GDT: Trade and Free Agency Thread - 2021/22 PART X

[Buds17]

Friedman on 32 thoughts says someone told him that they heard Toronto and Colorado were talking, but he has no idea about what. (17:00)

Campbell for Kuemper?

 

[SprDaVE]

Friedman on 32 thoughts says someone told him that they heard Toronto and Colorado were talking, but he has no idea about what. (17:00)

Im going to guess Francouz might have been talked about, but they just re-signed him.

 

[DraftSchmaft]

People at current moment can't find any goalie options but now oblivious that this supply issue was more reason not to bet on backup goalie and stick with andersen. At least we know his flaw and can think how to offset. We dont know Campbell bad looks like. It nightmare

This is actually an amazingly good point. Goalie pickings are slim, even in the off season. There's a chance our goaltending might be average or worse next season and the season after.

I can see the appeal for just sticking with a surefire no.1 and hope he overcomes his elimination game woes. Our core has to overcome this exact struggle yet we bet on them too. The alternative is being in no man's land like we are now If your bet fails, like it did.

It would have made more sense to bet on last season being injury related for andersen instead of being finished versus betting on Campbells one quarter season wonder.

It's just a whole long line of "made sense at the time, didn't work out" moves from Dubas.

With that said I'm not okay with firing him. Might have a trick up his sleeve let's see.

 

[Nylanderthal]

Yeah, Kadri is useless in the playoffs for obvious reasons. Kerfoot was totally useless against the more physical teams out west.

Kerfoot and Nylander were the only two forwards who showed up last playoff

 

[Buds17]

Getting Kerfoot and end around way ending up with Brodie is fine return for a Kadri trade.

Kerfoot also wasn't going to be a pending UFA like Brodie was, so it couldn't have worked out had Kadri accepted that trade to Calgary.

 

[TMLAM34]

Because they wanted Brodie and Kadri denied the trade to Calgary and instead of resigning Barrie they scooped up Brodie with the cap allotment. It’s pretty straight forward

So the 1 million dollars we saved gave us the opportunity to sign Brodie? Kadri made 4.5 million, Kerfoot makes 3.5 million. There was barely any cap savings from the trade to “allow us to sign Brodie”, there was a million other ways to open up 1 million dollars that trade really gave us. We did not trade Kadri for Kerfoot and Brodie. That’s pretty straight forward IMO.

 

[Nylanderthal]

Kerfoot also wasn't going to be a pending UFA like Brodie was, so it couldn't have worked out had Kadri accepted that trade to Calgary.

He did end up with the best D man and best forward target from the proposed offers we knew about.

 

[WTFMAN99]

Why do people put Brodie in the same sentence as the Kadri deal? I never understood that. It’s like we’re trying to make the trade seem better. Brodie was a UFA signing the following year after the Kadri-Kerfoot trade. It’s not because we got rid of Kadri we signed Brodie. Whether we still had Kadri or not, Brodie would have been a target for Dubas in free agency.

Because they wanted Brodie and Kadri denied the trade to Calgary and instead of resigning Barrie they scooped up Brodie with the cap allotment. It’s pretty straight forward

It's mental gymnastics to make a bad trade by Dubas look better than it was.

 

[Nylanderthal]

It's mental gymnastics to make a bad trade by Dubas look better than it was.

Not really, they took back Barrie who was 2.75 on the cap, if there was a way to get brodie & Kerfoot in the same deal the cap would’ve worked out easily. Am I saying the trade was brodie & Kerfoot? No, no one is but those were the targets, and they were only being moved in a deal where the other team got Naz back. In the end he got both targets. That’s all anyones saying

 

[Buds17]

He did end up with the best D man and best forward target from the proposed offers we knew about.

No doubt that Kerfoot and Brodie is preferable to Jankowski and Barrie from my viewpoint. I was agreeing with your previous post and stating that the Leafs couldn't have ended up with both Brodie and Kerfoot had they traded Kadri to Calgary (without also trading for Kerfoot in a separate deal). That later Zaitsev and Brown for Ceci swap might have also fallen apart entirely with Brown in Calgary. I have to credit Kadri as well for turning down the initial trade.

