Trade and Free Agency Thread - 2022 - Off-season

[Brobust]

Looking back on it all, last summer would have been the time to bet on Jack on a $3.5-4 million instead of giving the other guy a medium term deal.

Who do things need to be characterized as so dramatic? Leafs seemed to be looking to go in another direction and now they can’t…

Why would Campbell extend last offseason when he knows he's got a chance to be a full time starter in 2021-22? The leafs did offer him a contract and he refused.

 

[LBloor]

The Leafs were bottom feeders for a lot of that.

They haven't been since Matthews got here. They are one of the best teams in the league.

regular season means shit in the nhl, its a win business not play good business!

 

[McSnypsky]

Given what Lou paid for Romanov, maybe Varly won’t be that pricey

He’d probably be my preferred trade target.

Comrie and Varly wouldn't be too bad

 

[SeaOfBlue]

regular season means shit in the nhl, its a win business not play good business!

So Colorado was a bottom feeder until this year then I guess.

Every team is a bottom feeder until they win the Cup.

I guess Tampa is back to being a bottom feeder?

That is how broad your definition is.

Comrie and Varly wouldn't be too bad

Id be good with that.

 

[ToneDog]

Why would Campbell extend last offseason when he knows he's got a chance to be a full time starter in 2021-22? The leafs did offer him a contract and he refused.

How much and for how long? I heard they made an offer a couple of months into the season and he refused. I get refusing when you were playing lights out but not last summer after losing to the Habs. The guy has been a journeyman his whole career. Can't see him turning down a reasonable offer last summer.

 

[TheShape]

Don't know why but I have a hunch Nichushkin replaces Palat in Tampa.

 

[ToneDog]

Don't know why but I have a hunch Nichushkin replaces Palat in Tampa.

That would be bad for us but I see them being loyal to Palat.

 

[TheShape]

That would be bad for us but I see them being loyal to Palat.

Palat is testing free agency. Looking for retirement deal would be my guess.

 

[Ziggdiezan]

I would be more than fine with taking a chance with Gibson if it was a trade that was in the vein of taking on Nikita Zaitsev. Not a pure cap dump, but mostly just shifting money and average assets involved.

The problem is that they want a lot of good future assets. I'm not sure it's worth dumping that many assets in a goaltender than has struggled over the last few years. That doesn't seem smart. So the price will have to significantly change or else the Ducks might as well keep him.

I wonder if Anaheim would be willing to retain large amounts of the contract to reduce the risk for the buyer and therefore be more deserving of good future assets.

What do you give up if you can grab Gibson at 4.5 million or below (i.e. cheaper than all the alternatives)?

 

[Stephen]

Why would Campbell extend last offseason when he knows he's got a chance to be a full time starter in 2021-22? The leafs did offer him a contract and he refused.

Well, it was much lower than what they paid Mrazek, so if the extension was reasonable maybe we could have resolved that issue then and there.

 

[Buds17]

As a back-up goalie?

I think Talbot can still be a starter or 1A. This definitely wouldn't be my favourite move though primarily due to him being a season away from UFA. Can't say I'd be too thrilled with Kallgren or Woll backing him up either.

 

[showtime8]

I don't get why there is such a dilemma with looking to acquire an actual #1 goaltender.

Gibson is the answer, plain and simple.

All of the other moves all seem to keep the Leafs in the same boat as before. Kuemper is a 32 year old #1B that was carried by a very good Colorado team. Greiss is 36 and might be a 25-30 game back-up at this point. Similar to Talbot in Minnesota. If he was the #1, they wouldn't have traded for Fleury at the deadline and then re-signed him. Martin Jones has fallen off a cliff since his playoff performance that took San Jose to the cup finals. Holtby is a good back-up.

Campbell is the wildcard at this point because he had a great stretch, wants to be a #1, but hasn't given the Leafs that big save when they need it in either series.

Pay the assets and we stop having this conversation for the next 2-4 years.

 

[Jozay]

Not a fan of paying a lot for a guy who isnt a bonafide #1. I say do what Colorado has done and get an interesting guy who wont cost (in assets to trade for and cap) a lot.

