Ticket/Attendance Discussion: The Sequel

[Buffdog]

Exactly. That’s what Chipman is doing. And he’s personally calling accounts that dropped out to talk about issues they had, etc. If that’s not enough, then I don’t know what is. He’s literally personally calling thousands of people who dropped out to get it right / make it right / figure out what went wrong. He’s not blaming or threatening people.

Someone give him my number lol... we could talk it out

 

[jetsfan15]

I gave a detailed run through in this thread a couple of months ago. Centred around pandemic restrictions. After banning me from entering the arena (which I don't hold against them BTW - they were just trying to run a business in the environment at the time like we all were), they told me I could terminate my contract. BUT they kept my $1500 deposit on the seats because they said it was MY CHOICE... what else was I supposed to do? Pay for tickets THEY wouldn't allow me to use?

So I told them that the second they return my deposit, I'll turn around and reinvest in 1/4 season. They'd rather I just use the $1500 as a credit on the account... but I'm drawing a line here. The returning of the deposit would be the gesture I need to return to the arena.

May seem petty to some, but others will 100% understand

Huh? What they are proposing accomplishes exactly what you are proposing: returning the $1,500 which would be used towards the quarter season seats. They are literally agreeing to return the $1,500 to you, but you just don’t like the manner by which they would do it, even if it accomplishes exactly what you’re proposing: using it towards quarter seats. The fact that you seem to insist that it be a $1,500 cheque to you vs. a credit on your account might be a red flag to them that you wouldn’t in fact buy the quarter season seats (I’m not saying you wouldn’t, but that may be their perspective). There might be legal reasons why they can’t make you buy quarter seats in exchange for a $1,500 cheque (I have no idea on that, but maybe that’s a thing?). Seems like they are being the reasonable ones here on this issue.

 

[Buffdog]

Huh? What they are proposing accomplishes exactly what you are proposing: returning the $1,500 which would be used towards the quarter season seats. They are literally agreeing to return the $1,500 to you, but you just don’t like the manner by which they would do it, even if it accomplishes exactly what you’re proposing: using it towards quarter seats. The fact that you seem to insist that it be a $1,500 cheque to you vs. a credit on your account might be a red flag to them that you wouldn’t in fact buy the quarter season seats (I’m not saying you wouldn’t, but that may be their perspective). There might be legal reasons why they can’t make you buy quarter seats in exchange for a $1,500 cheque (I have no idea on that, but maybe that’s a thing?). Seems like they are being the reasonable ones here on this issue.

Go back and reread my post. I said some people won't understand. You're one of them

My agreement with TNSE was that I give them money and in return, they let me into the arena to watch the Jets. They broke the agreement, not me.

I guess some people just have stronger convictions than others

 

[WpgSteve]

As

Someone give him my number lol... we could talk it out

As I get older, I regret a lot of the times I missed out trying to uphold a principle. It never accomplished anything. When I finally swallowed my pride and went back, all my anger went away. I would have been a lot better off to have let it go sooner.

I'm not telling you what to do. But if you love the team and enjoy seeing it live, you should swallow your pride and go. Life's too short to miss out on principle. You're hurting yourself more than TNSE.

 

[raideralex99]

I don't know the whole story being on the west coast only reading on the internet but if Chipman is threatening the fan base with moving that's bad business practice.
If he wants the old season ticket crowd back he has to entice them to come back not threaten them.
I understand people being bitter and not coming back. I never give my business to any company who mistreats me until they make it right and then I might think about coming back.
Here's a perfect example how to run a business ... I left my phone carrier last month because they would not match the competition rates so I signed up with the competition 7 days later they called and gave me $250 credit and $20 cheaper rate/month than the competition if I come back.
Guess what ... I came back.
I do believe Bettman is coming to talk to the business community more than the people. He did in Calgary to get them a new arena.

 

[Puckatron 3000]

I wonder how much a change in the re-entry policy would help attract more season ticket holders. I understand the downsides of allowing fans to leave and re-enter the arena, but are those worse than the upsides? I don't know.

I do know that a lot of people who vape or smoke find it quite unpleasant to go for multiple hours without, especially when drinks are involved.

 

[Buffdog]

I

I wonder how much a change in the re-entry policy would help attract more season ticket holders. I understand the downsides of allowing fans to leave and re-enter the arena, but are those worse than the upsides? I don't know.

I do know that a lot of people who vape or smoke find it quite unpleasant to go for multiple hours without, especially when drinks are involved.

TNSE should sell ZYN at a 6X markups like everything else lol

 

[Puckatron 3000]

TNSE should sell ZYN at a 6X markups like everything else lol

I had to look up what that is, but yeah they would have quite the "captive" audience.

