Confirmed with Link: Toffoli to CGY for Emil Heineman, Tyler Pitlick + Picks (Part 2)

[dcyhabs]

Maybe, but his numbers are well within his career norm. His defensive game has slipped which may be due to the team, but it was always pretty overrated.

Yes, Dvorak was acquired because he was very, very available and not because anyone, even MB, thought that he was what the team needed. He doesn't really bring skills the team is lacking and he needs to be surrounded by players the habs don't have.

 

[RandR]

What could be questioned in my view, is the timing of the trade on a player with term, at a low cap hit and who wanted to be a part of the rebuild. Toffoli wasn't a fit in terms of speed, but he checked off a lot of boxes otherwise. I'd just be curious to know why they opted to trade him now. Would he not have kept his value if traded at the trading deadline next year?

Just a guess, but it may simply be a matter that the Habs are willing to trade all but about 5 of their current roster and the Flames wanted Toffoli badly enough to be the first team to make an offer that Hughes and Gorton are happy with.

 

[PuckNorris]

It's nice to trade a guy not because he's fallen out of favour, but because it's the right thing to do long term. When was the last time that happened? In the past the Habs have always traded guys because they soured with either the fans or coaches/management and it usually ended with bitterness.

It feels like we're in a different era finally.

 

[Adam Michaels]

It's nice to trade a guy not because he's fallen out of favour, but because it's the right thing to do long term. When was the last time that happened? In the past the Habs have always traded guys because they soured with either the fans or coaches/management and it usually ended with bitterness.

It feels like we're in a different era finally.

That is true. But to Bergevin's credit, even though things soured with a bunch of guys, he was able to muster good value in trades.

But of course, the Markov & Radulov fiasco wouldn't happen.

 

[JianYang]

It's nice to trade a guy not because he's fallen out of favour, but because it's the right thing to do long term. When was the last time that happened? In the past the Habs have always traded guys because they soured with either the fans or coaches/management and it usually ended with bitterness.

It feels like we're in a different era finally.

If toffoli was genuine about staying, I think he's still bitter. He signed for 4 years, and only got 1.5 years out of it.

If he truly wanted to stay despite the team being bad, then there's something about the city or family that was keeping him here, so I doubt he's ready to give Gorton some flowers.

 

[SwiftyHab]

Let me throw out a few extra considerations around this trade.

All our players are undervalued right now based on how poorly the team is doing but they showed last year that they can play at a high level right through the playoff and if Toffoli can have a good start with the flames tonight then Hughes will have a good argument with other GMs that are undervaluing our players.

secondly, with our cap space, I’m looking forward to seeing what other moves this helps us make with teams that need to shed salary before the trade deadline.

 

[Habs]

You need some balance. Calgary has the big players to open space for Gaudreau and Toffoli, and neither of them needs it as much as say, Drouin, Hoffman, and Caufield. Montreal had some balance but when they lost Danault, KK, Weber, Edmundson, and (not literally) Petry then "replaced" them with Savard, Hoffman, and Dvorak they had none. Losing all your best players is bad, trying to build lines with only small snipers makes it worse.

Big skilled teams can be better with a couple of elusive small guys. Teams that have mainly elusive small guys only work in the NHL when the officiating is in a "no holding" phase. Read "never" in the playoffs.

MB went out and made individual deals to get single players and then heaped them together and expected the coach to make a team. Gorton and Hughes appear to be looking for skillsets they need and players who will work for the team in future. I hope they get it right. Calgary looks to be doing OK, I expect Toffoli to do well.

I still hate this trade, TT was exactly what we needed to rebuild with. Scores, wanted to be here, cap friendly ,a leader. They will be looking to replace him now for years to come. I hate it. If this was a wicked draft, ok, fine but meh..

 

[The Last Red]

I still hate this trade, TT was exactly what we needed to rebuild with. Scores, wanted to be here, cap friendly ,a leader. They will be looking to replace him now for years to come. I hate it. If this was a wicked draft, ok, fine but meh..

