GDT: Trade and Free Agency Thread - 2021/22 PART VII

[Havoc]

If you can trick a team into thinking Ritchie will be useful in the playoffs, that'd be great.

Trick is the right word. Someone will take him for sure if he can string together a good week or 2. 2 weeks ago there were debates about Crouse here, someone brought up the whole goals/hits combo. Any sign of potential for that combination of stats and teams will line up. 2.5 mil is low enough for teams to take the gamble (or get themselves caught ), especially bubble teams or lower.

 

[4thline]

I think Ritchie will go to Arizona as part of a low cost rental deal. They need to meet the cap floor anyway, and have tonnes of roster spots for him to play and potentially be a deadline piece for them next off-season.

 

[ToneDog]

Definitely, he didn't sign with his hometown team so quickly because there was interest. It shouldn't have taken the highest bid to get him to come here to play beside Matthews & Mitch... you'd think

Since then he's played poorly but the timing helps for what teams often look for this time of year.

Not so sure. Leafs may have been desperate to sign a Hyman replacement. Don't recall whether they tried for Foligno first. Win some, you lose some when you fill your roster "off the shelf". Thankfully Dubas went 3 for 5 if you count the slug they traded to Chicago and he went two years with 58 and 64.

 

[The Podium]

A team acquiring Ritchie would be a low risk moderate reward type move.

Ritchie can continue to poo the bed and he’s only on the books for another season. He has some untapped potential and offensive big bodies are rare in this league.

I don’t think it’s outlandish that a team may see value in him, even at 2.5

 

[zeke]

We're giving up a 1st, our top 3 prospect and another 2nd/B prospect and a serviceable NHL player for a playoff run with Hertl? You are aware that he's a UFA and he's going to get at least $7 mil AAV on his next contract and we can't afford that. We are cap-strapped at least for 2 more years and having guys like Amirov and future 1st rounders ready to slide into the lineup as cheap and effective ELCs is going to be our only out. Why are we actively shooting ourselves in the foot?

At most I'd give up picks and a B-level prospect for a guy. I'm not giving up top-end sure-fire NHL prospects. That is so shortsighted.

Well sure, all rentals are shortsighted.

But we're in the perfect position for a shortsighted move imo - we're an elite team with a nice depth of very good but not untouchable young assets that we can afford to move some of, with a front office that seems able to continually find more of them.

 

[Morgs]

Well sure, all rentals are shortsighted.

But we're in the perfect position for a shortsighted move imo - we're an elite team with a nice depth of very good but not untouchable young assets that we can afford to move some of, with a front office that seems able to continually find more of them.

I have no issue trading the 1st for Hertl. I forgot he was a UFA at seasons end. He's the type of high-impact LW/C we could really use in the top-6, 2PP that would be worth our 1st+.

No chance I'd add Amirov (or Niemela, Robby, Knies) in a deal for a rental though. Just seems insane to be giving that level of value on guys that appear to have "hit". Plus no teams give a 1st + A prospect for a rental. I'd do one of our B-tier guys though: Hirvonen, Abruzzese, Holmberg, Abramov, Kokkonen, etc. and just be sad about it being slightly too much.

 

[zeke]

I have no issue trading the 1st for Hertl. I forgot he was a UFA at seasons end. He's the type of high-impact LW/C we could really use in the top-6, 2PP that would be worth our 1st+.

No chance I'd add Amirov (or Niemela, Robby, Knies) in a deal for a rental though. Just seems insane to be giving that level of value on guys that appear to have "hit". Plus no teams give a 1st + A prospect for a rental. I'd do one of our B-tier guys though: Hirvonen, Abruzzese, Holmberg, Abramov, Kokkonen, etc. and just be sad about it being slightly too much.

that's fair. we can quibble over prospect ratings all day though.

maybe it's best to phrase it strictly in terms of draft pick value - would i be willing to move 2 late 1sts for Hertl? it's rich, but i think I might. then again maybe not. if he's cheaper than that then i'd be even more eager to win that bidding war, of course.

p.s. there's no need so slash Hertl as a C/LW - the guy is a very very good C, period. Of course you can move him to the wing like you can with any center though.

