Player Discussion Tony DeAngelo: Part III

[Bleed Ranger Blue]

ADA's agent, pat brisson, and his high powered partner jp barry for that matter, have a duty to seek the best deal for their clients every time.

this is a process.

the organization just gave arty and jake big long term deals. good. they earned those contracts. unproven rookies are making rook minimum salaries of 925k. ADA wants more than that. who can blame him ?

ADA and his people at CAA believe hes worth more than a QO this year based on his production and overall body of work. also, hes going to be an integral part of this team this year- adam fox or no adam fox, ADA is going to be big time player this season. top 4 minutes is a reality.

you can see both sides here. ADA is looking for "fair" money with an organization that is cash strapped right now- not his fault and why take a chance on a low ball "value" deal when the chance of injury- career threatening injury- one hit away ever time he laces up.

best deal. best AAV. best term. every time. thats what his people are looking for. taking a low ball deal and playing better sounds good but its just not sound management.

get him signed already.

This post blatantly ignores the fact that DeAngelo has been a difficult person to deal with his entire career, up to and through last season. Despite a good season on a bad team, he's given the Rangers little reason to go beyond the bare minimum and invest more heavily in him.

You reap what you sow, Tony.

 

[offdacrossbar]

This post blatantly ignores the fact that DeAngelo has been a difficult person to deal with his entire career, up to and through last season. Despite a good season on a bad team, he's given the Rangers little reason to go beyond the bare minimum and invest more heavily in him.

You reap what you sow, Tony.

sadly not disagreeing. i see bad things in his future if he indeed has drawn a line in the sand.

as stated before, this may well be an attempt to get his walking papers and be dealt for chump change to a team that will use his considerable skills.

lets not discount the quinn factor. there may well be a dislike for quinn and also some displeasure with fox being brought in. tony should not feel entitled to anything. he has no leverage here.

kid needs to sign and get to camp and prove hes more than a headache with talent.

dont blow this tony.

 

[haohmaru]

ADA needs to fire whoever is advising him to pursue this course of action. It's idiocy. I'm a pro-player guy, but this makes less than little sense to a guy in his position. No leverage. Nobody with an offer sheet. Nowhere to go but to another league - which would damage his career even further. Scratched for a quarter of last season for a myriad of reasons doesn't help things either. Holding out for a contract clearly a bit north of 1M when the Rangers have zero obligation to provide that is dumb.

Sign for 1M, or whatever the number is, get your ass to camp and prove that last season was only the beginning of what you can offer a team instead of rotting away on the sidelines watching other people getting a shot at the spot you earned last year.

I'd fire my f***ing agent if I were him.

 

[offdacrossbar]

ADA needs to fire whoever is advising him to pursue this course of action. It's idiocy. I'm a pro-player guy, but this makes less than little sense to a guy in his position. No leverage. Nobody with an offer sheet. Nowhere to go but to another league - which would damage his career even further. Scratched for a quarter of last season for a myriad of reasons doesn't help things either. Holding out for a contract clearly a bit north of 1M when the Rangers have zero obligation to provide that is dumb.

Sign for 1M, or whatever the number is, get your ass to camp and prove that last season was only the beginning of what you can offer a team instead of rotting away on the sidelines watching other people getting a shot at the spot you earned last year.

I'd fire my ****ing agent if I were him.

oh if it were that easy.

i disagree.

kid has proven hes a viable dman. played important minutes last yr and had stupid good offensive numbers. was at times, comfortably, our best defender.

poised to play key top 4 minutes this year with only the unproven adam fox on the right side after jake. i think hes earned more than 925 QO. why play for peanuts ?

there's money there to offer him 1 x 2 or 1.5 for 1.

look at the money they gave to the big time FA's- not his fault there isnt any money left. he should take less than market ? nah.

i mean look what neal pionk is getting paid ??? hes 2 yr @ 3.55

brendan smith 4.3 mil !!!

adam fox and ADA should be paid the same ?? really

team is hard balling him. 1.5/ 1 yr is fair.

