GDT: Trade Deadline: Tampa won the Jeannot sweepstakes!

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Gurglesons

Registered User
Dec 18, 2009
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Joshua Tree, CA
last-train-tocool.blogspot.com
We have Letang and Dumo who are physical. Petry and Rutta who are too. We aren't lacking physicality.

If anything, we are lacking high-offense dmen capable of putting up actual points. Gavrikov does not help that nor does his addition support that.

I'm not against Gavrikov. I do like him as a player. I'm just suggesting that going out of our way to trade Pettersson to bring him in is, at the end of the day, paying assets to needlessly rearrange the deck chairs on the Titanic.

Gavrikov has 3 goals in 52 games which is more goals than Pettersson has in his last 120.

Pettersson isn’t really anything special. He’s fine and I don’t want to give him away, but he’s overpaid and if we can get out of the contract do it.
 

Sidney the Kidney

One last time
Jun 29, 2009
56,382
48,308
Gavrikov has 3 goals in 52 games which is more goals than Pettersson has in his last 120.

Pettersson isn’t really anything special. He’s fine and I don’t want to give him away, but he’s overpaid and if we can get out of the contract do it.
Pettersson's one of the poster boys for why I still think analytics have a long way to go. Analytics paint him as some sort of great contributor to offense, but it does NOT show up in his actual production.

Anyone who adheres strongly to the accuracy of these analytics, please make that make sense. How does a guy with zero goals and not even that many assists translate into this really good offense driver?
 

Captain Hook

Registered User
Jul 12, 2007
15,463
396
Kane is interesting. He's not having a great year by his standards but you have to consider that Chicago's lineup might be the worst in the league and Kane did hit 92 points just last year when he had someone good to play with (DeBrincat). Salary cap is an issue and I don't think scoring winger is our biggest need. Still rather focus on a good #3 Center and possibly goalie depth.
 

Gurglesons

Registered User
Dec 18, 2009
95,090
76,892
Joshua Tree, CA
last-train-tocool.blogspot.com
Kane is interesting. He's not having a great year by his standards but you have to consider that Chicago's lineup might be the worst in the league and Kane did hit 92 points just last year when he had someone good to play with (DeBrincat). Salary cap is an issue and I don't think scoring winger is our biggest need. Still rather focus on a good #3 Center and possibly goalie depth.

The big issue with this team is defensive commitment. Adding arguably the worst defensive player in the league would be insane.

The package for Kane is likely similar to the package for ROR, I take him all day over Kane.
 

SEALBound

Fancy Gina Carano
Sponsor
Jun 13, 2010
42,084
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Pettersson's one of the poster boys for why I still think analytics have a long way to go. Analytics paint him as some sort of great contributor to offense, but it does NOT show up in his actual production.

Anyone who adheres strongly to the accuracy of these analytics, please make that make sense. How does a guy with zero goals and not even that many assists translate into this really good offense driver?
I think a good comparison is Rakell. We can watch him game in and game out making positive contributions on the ice, especially on the forecheck that lead to high-quality chances and goals but he doesn't end up getting the assist. There have been numerous times this season that his hard work and forecheck created the play that we end up scoring on and the scoresheet says "Crosby from Guentzel and Letang" (or similar) but if you watch, it was Rakell that made it happen.

With that, if he's with Letang that helps as Letang tends to drive offense as well. So if you can be a good partner that contributes to the continuation of play that leads to offense, then you are doing your job. Sometimes that will translate into points, sometimes not. At the end of the day, that's not why he's here though.

Going back to Rakell, when I looked at the stat line and thought he should have WAY more points than what he does, especially based on the eye test, I took the position of "well as long as the line is scoring with his contributions and we are winning, I will put less emphasis on his individual stat line" and i think that's an incredibly reasonable approach to a guy like Rakell.

Likewise, I think the same can be said for Pettersson.

