Speculation: Trade Deadline

[deadhead]

1. All the film in the world didn't help Jeff much
2. The league has seen a yuuuge sample size from one year's play off
3. Small is an issue, especially looking at Tampa

TB defensemen:
Hedman 6'6 223
McDonagh 6'1 215
Stralman 5'11 190
Cernak 6'4 225
Sergachev 6'3 215
Girardi 6'1 212
Coburn 6'5 223

There just aren't a lot of small defensemen:
Barrie 5'10 190
Butcher 5'10 190
Djoos 6'0 169
Ellis 5'10 180
Girard 5'10 162
Hicketts 5'8 180
Honka 5'10 180
Hunt 5'9 187
Krug 5'9 186
Mete 5'9 183
Spurgeon 5'9 167

 

[kudymen]

TB defensemen:
Hedman 6'6 223
McDonagh 6'1 215
Stralman 5'11 190
Cernak 6'4 225
Sergachev 6'3 215
Girardi 6'1 212
Coburn 6'5 223

And how is Stralman doing?

But I concede, because in the TOP10 teams league wise:
Tampa has one D who is an inch taller than Ghost - and any lady appreciates an inch more so this logic is absolutely impossible to defeat
Calgary has all D at 6'0 at least
San Jose has 3 guys at 5'11 (that extra inch again!)
Winnipeg, NYI same as Calgary
Nashville has Ryan Ellis at 5'10 (and I can only imagine his play off tape is terrible), Yannick Weber is at 5'11 but 200 pounds - heavy!
Vegas is yuuuge, everyone 6'1 at least!
Toronto just like Calgary, WPG, NYI, at least 6'0
Capitals' only sub 6 feet player would be Orlov, again very heavy at 212
CBJ like Vegas

All in all, Ghost is small. Lacks that one extra inch to be on a TOP10 team. If there is something we need, it is not a small guy capable of >60 points. Even if he was the only small lacking heaviness in that group. Just no.

 

[Beef Invictus]

Multiple players have made it clear Hakstol was garbage at communicating. Hakstol himself said he was garbage at communicating. I don't know why this is a debate anymore, it's easily settled.

 

[FatTugboatFlahr]

would you guys do a basis of Ceci for Ghost swap?

I’d spit straight in your face for even mentioning it.

 

[BernieParent]

Well Duchene plays C and Wing - but yeah you guys are deep at C

Dont thinks theres a chance Stone would sign in Philly and as a rental doesn't make any sense

Duchene is a talented forward who is justified in looking for a contract that isn't palatable to the Flyers' salary structure. Sorry for the run-on sentence. I would love to have him as a 2C in a no-cap league.

 

[kudymen]

I am not even trying to be a douchelord here, but numerous sources indicated communication might have been an issue, Hak commenting on that too, i.e. maybe it is acceptable for me to mention it too without being with the team 24/7; we have also seen in the past what is Ghost capable of doing at his size and strength, so despite a sample size of 6 PO games under Dave Hakstol last year, it is not that outlandish to suggest he may be more than useful for our D corps. But he has a down year so bleh bleh bleh

 

[Striiker]

I am not even trying to be a *****elord here, but numerous sources indicated communication might have been an issue, Hak commenting on that too, i.e. maybe it is acceptable for me to mention it too without being with the team 24/7; we have also seen in the past what is Ghost capable of doing at his size and strength, so despite a sample size of 6 PO games under Dave Hakstol last year, it is not that outlandish to suggest he may be more than useful for our D corps. But he has a down year so bleh bleh bleh

You're indisputably in the right here.

It's a fact that Hakstol was bad with communication. Players said it, HAKSTOL said it, and then once Hakstol was gone the players remarked on how happy they were to have a coach that communicates with them. This isn't an assumption or an argument, this is a fact.

Just like it's an indisputable fact that judging Ghost based on 6 games is an idiotic thing to do and a clear sign of bias against the player. Anyone with a shred of common sense would know that this isn't enough to draw any conclusions worth a damn... especially when you see the disaster that was our goaltending and know the effect that going down multiple goals early has on the play styles of both teams.

 

[Beef Invictus]

I am not even trying to be a *****elord here, but numerous sources indicated communication might have been an issue, Hak commenting on that too, i.e. maybe it is acceptable for me to mention it too without being with the team 24/7; we have also seen in the past what is Ghost capable of doing at his size and strength, so despite a sample size of 6 PO games under Dave Hakstol last year, it is not that outlandish to suggest he may be more than useful for our D corps. But he has a down year so bleh bleh bleh

This fanbase always has people eager to quit on unique talents at the first opportunity. It was true of Couturier too. There were even people who wanted to trade Giroux once upon a time, citing his size as a hard limitation he could never overcome and reasoning that his best value to the team was via trade.