 

[thusk]

If husso get close of 5M, Campbell will sign around 6M and kuemper probably around 7M

So If toronto can get gibson for something like sandin and a 1st or second... just do it... i like sandin as a player but dont like his attittude, remimber me drouin in tampa... guy just doing his baby and complain unstead of just trying to work harder and probing they're wrong to dont giving you more ice time...

 

[showtime8]

I think Talbot can still be a starter or 1A. This definitely wouldn't be my favourite move though primarily due to him being a season away from UFA. Can't say I'd be too thrilled with Kallgren or Woll backing him up either.

I would disagree with this point, but you're welcome to your opinion. My counter would be that if Talbot was the 1A, they wouldn't have tried to bring in anyone at the deadline. Colorado didn't bring anyone in and they actually re-signed Francouz. Tampa the same thing. They don't have to worry about who the #1 guy is.

Talbot is a good goaltender that can work in tandem and hopefully he would get hot around playoff time or a stretch during the year. I also worry that he's 35 and the Leafs are looking for a #1 goaltender a year from now.

 

[SeaOfBlue]

I don't get why there is such a dilemma with looking to acquire an actual #1 goaltender.

Gibson is the answer, plain and simple.

All of the other moves all seem to keep the Leafs in the same boat as before. Kuemper is a 32 year old #1B that was carried by a very good Colorado team. Greiss is 36 and might be a 25-30 game back-up at this point. Similar to Talbot in Minnesota. If he was the #1, they wouldn't have traded for Fleury at the deadline and then re-signed him. Martin Jones has fallen off a cliff since his playoff performance that took San Jose to the cup finals. Holtby is a good back-up.

Campbell is the wildcard at this point because he had a great stretch, wants to be a #1, but hasn't given the Leafs that big save when they need it in either series.

Pay the assets and we stop having this conversation for the next 2-4 years.

Kuemper is much better than a 1B, but I am not rushing to give him a huge contract at his age.

Gibson is not the clear answer though. His cap hit is way too high for what he has brought, and that excludes whatever ridiculous price that Anaheim wants for him.

I just think we need to be open to a less "sexy" option, because none of our options are (or were) great and we should not be overpaying for one just because they have more hype attached to them.

Murray with a good partner like Holtby has had more recent success than Gibson has had and we can get him for less cap and assets.

Varlamov too has had a lot more recent success and a strong track record overall.

Or a younger and cheaper guy to pair with less proven ability but great upside with a solid veteran... like a Comrie with Varlamov.

Gibson is not any more of a guarantee at this point, and he has by far the most risk attached.

 

[ToneDog]

Not a fan of paying a lot for a guy who isnt a bonafide #1. I say do what Colorado has done and get an interesting guy who wont cost (in assets to trade for and cap) a lot.

This is my thinking as well. Blackwood > Georgiev but we might want to sign a backup as well.

 

[TheShape]

I'm not about handing term to goalies unless they're unicorns like Vaz or Shesterkin. The position is too erratic to bank on long term. Gibson at 3 more years is fine, but 5? No thanks. That's why I'd stay away from Campbell/Kuemper but it looks like we're heading in that direction.

Teams have won cups over the years without elite goaltending, if the team in front is good enough which I think we are, then we just need someone competent.

 

[showtime8]

Kuemper is much better than a 1B, but I am not rushing to give him a huge contract at his age.

Gibson is not the clear answer though. His cap hit is way too high for what he has brought, and that excludes whatever ridiculous price that Anaheim wants for him.

I just think we need to be open to a less "sexy" option, because none of our options are (or were) great and we should not be overpaying for one just because they have more hype attached to them.

But when teams go with the less sexy option, they often find themselves in the same situation a year or 2 out.

Here's an example on why I think the Gibson situation could work out for the Leafs...

This goalie went from these save percentages and GAA in the past 4 years:
2.64 / 0.917
2.86 / .920
2.63 / .916
1.95 / .922

to

3.16 / .887 this past season.