 

[Walkingtalkingeye]

To the mods who deleted the last few posts, can you PM me as to why? I'm new here and just wondering what the problem was, it was all respectful and on topic.

Then please delete this post.

 

[Snowboy]

Freisen's stuff is such self-indulgent twaddle - sensationalist, personalized and vindictive. I read it only to gather context - eg, once or twice a year.

Yeah i agree!.........all the other media outlets handled it with some degree of sensitivity emphasizing concern, Friesen handled it with glee and vindictiveness.!

 

[Gm0ney]

I don't know the whole story being on the west coast only reading on the internet but if Chipman is threatening the fan base with moving that's bad business practice.
If he wants the old season ticket crowd back he has to entice them to come back not threaten them.
I understand people being bitter and not coming back. I never give my business to any company who mistreats me until they make it right and then I might think about coming back.
Here's a perfect example how to run a business ... I left my phone carrier last month because they would not match the competition rates so I signed up with the competition 7 days later they called and gave me $250 credit and $20 cheaper rate/month than the competition if I come back.
Guess what ... I came back.
I do believe Bettman is coming to talk to the business community more than the people. He did in Calgary to get them a new arena.

The time to figure out a retention strategy was in the leadup to the summer of 2019 when all the P3/P4/P5 seats were coming up and the floor had fallen out of the ticket resale market. And I haven't heard a word from them since I dropped my tickets after 8 years in 2019. They were quite indifferent to the fact that we'd spent around $80,000 plus playoffs, plus concessions, plus merch and we were just walking away. And this scenario played out with thousands of others. How do you treat your loyal customers like that? $10k+ probably more like $12k per season and you're corporate position is "don't let the door hit you on the way out!"

Like in your situation with the phone. What do you spend, $1000 a year? $2000? And Rogers/Telus/Bell are absolutely scrambling to get you back on board. $12k a year and TNSE is like "meh...there's more where that came from!" Except they've found out that there aren't any more where that came from. Just incredible short-sightedness.

But it seems like TNSE doesn't even want to win back their lost season ticket holders (Chipman's PR stunt calling 3 former STHs aside). They're complaining that business isn't doing enough. They point to business support in other cities and how far Winnipeg is behind those numbers (even though the reasons for that are largely of TNSE's own making). I guess they decided businesses are...more reliable STHs? Complain less about price hikes and concessions? I think they've got this backward...you'd do better in Winnipeg selling to individuals. Better for the grassroots "it's our team" feeling, better for atmosphere in the arena.

Although maybe it's an NHL push. There's an old article about the Preds sale in 2007 that bemoans the low level of business STHs:

""While individual fan support has always been strong, we've worked aggressively to increase our local business support since Season Four. We've tried a variety of approaches with minimal success. Our records show today that corporate support for the Nashville Predators makes up about 35% of our season ticket base. The average in other markets is around 60%. During our first two years, approximately 4,000 businesses owned season tickets. Today, only 1,800 businesses have season tickets.""

Sounds like the same song and dance that Chippy is doing now.

And if the league and TNSE think Business STHs is better than individual STHs then that might actually explain some of the ambivalence towards individuals walking away from their seats.

 

[Buffdog]

To the mods who deleted the last few posts, can you PM me as to why? I'm new here and just wondering what the problem was, it was all respectful and on topic.

Then please delete this post.

Not sure what was deleted or why, but the topic of how TNSE handled the pandemic is absolutely on topic. It's not a coincidence that their attendance is down by roughly the same percentage as the population at large that made the same decision I did. Seems like the easiest path forward to put our asses back in seats at CLC is to find a way to mend fences

 

[robertocarlos]

Wait, they were willing to give you that money back as a credit for season tickets and that wasn't enough for you? Bud, you're being insane. If I'm missing some other context please link me to your original post but as I understand it now, I think you're the crazy one.

He should sue them in small claims to get his $1500 back and then he should tell Chipman to go to Hell.

 

[tbcwpg]

To the mods who deleted the last few posts, can you PM me as to why? I'm new here and just wondering what the problem was, it was all respectful and on topic.

Then please delete this post.

Not sure what was deleted or why, but the topic of how TNSE handled the pandemic is absolutely on topic. It's not a coincidence that their attendance is down by roughly the same percentage as the population at large that made the same decision I did. Seems like the easiest path forward to put our asses back in seats at CLC is to find a way to mend fences

When it comes to how it impacted attendance, sure but when it comes to saying how well the vaccine worked or how bad covid was, that's a no go topic on this board specifically.

