HF Habs: Trade Proposal Thread #79

[Runner77]

The "get him for free later" crowd is mostly filled with people who just don't like Dubois. If you really like a player, you try to find a way to get it done and if it does not work, you move on.

I like that girl, there's something about her, but she is going to school in Winnipeg, and has a boyfriend right now she is apparently not ready/willing to marry. My friends are worried I may not be able to win her over now, and I may not be able to keep her afterwards because I still have two years of school left and am in life building phase. Other mutual friends are telling me she kind of likes me and is from Montreal.

Should I take the advice to wait until her current relationship ends (looks like two years IF NO ONE ELSE MAKES A MOVE) and at that point if the people who say she likes me and wants to move to Montreal are right, she'll come running!

If I took the advice to not reach out, it would logically be that I don't really think she could be part of my life when I finish building it.

Your girlfriend is not costing you Dach, a Florida unprotected 1st, Barron, and whatnot. Your reaching out to her is a simple and cheap option.

 

[Frank JT]

There's no way we can compete with the suckfest some teams like Chicago are preparing.
There's no way we move pass.....well, pretty much anyone in the east.

That's with or without Dubois.
We have D and G problems and adding a forward won't change that.

I don't agree. Price could be healty, as Montembault and Allen could be better next season. Edmundson (who was injured a large part of last season) will be there with Petry (good duo). MSL effect will be there also. PLD could help our offense and grab a couple of points that could kick us in the teeth.

 

[McPhees Moustache]

I guess I just view Dubois as a complimentary piece - he’ll be a good second liner but a C line of him and Suzuki sill screams middle of the pack to me when I look around the league. I want a truly elite centre with the possibility of putting up 100pts/season and have the patience to wait for the right opportunity t come along. Locking in Dubois as a 2C at this point just seems like an attempted shortcut to the rebuild that will ultimately lower what we could become. A month ago it seemed like most people were on board for the play the season/sell the vets narrative - trying to bring in Dubois right now just screams of ‘instant gratification’ as opposed to being the smart choice

 

[The Great Weal]

Lol Your quantity doesn’t equal any quality for a a good young player
You obviously don’t like Dubois but that proposal was embarrassing
Imagine someone offered that for Suzuki
You’d be laughing your ass off

Suzuki made Dubois his bitch last year in the playoffs. Suzuki is a vastly better player, isn't quitting on his team twice, and is younger. If you want a comparable look at what Jacob Trouba got since it's a similar scenario.

Yeah, I've only noticed now that, for whatever reason, you've equaled Dach (a 1st rounder) and a non-1st round prospect to two 1st rounders, based on on the pick number we've traded for Dach (13 OA). I'm not sure why would you do that, but good for you.

Should I assign the value of Dubois as "two late 1sts" based on the fact he was picked 3OA and add another 1st to account for the fact that he's a proven top-6C? See? 3 firsts!

What does the fact that Dubois was traded for Laine and Roslovic is worth? Maybe another 1st pick shold be added to his "value"?



I already understand that you want nothing to do with this player.

Not sure why you believe every first-rounder is worth the same, but good for you.

Let me make it even more clear for you since you are struggling a lot with this.

OFFER 1: Dubois for Dvorak, Byron, FLA 1st 2023 (unprotected), and a prospect not named Guhle/Slaf/Mesar.

You already acknowledged that this offer includes 3 1sts.

OFFER 2: Dubois for Dach, Hoffman, FLA 1st 2023 (unprotected), and a prospect not in your top 8.

Dach JUST got traded for the 13th OA+. He's clearly worth more than Dvorak despite where he was drafted 3 years ago. That's an actual fact given Dvorak's return.

So there is a considerable difference between Dach (i.e 13th OA) and Dvorak (i.e 27th OA). So the "1st round value" is not similar at all just like how the value between a prospect like Barron is not the same as a prospect not in our top 8...

Also what happened to not getting agitated?

 

[Andy]

I guess I just view Dubois as a complimentary piece - he’ll be a good second liner but a C line of him and Suzuki sill screams middle of the pack to me when I look around the league. I want a truly elite centre with the possibility of putting up 100pts/season and have the patience to wait for the right opportunity t come along. Locking in Dubois as a 2C at this point just seems like an attempted shortcut to the rebuild that will ultimately lower what we could become. A month ago it seemed like most people were on board for the play the season/sell the vets narrative - trying to bring in Dubois right now just screams of ‘instant gratification’ as opposed to being the smart choice

Boston and the Blues have shown you don’t need a 100 point centre to win. You need a balance of good offensive and being hard to play against defensively.

