, we need a RHD and we need a Top 2 center; the last can be achieve with PLD and/or the first pick of this year!
Goalie : I really like Levi and Wolf as "underdog" without the love they deserve but my main target like everyone would be Askarov; even if I have some issue with his mental but I'm a little bit "paranoaic" like you already saw but I think he can be a MAF kind of goalie sometime a wall and sometime being beat in the worst way possible; an elite rollercoaster. They would not want to deal him in any sort of way but you need to make the decision harder sometimes let met explain.
I would wait PLD via UFA and in my example I trade Anderson just to give me more assets to achieve what I want! I would targetting Askarov and a RHD with some pretty got upside without a name for the moment!
PLD via UFA
Anderson trade versus 1st Pick and Prospect B
In the books at the moment :
1st picks : Andy 1st, Flo 1st and Cal 1st
Others assets not include in PLD deal like an establish player and a young player
Prospect B
Askarov versus 2 x 1st picks + Establish Player (Dump Salary) + Prospect A- or B+ something like Kidney
RHD versus 1st picks + Prospect A like Mesar
Without touching your 1st and managing the assets we got gifted over the years, Monahan, Chariot, Toffoli and Andy we push that team a couple a step ahead closer than ever to be ultra competitive again! I don't know if the others team would be interested to listen but like you saw I'm willing to pay the price just tell me what you want and we will find a solution with the thinking of some of the asset to build this deal are "free" because of the commitment of PLD it's not the same case to paid the "full price" like before!
Caufield-Suzuki-Slaf/1st pick 2023
Dach-Dubois-Roy
Farrell-Beck-1st pick 2023/Slaf
RHP-Kapanen-Heineman
Guhle - RHD not name
Hutson - Mailloux
Xhekaj - Barron
Harris
Askarov
??? (Monty)
In that lineup, only Slaf have some QI hockey issue at the moment and it can be just a question of time before he establish himself to another dimension like Rantanen and Draisatl have do later than their rookie year in their career without having the same ceiling! All players are effective with the puck and born to be in the new NHL! We would need to do some upgrade a la Tampa Bay before winning something but it's already a pretty good start and something I would not even dream of 3 years ago!
The creativity, the pace and how this team would be able to play with the puck would be a fresh of breath air after all the years of when we can't do freakin nothing with the puck! We deserve that and I would said more we deserve Bedard after the treatment Price got over the time but it's another story; a la Tom Hanks in "Cast Away"!
PS : Gallagher and Armia still have contract but if we can build that kind of team, Hughes will find a way to move these guys somewhere else and if not they will take the buyout option! I wish nothing bad to Gally but the easiest way would be the LTIR ...
PP Subban
Registered User
- Nov 9, 2006
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I still have a hard time imagining Dubois in Montreal.
Winnipeg is not gonna let him walk for free. So Habs will have to pay for him this summer or outbid teams at the deadline for him as a rental.
Does anyone else not see a team like LA for example making a play for a guy like him. Bringing him in. Showing him how great it is to play in California then offering him a solid deal and he’s gonna say NO????
Idk guys we’ve heard this one a few too many times. For sure he’d love to play in Montreal but if another good fit swoops in, before Montréal has a chance to sign him for free in 2 summers, I think he’ll sign there…
Winnipeg is not gonna let him walk for free. So Habs will have to pay for him this summer or outbid teams at the deadline for him as a rental.
Does anyone else not see a team like LA for example making a play for a guy like him. Bringing him in. Showing him how great it is to play in California then offering him a solid deal and he’s gonna say NO????
Idk guys we’ve heard this one a few too many times. For sure he’d love to play in Montreal but if another good fit swoops in, before Montréal has a chance to sign him for free in 2 summers, I think he’ll sign there…
Carolina is in win now mode and could be looking for a veteran goalie like Saros or Hellebuyck this summer and Montreal could go after Kochetkov in a 3 team trade.
BoneHutson
Registered User
- Mar 26, 2023
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I mostly agree with your proposals as Ive basically made the same acquisitions in my post just above yours, but as great as he might be, I don't think giving up 2 first, a roster player and a solid prospect for Askarov is wise as he's not a sure thing. In 2013, VAN traded Schneider for the 9th OA pick and he was coming of a couple of really solid seasons IN THE NHL, and he was young. My trade above of Holloway (or any solid prospect acquired in a trade) + 13th OA is the max Id do. If they don't take that kind of offer (which I think would be crazy for a team like NAS in lack of offense and considering Askarov is still a prospect), then I would just look at Hart in PHI as hed probably cost less and already showed that he can be solid in the NHL (despite a few bad seasons).
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