HF Habs: Trade Proposal Thread #80

[26Mats]

God, i’m so tired of these BS rumours

We don't have the cap space. And, presumably, the isles are trying to clear cap space for Kadri.

 

[Takeru]

Is anyone surprised by this?



Of course, it doesn’t take anything away from the usual, expected value from non first rounders to fill other needs in a lineup.

Also, one could argue about where the cutoffs were in defining a “star” but the gyst of the argument remains — Habs trading for a 3rd 1st rounder in 2023 remains the jugular.

I’d be curious what the numbers are for star Dmen outside the 1st round.
My guess is they’d be at least slightly higher.

 

[Habs Halifax]

You seriously need to stop repeating yourself and im gonna stop arguing with you you lets just agree to disagree because no way Allen is worth more then a second imo and i dont feel like going back and forth about it

I have to repeat myself cause you are completely ignoring the flat cap and supply and demand for goalies. You think it's 2019 or something where there is no cap issues and teams are not really looking for a goalies. False. Keep ignoring it and I'll keep telling you the same thing

Allen with no cap issues and no supply/demand for goalies might mean Allen is worth a 2nd. But once again, this is not the reality of the NHL at the moment. Don't want to go back and forth? Don't reply and ignore the context I'm providing. Pretty simple.

 

[Habs Halifax]

You aren't getting a 1st or 2nd when Marc Andre Fleury just got a 2nd round pick at deadline. Stop acting like Teams want him because they don't. He doesn't have much value

I don't agree with the MAF point.
* Different season with different cap issues from across the NHL
* Rental price at the deadline vs for a full season
* Completely different cap hits
* MAF had a very small list of teams he would accept a trade too.... therefore limiting his value

Teams do want Allen but they don't like our price. Thinking they don't want Allen is comical.

Oh, so now we are not going to get a 1st, we are not getting a 2nd either?

 

[JoelWarlord]

We don't have the cap space. And, presumably, the isles are trying to clear cap space for Kadri.

Yeah it doesn't really make sense. The only possible way would be trading Hoffman or Dvorak elsewhere to clear the space and then taking Beauvillier from the Islanders since they want to clear salary, but it doesn't really seem likely that either of those players could be traded at this point in the offseason without taking any salary back.

 

[Sterling Archer]

$4.1M for an undersized winger whose never had 40 point season and oft injured. Aaaaand we'll have to pay for the privilege!

Sounds like a dream to me

 

[Nico Cauzuki]

I have to repeat myself cause you are completely ignoring the flat cap and supply and demand for goalies. You think it's 2019 or something where there is no cap issues and teams are not really looking for a goalies. False. Keep ignoring it and I'll keep telling you the same thing

Allen with no cap issues and no supply/demand for goalies might mean Allen is worth a 2nd. But once again, this is not the reality of the NHL at the moment. Don't want to go back and forth? Don't reply and ignore the context I'm providing. Pretty simple.

Lol @ supply and demand

Allen is worth a 2nd only delusional homer fans like you think he would be worth a 1st + im still laughing at we should ask for 2 1st

 

[nhlfan9191]

Lol @ supply and demand

Allen is worth a 2nd only delusional homer fans like you think he would be worth a 1st + im still laughing at we should ask for 2 1st

We would probably get a second or in and around that. He’s more valuable to our team then he is in a trade.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Lol @ supply and demand

Allen is worth a 2nd only delusional homer fans like you think he would be worth a 1st + im still laughing at we should ask for 2 1st

You're character is showing in the disagreement by using "delusional homer fans". Very disingenuous approach by you at this point in time. If you can't handle a disagreement, that's on you, not me.

Supply and Demand is a big factor. Laugh all you want but that's basically ignorance

 

[Le Tricolore]

God, i’m so tired of these BS rumours

I'm good friends with Marco, and know he wouldn't make stuff up. He basically said the Habs inquired and weren't willing to pay the price.

It's silly that this is reported since teams kick tires about players all the time, but this is Montreal, and Beauvillier is a local kid, so here you are.

 

[Nico Cauzuki]

We would probably get a second or in and around that. He’s more valuable to our team then he is in a trade.

will all depend on Price i think hes knees are done so yes i would rather keep Allen then trade him for a 2nd

 

[Habs Halifax]

We would probably get a second or in and around that. He’s more valuable to our team then he is in a trade.

I think we easily get a 2nd type offer from several teams. He's got a value contract in a season where there is very little cap space.

If there was no supply/demand and also no cap issues, I'd say his value was meh. But that's just not the reality of the NHL right now. This is a leverage asking price and I agree with you, he's worth more to the Habs than a trade to make another team happy with the price.

 

[Nico Cauzuki]

You're character is showing in the disagreement by using "delusional homer fans". Very disingenuous approach by you at this point in time. If you can't handle a disagreement, that's on you, not me.