 

[TMLAM34]

Not really, they took back Barrie who was 2.75 on the cap, if there was a way to get brodie & Kerfoot in the same deal the cap would’ve worked out easily. Am I saying the trade was brodie & Kerfoot? No, no one is but those were the targets, and they were only being moved in a deal where the other team got Naz back. In the end he got both targets. That’s all anyones saying

There’s only a 1 million dollar difference from Kerfoot’s cap hit compared to Kadri’s. Brodie was a UFA and signed for 5 million. That trade barely made any impact on signing Brodie regardless if Dubas tried acquiring or showed interest in Brodie previously. The trade was Kadri for Kerfoot and Barrie and we ended up getting the short end of the stick. Doesn’t mean I didn’t disagree with the trade at the time, I understand why Dubas did it. But to say we got Brodie out of it as well is an excuse to cover up a deal we lost on. Simple as that.

 

[Nylanderthal]

There’s only a 1 million dollar difference from Kerfoot’s cap hit compared to Kadri’s. Brodie was a UFA and signed for 5 million. That trade barely made any impact on signing Brodie regardless if Dubas tried acquiring or showed interest in Brodie previously. The trade was Kadri for Kerfoot and Barrie and we ended up getting the short end of the stick. Doesn’t mean I didn’t disagree with the trade at the time, I understand why Dubas did it. But to say we got Brodie out of it as well is an excuse to cover up a deal we lost on. Simple as that.

They were going to spend on a forward regardless, stop comparing kerfoot’s 3.5 for kadri’s 4.5 straight up when they also brought in Barrie at 2.75. If they wanted to add the extra 1.9 to get Brodie in as well I’m sure it could have worked back then, (Brodies deal that season was 4.65) but alas neither Colorado or Calgary were giving up Kerfoot or Brodie without themselves getting Kadri, and in the end the leafs ended up with both.

 

[Hockey 4 Life]

Ah yes, the one line team with garbage D who’s 6th? 7th league wide? Right…. It’s like some of you don’t watch any hockey aside from the leafs… Defence makes mistakes, literally the name of that game is mitigating mistakes and we’re middle of the pack at worst with regards to that, which is fine considering the other strengths on the team. Our black hole of a second line while admittedly has not been looking good as of recent has two guys hovering around ppg. The critical weakness on this team is goaltending, they can’t buy a routine save. Get league avg goaltending and Muzzin back in form and this is a contender.

Goaltending has been horrible and is our biggest issue, but you can't honestly sit there and tell me the defense havent been getting worse since January. Also those two near ppg players literally have had little to no impact on our games in months. Your hoping best case scenario and I hope that as well, but the odds of everything turning out the way we hope are minimal.

 

[Duke16]

I think the TOR-COL talks could be Dermott, which clears a bit of cap for the Leafs as they look at bigger moves.

Would probably end up making a move alike the Ben Hutton one to replace Dermott on the depth chart before the deadline

 

[Hoglund4MvP]

They didn’t just bet on a “back up” they also brought in a guy with a decade of track record as a platoon starter for a playoff team. Unfortunately both have had issues this year. To me it’s more so how they react to this issue not so much that it popped up

Yes very fair way to look, if they can get out this trouble they will get praise if it's a good rescue, but the bad thing from initial look is that it will cost more assets to fix when we could have just had andersen who was more than good enough for team. Only extra cost to go Andersen would be extra hit for his backup cost. Summer I read he want 5 mil. Hit from backup more cheap than cost to fix problem and the fix is not guarantee to work. None of dubas goalie moves has ever worked so cant assume he can fix.

 

[Nylanderthal]

Goaltending has been horrible and is our biggest issue, but you can't honestly sit there and tell me the defense havent been getting worse since January. Also those two near ppg players literally have had little to no impact on our games in months. Your hoping best case scenario and I hope that as well, but the odds of everything turning out the way we hope are minimal.

I agree they haven’t looked great as of late, but the number are still solid so you still have to hope that they regain their dominance when it matters, there isn’t much use in expending energy thinking about any other result in the present and then you adjust as needed based on the results.
I honestly think that solid goaltending would ease everyone’s mind and give the team confidence to play good structured hockey, they’ve shown to be able to do it in decently long stretches before, it’s just a fire drill out there as of late. Right now you can tell the guys are tense because it’s like every bouncing puck, or 2 on 1 ends up in the back of the net and they feel the need to press and score 4/5 a game.

 

[Nylanderthal]

Yes very fair way to look, if they can get out this trouble they will get praise if it's a good rescue, but the bad thing from initial look is that it will cost more assets to fix when we could have just had andersen who was more than good enough for team. Only extra cost to go Andersen would be extra hit for his backup cost. Summer I read he want 5 mil. Hit from backup more cheap than cost to fix problem and the fix is not guarantee to work. None of dubas goalie moves has ever worked so cant assume he can fix.

Freddie quit on the team, he wasn’t an option. You have to look at every other option available this summer aside from Fred.
That ship had sailed.