Suzuki is really good.

 

[Jack Skellington]

Put me in the crowd that doesn't want to trade Anderson. I get excited every time he is on the ice.
For PLD? - ok, but he is a crowd favorite and awesome for a playoff team. But no way am I considering him a throw in or a salary dump. If Jets fans don't want him then that is perfectly fine by me.
He was a big reason we beat Toronto 2 years ago. The defense kept coughing up the puck when he went into the corner with them. This stuff doesn't show up on analytics charts.

They team would be awesome with all of Slaf, Dubois and Anderson - Dach too.
They make room for guys like Caufield and Farrell.

You must own the company that cleans the scuff marks off the boards lol

 

[Skip Bayless]

I guess I just view Dubois as a complimentary piece - he’ll be a good second liner but a C line of him and Suzuki sill screams middle of the pack to me when I look around the league. I want a truly elite centre with the possibility of putting up 100pts/season and have the patience to wait for the right opportunity t come along. Locking in Dubois as a 2C at this point just seems like an attempted shortcut to the rebuild that will ultimately lower what we could become. A month ago it seemed like most people were on board for the play the season/sell the vets narrative - trying to bring in Dubois right now just screams of ‘instant gratification’ as opposed to being the smart choice

I view Dubois as our solution for our 1LW or 2LW, depending on Slaf's development.

 

[Harry Kakalovich]

I guess I just view Dubois as a complimentary piece - he’ll be a good second liner but a C line of him and Suzuki sill screams middle of the pack to me when I look around the league. I want a truly elite centre with the possibility of putting up 100pts/season and have the patience to wait for the right opportunity t come along. Locking in Dubois as a 2C at this point just seems like an attempted shortcut to the rebuild that will ultimately lower what we could become. A month ago it seemed like most people were on board for the play the season/sell the vets narrative - trying to bring in Dubois right now just screams of ‘instant gratification’ as opposed to being the smart choice

Yeah he's the type of low end top 6 player the Habs always end up with that's overpaid and always leaves you wanting more.

 

[HostileCapSpace]

Hillarious how people don't think a 60pt center is a #2 center. Pld is top 25 in his position last year in pts and goals. What exactly do you guys think a #2 center is??

If we get PLD and retain Dach the issue we will have is that the #2 and #3 centers would suck on faceoffs, not that PLD is not a proper #2.

People always overestimate what a top line player makes around the league because they focus on the top 10 best players.

Dubois is 74th in points and 54th in goals among forwards - so yeah, he's easily a 2nd line player. His numbers are 1st line player level. So even if he's "plateaud" like I see some posters say he's still a first or second line player.

Sure, we all want Bedard, but PLD is not going to matter. What will matter is our goaltending, our terrible D corps, if we get rid of players like Petry and Anderson, and most importantly: pure luck at the lottery draft.

We can hope Dach becomes as good but the chances of that happening are slim. At the same age Dubois had more than twice the production, three times the goals, and he could actually win a faceoff once in a while. Plus Dubois actually uses his body.

 

[Harry Kakalovich]

I view Dubois as our solution for our 1LW or 2LW, depending on Slaf's development.

If you're paying a LW 7.5M he better be REALLY good

 

[McPhees Moustache]

Boston and the Blues have shown you don’t need a 100 point centre to win. You need a balance of good offensive and being hard to play against defensively.

Suzuki is really good.

I know there a multiple ‘recipes’ for success - we could go out, find the next great goalie and play trap hockey and win every game 2-1.
Based on the vision Gorton and Hughes laid out upon their arrival we were going to transition to a more fast-paced offensive style game. It’s been 3+ decades since we’ve had anything resembling this as a team style and I am quite excited at this possibility. That being said while Suzuki amd Dubois could be an effective 1/2C combination I don’t think the fit this MO.

 

[Harry Kakalovich]

People always overestimate what a top line player makes around the league because they focus on the top 10 best players.