 

[Morbo]

I think Hertl will re-sign. but I'm a fan. good player and it would give us 3 strong C again.

 

[nuck]

Miller from Van apparently has an asking price of a 1st, a top prospect and a roster player. You would have him for 2 playoff runs. Giroux is on his way out of Philly, obviously for something a little less, expiring deal. You would need max retention and some addition voodoo to have any chance to make the.money work but he pushes Kampf down to the 4th line and makes telling matching against the Leafs impossible. Is it possible to absorb 4.1x in salary?. Do you spend your 1 bullet on a forward with this D?

 

[Morgs]

that's fair. we can quibble over prospect ratings all day though.

maybe it's best to phrase it strictly in terms of draft pick value - would i be willing to move 2 late 1sts for Hertl? it's rich, but i think I might. then again maybe not. if he's cheaper than that then i'd be even more eager to win that bidding war, of course.

p.s. there's no need so slash Hertl as a C/LW - the guy is a very very good C, period. Of course you can move him to the wing like you can with any center though.

I'm aware of how good of a C he is. I'd just prefer him as a LW in our lineup because both Matthews and Tavares are better C at this stage and there's a spot available for him at LW in the top-6. If not, we can bump Kampf down a line and use him as the best 3C in hockey.

Him, Giroux, and FF09 (if available) are all intriguing pieces for me that I'd be willing to give up significant value for.

 

[ToneDog]

Well sure, all rentals are shortsighted.

But we're in the perfect position for a shortsighted move imo - we're an elite team with a nice depth of very good but not untouchable young assets that we can afford to move some of, with a front office that seems able to continually find more of them.

With Soup coming back down to earth, Muzzin and Holl shaky at best, and Tampa/Florida in round #1,I'd hardly call us being in the perfect position for a shortsighted move. If they can right the ship in the next 4 weeks, maybe, otherwise I tread carefully.

 

[Mickey Marner]

Hard pass on Kessel. We have two better RHS RWs that need PP time and Spezza as well, who fills a similar role. He'd be the single most redundant addition we could make.

I really like Hertl, but I don't see the scenario where we could re-sign him and his rental cost is too prohibitive.

I'd stick to a depth C/W and a depth RD. This core still needs to prove they can win a series. Let them do that before we break the bank again like last year.

 

[mydnyte]

I mean he played with Crosby and Malkin, and they figured out he was best on his own line too…

Kessel was pretty good with Malkin (and he should have won the Conn Smythe), but, i dont understand why its hard for anyone to gel with Crosby and excel for more than a few seasons

 

[SprDaVE]

With how the playoffs have gone for us, I have zero confidence that acquiring Hertl would be a good move. I love the player and he'd be a great fit but it's a hard thing to pull off regardless. If he had another year on his contract, I'd probably be very willing to give up multiple future assets. JT Miller seems like a better fit for that reason.

I'd prefer to go after someone like Kessel if the rumours are true. Multiple cup winner and knows Toronto extremely well. He's a good secondary scorer, something the Leafs have struggled with last few playoff rounds. Shift Kase or Nylander to LW and you got yourself a heck of forward lineup.

 

[Fogelhund]

With how the playoffs have gone for us, I have zero confidence that acquiring Hertl would be a good move. I love the player and he'd be a great fit but it's a hard thing to pull off regardless. If he had another year on his contract, I'd probably be very willing to give up multiple future assets. JT Miller seems like a better fit for that reason.

I'd prefer to go after someone like Kessel if the rumours are true. Multiple cup winner and knows Toronto extremely well. He's a good secondary scorer, something the Leafs have struggled with last few playoff rounds. Shift Kase or Nylander to LW and you got yourself a heck of forward lineup.