My issue with moving Pettersson is salary and contract lengths. While everyone here wants to get out of the deal for some reason, they quickly forget the fact that contract rates and lengths are increasing, not decreasing. The natural "inflation" of salaries means that you are likely paying a $3mil guy $4-5mil now. So if we move Pettersson and look to replace him with a $4mil player, I believe that player will provide a lesser level of play than what Pettersson currently is. Petts plays up and down the lineup on all three pairings. He's fine on the top pair with Letang too so that's a relatively rare asset to have locked up at a reasonable rate.

Pettersson has this year + 2 more years at $4mil and is 26yo. He is far from a contract issue at his current level of play.

It's like "Let's trade Zucker so that we can sign Bertuzzi for $7mil!" Ummmm...why? Is Bertuzzi really giving us THAT much more than Zucker would at a reduced hit? Gotta think he goes for what Saad does, or close, at $4.5mil for 4yrs. So why are we so quick to get rid of someone only to replace them with an, at best, equal asset that costs us more in cap?
 

bigdaddyk88

Registered User
Apr 21, 2019
4,300
844
All i want is Teddy for 4th and Dumo for a 2nd opening up spots for AHl guys since both are ufa. If we make the playoffs it’s probably one and done anyway
 

Jobeycool

Registered User
Jun 20, 2019
3,115
818
Chychrun is the only guy worth going all in for.. IMO... 1rst/ Rust etc, etc. This sitting back and not making trades is killing this league..
 

Freeptop

Registered User
Jun 17, 2009
2,399
1,299
Pittsburgh, PA
Pettersson's one of the poster boys for why I still think analytics have a long way to go. Analytics paint him as some sort of great contributor to offense, but it does NOT show up in his actual production.

Anyone who adheres strongly to the accuracy of these analytics, please make that make sense. How does a guy with zero goals and not even that many assists translate into this really good offense driver?

Many analytics get mistaken as being solely about offense, when they might instead be indicating good _defense_. That's because good defense can lead indirectly to good offense.

For example: breaking up an attack, retrieving the puck, and getting it out of the zone and up the ice towards the offensive zone. Those are all plays that are very good defensive plays, and they do lead to offense eventually, in that you generally don't score goals if you don't have the puck in the first place. But from that far back in the action, so to speak, those plays don't tend to end up on the scoresheet. Especially with a pass-happy team like the Pens.

A player like Petterson ends up having good puck posesssion stats, because he does a lot to get the puck off the other team, and get it out of his own zone. So for example, that means that Petterson is going to have lower Corsi Against, or Expected Goals Against stats because of the work he does in his own end. Meanwhile, since he generally plays with offensively talented players, his own Corsi For or Expected Goals For stats are going to be higher. That translates into excellent CF% or xG% stats. Which some people interpret (incorrectly) as meaning he is good offensively.

One of these days, I should really write up a post about analytics, and what they're actually telling us (free preview: they don't actually indicate which player is overall "better" than another one all on their own).
 

Ugene Magic

EVIL LAUGH
Oct 17, 2008
54,998
19,489
Pittsburgh

No to Vrana. He costs even more than Bertuzzi whom I don't like for reasons.

Which Vrana are you going to get? If he was hot off the Caps lineup it would be a hard-time passing him up. This team doesn't need anymore sob stories, though him on the team would mean less goals in their own net. I'd like to think Vrana was what everyone hoped Kapanen would be in Vrana's hey day. Unfortunately, I'd think we'd just end up with two Kapanens considering he would not touch the top six in prime minutes. His 5.250 is not worth taking that chance this year and next.

Is it worth even paying for retention?

He's not the Droid we are looking for.
 

Josey Wales

Registered User
May 16, 2022
3,557
1,331
No to Vrana. He costs even more than Bertuzzi whom I don't like for reasons.

Which Vrana are you going to get? If he was hot off the Caps lineup it would be a hard-time passing him up. This team doesn't need anymore sob stories, though him on the team would mean less goals in their own net. I'd like to think Vrana was what everyone hoped Kapanen would be in Vrana's hey day. Unfortunately, I'd think we'd just end up with two Kapanens considering he would not touch the top six in prime minutes. His 5.250 is not worth taking that chance this year and next.