 

[haohmaru]

oh if it were that easy.

i disagree.

kid has proven hes a viable dman. played important minutes last yr and had stupid good offensive numbers. was at times, comfortably, our best defender.

poised to play key top 4 minutes this year with only the unproven adam fox on the right side after jake. i think hes earned more than 925 QO. why play for peanuts ?

there's money there to offer him 1 x 2 or 1.5 for 1.

look at the money they gave to the big time FA's- not his fault there isnt any money left. he should take less than market ? nah.

i mean look what neal pionk is getting paid ??? hes 2 yr @ 3.55

brendan smith 4.3 mil !!!

adam fox and ADA should be paid the same ?? really

All of those guys had something Tony KO doesn't: Leverage

That's the difference. Tony has to take it or leave it and the Rangers would be stupid, no, STUPID to offer him 1.5 x 1. Why should they? If they're going to offer more than they have to, then term (2+ years) has to enter the equation otherwise the front office doesn't know what it's doing.

The money they gave the UFA's is the Rangers fault. 100%. Not Tony's fault. 100%. The Rangers gave those out knowing that Lemieux and ADA had no recourse other than signing a QO at or a little above the minimum because the Rangers hold the damned cards.

The Rangers need to hold fast. If ADA wants more money then he has to add term to the deal. That's the way the cookie crumbles.

Like Clint Eastwood says in Unforgiven: "Deserve's got nothing to do with it".

 

[Oscar Lindberg]

there's money there to offer him 1 x 2 or 1.5 for 1.

They literally do not have the money to offer him 2 million

Unless you’re talking about 2 years, in which case that won’t happen either.

I think some are greatly overvaluing what Tony’s place on this team is long term. More and more it seems to me he’ll be a product of “pumping and dumping” an asset

 

[offdacrossbar]

All of those guys had something Tony KO doesn't: Leverage

That's the difference. Tony has to take it or leave it and the Rangers would be stupid, no, STUPID to offer him 1.5 x 1. Why should they? If they're going to offer more than they have to, then term (2+ years) has to enter the equation otherwise the front office doesn't know what it's doing.

The money they gave the UFA's is the Rangers fault. 100%. Not Tony's fault. 100%. The Rangers gave those out knowing that Lemieux and ADA had no recourse other than signing a QO at or a little above the minimum because the Rangers hold the damned cards.

The Rangers need to hold fast. If ADA wants more money then he has to add term to the deal. That's the way the cookie crumbles.

Like Clint Eastwood says in Unforgiven: "Deserve's got nothing to do with it".

makes the team weaker.

dumb move on the part of the organization to low ball a guy who was being counted on to provide a lot from the blue line.

if they believe they can make the playoffs this season, not having 77 back there makes that tougher.

he lacks leverage agreed. but this hardball play seems petty really.

neal pionk makes 1.5 mil per yr. let that sink in and then tell me tony d is asking for too much.....

 

[haohmaru]

makes the team weaker.

dumb move on the part of the organization to low ball a guy who was being counted on to provide a lot from the blue line.

if they believe they can make the playoffs this season, not having 77 back there makes that tougher.

he lacks leverage agreed. but this hardball play seems petty really.

neal pionk makes 1.5 mil per yr. let that sink in and then tell me tony d is asking for too much.....

Again, apples and oranges. Pionk had arbitration rights, Tony doesn't. The Rangers are doing the right thing for the Rangers.

They aren't "low-balling" anyone. They're staying the course with what they've done throughout the cap era - 1 year QO or more $ for more term. The guy being the hard ass here is the ADA.

 

[will1066]

I'm still not talking to you Mortimer

When are you ever going to forgive me for insisting to turn those machines back on while you weren't feeling well?

 

[will1066]

"I'M A KARATE MAN! KARATE MEN BRUISE ON THE INSIDE!"

"It aint cool being a jive turkey so close to Thanksgiving."

