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Time to Hire Barry Trotz

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DarkKnight said:
I wanted to turf Keefe after the season, and would have pursued Trotz like a bloodhound, so this isn’t early season “take it easy” stuff. We lost, again, you have to change something, only hubris tells you to roll it all back. There is no downside to a Trotz over Keefe consideration in my mind, none.

Anyways, it is early and we probably rebound, but philosophically YES please.
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Trotz would be an improvement, I am surprised that Tortarella was not considered, something big has to change if this team is bounced from the playoffs early this season, for the record I am not a leafs fan. I am thinking that Torts was not even considered because he would be tough on the players.
 
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Lightsol said:
Torterella would drop dead of a heart attack less than 5 games into the season in Toronto, because the media would spent as much time as possible goading him into one of his huge anti-media screaming matches.
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Leafs brass would be ok with this if Torts were brought in for the playoffs, but we will see what happens this year in Philly, still time for Trotz, If things do not change in this years playoffs, Keefe and Dubas probably gone, but i would trade the overpriced talent first, but that ain,t about to happen.
 
Andrewcoursol said:
Leafs brass would be ok with this if Torts were brought in for the playoffs, but we will see what happens this year in Philly, still time for Trotz, If things do not change in this years playoffs, Keefe and Dubas probably gone, but i would trade the overpriced talent first, but that ain,t about to happen.
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I'll spoil it for you. They're going out in round 1 again. Keefe will be outcoached in any series he ever enters at the NHL level.
 
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saltming said:
It's not the kids but the system. They try to keep possession hrough the neutral zone and enter the offensive zone with the puck. That is hard to do with the trap.
When facing the trap you dump and chase, I know you know this, so are you saying the players can't skate fast enough to retrieve the puck?
Imo they aren't being coached on this so when they face a trap they continue to play their game, this I my issue with Keefe, not able to adapt especially in game.
The dump and chase is not as simple as it sounds and the team should practice the timing and nuances to add to their toolbox. That's on coaching
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To play dump and chase, you also need some physical presence up front to pound your opponents defence and put them on their heels. The Leafs have very few players capable of playing that physical game and the few that they do have, aren’t players with meaningful offensive ability.

Until that changes, they will get bounced from the playoffs repeatedly by any team capable of playing an effective trap game.
 
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CaptainCrunch17 said:
To play dump and chase, you also need some physical presence up front to pound your opponents defence and put them on their heels. The Leafs have very few players capable of playing that physical game and the few that they do have, aren’t players with meaningful offensive ability.

Until that changes, they will get bounced from the playoffs repeatedly by any team capable of playing an effective trap game.
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I agree to an extent and think it would be better if we had a tkchuck or Wilson but Matthews Tavares and Nylander are strong on the puck and should be able to recover the puck regularly.
I, like you, would like a heavy hitter out there too. When you tenderize the opposing D they rush plays or give up the puck to scouts the hit etc
 
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Laughable people are blaming Keefe. Babcock was a hardass who preached one way and Keefe was hard at times but mostly treated the group as adults and preached another. Doesn't matter the voice the issue with this team if there is one lies with the players. Everything else around the core has been changed.

I don't think personally we are close to seeing any big changes. They will have 20 games to figure it out and see how things are going. But after 20 games, IMO you fire Dubas (and I am a fan of him but his refusal to change anything would be the cause here) and task the new GM with a shakeup trade mid season.

Vancouver wants a change. Maybe Nylander for Horvat?
 
HockeyVirus said:
Laughable people are blaming Keefe. Babcock was a hardass who preached one way and Keefe was hard at times but mostly treated the group as adults and preached another. Doesn't matter the voice the issue with this team if there is one lies with the players. Everything else around the core has been changed.

I don't think personally we are close to seeing any big changes. They will have 20 games to figure it out and see how things are going. But after 20 games, IMO you fire Dubas (and I am a fan of him but his refusal to change anything would be the cause here) and task the new GM with a shakeup trade mid season.

Vancouver wants a change. Maybe Nylander for Horvat?
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You’re gonna trade the only guy that consistently scores in the playoffs?
 
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KPower said:
You’re gonna trade the only guy that consistently scores in the playoffs?
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Tavares isn't moving he has a NMC and it is suicide to ask the biggest UFA in team history to waive it especially when you have pending UFA's watching.

Marner goes you might as well trade Matthews too because Matthews is best friends with him and has been clear he wants to play with him. Matthews won't go because ownership would never approve the trade.

I get why Dubas hasn't moved anyone because it needs to be Willy and he is great value with his caphit and like you said a good player. But that is the reality of the situation. And to be honest Nylander is likely gone as a UFA anyways he will not be made the priority.

The only situation where anyone other than Nylander goes is if Ownership decides it is so bad they are firing everyone and rebuilding which will NEVER EVER happen especially with stars in their primes. In theory though, the return on Matthews and Marner alone would accelerate a rebuild by half a decade. It's just not realistic.
 
HockeyVirus said:
Laughable people are blaming Keefe. Babcock was a hardass who preached one way and Keefe was hard at times but mostly treated the group as adults and preached another. Doesn't matter the voice the issue with this team if there is one lies with the players. Everything else around the core has been changed.

I don't think personally we are close to seeing any big changes. They will have 20 games to figure it out and see how things are going. But after 20 games, IMO you fire Dubas (and I am a fan of him but his refusal to change anything would be the cause here) and task the new GM with a shakeup trade mid season.

Vancouver wants a change. Maybe Nylander for Horvat?
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Absolutely god awful.
 
Fogelhund said:
I think he'd want a say in personnel decisions, or I doubt he'd take the job.
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That is the rumour but I am sure he is putting this out there for Shanny. Maybe this guy can be the next Pat Quinn, and eventually become the GM. What I know is you can't fire 23 players.
 
It’s a strange argument to make that Trotz isn’t the right fit here for this team as constructed. On one hand, completely agree. Also though, perhaps that is instructive as to our makeup.

Keefe is a passenger, we have talent to win games but for my money is a middling coach who doesn’t elevate anything. Dubas’ buddy, we’re stuck with him unless it goes completely sideaways, and again I think our talent prevents that outcome.
 
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ToneDog said:
That is the rumour but I am sure he is putting this out there for Shanny. Maybe this guy can be the next Pat Quinn, and eventually become the GM. What I know is you can't fire 23 players.
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The good thing is, we don't need to fire 23 players. 3-5 changes, and the team looks completely different. I would go so far as to say, we don't really need to change bodies in the top six... so some redo some of the bottom six, a couple of D, and away we go. Some of those changes could even come internally before the end of the year.
 
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Supporting cast is no longer good enough for me to judge Keefe imo especially when he's getting annoyed at the same things that annoy us lately. He has moved to inconclusive.

This team literally depends on if core shows up or not. When they show up they rarely lose. When they don't show up......:help:
 
If Trotz does want some say in player decisions and Shanny wants more say as well, could be an interesting option. One moves up, one moves down, ditch the buddies and retool on the fly. It’s an idea.
 
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