GDT: Trade and Free Agency Thread - 2021/22 PART VII

[The Podium]

People talk about his competence as a 2way player, but both on Dom's card and JFresh's he grades out as poor defensively virtually every season besides this one. Can he be a top-6 player with better guys? Sure, its possible. A lot of people thought the same with Ritchie too. He's not worth that right now in a trade though and there's less than 0 chance I'd be willing to give up significant assets for a guy who's never shown to be an overly effective NHL player, especially offensively- which is required for a top-6 player.

People think the grass is always greener. Before Ritchie was signed, or even while he was on ANA and BOS, the same people were fawning over him similar to Crouse now.

Getting Crouse in a soft deal would be nice (thinking a 2nd/3rd + B level prospect), but no way would I like to see valuable assets going the other way.

Any deal involving Amirov, Knies, Robertson, Niemela or Abruzzese should be a non-starter IMO.

 

[Mickey Marner]

I don't think this is the year to trade our top prospects. If it's a retained Miller or Chychrun coming back, sure, but otherwise no.

Next year is the last year before Matthews' NMC kicks in. Anytime between this off-season and next deadline is when you empty the cupboards for a last ditch effort.

In the meantime you hope the core figures out how to win a series.

 

[Morgs]

what would be a comparable LW you would want instead of Crouse? (I mean this as a positive discussion I know how antagonistic this board can be)

Haven't thought about it much besides rentals:

Giroux, FF09, or Hertl. All three play driving top-line F that really move the needle.

Non-rentals though? JT Miller, DeBrusk, Kravtsov are all guys I'd probably take a swing on before Crouse. I've heard lots of issues with Miller's personality though, so I'm hesitant.

 

[Nylanderthal]

Kerfoot is a complete passenger on his line. He doesn’t hit, he’s weak on the boards and he doesn’t cash in the chances created by Willy and Tavares. The argument that he was “good in the playoffs” is completely false and Nylander carried him around that whole series last year.

Move this clown for someone that can bury chances.

Guys who are top 3 in 5v5 scoring both raw numbers and expected are not passengers as much as you want to talk it into existence

 

[Fogelhund]

Given the Tavares/Nylander/Kerfoot discussions, and the Kerfoot discussions...

Num	Time	%	Players	GF	GA	+/-	SF	SA	SF%	CF	CA	CF%
1	292:48	41.3	JOHN TAVARES - ALEXANDER KERFOOT - WILLIAM NYLANDER	19	14	5	168	153	52.3	305	288	51.4
2	120:09	17.0	WILLIAM NYLANDER - MICHAEL BUNTING - AUSTON MATTHEWS	3	6	-3	66	73	47.5	143	118	54.8
3	34:58	4.9	JOHN TAVARES - WILLIAM NYLANDER - MICHAEL BUNTING	1	4	-3	14	17	45.2	36	30	54.5
4	29:12	4.1	ALEXANDER KERFOOT - WILLIAM NYLANDER - MICHAEL BUNTING	1	0	1	15	11	57.7	26	20	56.5
5	23:16	3.3	WILLIAM NYLANDER - MITCHELL MARNER - AUSTON MATTHEWS	2	0	2	8	8	50.0	24	20	54.5
6	21:04	3.0	JOHN TAVARES - WILLIAM NYLANDER - AUSTON MATTHEWS	2	1	1	18	9	66.7	34	11	75.6
7	19:27	2.7	JOHN TAVARES - WILLIAM NYLANDER - ILYA MIKHEYEV	1	2	-1	21	13	61.8	25	18	58.1
8	18:05	2.6	ALEXANDER KERFOOT - WILLIAM NYLANDER - DAVID KAMPF	1	0	1	5	11	31.3	7	16	30.4
9	15:26	2.2	WILLIAM NYLANDER - AUSTON MATTHEWS - ONDREJ KASE	0	1	-1	7	11	38.9	11	19	36.7
10	13:40	1.9	JOHN TAVARES - WILLIAM NYLANDER - MITCHELL MARNER	0	2	-2	13	5	72.2	24	10	70.6