The goalie is Phillipp Grubauer and he went from really good teams to a team that was ass.


Could it be that Gibson has struggled the past couple years? Sure, I would say that he's not been amazing. But could it also be that Anaheim has been awful for the past 5 years years and haven't finished higher than 13th in their conference? Yeah, I would say that plays a huge hand in it too.

 

[Legion34]

regular season means shit in the nhl, its a win business not play good business!

Actually it’s the making money BUSINESS. And they are the best at that.

 

[ULF_55]

Sure lets end this decade without a first rd pick...enough is enough with giving up picks, we are not tampa or colorado

2022
2029
2030

Time is just flying by.

 

[Bigmarycombo]

Dubas has just bent over and said to the players agents and GM’s
Have a go boys.

How in the hell do you let yourself get in this position. We are now desperate for a goalie and everyone in the league knows it. How dumb can you be letting mrazek go without having a replacement before hand.

If I’m a GM I’m asking for the moon in a trade because dubas has no options now.

If I’m an agent with a free agent I’m squeezing every cent out of him.

dubas reeks desperation at this point.

Not a good look for a team with limited cap space

 

[BertCorbeau]

Dubas has just bent over and said to the players agents and GM’s
Have a go boys.

How in the hell do you let yourself get in this position. We are now desperate for a goalie and everyone in the league knows it. How dumb can you be letting mrazek go without having a replacement before hand.

If I’m a GM I’m asking for the moon in a trade because dubas has no options now.

If I’m an agent with a free agent I’m squeezing every cent out of him.

dubas reeks desperation at this point.

Not a good look for a team with limited cap space

I mean even with Mrazek, teams knew the Leafs needed a goalie pretty badly. Mrazek's presence wasn't really giving anyone comfort.

 

[BertCorbeau]

This is a tough situation where the supply just doesn't meet the demand.

There haven't been any clear cut starting goalie options that are can't-miss for the Leafs .. all have risks either age, contract length, or cost to acquire

 

[SeaOfBlue]

But when teams go with the less sexy option, they often find themselves in the same situation a year or 2 out.

Here's an example on why I think the Gibson situation could work out for the Leafs...

This goalie went from these save percentages and GAA in the past 4 years:
2.64 / 0.917
2.86 / .920
2.63 / .916
1.95 / .922

to

3.16 / .887 this past season.

The goalie is Phillipp Grubauer and he went from really good teams to a team that was ass.


Could it be that Gibson has struggled the past couple years? Sure, I would say that he's not been amazing. But could it also be that Anaheim has been awful for the past 5 years years and haven't finished higher than 13th in their conference? Yeah, I would say that plays a huge hand in it too.

Grubauer was far more ass than the defense in front of him. He was the worst goalie in the league. I dont know if he just checked out after getting paid, but Seattle was a much better defensive team than Grubauers numbers say.

Gibson, too, is playing well below expectation. It is one thing if he has bad numbers behind a bad team, but he is playing below expectation and he is the 4th highest paid goalie in the league. A goalie of that stature can't play like he has, good team or bad.

And we are assuming he returns to form behind a good team. Maybe he does. But we need him to return to elite form, and he has not shown elite form at any point during the playoffs in his career (including when Anaheim has been good), and has not been elite since Anaheim had one of the best defenses in the league. So maybe he is just an overpaid product of a great defense that falls apart when he is going up against good teams come playoff time. That is all he has proven at any point in his career, and that was 5 seasons ago now. He may be totally checked out like Grubauer was after getting paid, and not only would we have an albatross contract we will not be able to dump, but we will also have paid huge assets to get him in the first place.

If I am betting on someone returning to form from 4 years ago, I will bet on the guy who led his team to back to back championships behind a worse defensive team and has been stuck behind a worse team in a much harder division. Bonus: he is cheaper on cap and assets, and doesn't have a ridiculously long contract if he proves he is a complete lemon. That is Murray.

Unless Hellebuyck is made available, nobody out there is worth big money or big assets. They are all massive question marks, and Gibson just happens to be the most expensive one of them all.