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GDT: Trade and Free Agency Thread - 2021/22 PART III

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Three trades I'd consider:

To Arizona: Sandin, Amirov, 1st in '22, Ritchie
To Toronto: Chychrun, Crouse
(Essentially, 3 1sts for Chych, which I believe is a decent return and .967M benefit to us in the lateral move between Ritchie and Crouse, .75M if we were to qualify him next year. I do like Crouse more for us because of his skating and he has PKed)

To Buffalo: Muzzin, Mrazak, Mikheyev
To Toronto: Miller, C. Anderson
(Miller needs to be re-signed next year, I don't know if we'd pursue, or for that matter if Buffalo would pursue, this year he'd be an upgrade on Holl. Anderson offers us a backup goalie with playoff experience and reasonable numbers, though injured now, his return date is close. His contract expires this year, but at .75M this year we could match if wanted and it gives us flexibility to re-sign Jack. While it would be a slap to Muzzin, Buffalo could certainly use his professionalism to help guide the mess that is Buffalo. They've got 3 1sts this year, some young talent, they could use the pro that Jake is...I'd give him the C. Mrazak offers some guidance and protection for their young RFA goalie Lukkonnen)

To Chicago: Kerfoot, Holl, and Gogolev
To Toronto: Strome, DeHaan (at 25%-3.4M) and A. Nylander
(Chicago gets the most complete player in Kerfoot. We take a chance on Stromes' improving game and DeHaan's ability to play both sides of the ice. With Kerfoot and Holl both signed for next year, Chicago avoids having to decide what to do with either of their players. With Tavares and Nylander, in the Ozone - which is where I'd start most of their shifts - Strome might regain some of the confidence and scoring touch he displayed in the past. )

Bunting Matthews Marner
Strome Tavares Nylander
Engvall Kamph Kase
Crouse Spezza Simmonds
Clifford

Rielly Brodie
Chychrun Miller
DeHaan Liljegren
Dermott

Campbell
Anderson

Cap hit this year: 78.3M 22 man roster, including Kessel's last year at 1.2M. We could make a move at the TDL.

*Bolded need new contracts next year.
**I would expect: Kase, Crouse, Spezza, Liljegren, and Campbell to be re-signed, with only Jack to receive a big raise. We would have the space to accommodate them all.
***Engvall, Strome, Clifford, Miller, DeHaan, and Anderson tbd.
 
In hindsight, they shouldn’t have gotten rid of him in the first place.

I agree why they did. I thought it was the right move. Even thought the return was good. But it turned out to be a disaster.

That being said, that ship has sailed. He’ll be too pricey and he won’t fit here now. He’s way more talented and will be paid more than the default 3rd liner he’d be here.
 
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meefer said:
Three trades I'd consider:

To Arizona: Sandin, Amirov, 1st in '22, Ritchie
To Toronto: Chychrun, Crouse
(Essentially, 3 1sts for Chych, which I believe is a decent return and .967M benefit to us in the lateral move between Ritchie and Crouse, .75M if we were to qualify him next year. I do like Crouse more for us because of his skating and he has PKed)

To Buffalo: Muzzin, Mrazak, Mikheyev
To Toronto: Miller, C. Anderson
(Miller needs to be re-signed next year, I don't know if we'd pursue, or for that matter if Buffalo would pursue, this year he'd be an upgrade on Holl. Anderson offers us a backup goalie with playoff experience and reasonable numbers, though injured now, his return date is close. His contract expires this year, but at .75M this year we could match if wanted and it gives us flexibility to re-sign Jack. While it would be a slap to Muzzin, Buffalo could certainly use his professionalism to help guide the mess that is Buffalo. They've got 3 1sts this year, some young talent, they could use the pro that Jake is...I'd give him the C. Mrazak offers some guidance and protection for their young RFA goalie Lukkonnen)