 

[KingBogo]

Not sure what was deleted or why, but the topic of how TNSE handled the pandemic is absolutely on topic. It's not a coincidence that their attendance is down by roughly the same percentage as the population at large that made the same decision I did. Seems like the easiest path forward to put our asses back in seats at CLC is to find a way to mend fences

Just imagine how low their ST base would be if they made other less popular decisions?

 

[ThinIce61]

Because I'm lazy as f*** and don't want to read pages and pages of what to me is a depressing situation I am wondering " do we take this whole situation seriously"? Is there a legitimate chance that I might see the Jets leave for a second time in my lifetime?

With the way things are in Arizona where the team isn't even playing in an NHL adequate arena how can bettman possible try to force a move by the Jets if that is his intent? I had season tickets for awhile for Jets 1.0 but didn't get for 2.0 mostly because we are 2 hours outside the city now and the logistics of the drive in and back don't make sense.

The salary cap was installed in large part because of the fact small markets were not sustainable when the big dogs could spend through the roof to acquire and sign players but the economy and the contracts IMO have gotten out of hand as owners will spend ridiculous amounts on players since winning is the only option for running a succesful franchise, which is not wrong but at the same time I hear expansion talks when the NHL should be striving to have the current member franchises on solid footing, some of which are not. Bettman may well be coming here in an attempt to help the Jets but he's a weasel in a chicken coop, a fox in the henhouse if you will who cares diddly squat about the Jets and certain other franchises.

We could go to a few games, maybe purchase a mini pack but unless there are a couple thousand out there willing to do the same then all is lost anyways. I remember the "Jets aren't going anywhere statement made by Chipman, paraphrasing the actual words a little but now I wonder with the "threat" of moving if things don't improve, what kind of timeline are we talking about?

The downtown of this city has become awful in the last decade and likely was never the best location but there is a constant attempt to make the "SHED" a "must go" destination for Winnipegs and travellers alike. But really the downtown especially in the area of the arena is like a backed up toilet that can't seem to be cleared. I hope I die before I have to see the jets leave, yet again.

 

[Gm0ney]

Just imagine how low their ST base would be if they made other less popular decisions?

Whether you agree with the decision or not it boils down to:

1. Customer signs STH contract with TNSE and puts down deposit and pays for tickets.
2. TNSE sets a new condition to entry (the contract says they can change terms and conditions, etc.).
3. Customer declines to adhere to new condition and thus won't be allowed entry to games that he's already paid for.
4. TNSE refunds paid tickets, but keeps deposit.

I suppose it's legal according to the terms for them to keep the deposit. Kind of a shitty thing to do though...it's a bit of a bridge burner.

 

[WpgSteve]

Because I'm lazy as f*** and don't want to read pages and pages of what to me is a depressing situation I am wondering " do we take this whole situation seriously"? Is there a legitimate chance that I might see the Jets leave for a second time in my lifetime?

With the way things are in Arizona where the team isn't even playing in an NHL adequate arena how can bettman possible try to force a move by the Jets if that is his intent? I had season tickets for awhile for Jets 1.0 but didn't get for 2.0 mostly because we are 2 hours outside the city now and the logistics of the drive in and back don't make sense.

The salary cap was installed in large part because of the fact small markets were not sustainable when the big dogs could spend through the roof to acquire and sign players but the economy and the contracts IMO have gotten out of hand as owners will spend ridiculous amounts on players since winning is the only option for running a succesful franchise, which is not wrong but at the same time I hear expansion talks when the NHL should be striving to have the current member franchises on solid footing, some of which are not. Bettman may well be coming here in an attempt to help the Jets but he's a weasel in a chicken coop, a fox in the henhouse if you will who cares diddly squat about the Jets and certain other franchises.

We could go to a few games, maybe purchase a mini pack but unless there are a couple thousand out there willing to do the same then all is lost anyways. I remember the "Jets aren't going anywhere statement made by Chipman, paraphrasing the actual words a little but now I wonder with the "threat" of moving if things don't improve, what kind of timeline are we talking about?

The downtown of this city has become awful in the last decade and likely was never the best location but there is a constant attempt to make the "SHED" a "must go" destination for Winnipegs and travellers alike. But really the downtown especially in the area of the arena is like a backed up toilet that can't seem to be cleared. I hope I die before I have to see the jets leave, yet again.

I don't think the team is in imminent danger of relocation. That said, selling 13,000 seats per game (many of them discounted) isn't sustainable. A sufficient number of people have to support the Jets or they'll move eventually.

A lot of people take offense to this for some reason, but it strikes me as simple business reality.

Oddly enough, I'm less concerned about the team than I am for what it says about Winnipeg and the Province overall. I want so badly to believe we have something going for us.