 

[kudymen]

This fanbase always has people eager to quit on unique talents at the first opportunity. It was true of Couturier too. There were even people who wanted to trade Giroux once upon a time, citing his size as a hard limitation he could never overcome and reasoning that his best value to the team was via trade.

In a way I understand the sentiment, if it stems simply from frustration. But even then, why would you call Patrick a bust in his sophomore season (where his numbers are NOT horrendous anyway),
....why trade Ghost now of all seasons (we have seen what he can do, he has a bad year but a good contract which itself should allow him a this wont cost much so why not kind of chance),
...why trade Couturier who consistently contributed positively in positions where needed at said time. I have saved that "Could Hextall trade Giroux?" thread from 2014, because it was glorious - not the reasons you were saying, but the trade was meant to create cap space (!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!).
...Why trade Jake while saying we need more talent and up the scoring. But the Couturier talk is my favorite because I have basically seen it ever since I was a member.

The panic mode when Hart hits a bit of a rough stretch (and he will, everybody will.. if not, he is Hašek and I love him immediately ), I cant even imagine what happens.

 

[JojoTheWhale]

This fanbase always has people eager to quit on unique talents at the first opportunity. It was true of Couturier too. There were even people who wanted to trade Giroux once upon a time, citing his size as a hard limitation he could never overcome and reasoning that his best value to the team was via trade.

The fanbase at large is ready to quit on everyone. There are still people who want to trade Giroux while his value is high. It’s notable when there’s an exception.

They’re also chiefly the people who pontificate on how right they were about X unprompted, which could not be more perfect.

 

[Striiker]

I have a hard time believing anyone who wanted to trade Giroux is ever right about anything.

 

[deadhead]

And how is Stralman doing?

But I concede, because in the TOP10 teams league wise:
Tampa has one D who is an inch taller than Ghost - and any lady appreciates an inch more so this logic is absolutely impossible to defeat
Calgary has all D at 6'0 at least
San Jose has 3 guys at 5'11 (that extra inch again!)
Winnipeg, NYI same as Calgary
Nashville has Ryan Ellis at 5'10 (and I can only imagine his play off tape is terrible), Yannick Weber is at 5'11 but 200 pounds - heavy!
Vegas is yuuuge, everyone 6'1 at least!
Toronto just like Calgary, WPG, NYI, at least 6'0
Capitals' only sub 6 feet player would be Orlov, again very heavy at 212
CBJ like Vegas

All in all, Ghost is small. Lacks that one extra inch to be on a TOP10 team. If there is something we need, it is not a small guy capable of >60 points. Even if he was the only small lacking heaviness in that group. Just no.

Uh, height does not equate with "small." A mistake made by too many people. This ain't basketball.
NAK is only 5'11, no one thinks he's small.
It's mass that matters, a 180 lb D-man is going to struggle to move a 210 lb forward in front of the net.
Guys with squat bodies like Kimmo or now Friedman are strong enough to use leverage.

 

[kudymen]

Uh, height does not equate with "small." A mistake made by too many people. This ain't basketball.
NAK is only 5'11, no one thinks he's small.
It's mass that matters, a 180 lb D-man is going to struggle to move a 210 lb forward in front of the net.
Guys with squat bodies like Kimmo or now Friedman are strong enough to use leverage.

Yeah thats why I asked about Stralman who is 190.

I listed height but weight (which I listed in cases where it had some meaning) usually went in line with what I said at respective teams - like Calgary has everyone bigger etc. I should have, uh, mentioned that.

Anyway, glad to see almost-Ghost (5'10 185 X 5'11 190) player is doing fine for the league's top team, which is basically what I asked.

 

[HSF]

LMFAO

NO

Why are we getting so many awful trade proposals lately?

I have seen some terrible proposals for stone here too

I guess I was wondering if ghost was someone who needed a change of scenery like our players do

If Ottawa and Philly are scouting each other it will be interesting to see maybe it's Anderson as a vet presence for Hart ? Would you guys even want pending ufas like Duchene or stone ? Seems unlikely

 

[Beef Invictus]

We've watched Ghost get the most out of his size before and know he can do it.

 

[Rebels57]

I have seen some terrible proposals for stone here too

I guess I was wondering if ghost was someone who needed a change of scenery like our players do

If Ottawa and Philly are scouting each other it will be interesting to see maybe it's Anderson as a vet presence for Hart ? Would you guys even want pending ufas like Duchene or stone ? Seems unlikely

Well Stone is a pending UFA. Ghost is on an incredible contract.

He just had 65 points last season. The PP has collapsed this season which has hurt quite a few players production. It will bounce back and so will Ghost. Besides, up until Hakstol was fired and Hart called up, there was too much turmoil around the team and it would be foolish to judge individuals based on it.

We would want Stone in the summer as a UFA but I doubt we'd trade much for him now.

Would love to have Anderson to mentor Hart.