To Chicago: Kerfoot, Holl, and Gogolev
To Toronto: Strome, DeHaan (at 25%-3.4M) and A. Nylander
(Chicago gets the most complete player in Kerfoot. We take a chance on Stromes' improving game and DeHaan's ability to play both sides of the ice. With Kerfoot and Holl both signed for next year, Chicago avoids having to decide what to do with either of their players. With Tavares and Nylander, in the Ozone - which is where I'd start most of their shifts - Strome might regain some of the confidence and scoring touch he displayed in the past. )

Bunting Matthews Marner
Strome Tavares Nylander
Engvall Kamph Kase
Crouse Spezza Simmonds
Clifford

Rielly Brodie
Chychrun Miller
DeHaan Liljegren
Dermott

Campbell
Anderson

Cap hit this year: 78.3M 22 man roster, including Kessel's last year at 1.2M. We could make a move at the TDL.

*Bolded need new contracts next year.
**I would expect: Kase, Crouse, Spezza, Liljegren, and Campbell to be re-signed, with only Jack to receive a big raise. We would have the space to accommodate them all.
***Engvall, Strome, Clifford, Miller, DeHaan, and Anderson tbd.
Click to expand...

Well done

Our top 6LW is worse
Our 2nd pair RD is worse (that's some effort by the way)
Our backup goalie is hurt, as old as dirt and worse to

I love this board, for years people complain about our inability to develop young defenders but can't wait to trade a 21 year old putting up points and killing bottom pair competition

:laugh:
 
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LaPlante94 said:
Yeah but don't you think we do that too much? Crediting opposing players aka other teams goalies.
Click to expand...
I think we do it way less than we should, if anything. If you watch broadcasts in other markets, there's a lot more crediting opponents. Here, we just endlessly blame our players for everything, because that's what the media trains our fanbase to do. It sells. When goals don't go in for us, it's all our forwards fault. When goals go in against us, it's always a quick camera zoom on our defenseman to commence the shaming.

You probably feel like people credit opposing goalies a lot, because we've essentially gotten to the quality of team, where outside of a few opponents, we are rarely beat in the flow of play, and it usually takes a superior goalie performance (and their sizable impact on the game, well beyond any other individual player) and/or some puck luck to beat us.

We've legitimately faced some of if not the best playoff goalie performances of the past 3 years. Literally everything points to this being a goalie playing well thing and not an us thing, but because it's an unlikely occurrence, some people are convinced that unlikely = impossible, and they try to create things wrong with us, regardless of how easily disproven those theories are. It's not like goalies are facing us and dominating, and then moving onto other teams and sucking. They are continuing their hot streaks beyond us on their way to playoff records and cup finals.
 
I’m fairly new to Hockey. Been watching for about 4 years and can’t believe we are still paying a guy (Kessel) that I’ve never seen play for us.
 
Kadri's next contract will be the biggest of his career - the price tag will be too high
 
Kiwi said:
Well done

Our top 6LW is worse
Our 2nd pair RD is worse (that's some effort by the way)
Our backup goalie is hurt, as old as dirt and worse to

I love this board, for years people complain about our inability to develop young defenders but can't wait to trade a 21 year old putting up points and killing bottom pair competition

:laugh:
Click to expand...

From Kerfoot to Strome, the team is downgrading today, but has the potential to see better offensive results, Kerfoot has never scored at the rate Strome has, and Strome has never played with the talent the likes of Tavares and Nylander. I believe DeHaan to be a useful addition due to the ability to play either side

I'd take a Miller over Holl any day, and if you are referring to Liljegren as our 2nd pair RD, fine, keep him there and pair Miller with DeHaan/Dermott on our 3rd. All three of our pairings in that scenario would have 1 D concentrating more on the O side of things with the other concentrating on straight defensive aspects. A left side today of Rielly, Chychrun and DeHaan/Dermott is, to my mind, equal to Rielly, Muzzin and Sandin (who I do not wish to lose, but) and they should be better tomorrow. I obviously believe the Brodie, Liljegren, Miller option beats what we see today.