Is it worth even paying for retention?

He's not the Droid we are looking for.
RW is a Pejorative Slur
 
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66-30-33

Registered User
Jan 24, 2006
63,935
16,935
Victoria, BC
Kane only wants to go to Toronto or the NYR's... Supposedly.
I am so sick and tired of reading every f***in thread talk about Toronto interested in this and that. Maybe they should make a sub forum dedicated to every single player in the NHL going to that team that doesn't have a cap meanwhile keep the trades sub forum.
 

Ugene Magic

EVIL LAUGH
Oct 17, 2008
54,998
19,489
Pittsburgh
I am so sick and tired of reading every f***in thread talk about Toronto interested in this and that. Maybe they should make a sub forum dedicated to every single player in the NHL going to that team that doesn't have a cap meanwhile keep the trades sub forum.

That came from Kane's end not Toronto.
 

Honour Over Glory

Sully-Quinn: Idiots Squared
Jan 30, 2012
78,748
43,886
which also raises the question why c-bussy would do the trade.
Maybe Sully doesn’t like that Smith requires patience and some work so might want Gavs instead. Dumo + Smith would probably be the only way.

Gavrikov has 3 goals in 52 games which is more goals than Pettersson has in his last 120.

Pettersson isn’t really anything special. He’s fine and I don’t want to give him away, but he’s overpaid and if we can get out of the contract do it.

Remember when blokes here would be all over me saying we needed to upgrade on Petts, or even when I said POJ was worth keeping over Petts.

Oh the turns have tabled.
 

Nakawick

Minty Fresh
Apr 5, 2010
11,427
2,930
The Range
I would love to have Freddy Goat in place of Blueger. Not sure what the Wild will try and do this year. They are a bubble team.
 

AuroraBorealis

Back-to-back hater
Oct 16, 2018
19,814
17,146
Vancouver, British Columbia
No to Vrana. He costs even more than Bertuzzi whom I don't like for reasons.

Which Vrana are you going to get? If he was hot off the Caps lineup it would be a hard-time passing him up. This team doesn't need anymore sob stories, though him on the team would mean less goals in their own net. I'd like to think Vrana was what everyone hoped Kapanen would be in Vrana's hey day. Unfortunately, I'd think we'd just end up with two Kapanens considering he would not touch the top six in prime minutes. His 5.250 is not worth taking that chance this year and next.

Is it worth even paying for retention?

He's not the Droid we are looking for.
His usage in Washington was kinda sketchy for how awesome of a producer he was. I heard he didn't get along with the coaches, and they slashed his minutes/linemate quality out of spite.
That changed when he came to Detroit. 22 goals, 11 assists in 39 games with them.
It's a real shame he can't stay healthy and has off-ice baggage. If we could get close to a full season out of him next year then there's no winger I'd want more at that cap hit. Perfect Zucker replacement.

But alas, it's a low percentage gamble...
 
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Night Shift

Registered User
Nov 3, 2014
9,982
4,664
Florida
I am so sick and tired of reading every f***in thread talk about Toronto interested in this and that. Maybe they should make a sub forum dedicated to every single player in the NHL going to that team that doesn't have a cap meanwhile keep the trades sub forum.

This is their window with Matthews going to the Yotes in a few years.

I love to bring it up every few months, its fun :laugh:
 

chethejet

Registered User
Feb 4, 2012
8,685
1,926
It comes down to Jarry and then what can Hextall actually do. You have sullivan as the I only want wonkers who play my style coach. Hextall just has to do his job here and upgrade from sullys favorites and admit the mistakes as GM and then coach. Move Dumo, Tell Carter its over and eat the contract. Kap has a pedigree so get a physical LD. Seattle is sliding so they may like to move Soucy for him. Teddy B just needs to go. My guess is Pens are stuck with sully and with no cap room, cosmetic deal that helps no one. This can be salvaged but not with the present management.
 
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