Dubois is 74th in points and 54th in goals among forwards - so yeah, he's easily a 2nd line player. His numbers are 1st line player level. So even if he's "plateaud" like I see some posters say he's still a first or second line player.

Sure, we all want Bedard, but PLD is not going to matter. What will matter is our goaltending, our terrible D corps, if we get rid of players like Petry and Anderson, and most importantly: pure luck at the lottery draft.

We can hope Dach becomes as good but the chances of that happening are slim. At the same age Dubois had more than twice the production, three times the goals, and he could actually win a faceoff once in a while. Plus Dubois actually uses his body.

Are you using his average Ppg over the past 3 seasons or just his most recent contract season to tabulate your conclusion?

 

[Runner77]

But now a Winnipeg journalist, Murat Ates, who works for The Athletic, adds a layer and argues that the general manager of the Jets, Kevin Cheveldayoff, is in a very ordinary position to negotiate the rights of his striker.

“The major negotiating lever for Kent Hughes here, and which plays in favor of the Canadians, is that Pierre-Luc Dubois has just made it all extremely clear: he intends to sign with CH in two years. The return that the Jets could receive in a trade, with a team other than Montreal is therefore affected by this. (They know he will still end up in Montreal in 2024).

“Multiple very reliable sources have confirmed to The Athletic that wearing the Bleu-Blanc-Rouge uniform is a dream for Dubois and he is not shy to talk about it openly.

"I think that at a certain point, whether it's this summer or next, or even in two years, when he will be an unrestricted free agent, it seems inevitable at that point if you ask me if Pierre-Luc Dubois will be a Montreal Canadiens one day. - Murat Ates

Imagine how happy that already dysfunctional Jets dressing room is going to be thanks to a turncoat teammate who has been relentlessly campaigning to play for another team.

Dubois is just the guy Chevaldayoff will want to begin his season with after all of this.

 

[Habricot]

I guess I just view Dubois as a complimentary piece - he’ll be a good second liner but a C line of him and Suzuki sill screams middle of the pack to me when I look around the league. I want a truly elite centre with the possibility of putting up 100pts/season and have the patience to wait for the right opportunity t come along. Locking in Dubois as a 2C at this point just seems like an attempted shortcut to the rebuild that will ultimately lower what we could become. A month ago it seemed like most people were on board for the play the season/sell the vets narrative - trying to bring in Dubois right now just screams of ‘instant gratification’ as opposed to being the smart choice

4 years ago the same was said about Tempa .. Stamkos, Point, Gould..

 

[Destopcorner]

But now a Winnipeg journalist, Murat Ates, who works for The Athletic, adds a layer and argues that the general manager of the Jets, Kevin Cheveldayoff, is in a very ordinary position to negotiate the rights of his striker.

“The major negotiating lever for Kent Hughes here, and which plays in favor of the Canadians, is that Pierre-Luc Dubois has just made it all extremely clear: he intends to sign with CH in two years. The return that the Jets could receive in a trade, with a team other than Montreal is therefore affected by this. (They know he will still end up in Montreal in 2024).

“Multiple very reliable sources have confirmed to The Athletic that wearing the Bleu-Blanc-Rouge uniform is a dream for Dubois and he is not shy to talk about it openly.

"I think that at a certain point, whether it's this summer or next, or even in two years, when he will be an unrestricted free agent, it seems inevitable at that point if you ask me if Pierre-Luc Dubois will be a Montreal Canadiens one day. - Murat Ates

Dubois is coming home soon enough, just need to find the middle ground with Chevy. It's common knowledge they'd like to bring Barron for the brother connection and want to stay competitive this year. Might be a good time to give more quality to shed more salary.

A combo of Dach and Barron is imo too much for a disgruted PLD, plus the salary doesn't work. The only way this could fit is by sending Gallagher contract as negative value. Winnipeg gets 2 great cost controlleds NHL ready prospects plus a former 30 goal winger still able to dcore 20 while leading by example and be a good influence in the locker room.

Dach/Barron/Gallagher + a pick or B prospect, would you do it?

 

[Richiebottles]

There is no way they start with PLD on the roster.

Just look at what happened in CBJ, once there is media attention and it becomes a distraction a move is made sooner rather than later.

 

[McPhees Moustache]

4 years ago the same was said about Tempa .. Stamkos, Point, Gould..