Over the last three seasons the old as dirt goalie has played 44 games, 10 the last two (in part because he was the third goalie in Washington) and 6 this year, is soon to come back. Mrazak has played 55 the last three, 15 the last two and 3 this year. Anderson has not posted a sub .900 season during those years, .902, .915, .921. Mrazak, .905, .923, .880. Two years ago Mrazak rocked a .873% in two playoff games. Anderson two years back playing two games, .929. I'd argue that if either had to take over from Campbell due to injury, they might win a series, but not a cup. I'd also argue that we can examine Campbell over the next 20 games to see how he performs as a true #1 and sign him with the cap savings accrued.

Ritchie and Crouse one could call a wash, but I suspect Crouse's speed would help him be a better fit with the team, and he's cheaper.

A final note, perhaps as opposed to rushing forth a critique, and claiming I "can't wait" to trade Sandin, you might wish to read the opening comment where I said "I'd consider" the trades. I've enough respect for you to offer an explanation as to why I'd consider these trades, please consider offering ideas as to why they're a bad idea as opposed to just bashing them and trying to mock. Thanks.
 
meefer said:
Three trades I'd consider:

To Arizona: Sandin, Amirov, 1st in '22, Ritchie
To Toronto: Chychrun, Crouse
(Essentially, 3 1sts for Chych, which I believe is a decent return and .967M benefit to us in the lateral move between Ritchie and Crouse, .75M if we were to qualify him next year. I do like Crouse more for us because of his skating and he has PKed)

To Buffalo: Muzzin, Mrazak, Mikheyev
To Toronto: Miller, C. Anderson
(Miller needs to be re-signed next year, I don't know if we'd pursue, or for that matter if Buffalo would pursue, this year he'd be an upgrade on Holl. Anderson offers us a backup goalie with playoff experience and reasonable numbers, though injured now, his return date is close. His contract expires this year, but at .75M this year we could match if wanted and it gives us flexibility to re-sign Jack. While it would be a slap to Muzzin, Buffalo could certainly use his professionalism to help guide the mess that is Buffalo. They've got 3 1sts this year, some young talent, they could use the pro that Jake is...I'd give him the C. Mrazak offers some guidance and protection for their young RFA goalie Lukkonnen)

To Chicago: Kerfoot, Holl, and Gogolev
To Toronto: Strome, DeHaan (at 25%-3.4M) and A. Nylander
(Chicago gets the most complete player in Kerfoot. We take a chance on Stromes' improving game and DeHaan's ability to play both sides of the ice. With Kerfoot and Holl both signed for next year, Chicago avoids having to decide what to do with either of their players. With Tavares and Nylander, in the Ozone - which is where I'd start most of their shifts - Strome might regain some of the confidence and scoring touch he displayed in the past. )

Bunting Matthews Marner
Strome Tavares Nylander
Engvall Kamph Kase
Crouse Spezza Simmonds
Clifford

Rielly Brodie
Chychrun Miller
DeHaan Liljegren
Dermott

Campbell
Anderson

Cap hit this year: 78.3M 22 man roster, including Kessel's last year at 1.2M. We could make a move at the TDL.

*Bolded need new contracts next year.
**I would expect: Kase, Crouse, Spezza, Liljegren, and Campbell to be re-signed, with only Jack to receive a big raise. We would have the space to accommodate them all.
***Engvall, Strome, Clifford, Miller, DeHaan, and Anderson tbd.
Click to expand...
Just curious. You think giving up essentially 3 1st round picks is a decent trade? When has a non superstar ever gotten 3 1st rounders in a trade. Especially one that has had knee surgeries. If Arizona wants one of Sandin or Liljgren it lessons the value of the other pieces, in my opinion
 
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Giving up Sandin or Liljegren to get Chychrun kind of defeats the whole purpose of the trade.

You get a more advanced/expensive version of what you are trying to develop Sandin/Liljegren into and you don't really address your weakness in Holl.

If you can add Chychrun to Rielly/Muzzin/Brodie while keeping Sandin and Liljegren then yea you absolutely would love to add that luxury.
 