 

[will1066]

sadly not disagreeing. i see bad things in his future if he indeed has drawn a line in the sand.

as stated before, this may well be an attempt to get his walking papers and be dealt for chump change to a team that will use his considerable skills.

lets not discount the quinn factor. there may well be a dislike for quinn and also some displeasure with fox being brought in. tony should not feel entitled to anything. he has no leverage here.

kid needs to sign and get to camp and prove hes more than a headache with talent.

dont blow this tony.

I read this and thought of a certain scene in Scarface where a Tony is warned in no uncertain terms.

But yeah, I had thought about the Quinn factor. Except the other way around. The decisions are predominantly in the hands of JG and JD, but is Quinn going to bat for him?

 

[True Blue]

When are you ever going to forgive me for insisting to turn those machines back on while you weren't feeling well?

One of the greatest moments.

Official #1: Margin call, gentlemen.
Mortimer: Why, you can't expect us to -
Official #2: You know the rules of the exchange, Mr. Duke! All accounts are to be settled at the end of the day's trading, without exception.
Randolph: You know perfectly well we don't have three hundred and ninety-four million dollars in cash!
George: I'm sorry, boys. [to Official #1] Put the Duke brothers' seats on the exchange up for sale at once; seize all assets of Duke & Duke Commodities Brokers, as well as all personal holdings of Randolph and Mortimer Duke.
Randolph: My God. [clutching his heart] We're ruined.
[He begins to totter on his feet]
Mortimer: This is an outrage! I demand an investigation! You can't sell our seats! A Duke has been sitting on this exchange since it was founded! We founded this exchange! It's ours!! It belongs to US!!!
Randolph: My God...
[He collapses]
George: Mortimer, your brother's not well! We'd better call an ambulance!
Mortimer: !@#$ HIM! Now you listen to me! I want trading reopened right now! Get those brokers back in here! Turn those machines back on!! [shouts, echoing throughout the trading hall] TURN THOSE MACHINES BACK ON!!!

 

[True Blue]

But yeah, I had thought about the Quinn factor. Except the other way around. The decisions are predominantly in the hands of JG and JD, but is Quinn going to bat for him?

I think to a point. I believe that the real danger point for DeAngelo is if Quinn decides that the hassle is not worth the talent. I also believe, that in the eyes of Quinn, DeAngelo is absolutely doing himself no favors. This does seems like activity that lands him squarely in the Quinn bin.

 

[will1066]

One of the greatest moments.

Official #1: Margin call, gentlemen.
Mortimer: Why, you can't expect us to -
Official #2: You know the rules of the exchange, Mr. Duke! All accounts are to be settled at the end of the day's trading, without exception.
Randolph: You know perfectly well we don't have three hundred and ninety-four million dollars in cash!
George: I'm sorry, boys. [to Official #1] Put the Duke brothers' seats on the exchange up for sale at once; seize all assets of Duke & Duke Commodities Brokers, as well as all personal holdings of Randolph and Mortimer Duke.
Randolph: My God. [clutching his heart] We're ruined.
[He begins to totter on his feet]
Mortimer: This is an outrage! I demand an investigation! You can't sell our seats! A Duke has been sitting on this exchange since it was founded! We founded this exchange! It's ours!! It belongs to US!!!
Randolph: My God...
[He collapses]
George: Mortimer, your brother's not well! We'd better call an ambulance!
Mortimer: !@#$ HIM! Now you listen to me! I want trading reopened right now! Get those brokers back in here! Turn those machines back on!! [shouts, echoing throughout the trading hall] TURN THOSE MACHINES BACK ON!!!

Mortimer: This is an outrage! I demand an investigation! You can't sell our seats! A Duke has been sitting on this exchange since it was founded! We founded this exchange! It's ours!! It belongs to US!!!

The way Don Ameche was slapping his chest when he said this, he wasn't acting!

 

[will1066]

I think to a point. I believe that the real danger point for DeAngelo is if Quinn decides that the hassle is not worth the talent. I also believe, that in the eyes of Quinn, DeAngelo is absolutely doing himself no favors. This does seems like activity that lands him squarely in the Quinn bin.