Keep in mind, he’s just come off a 17 game scoreless drought. He isn’t the player he once was.

 

[zeke]

With Soup coming back down to earth, Muzzin and Holl shaky at best, and Tampa/Florida in round #1,I'd hardly call us being in the perfect position for a shortsighted move. If they can right the ship in the next 4 weeks, maybe, otherwise I tread carefully.

right the ship?

they're 7-3-0 in their last 10 and 11-4-1 since the restart.

 

[SprDaVE]

Keep in mind, he’s just come off a 17 game scoreless drought. He isn’t the player he once was.

He's only shooting 6%. Definitely a big dip in his usual shooting percentage and the Coyotes are pretty awful. He isn't the same player but he's better than that 17 game slide. He still has 5 points in his last 5 games and can still play a good amount of minutes.

For a 3rd round pick and probably being able to dump Ritchie, I'd take Kessel in a heart beat.

 

[zeke]

i'd stay away from all old guys, tbh.

Hertl gives us the chance to add a prime aged big fast skilled complete player that can carry his own line or stack a top line. He's even good on faceoffs and the PK. And importantly he's not reliant on the PP to be productive - he's consistently at a 25+ goal / 50+ point pace just at even strength alone, even on a poor team with questionable linemates.

All the other names being mentioned are just complementary and/or one dimensional players at this point. even giroux.

A 3rd line of Spezza/Robertson - Hertl - Kase would be fantastic, and a 4th line of Mikheyev-Kampf-Engvall would be tremendous.

 

[Groo]

i'd stay away from all old guys, tbh.

Hertl gives us the chance to add a prime aged big fast skilled complete player that can carry his own line or stack a top line. He's even good on faceoffs and the PK. And importantly he's not reliant on the PP to be productive - he's consistently at a 25+ goal / 50+ point pace just at even strength alone, even on a poor team with questionable linemates.

All the other names being mentioned are just complementary and/or one dimensional players at this point. even giroux.

A 3rd line of Spezza/Robertson - Hertl - Kase would be fantastic, and a 4th line of Mikheyev-Kampf-Engvall would be tremendous.

Hertl is a lot of things. Fast isn't one of them

 

[X66]

i'd stay away from all old guys, tbh.

But then why does a Spezza/Kessel flanked 4th line sound so nice to me?

 

[zeke]

Hertl is a lot of things. Fast isn't one of them

fair. but he's still a strong and agile skater.

 

[Judas Tavares]

I get that the window may be shorter than anticipated. Whether you want to debate if the shutting of the window is Matthews' contract, Tavares' dropoff or whatever. Personally, while the window could rest on a lot of things, for me the main piece is the Matthews contract.

Well, that is still 3 years. Thus, I think it would be a bad idea and shortsighted to go all in this year. Or to put all the eggs in one basket. I think you need to make moves based on the 3 years and even beyond... A guy like Hertl is tempting, and I'd throw in a top asset for him. But multiple top assets (Knies, Niemela, Robertson, Amirov, 2022 1st, 2023 1st) for a rental is just too much.

These assets can definitely help in 2023 and 2024. While Matthews is still here. So if you trade them in multiples for a rental. Well you lose them and the rental after 2022.

 

[zeke]

Bunting - Matthews - Marner
Kerfoot* - Tavares - Nylander
Spezza* - Hertl - Kase
Mikheyev* - Kampf - Engvall
Robertson*

* = interchangeable​

 

[Kurtz]

Bunting - Matthews - Marner
Kerfoot* - Tavares - Nylander
Spezza* - Hertl - Kase
Mikheyev* - Kampf - Engvall
Robertson*

* = interchangeable​

That's a lot of assets to give up for Hertl just to play him less than 15 mpg on the 3rd line, imo. Besides, I really like the idea of a shutdown 3rd line centered by Kampf for the playoffs.

 

[BertCorbeau]

I’m down for Hertl if they think they can re-sign him