Tim Stutzle vs Auston Matthews Contracts Included

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

Doesn’t matter if you think Tarasenko + Stutzle > Matthews when you literally mismanage the rest of your cap lol. It voids everything. You literally can’t sign your 3c even if you wanted to. NyQuil likes to pretend like it was planned, but even if it was / wasn’t, it’s irrelevant, you still couldn’t sign him lol

I like how you have to resort to making this a Toronto vs Ottawa thread, because you realize the futility of debating the actual thread.

 

[The90]

I like how you have to resort to making this a Toronto vs Ottawa thread, because you realize the futility of debating the actual thread.

It’s the whole premise of the thread? Cap space and inferior player vs better player and cap it. Then you get 40 pages debating which is better. Also the 2 players play for Toronto and Ottawa. You swung dude, you also missed, though.

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

It’s the whole premise of the thread? Cap space and inferior player vs better player and cap it. Then you get 40 pages debating which is better. Also the 2 players play for Toronto and Ottawa. You swung dude, you also missed, though.

Toronto vs Ottawa is not the premise of the thread.

 

[The90]

Toronto vs Ottawa is not the premise of the thread

I too like to stop reading after the first sentence of a paragraph sometimes

 

[KevinRedkey]

Doesn’t matter if you think Tarasenko + Stutzle > Matthews when you literally mismanage the rest of your cap lol. It voids everything. You literally can’t sign your 3c even if you wanted to. NyQuil likes to pretend like it was planned, but even if it was / wasn’t, it’s irrelevant, you still couldn’t sign him lol

Ok Mr gatekeeper.

It doesn't matter what I think. Remove my vote and take a look at the poll for all I care.

I'm done with you. Lol

 

[The90]

Ok Mr gatekeeper.

It doesn't matter what I think. Remove my vote and take a look at the poll for all I care.

I'm done with you. Lol

Aka you can’t argue a good point, so you’re out

 

[KevinRedkey]

Let's get back on topic.

Stutzle leads by 52 votes.

Discuss.

 

[The90]

Let's get back on topic.

Stutzle leads by 52 votes.

Discuss.

Yes. Let’s. A smaller cap hit player only makes sense if a team can properly manage their cap in order to sign all other players, like a 3c.

 

[jbeck5]

I get that....but people were trying to compare players rather than a specific point in time. I honestly haven't read through all of this as I haven't been interested enough....but Stutzle seems to have been lauded for his season last year (78 games, 39 goals and 90 points) and Matthews crapped on for his season (74 games, 40 goals and 85 points). Seems odd....I get Matthews is more experienced and makes more money.

If you just look at raw stats for the years both have been in the NHL (Stutzle - 223 games, 71 goals, 194pts, Matthews - 214 games, 154 goals, 276pts).

I'm honestly not trying to make any arguments here, I try my very best to avoid the discussions starting with "cap hit considered" because I just hate that....I look at who I think is the better player...that can be subjective enough to begin with. For me, Matthews has clearly been the better player, last year wasn't great, but effectively on par with Stutzle's year. Stutzle will likely continue to improve, etc.....but I'm not in a position to say much at this point....anything is possible (he could blow Matthews away in the next few years, who knows).

What a bias comparison to start tracking when one is a rookie and the other is in their prime.

Usually, combining last year and this year should give you a pretty good picture of how they're playing presently.

Matthews 89GP-53-51-104
Stutzle 92GP-42-65-107

Interesting that the one outscoring the other is a few years younger and only making about 2/3 the salary.

To me, it doesnt seem crazy at all to pick stutzle here.

 

[Sensatauro]

The sens mismanagement of the cap only makes sense if you believe they could sign Pinto in offseason.

It's a misnomer.

It's been brought to light that they COULD NOT sign Pinto.

But don't let facts get in your way of bashing the sens mismanaged cap

Also, LOL leafs, Sens have 2 games in hand only 6 points seperate the teams, yet leafs fans act like they're infinitely better.

Fun fact, which team has had more playoff success in last ten years...I remember the day I watched the leafs in the eastern conference finals ...oh wait that was the Senators...

And the next ten years won't be any different.

 

[jbeck5]

It’s a subject that Toronto sports media and Toronto fans are trying to push hard, it’s false but they try.

I was wondering this. I never see him sacrifice his body or play guys physically defensively.

In fact, I'm not sure I've ever seen him throw a hit.

He's like a much better Bobby Ryan...can't spell the word intense.

 

[jbeck5]

It’s the whole premise of the thread? Cap space and inferior player vs better player and cap it. Then you get 40 pages debating which is better. Also the 2 players play for Toronto and Ottawa. You swung dude, you also missed, though.

Actually, the topic is about who you would rather have. Stutzle or Matthews.

Not about which team is better.

And you're calling someone else out for swinging and missing?

You litterally missed the entire premise of the thread.

 

[umma gumma]

Yes. Let’s. A smaller cap hit player only makes sense if a team can properly manage their cap in order to sign all other players, like a 3c.

Or you could use the extra cash to re-sign your top line right winger who's due for a raise. More than one way to use a smaller cap hit.

 

[notbias]

What a bias comparison to start tracking when one is a rookie and the other is in their prime.

Usually, combining last year and this year should give you a pretty good picture of how they're playing presently.

Matthews 89GP-53-51-104
Stutzle 92GP-42-65-107

Interesting that the one outproducing the other is a few years younger and only making about 2/3 the salary.