Bro, by the time we’re okay again TT will be minimum 33-34 and long gone. Trust the process.

 

[Adam Michaels]

 

[417]

Exactly. As usual, no one knows anything. They're all playing GM and like to believe that they could have done better.

What could be questioned in my view, is the timing of the trade on a player with term, at a low cap hit and who wanted to be a part of the rebuild. Toffoli wasn't a fit in terms of speed, but he checked off a lot of boxes otherwise. I'd just be curious to know why they opted to trade him now. Would he not have kept his value if traded at the trading deadline next year?

Calgary can use Toffoli for two seasons and flip him for value when his contract is expiring. I wonder how this factored into the deal and how much leverage Hughes had on account of it.

I asked myself the same question but I came away thinking that it would have been easy for a new GM to come in and just make the obvious trades, Hughes has an idea of the kind of team he wants and Toffoli, fair or not, probably didn’t fit in the medium-to-long-term vision of what he wants to see.

The return was fair, the team isn’t going anywhere…so why should he turn it down?

Especially considering wing is probably where this team needs to look at when re-allocating salary cap money in their lineup.

 

[Runner77]

I asked myself the same question but I came away thinking that it would have been easy for a new GM to come in and just make the obvious trades, Hughes has an idea of the kind of team he wants and Toffoli, fair or not, probably didn’t fit in the medium-to-long-term vision of what he wants to see.

The return was fair, the team isn’t going anywhere…so why should he turn it down?

Especially considering wing is probably where this team needs to look at when re-allocating salary cap money in their lineup.

It’s the bird in the hand thing. However, it also signaled how difficult this trade deadline market might be. There is limited cap space, how many teams will be willing to cough up a first rounder without retention?

Maybe not on a Chiarot with an expiring contract or on a Lehkonen on an affordable deal, but likely any other outgoing piece will require more compromise and more creativity.

 

[Halakitlikethat]

It's nice to trade a guy not because he's fallen out of favour, but because it's the right thing to do long term. When was the last time that happened? In the past the Habs have always traded guys because they soured with either the fans or coaches/management and it usually ended with bitterness.

It feels like we're in a different era finally.

Agreed and I think that’s why I’m so conflicted on this deal. I know it was the right thing to do but it feels uncomfortable because I like Toffoli so much

 

[MadMslm]

Gallagher in shambles right now.

He was a good veteran to have around, hopefully the team can have a bit of success to bring some positivity into the room.

 

[Adam Michaels]

 

[Runner77]

Friggin’ hate these vanity shots with Toffoli involving Lucic the f*** face goon. Maybe Flames fan can enjoy them.

 

[Naslund]

I still hate this trade, TT was exactly what we needed to rebuild with. Scores, wanted to be here, cap friendly ,a leader. They will be looking to replace him now for years to come. I hate it. If this was a wicked draft, ok, fine but meh..

I liked him to, but no more treadmill. We rebuild, and rebuilding requires Toffoli-type trades for younger assets. No two ways about it.

 

[Habs]

I liked him to, but no more treadmill. We rebuild, and rebuilding requires Toffoli-type trades for younger assets. No two ways about it.

getting younger does not mean we are better.

 

[Habs]

Bro, by the time we’re okay again TT will be minimum 33-34 and long gone. Trust the process.

I do not trust the process though, so .. meh .. did we lost a player to really work with Suzuki? Who is he going to pass to ? There was no rush to trade TT at this point at all, unless a 'killer deal' came up. This was not a killer deal

 

[Mandalorian]

getting younger does not mean we are better.

The point is to build a window of contention from 2024-2034, in the prime of our future high picks. Prospects we aquire are much more likely to be useful players in that window than our near 30 or over 30 vets.