[TBODY] [/TBODY]
[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Num	Time	%	Players	GF	GA	+/-	SF	SA	SF%	CF	CA	CF%
1	292:48	42.3	JOHN TAVARES - ALEXANDER KERFOOT - WILLIAM NYLANDER	19	14	5	168	153	52.3	305	288	51.4
2	87:04	12.6	JOHN TAVARES - ALEXANDER KERFOOT - MITCHELL MARNER	8	5	3	42	53	44.2	91	90	50.3
3	46:21	6.7	JOHN TAVARES - NICK RITCHIE - MITCHELL MARNER	0	0	0	17	20	45.9	48	46	51.1
4	34:58	5.0	JOHN TAVARES - WILLIAM NYLANDER - MICHAEL BUNTING	1	4	-3	14	17	45.2	36	30	54.5
5	21:04	3.0	JOHN TAVARES - WILLIAM NYLANDER - AUSTON MATTHEWS	2	1	1	18	9	66.7	34	11	75.6
6	19:27	2.8	JOHN TAVARES - WILLIAM NYLANDER - ILYA MIKHEYEV	1	2	-1	21	13	61.8	25	18	58.1
7	15:38	2.3	JOHN TAVARES - MITCHELL MARNER - AUSTON MATTHEWS	0	1	-1	9	3	75.0	15	9	62.5
8	13:41	2.0	JOHN TAVARES - MITCHELL MARNER - ILYA MIKHEYEV	0	1	-1	9	7	56.3	15	12	55.6
9	13:40	2.0	JOHN TAVARES - WILLIAM NYLANDER - MITCHELL MARNER	0	2	-2	13	5	72.2	24	10	70.6

[TBODY] [/TBODY]
[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Num	Time	%	Players	GF	GA	+/-	SF	SA	SF%	CF	CA	CF%
1	292:48	47.0	JOHN TAVARES - ALEXANDER KERFOOT - WILLIAM NYLANDER	19	14	5	168	153	52.3	305	288	51.4
2	87:04	14.0	JOHN TAVARES - ALEXANDER KERFOOT - MITCHELL MARNER	8	5	3	42	53	44.2	91	90	50.3
3	34:54	5.6	ALEXANDER KERFOOT - ONDREJ KASE - DAVID KAMPF	4	3	1	19	15	55.9	31	32	49.2
4	29:12	4.7	ALEXANDER KERFOOT - WILLIAM NYLANDER - MICHAEL BUNTING	1	0	1	15	11	57.7	26	20	56.5
5	18:05	2.9	ALEXANDER KERFOOT - WILLIAM NYLANDER - DAVID KAMPF	1	0	1	5	11	31.3	7	16	30.4
6	16:35	2.7	ALEXANDER KERFOOT - DAVID KAMPF - PIERRE ENGVALL	1	0	1	6	4	60.0	9	10	47.4
7	14:14	2.3	ALEXANDER KERFOOT - MICHAEL BUNTING - AUSTON MATTHEWS	3	1	2	11	7	61.1	16	9	64.0

[TBODY] [/TBODY]
[TBODY] [/TBODY]

These are lines, with more than 2% of a players 5v5 ice time this year. Nylander's best stats, are with Tavares and Kerfoot. Tavares best stats are with Nylander and Kerfoot (Well, I mean Tavares, Nylander and Matthews are a pretty dominant line, but we can't expect that line all the time). Kerfoot with any other mix, always had positive GF v GA. ... though in the case of adding Kampf on the line, it appears to be more goaltending. Kerfoot is the teams top +- player.

Are we looking to for problems, where maybe they don't exist?

 

[Nylanderthal]

You clearly you rely a little too much on numbers, without applying context to those numbers. He's on a bad team, his numbers are bad... oh... what a surprise no one could have ever predicted that. If you take my post in the context that Chara would replace Holl or Lilly, which is what I said in the original post, in this case if we got Manson, Manson replaces Holl and Chara replaces Lily, yeah Chara is an upgrade over Lily.

At what? He’s useless at hockey now.

 

[Fogelhund]

really? look at the stats for him and holl as a comparison, one year younger same stats. do you think holl would get more then that?

Why do you want him if he's only worth a 3rd?

Why do the Islanders move him for a 3rd? What's in it for them? Do they get something that fits a need for them? I mean, a 3rd? Islanders fans are asking for a 1st in 2022 and a 2nd in 2023.... I think that's too much, but a 3rd isn't in the ball park. You have to fill a need, for a team to trade a player.

 

[Mugzy97]

Severson would be a good target, I wonder if we could pry him out of NJ and what the price would be?

 

[crump]

from The Hockey News: Regarding trying to trade Ritchie.
"Convincing a team to absorb the $2.5 million due to Ritchie both this season and next would absolutely require a sweetener. And with the Maple Leafs holding just three picks in the 2022 draft, that might need to be a prospect."

What prospect would you be willing to give up to trade Ritchie? rights to Herzog?

(You guys have no sense of humour)

 

[Apex Predator]

from The Hockey News: Regarding trying to trade Ritchie.
"Convincing a team to absorb the $2.5 million due to Ritchie both this season and next would absolutely require a sweetener. And with the Maple Leafs holding just three picks in the 2022 draft, that might need to be a prospect."