To me, it doesnt seem crazy at all to pick stutzle here.

"Combining the year Matthews was injured with this year makes the most sense"

To me, it seems crazy.

Hart, Lindsay, 2x Rocket vs top 20 C.

Or you could use the extra cash to re-sign your top line right winger who's due for a raise. More than one way to use a smaller cap hit.

Or you can use it on 5 million in dead cap like Ottawa.

Not sure what the point is but GMs constantly overpay or mismanage the cap.

Ottawa has proven once again so far this year that the 5 million extra was a waste, you can look at the standings and see for yourself.

 

[jbeck5]

"Combining the year Matthews was injured with this year makes the most sense"

To me, it seems crazy.

Hart, Lindsay, 2x Rocket vs top 20 C.

They're all fighting injuries, missing some games, or playing injured.

I don't remember the last time my team played at full strength or without players playing injured.

It's part of life.

The point is, looking at this year and last year makes a whole lot more sense than looking at 2 or 3 or 4 years ago to determine who's better right now. That makes no sense.

 

[notbias]

They're all fighting injuries, missing some games, or playing injured.

I don't remember the last time my team played at full strength or without players playing injured.

It's part of life.

The point is, looking at this year and last year makes a whole lot more sense than looking at 2 or 3 or 4 years ago to determine who's better right now. That makes no sense.

You chose a year Matthews had an injury all year... it is idiotic.

Choosing smaller sample sizes is idiotic.

Why not just choose this year if you want to know who is the best right now?

The motive is clear.

 

[jbeck5]

"Combining the year Matthews was injured with this year makes the most sense"

To me, it seems crazy.

Hart, Lindsay, 2x Rocket vs top 20 C.



Or you can use it on 5 million in dead cap like Ottawa.

Not sure what the point is but GMs constantly overpay or mismanage the cap.

Ottawa has proven once again so far this year that the 5 million extra was a waste, you can look at the standings and see for yourself.

Good thing goal differential is generally a good indicator of how things will average out.

Just curious.

Why do you think Toronto is only +1 and Ottawa is +6? What do you think has caused this so far this year?

 

[umma gumma]

"Combining the year Matthews was injured with this year makes the most sense"

To me, it seems crazy.

Hart, Lindsay, 2x Rocket vs top 20 C.



Or you can use it on 5 million in dead cap like Ottawa.

Not sure what the point is but GMs constantly overpay or mismanage the cap.

Ottawa has proven once again so far this year that the 5 million extra was a waste, you can look at the standings and see for yourself.

Talking about Ottawa's situation does nothing to change needing to sign your star winger, and an extra 5m would get it done. The 5mil in dead space is for one season in Ottawa. You can use the extra 5 on your winger for the duration of his contract.

 

[The90]

Or you could use the extra cash to re-sign your top line right winger who's due for a raise. More than one way to use a smaller cap hit.

Lol. Zing. What a burn.

 

[notbias]

Good thing goal differential is generally a good indicator of how things will average out.

Just curious.

Why do you think Toronto is only +1 and Ottawa is +6? What do you think has caused this so far this year?

Terrible Toronto goaltending and bad defensive coverage by playing Reaves (-11) and Klingberg too much.

I think Ottawa will continue to be a bottom feeder and Toronto will get better.

Talking about Ottawa's situation does nothing to change needing to sign your star winger, and an extra 5m would get it done. The 5mil in dead space is for one season in Ottawa. You can use the extra 5 on your winger for the duration of his contract.

They will have no issues signing Nylander... Toronto has basically no wasted cap on bad players... Ottawa does.

 

[jbeck5]

You chose a year Matthews had an injury all year... it is idiotic.

Choosing smaller sample sizes is idiotic.

Why not just choose this year if you want to know who is the best right now?

The motive is clear.

Ok, then use this year.

Matthews 19 points in 15 games.
Stutzle 17 points in 13 games.

Stutzle is much younger and much cheaper.

You gotta go stutzle.

Funny is sens fans agree that other than a game or two, he hasn't been his best...yet he seems to have no problem keeping pace with Matthews while on a cold streak...while being young and cheaper.

 

[umma gumma]

Lol. Zing. What a burn.

It wasn't meant to be a burn, but ok.

 

[jbeck5]

Terrible Toronto goaltending and bad defensive coverage by playing Reaves (-11) and Klingberg too much.

I think Ottawa will continue to be a bottom feeder and Toronto will get better.



They will have no issues signing Nylander... Toronto has basically no wasted cap on bad players... Ottawa does.

Which players on Ottawa are bad contracts?

 

[notbias]

Ok, then use this year.

Matthews 19 points in 15 games.
Stutzle 17 points in 13 games.

Stutzle is much younger and much cheaper.

You gotta go stutzle.

Funny is sens fans agree that other than a game or two, he hasn't been his best...yet he seems to have no problem keeping pace with Matthews while on a cold streak...while being young and cheaper.

Stutzle - G 3 | A1 7 | A2 7
Matthews - G 13 | A1 5 | A2 1

Not a lot of primary points for Stutzle this year, 10 vs 18.

Matthews is only slightly better in on-ice goal differential but like you pointed out, Toronto is only a +1 and Ottawa is +6, so relative to that, Matthews has helped his team much more.

Looks like Matthews is directly impacting scoring much more and helping his team win more.

 

[umma gumma]

They will have no issues signing Nylander... Toronto has basically no wasted cap on bad players... Ottawa does.

Great! That will leave you lots leftover to shore up that defence.