Supply and Demand is a big factor. Laugh all you want but that's basically ignorance

It is when there is actually one

Vegas goes after Varlamov so whos all these teams that will battle to give Allen a 1st round pick....

 

[SlafySZN]

I'm good friends with Marco, and know he wouldn't make stuff up. He basically said the Habs inquired and weren't willing to pay the price.

It's silly that this is reported since teams kick tires about players all the time, but this is Montreal, and Beauvillier is a local kid, so here you are.

It’s a Murphy article though!

I just think it’s funny that a ‘’NHL source’’ is cited everytime and been wrong all off-season.

 

[Habs Halifax]

will all depend on Price i think hes knees are done so yes i would rather keep Allen then trade him for a 2nd

I've been telling you this over and over again for a while now and you are saying it now? Seems to me that you are confused and not comprehending what I am saying cause you got "belittle narrative" stuck in your head. You wanna be confrontational, that's a two way street bud

It is when there is actually one

Vegas goes after Varlamov so whos all these teams that will battle to give Allen a 1st round pick....

There is a demand for quality goalies. It's not just Vegas who are looking. Allen has a better cap hit vs Varlamov which provides cap flexibility or ability to add other improvements. Pretty sure you already know this but for some reason, you are ignoring

 

[Nico Cauzuki]

There is a demand for quality goalies. It's not just Vegas who are looking.

name them and whats quality for you because Allen is a fringe starter thats not quality for me and definitely not worth a 1st +

 

[Habs Halifax]

name them and whats quality for you because Allen is a fringe starter thats not quality for me and definitely not worth a 1st +

Multiple reports that Allen has been a sough after commodity dating back to the last deadline. I'm not wasting my time for you when you have belittle narrative stuck in your head on me now. I've seen lots of Allen trade talk and you have to be living under a rock if you think there is no supply/demand issues for teams and their goalie upgrade search.

Possible Reasoning For Canadiens To Hold Jake Allen Trade Talks

Montreal Hockey Now learned that Montreal Canadiens goaltender Jake Allen’s name has started to pop up again in trade discussions across the league, and despite the uncertainty in net, there is some sense in making such a trade before training camp. The Montreal Canadiens goaltender has been a...

montrealhockeynow.com

 

[Runner77]

Multiple reports that Allen has been a sough after commodity dating back to the last deadline. I'm not wasting my time for you when you have belittle narrative stuck in your head on me now. I've seen lots of Allen trade talk and you have to be living under a rock if you think there is no supply/demand issues for teams and their goalie upgrade search.

Possible Reasoning For Canadiens To Hold Jake Allen Trade Talks

Montreal Hockey Now learned that Montreal Canadiens goaltender Jake Allen’s name has started to pop up again in trade discussions across the league, and despite the uncertainty in net, there is some sense in making such a trade before training camp. The Montreal Canadiens goaltender has been a...

montrealhockeynow.com

That piece is mostly rehashing the same thing from a link to the same site that I posted last night, only a few posts ago. They are even alluding to the same unnamed source.

I don’t know why they’re trying so hard to be newsworthy every day when there isn’t a lot going on right now. It’s an impossible standard hence their regurgitation. If I were them, I’d avoid repeating the same content and simply strive for new material 2-3 times a week rather than daily.

 

[HabzSauce]

There is a demand for quality goalies. It's not just Vegas who are looking. Allen has a better cap hit vs Varlamov which provides cap flexibility or ability to add other improvements. Pretty sure you already know this but for some reason, you are ignoring

What teams exactly? You keep saying there is a demand for Allen, but what teams outside of Vegas need a goalie that bad that they would pay a 1st?

I only see Vegas as a team desperate enough to overpay for Allen right now. And if NYI only wants a 2nd for Varly, then we ain't getting jack for Allen - so there a few factors in play here.

However maybe later in the season due to injuries, more teams will need a goalie. We need at least a few more teams to create a bidding war.

 

[nhlfan9191]

I think we easily get a 2nd type offer from several teams. He's got a value contract in a season where there is very little cap space.

If there was no supply/demand and also no cap issues, I'd say his value was meh. But that's just not the reality of the NHL right now. This is a leverage asking price and I agree with you, he's worth more to the Habs than a trade to make another team happy with the price.

Outside of Vegas, who I believe will think they need a real starter if they want to contend with Lehner done all year, who is paying a price to make it worth while? A second is alright value, but like I said he’s worth more to us then just a second round pick. He adds a little bit of stability where as Montembault and Primeau are big question marks. We want to tank, not implode again. That’s not healthy for the locker room. If we were going to trade him, we should’ve did it last year when teams like Edmonton and Toronto were desperate and hadn’t committed to other goalies.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Outside of Vegas, who I believe will think they need a real starter if they want to contend with Lehner done all year, who is paying a price to make it worth while? A second is alright value, but like I said he’s worth more to us then just a second round pick. He adds a little bit of stability where as Montembault and Primeau are big question marks. We want to tank, not implode again. That’s not healthy for the locker room. If we were going to trade him, we should’ve did it last year when teams like Edmonton and Toronto were desperate and hadn’t committed to other goalies.