Not sure I get the reference but I don’t think a C lineup of Suzuki/Dubois could compete with Stamkos/Point…..maybe in a few years if they have quite a bit of untapped development left?

 

[Saundies]

I guess I just view Dubois as a complimentary piece - he’ll be a good second liner but a C line of him and Suzuki sill screams middle of the pack to me when I look around the league. I want a truly elite centre with the possibility of putting up 100pts/season and have the patience to wait for the right opportunity t come along. Locking in Dubois as a 2C at this point just seems like an attempted shortcut to the rebuild that will ultimately lower what we could become. A month ago it seemed like most people were on board for the play the season/sell the vets narrative - trying to bring in Dubois right now just screams of ‘instant gratification’ as opposed to being the smart choice

Do you understand how rare 100 pt C’s are and how much they actually make a difference? Toronto has 2 and haven’t done shit all. Meanwhile, we almost won the cup with Danault/Suzuki.

You need to have the RIGHT 100 pt C to get over the hump. Connor McDavid gets 130 points a year. Draisatl 120. What have they won?

It’s fine and dandy to want to “wait” but realistically you have to get lucky for it happen. PLD/Suzuki/Dach is a solid, solid top 3 to build on. Like someone mentioned above , if we get insanely lucky and end up with Bedard or Michkov, you trade one of them for other needed pieces.

 

[Harry Kakalovich]

I think I'd rather have Drouin 1x5.5M than PLD 8x7.5M

 

[Spring in Fialta]

Interesting that many here who are hoping we acquire Dubois don't think he'll move the needle and affect our 2023 tank aspirations. If he isn't good enough to move that needle, why in the hell should we trade for and invest in a high salaried 24 year old who can't stay in one spot for more than 2 years without being unhappy?

The rub here seems that he can't stay in a spot for more than two years because he's desperate to play here. His trade requests always arrive when he doesn't have a contract.

 

[Harry Kakalovich]

Do you understand how rare 100 pt C’s are and how much they actually make a difference? Toronto has 2 and haven’t done shit all. Meanwhile, we almost won the cup with Danault/Suzuki.

You need to have the RIGHT 100 pt C to get over the hump. Connor McDavid gets 130 points a year. Draisatl 120. What have they won?

It’s fine and dandy to want to “wait” but realistically you have to get lucky for it happen. PLD/Suzuki/Dach is a solid, solid top 3 to build on. Like someone mentioned above , if we get insanely lucky and end up with Bedard or Michkov, you trade one of them for other needed pieces.

I don't think it is 100 point centers. It's just that PLD is a low end top 6 player.

 

[McPhees Moustache]

Do you understand how rare 100 pt C’s are and how much they actually make a difference? Toronto has 2 and haven’t done shit all. Meanwhile, we almost won the cup with Danault/Suzuki.

You need to have the RIGHT 100 pt C to get over the hump. Connor McDavid gets 130 points a year. Draisatl 120. What have they won?

It’s fine and dandy to want to “wait” but realistically you have to get lucky for it happen. PLD/Suzuki/Dach is a solid, solid top 3 to build on. Like someone mentioned above , if we get insanely lucky and end up with Bedard or Michkov, you trade one of them for other needed pieces.

Haven’t seen Toronto’s second 100pt C?
It’s not about the actual number for me but the style of play/potential.
I agree that we can trade assets later on if we have redundancy at certain positions but if we talking about maximizing asset value you can’t really beat picking Dubois up for free in two years, unless of course you see him as some kind of irreplaceable part that won’t be available in a couple years when we’re ready to actually compete

 

[Canadienna]

I think I'd rather have Drouin 1x5.5M than PLD 8x7.5M

I don't get it. Do you think Dubois is a bad player?

I'm not a huge fan of his but 7.5m x 8 seems pretty fair and locks him up for his prime.

 

[Saundies]

I don't think it is 100 point centers. It's just that PLD is a low end top 6 player.

Suzuki/PLD at 23/24 would easily be our best C tandem in the last 30 years. It’s funny how Habs fans are suddenly too good for a (so far) 60 point C.

 

[Destopcorner]

I think I'd rather have Drouin 1x5.5M than PLD 8x7.5M

Thank god you ain't part of the management. Don't leave your day job !!!