What prospect would you be willing to give up to trade Ritchie? rights to Herzog?

I would do rights to Herzog but doubt the other team is interested in him.

 

[SeaOfBlue]

really? look at the stats for him and holl as a comparison, one year younger same stats. do you think holl would get more then that?

Holl would get more than a 3rd and a prospect.

 

[GoodNewfieBoy]

As if the rights to fking Herzog are worth anything haha honestly smh

 

[SeaOfBlue]

from The Hockey News: Regarding trying to trade Ritchie.
"Convincing a team to absorb the $2.5 million due to Ritchie both this season and next would absolutely require a sweetener. And with the Maple Leafs holding just three picks in the 2022 draft, that might need to be a prospect."

What prospect would you be willing to give up to trade Ritchie? rights to Herzog?

I believe we will have to give up any kind of sweetner when I see it.

But sure, Herzog's rights would be fine I guess.

 

[Morgs]

If anyone else was trying to trade 1.5 years of Ritchie they'd be asking for a 2nd or 3rd. We need to give up a prospect? Imagine if the media wasn't on the Habs side when it comes to Chiarot. Glad to see Dom rip him in his article today

 

[CantLoseWithMatthews]

If anyone else was trying to trade 1.5 years of Ritchie they'd be asking for a 2nd or 3rd. We need to give up a prospect? Imagine if the media wasn't on the Habs side when it comes to Chiarot. Glad to see Dom rip Chiarot in his article today

yeah it's such bullshit. Now even if Chiarot goes for like a 2nd + a good prospect, it will be seen as a big win. Even though that's still an ugly overpayment. Too bad the media only inflates the value of Leafs players when it's time to sign them to a new deal

 

[ToneDog]

Bogo was our worst dman defensively in the playoffs last year.

Debateable, but that is not the point. As things stand today, without Muzzin, Sandin is our grittiest dman.

 

[Bluelines]

At what? He’s useless at hockey now.

Almost 19 minutes a night under a Trotz coaching staff would suggest otherwise.

 

[Buds17]

from The Hockey News: Regarding trying to trade Ritchie.
"Convincing a team to absorb the $2.5 million due to Ritchie both this season and next would absolutely require a sweetener. And with the Maple Leafs holding just three picks in the 2022 draft, that might need to be a prospect."

What prospect would you be willing to give up to trade Ritchie? rights to Herzog?

I took that to mean the Leafs would need to include a sweetener if they wanted to be rid of Ritchie's contract without any retention or taking back of a contract/salary. I could very well be wrong here.

 

[Morgs]

yeah it's such bullshit. Now even if Chiarot goes for like a 2nd + a good prospect, it will be seen as a big win. Even though that's still an ugly overpayment. Too bad the media only inflates the value of Leafs players when it's time to sign them to a new deal

It's insane lol. Ritchie is the same player as he was when he signed and I guarantee there were 5+ other teams that offered similar contracts. He doesn't fit here, he's a fine bottom-6 player still that *should* have positive value even if we had to take back some money to make it fit.

.... yet Ben Chiarot may actually go for a 1st

 

[Nylanderthal]

Almost 19 minutes a night under a Trotz coaching staff would suggest otherwise.

How’s that working out for them this season?

 

[ToneDog]

It's insane lol. Ritchie is the same player as he was when he signed and I guarantee there were 5+ other teams that offered similar contracts. He doesn't fit here, he's a fine bottom-6 player still that *should* have positive value even if we had to take back some money to make it fit.

.... yet Ben Chiarot may actually go for a 1st

Anybody could have had Ritchie for free. Do you think Chariot makes it through waivers ??

 

[zeke]

Almost 19 minutes a night under a Trotz coaching staff would suggest otherwise.

19 minutes is borderline top-5 minutes, and he's needed an injury to their #1 RD Pulock to even get that much.

 

[Bluelines]

How’s that working out for them this season?

Pretty good actually, the Islanders have 2 dmen who have been on ice for more goals for than goals against. Pelech is one, take a guess who the other one is. The narrative that he old so he sucks is a lazy ignorant POV. He is a good #5/#6 who is great on the PK.

 

[Bluelines]

19 minutes is borderline top-5 minutes, and he's needed an injury to their #1 RD Pulock to even get that much.

Which is what I said multiple times #5/#6 D.

 

[SprDaVE]

Chara is god awful and anyone that has watched him in the past season or so will tell you that, whether they are an Islander or neutral NHL fan.

I think I'd rather trade a 1st round pick for Chiarot than to acquire Chara for anything else.