More in terms of teams looking for 1A and 1B situations to improve their situation. There are a few of them in the NHL. Are they desperate to do it? Not really but that don't mean our price to move Allen should change either.

 

[Habs Halifax]

What teams exactly? You keep saying there is a demand for Allen, but what teams outside of Vegas need a goalie that bad that they would pay a 1st?

I only see Vegas as a team desperate enough to overpay for Allen right now. And if NYI only wants a 2nd for Varly, then we ain't getting jack for Allen - so there a few factors in play here.

However maybe later in the season due to injuries, more teams will need a goalie. We need at least a few more teams to create a bidding war.

You're thinking about starters only where there are a lot of teams looking for 1A/1B situations and would like to improve their situation. Are they desperate to improve it? I don't believe so but lets not pretend there is a clutter of goalie options out there.

List of teams? I'll let you decide that cause you think it's Vegas only. Think 1A/1B situations and you will see my point.

I've seen multiple reports where the Habs are being called about Allen. It make sense to me and it's something I believed even before this off season started.

 

[Habs Halifax]

That piece is mostly rehashing the same thing from a link to the same site that I posted last night, only a few posts ago. They are even alluding to the same unnamed source.

I don’t know why they’re trying so hard to be newsworthy every day when there isn’t a lot going on right now. It’s an impossible standard hence their regurgitation. If I were then, I’d avoid repeating the same content and simply strive for new material 2-3 times a week rather than daily.

I do believe teams are calling the Habs about Allen. Great NHL starters is just not a huge list. There are lots of teams who will try to ride the 1A/1B situation if they can fit it in their cap which is also an issue. And Allen has one of the best 1B goalie contracts in the NHL for this coming season. It makes sense to me that they are interested. Problem is they are calling thinking they can get Allen for a 2nd rounder or less. Habs need higher incentive and what is "fair" don't factor in.

 

[HabzSauce]

You're thinking about starters only where there are a lot of teams looking for 1A/1B situations and would like to improve their situation. Are they desperate to improve it? I don't believe so but lets not pretend there is a clutter of goalie options out there.

List of teams? I'll let you decide that cause you think it's Vegas only. Think 1A/1B situations and you will see my point.

I've seen multiple reports where the Habs are being called about Allen. It make sense to me and it's something I believed even before this off season started.

I'm asking for your opinion because you're the one proposing this outlandish statement that there are "multiple teams" that value Allen enough to give us a 1st for him.

I've gone through all 32 NHL teams - i can see MAYBE a few of them like NJD and DAL that need a 1a/1b, or maybe a team like PITT who has a starter in Jarry but needs a solid backup....but man that's about it. And I don't think any of these teams would value allen so much that they would pry up a 1st. That's a hefty price to pay for a post-season run, especially if these teams aren't contenders.

Why are you so reluctant to provide any of your own opinions as for which teams would want allen that bad?? Normally when people have zero explanation for their claims, it means they are full of you know what.

And I've seen 'reports' too. A report saying "multiple teams are interested in allen" doesn't mean jack. For all we know, they are just kicking tires and offering us 3rds. Those aren't serious bidders.

 

[Habs Halifax]

I'm asking for your opinion because you're the one proposing this outlandish statement that there are "multiple teams" that value Allen enough to give us a 1st for him.

I've gone through all 32 NHL teams - i can see MAYBE a few of them like NJD and DAL that need a 1a/1b, or maybe a team like PITT who has a starter in Jarry but needs a solid backup....but man that's about it. And I don't think any of these teams would value allen so much that they would pry up a 1st. That's a hefty price to pay for a post-season run, especially if these teams aren't contenders.

Why are you so reluctant to provide any of your own opinions as for which teams would want allen that bad?? Normally when people have zero explanation for their claims, it means they are full of you know what.

And I've seen 'reports' too. A report saying "multiple teams are interested in allen" doesn't mean jack. For all we know, they are just kicking tires and offering us 3rds. Those aren't serious bidders.

I didn't say multiple teams would give a 1st though. I said multiple teams would love to add him with the cap hit he has but they likely are calling thinking they can acquire for cheap. Comprehend it better please before you use "outlandish" narratives. You don't need to put sauce on it bud

All these teams can use upgrades or a better 2nd goalie when your plan is to ride with a 1A/1B situation which has been a clear trend in the NHL... Coyotes, Sabres, Oilers, Kings, Preds, Flyers, Sharks, Caps.... and Vegas who would be more on the desperate side of things vs the other teams.

Not reluctant and you could have reviewed the NHL teams as well to find the same information when we are talking 1A/1B situations. There are many teams who will have that strategy and like I said, it's been a clear trend in the NHL. No doubt in my mind the Habs had several calls about Allen's value contract.