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We have Kerfoot from the original trade, so management didn't feel we needed Kadri then, so what makes people think he would want him back now?
 
bigbabybuda said:
We can't afford him. It's never going to happen. Should have never been traded and never run outta town. Only real big mistake Dubas has made.
Click to expand...
It was a mistake in hindsight but at the time it was the right kind of move that the team should have made. On paper, adding Barrie to a PP with our core was a match made in heaven. Just didn't work out.
 
These proposals are making my head hurt.

Thankfully Dubas doesn't read these boards.

Looking forward to Chychrun being traded to someone else so that we can move on to overpaying the next sexy name and depleting our picks and pipeline, usually without addressing our most pressing need.

Also, please don't post your video game trades. They are pretty horribad and add nothing of relevance to the conversation.

Yeesh
 
budzz said:
Habs are screaming for a decent center he'll end up there.
Click to expand...

Here is a young Naz with his father both sporting favourite childhood team.

img
boooooookadri.0.jpeg


Nazem Kadri with his dad, sporting the jersey of his favourite team.
The Leafs Nation​
 
I would love for him to be back but I just don't see how it's possible.

So, barring being able to return to the Leafs, I hope Naz gets PAID. Get your bag bro.
 
I really hope we pass on the Chychrun idea.

Too many assets for a player that will rearrange our d position based on which side he plays... We haven't been playing bad defensively, although there is a lot of room for improvement, our system has been pretty solid... And everyone is getting used to their roles... Holl is having a rough season but finding someone more confident in his spot and can handle tough minutes and make good decisions is all we really need.

That and depth moving forward. We go out and grab Chychrun it might shake everything up on the back end and have players playing their wrong side might mess with the flow.

Remember we were tied for first in the league, also In arguably the toughest division in the league too... Let's not get too carried away.
 
Kiwi said:
Well done

Our top 6LW is worse
Our 2nd pair RD is worse (that's some effort by the way)
Our backup goalie is hurt, as old as dirt and worse to

I love this board, for years people complain about our inability to develop young defenders but can't wait to trade a 21 year old putting up points and killing bottom pair competition

:laugh:
Click to expand...

im sorry but screw prospects at this point (respectfully, not saying we should trade all our prospects, but we need to also value actually doing whatever it takes to finally win a cup). It’s virtually impossible to build for the future and build for the now. (The only team to do that in the cap era is Tampa Bay. They hit on so many 2nd, 3rd, 4th and 5th rounders so they have been able to graduate a lot of guys to fill in lost roster players and stay strong) At some point you have to choose one or the other. If Dubas really believes in this core like he says he does, then he knows the window is 2-3 years. Maybe even less. There’s no time to wait on these prospects. If there is a deal that gives you a chance to add a player that will be a huge impact and help you at a deep cup run or even a finals win you trade that prospect for the player(s) (Not saying it has to be Chychrun).

No prospect, Amirov, Robertson, Sandin, Liljegren, our two Finnish guys, Knies should really be off the table at this point. Look at the teams that have consistently had deep runs. They have ultimately sacrificed future for now, it sucks but it is what it is. The leafs have had no success for so many years and we keep waiting for those prospects to lead us there. Hasn’t happened yet, something has to change.

that being said we have a good roster so we don’t HAVE to make a drastic move. But if a can’t miss player becomes available and we have the pieces Dubas absolutely should be making that move.
 
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Naz isn’t gonna keep pace and get 120 points, he won’t even get 100.

But if he scores at career pace he gets 75, easily his best season.

If he plays well I think he ends up around 30-55-85.

That’s going to be a costly floor, even with his colorful history, and his age (32).

He’s getting at least 6.5 for at least four years but it’s a retirement deal for him, Colorado needs a goalie while Burakovsky and Nuke need new deals - 25ish in cap with just 7F and 5D (0G) signed next year.

If he wants to win then staying where he is is a good play, but I think he’s on the market, he won’t take a haircut again - he was worth 5.5, possibly six when he was signed for 4.5.

He picked an absolutely beautiful time to pop, I hope he gets his money.
 
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I'd love to have him back, but as mentioned, the market conditions won't allow us to sign him as a UFA to contract terms that would make sense for our club as it's currently constructed.
 
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