 

[Doc5]

I don’t understand why some people are disappointed.. this signals the start of something we never done before, a rebuild. Could we have gotten more for Toffoli? Possibly. Did they get a good return nonetheless? Heck yeah, so what more can we can ask for? With Habs fans it’s always going to be damned if they do, damned if they don’t.

 

[Habs]

The point is to build a window of contention from 2024-2034, in the prime of our future high picks. Prospects we aquire are much more likely to be useful players in that window than our near 30 or over 30 vets.

I get it, I've followed this team forever and seen this talk 1000x on HF since the early 2000's. Who is going to help Suzuki and how do he and CC grow without an ounce of talent on the PP? So guess what, they go and get a FA that fills the void TT just left. Keep TT, we need an 'ounce' of talent to create a little bit of positive energy on this team. They didn't dump all the talent in NYC when they rebuilt. Also, its not an issue to land a FA in NY, unlike Montreal.

and statistically, the prospects this year and next are nothing to write home about in the draft after the top 5 and we got Calgary's 20th? Shane Wright is not a saving grace, you can't rebuild with shit players.

 

[VirginiaMtlExpat]

I still hate this trade, TT was exactly what we needed to rebuild with. Scores, wanted to be here, cap friendly ,a leader. They will be looking to replace him now for years to come. I hate it. If this was a wicked draft, ok, fine but meh..

I get the same feeling as well. Someone will have to put the puck in the net and help the team compete at some point, otherwise the misery will be self-perpetuating. I can understand that he is not the most explosive skater, but I would have done surgery elsewhere on the team.

 

[BLONG7]

I get it, I've followed this team forever and seen this talk 1000x on HF since the early 2000's. Who is going to help Suzuki and how do he and CC grow without an ounce of talent on the PP? So guess what, they go and get a FA that fills the void TT just left. Keep TT, we need an 'ounce' of talent to create a little bit of positive energy on this team. They didn't dump all the talent in NYC when they rebuilt. Also, its not an issue to land a FA in NY, unlike Montreal.

and statistically, the prospects this year and next are nothing to write home about in the draft after the top 5 and we got Calgary's 20th? Shane Wright is not a saving grace, you can't rebuild with shit players.

If Bergevin was given almost 10 seasons, how about we give the new guys more than a few weeks?
This is an entirely different time, and the new guys seemingly have a plan. I think the Bergevin Rinse and Repeat Era may have you thinking the way you are...
Rebuilds gotta start somewhere....it's so early in the process.
I loved TT too, but as soon as Hughes said he wanted a ast team, guys like Toffolli were on borrowed time....we have several of those types, it's just that Toffolli actually had some value to Calgary.

I am looking for a few more guys to get traded fairly soon.....
As others have said, trust the process. The new guys deserve some time............they are actually using their brains, unlike the clown who just left town...

 

[McPhees Moustache]

I get the same feeling as well. Someone will have to put the puck in the net and help the team compete at some point, otherwise the misery will be self-perpetuating. I can understand that he is not the most explosive skater, but I would have done surgery elsewhere on the team.

We're gonna suck for a couple years - Keeping Toffoli to score 10-15 extra goals and win 4 extra games a year was going to make us 'competitive'? This team needs elite talent to build around - we've been a team of 2nd & 3rd liners with a great goalie for the past decade and it hasn't worked. Time to try something different!

 

[26Mats]

I don’t understand why some people are disappointed.. this signals the start of something we never done before, a rebuild. Could we have gotten more for Toffoli? Possibly. Did they get a good return nonetheless? Heck yeah, so what more can we can ask for? With Habs fans it’s always going to be damned if they do, damned if they don’t.

I guess they thought his numbers would be what they are now going forward on this bad team, so might as well move him now while the memory of his numbers from last season still lingers in GM's minds.

And, if Toffoli is for sale, that must mean all vets are for sale. After Price, he's got to he our 2nd best vet.

Petry, Chiarot, amd Edmundson may all be traded soon, if they can fetch a 1st.