I don't think all hope is lost though. TNSE is working to do what they have to, I believe Manitobans will as well. There was a lot of negativity in the offseason that impacted ticket sales this year. I think there is a good chance TNSE and the fans can right the ship.

 

[KingBogo]

Whether you agree with the decision or not it boils down to:

1. Customer signs STH contract with TNSE and puts down deposit and pays for tickets.
2. TNSE sets a new condition to entry (the contract says they can change terms and conditions, etc.).
3. Customer declines to adhere to new condition and thus won't be allowed entry to games that he's already paid for.
4. TNSE refunds paid tickets, but keeps deposit.

I suppose it's legal according to the terms for them to keep the deposit. Kind of a shitty thing to do though...it's a bit of a bridge burner.

We all signed the same contracts.

 

[jetsmooseice]

If they can easily afford to go to a game, and or buy merchandise and do not, then yes I’m telling you that they are not real fans. Simply because they don’t prioritize support of “their team”.

Literal dictionary definition of fan: a person who has a strong interest in or admiration for a particular person or thing.

Nowhere does it point to a requirement to buy tickets or merchandise. I don't doubt that TNSE doesn't have much use for fans who never spend a dime on anything Jets-related, but that doesn't mean they aren't fans.

The time to figure out a retention strategy was in the leadup to the summer of 2019 when all the P3/P4/P5 seats were coming up and the floor had fallen out of the ticket resale market. And I haven't heard a word from them since I dropped my tickets after 8 years in 2019. They were quite indifferent to the fact that we'd spent around $80,000 plus playoffs, plus concessions, plus merch and we were just walking away. And this scenario played out with thousands of others. How do you treat your loyal customers like that? $10k+ probably more like $12k per season and you're corporate position is "don't let the door hit you on the way out!"

Not even a call? That is shocking. It's hard to imagine spending that much money and not even getting a courtesy call.

By contrast, back in the summer of 2013 when my first kid was born, I gave up my Bomber season tickets just because I didn't want to leave my wife at home on her own all those evenings with a newborn, I decided to stay home and watch on TV instead. This was a pair of P7s, so like maybe a little over $500 value. I still got a polite call from the Bomber ticket office asking me about why I decided to give up the tickets. Seems like a no-brainer to me. (I have since resumed my Bomber season tickets.)

I don't think all hope is lost though. TNSE is working to do what they have to, I believe Manitobans will as well. There was a lot of negativity in the offseason that impacted ticket sales this year. I think there is a good chance TNSE and the fans can right the ship.

Nothing will sell tickets like a long playoff run. And unlike in 2018, there are alternatives to full/half seasons so people who want to get in on things can do it without a huge outlay.

 

[nobody imp0rtant]

Dumb question: If you're not interested in the team, why are you here?

In my case, I came here for the team, but I stayed for the epic meltdowns and internecine warfare. Damn, but this board feeds my Schadenfreude some good hay at times.

 

[Buffdog]

Just imagine how low their ST base would be if they made other less popular decisions?

Yeah, like what?

Anyway, that's hardly the point. Their attendance is down and they want it to go up. Reaching out to people who have had season tickets in the past and trying to mend the fences.that caused them to not want to attend games (whatever those reasons are) seems like a reasonable step to take

They essentially said to me "what do we have to do to get yplou back in the rink?". I gave them a very specific answer. They outright said that they would not do it. So here we are

 

[Buffdog]

Whether you agree with the decision or not it boils down to:

1. Customer signs STH contract with TNSE and puts down deposit and pays for tickets.
2. TNSE sets a new condition to entry (the contract says they can change terms and conditions, etc.).
3. Customer declines to adhere to new condition and thus won't be allowed entry to games that he's already paid for.
4. TNSE refunds paid tickets, but keeps deposit.

I suppose it's legal according to the terms for them to keep the deposit. Kind of a shitty thing to do though...it's a bit of a bridge burner.

This is exactly it

TNSE made their bed with regards to people like me, and now they are complaining about having to be in it

All it would take is a simple "hey, those were crazy times, we did what we needed to do to stay afloat... we understand why you feel the way you do about us keeping your deposit, so we've changed our minds and here it is back. We'd love to see you in the stands again one day"

I'd be a season ticket holder for life

 

[Mad Dog Tannen]

I’m on team buffdog.

We all signed the same contracts.

What you can do and what you should do are 2 different things depending on what your desired outcome is.

 

[DeepFrickinValue]

If someone can’t afford to go then that’s one thing. But if they can afford to go but choose to spend their entertainment dollars on something else, and have never been to a game, then no, they’re not a fan.

Not sure what to make of this comment.