 

[Hockey 4 Life]

I agree they haven’t looked great as of late, but the number are still solid so you still have to hope that they regain their dominance when it matters, there isn’t much use in expending energy thinking about any other result in the present and then you adjust as needed based on the results.
I honestly think that solid goaltending would ease everyone’s mind and give the team confidence to play good structured hockey, they’ve shown to be able to do it in decently long stretches before, it’s just a fire drill out there as of late. Right now you can tell the guys are tense because it’s like every bouncing puck, or 2 on 1 ends up in the back of the net and they feel the need to press and score 4/5 a game.

I agree with most of what you are saying, I just believe with holes in net, on d and 2 lw, we just have to many holes to little time and not enough trade capitol we realistically can trade.

 

[TMLAM34]

They were going to spend on a forward regardless, stop comparing kerfoot’s 3.5 for kadri’s 4.5 straight up when they also brought in Barrie at 2.75. If they wanted to add the extra 1.9 to get Brodie in as well I’m sure it could have worked back then, (Brodies deal that season was 4.65) but alas neither Colorado or Calgary were giving up Kerfoot or Brodie without themselves getting Kadri, and in the end the leafs ended up with both.

If we never pulled the trigger on the Kadri for Kerfoot and Barrie trade and still had Kadri when Brodie was a UFA, do you think Dubas would still be interested and go out and sign Brodie in free agency? Absolutely. I’m just saying I don’t understand why people say we got Brodie because of the Kadri trade. Makes no sense. We tried using Kadri as a trade chip to acquire Brodie, yes, until Kadri rejected the trade. We then traded Kadri for Kerfoot and Barrie which was the next best offer Dubas thought he had on the table. Barrie was an absolute disaster, both the team and player knew they had to separate in the off-season and go there own ways. Brodie was a free agent and Dubas had interest and signed him. It’s because Brodie tested the UFA market we have him, not because of the Kadri deal is all I’m saying.

 

[SeaOfBlue]

I think the TOR-COL talks could be Dermott, which clears a bit of cap for the Leafs as they look at bigger moves.

Would probably end up making a move alike the Ben Hutton one to replace Dermott on the depth chart before the deadline

Do they need Dermott?

They have some injuries and Dermott would upgrade a few guys they are currently using, but wouldn't a cheaper rental make more sense?

I don't really care if they decide to pay the price for Dermott (probably would have to be Jack Johnson and a future 2nd), but just seems weird to me.

 

[Nylanderthal]

I agree with most of what you are saying, I just believe with holes in net, on d and 2 lw, we just have to many holes to little time and not enough trade capitol we realistically can trade.

Muzzin back would suffice for me on the back end if they can solve the goaltending. I want to see a top 6 with rielly brodie muzzin lyubushkin and two of Sandin liljegren holl depending on who’s playing well. (Not those as pairings, just that group) play in front of a guy who night in and out provides 910-915. Nothing spectacular, just make the saves required and if he gives you one or two extra a game that’s gravy.
I think you can find a middle 6 winger and a goalie with what’s expendable asset wise.
I agree they’re not perfect but in the flat cap no team is and if the goaltending can solve itself I like our chances as much as any team once they get the monkey off their back of the first round failures.

 

[Hockey 4 Life]

Muzzin back would suffice for me on the back end if they can solve the goaltending. I want to see a top 6 with rielly brodie muzzin lyubushkin and two of Sandin liljegren holl depending on who’s playing well. (Not those as pairings, just that group) play in front of a guy who night in and out provides 910-915. Nothing spectacular, just make the saves required and if he gives you one or two extra a game that’s gravy.
I think you can find a middle 6 winger and a goalie with what’s expendable asset wise.
I agree they’re not perfect but in the flat cap no team is and if the goaltending can solve itself I like our chances as much as any team once they get the monkey off their back of the first round failures.

Well in this instance I hope I'm wrong and you are right but I guess I'll believe it when I actually see it.

 

[Dreakmur]

Because they wanted Brodie and Kadri denied the trade to Calgary and instead of resigning Barrie they scooped up Brodie with the cap allotment. It’s pretty straight forward

They could have kept Kadri and then singed Brodie too.

 

[thusk]

For me leafs should look to trade liljegren for a stay at home dman. I already said it, i dont see any future with rielly sandin and liljegren on the same am. 3 offensive minded dman who struggle defensive side, its just too much.

 

[Nylanderthal]

They could have kept Kadri and then singed Brodie too.

Kadri played his way off the team with his nonsense in back to back playoffs