Agreed. I was hinting in my post that Quinn probably doesn't feel he is worth the hassle--to him or the team. Not that holding out at any time is good, but during camp, it's the worst time, when the entire organization is roaring to go.

 

[Mandar]

"It aint cool being a jive turkey so close to Thanksgiving."

"Haven't you people heard of coasters?"

 

[Vitto79]

Only way he gets more is if Belesky is dealt w an asset to renove that cap hit

 

[Dr. Ogrodnick]

makes the team weaker.

dumb move on the part of the organization to low ball a guy who was being counted on to provide a lot from the blue line.

if they believe they can make the playoffs this season, not having 77 back there makes that tougher.

he lacks leverage agreed. but this hardball play seems petty really.

neal pionk makes 1.5 mil per yr. let that sink in and then tell me tony d is asking for too much.....

Actually, what seems petty is holding out for a big contract (according to brooks the gulf is wide between the Rangers offer and ADA's ask) when you have no leverage, the Rangers have no cap room to accomodate you, and you have yet to get a full season under you belt due to maturity issues which have already put you on your 3rd team.

The more camp/pre-season/season he misses, the more likely struggles next season. Then he goes into next summer when he actually has leverage with much less to bring to the table for his next contract. He's shooting himself in the foot.

 

[Crease]

Sadly I can't say I'm at all surprised ADA is holding out. I get it from his perspective, he's talented and worth more than his QO, but c'mon let's go. Sign your one year deal like everyone else and set yourself up for success in the ice and in arbitration next summer.

 

[SA16]

They literally do not have the money to offer him 2 million

Unless you’re talking about 2 years, in which case that won’t happen either.

I think some are greatly overvaluing what Tony’s place on this team is long term. More and more it seems to me he’ll be a product of “pumping and dumping” an asset

They have the money. They don't want to spend it and get closer to the cap due to call ups and potential bonuses (which aren't a big deal since they'll easily be able to withstand them next year). But they can definitely go up to 2.6M if they run a 21 man roster.

 

[Brooklyn Rangers Fan]

They have the money. They don't want to spend it and get closer to the cap due to call ups and potential bonuses (which aren't a big deal since they'll easily be able to withstand them next year). But they can definitely go up to 2.6M if they run a 21 man roster.

So in other words they don’t — unless you’re suggesting they should prioritize accommodating Tony’s demands over retaining the flexibility to ice the team the coach/org wants to ice.

 

[SA16]

So in other words they don’t — unless you’re suggesting they should prioritize accommodating Tony’s demands over retaining the flexibility to ice the team the coach/org wants to ice.

Well yea I would rather have DeAngelo playing than have a 22nd player sit around in the press box to watch every game and fill in when he decides it’s the day to healthy scratch kakko/kravtsov/Anderson/fox/hajek ke whoever.

Also they have enough young players on deals that they can easily make paper moves to demote them to the AHL/promote someone else whenever Quinn wants them to sit anyway.

And they can certainly go up to 1.9M if they want to run 22 guys as there is definitely no need for 23

 

[Lua]

There's a certain Canadian team that really wishes they didn't let an RFA with no leverage strong arm them by sitting out for half a season.

You really don't want to send RFAs with no arbitration rights the message that they have something to gain by holding out. The line is in the sand, and the Rangers have a ton of blue chip prospects that will be in the same exact position as Tony D before we know it. If the Rangers bend, these younger guys will take notice.

Tony's production and skillset is worth more than what he will get. Sucks for him.

 

[Bleed Ranger Blue]

They have the money. They don't want to spend it and get closer to the cap due to call ups and potential bonuses (which aren't a big deal since they'll easily be able to withstand them next year). But they can definitely go up to 2.6M if they run a 21 man roster.

Yeah. Maybe. But the more likely scenario is that the organization wants to show it's younger players that its not going to kowtow to the locker room dickhead

 

[will1066]

"Haven't you people heard of coasters?"

Who's been putting out their Kools on my floor?!