 

[Striiker]

It'll never fail to amuse me how hard some try to downplay the importance of scoring. Literally the most important thing in the entire sport.

A player who can score is the most valuable thing you can have. It's tangible value. Indisputable proof that they help the team win. Even defense doesn't have the same value because there's too many factors that could lead to a goal not being scored, separate from the actions of a good defensive player.

Obviously that doesn't mean that defensive players don't have value, they absolutely do, but it's incredible how there's this reputation that a player who scores but doesn't defend is the worst thing ever but a player who defends but can't score is a noble hero.

Then you have a guy like Gostisbehere, who's a top offensive defensemen and not bad defensively, and somehow fans act like he's expendable and do everything in their power to exaggerate his every flaw and mistake. I really just can't understand how you can watch these games over the past few years and not realize how unbelievably stupid it would be to trade him. It seems to just come down to narratives with most of the people advocating it. People known to have some strange agenda against him and they're going to screech and cry until he's gone. Pretty pathetic. Luckily for us, the chances that Fletcher is as clueless as they are is pretty slim.

 

[Bigkarl]

In a way I understand the sentiment, if it stems simply from frustration. But even then, why would you call Patrick a bust in his sophomore season (where his numbers are NOT horrendous anyway),
....why trade Ghost now of all seasons (we have seen what he can do, he has a bad year but a good contract which itself should allow him a this wont cost much so why not kind of chance),
...why trade Couturier who consistently contributed positively in positions where needed at said time. I have saved that "Could Hextall trade Giroux?" thread from 2014, because it was glorious - not the reasons you were saying, but the trade was meant to create cap space (!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!).
...Why trade Jake while saying we need more talent and up the scoring. But the Couturier talk is my favorite because I have basically seen it ever since I was a member.

The panic mode when Hart hits a bit of a rough stretch (and he will, everybody will.. if not, he is Hašek and I love him immediately ), I cant even imagine what happens.

I was just recently thinking how much I’m going to dread reading some of the stuff on hfboards when Hart inevitably hits a wall in the next season or two.

 

[Striiker]

I was just recently thinking how much I’m going to dread reading some of the stuff on hfboards when Hart inevitably hits a wall in the next season or two.

The second he hits a rough patch there will be posts saying how he was rushed, ruined, overrated, a disappointment, etc etc etc

As predictable as the sunrise.

 

[SanBlom]

It'll never fail to amuse me how hard some try to downplay the importance of scoring. Literally the most important thing in the entire sport.

A player who can score is the most valuable thing you can have. It's tangible value. Indisputable proof that they help the team win. Even defense doesn't have the same value because there's too many factors that could lead to a goal not being scored, separate from the actions of a good defensive player.

Obviously that doesn't mean that defensive players don't have value, they absolutely do, but it's incredible how there's this reputation that a player who scores but doesn't defend is the worst thing ever but a player who defends but can't score is a noble hero.

Then you have a guy like Gostisbehere, who's a top offensive defensemen and not bad defensively, and somehow fans act like he's expendable and do everything in their power to exaggerate his every flaw and mistake. I really just can't understand how you can watch these games over the past few years and not realize how unbelievably stupid it would be to trade him. It seems to just come down to narratives with most of the people advocating it. People known to have some strange agenda against him and they're going to screech and cry until he's gone. Pretty pathetic. Luckily for us, the chances that Fletcher is as clueless as they are is pretty slim.

Thank you!

 

[BackToTheBrierePatch]

This fanbase always has people eager to quit on unique talents at the first opportunity. It was true of Couturier too. There were even people who wanted to trade Giroux once upon a time, citing his size as a hard limitation he could never overcome and reasoning that his best value to the team was via trade.

Jeff Carter was a whipping boy for some reason. All the guy did was produce. But he wasnt a fighter and wasn’t physical.
This fanbase will turn on Giroux on the downside of his career when he isnt producing. Not that has never happened before.

 

[Beef Invictus]

Jeff Carter was a whipping boy for some reason. All the guy did was produce. But he wasnt a fighter and wasn’t physical.
This fanbase will turn on Giroux on the downside of his career when he isnt producing. Not that has never happened before.

Oh man, the avalanche of complaints that came every single time he took a shot that didn't score. Like it was expected he'd never miss the net and would shoot at 100%.

 

[Magua]

so many great posts

 

[BackToTheBrierePatch]

I was just recently thinking how much I’m going to dread reading some of the stuff on hfboards when Hart inevitably hits a wall in the next season or two.

Well teams will definitely be looking to exploit his weaknesses once there is enough tape. But he seems to be strong mentally and has a high hockey IQ.
The flip flopping we do as fans on many players is hilarious. Player X has a 5 point pointless streak he sucks and should be benched or traded. Scores 12 in the next 5 and we talk MVP. So many times there is no middle ground

 

[Rebels57]

Carter can forever f*** off for ghosting on us in the 2010 playoffs.