Just a comment on downtown atmosphere. I think its a Canada wide problem. I live in Vancouver and the downtown night life/energy has been crushed by Covid. Add that to inflation and cost of living issues and the difference is astronomical. Downtown Vancouver is really quiet and really boring.
Ticket/Attendance Discussion: The Sequel
- Thread starter nobody imp0rtant
- Start date
I work for a Fortune 500 company that used to have a Corporate Suite for the Moose games. When the Jets came back, the company had Season Tickets in the Bud Zone. Then corporate policy changed and we are no longer able to give tickets away as incentives to our clients. This sucked for me, because the year of the change, the employees were given the tickets instead, and I was able to see a couple of games...
As for fans buying tickets, I go back to the Jets 1.0 era. If the team played poorly, no one would go, but if the team put in an effort, the place was packed. It didn't matter if the Jets won or lost, as long as the effort was there, people went to the games.
That's what Chipman seems to forget. The on ice product matters. Why would I want to spend a couple of hundred bucks to go see a team that's just going through the motions? If they're playing like they care, then I'll care. It really is just that simple. Just like when the Jets 2.0 came back, the results weren't great, but the team put in the effort and the crowd was electric. It makes all the difference in the world. At least that's my humble opinion anyway...
As for fans buying tickets, I go back to the Jets 1.0 era. If the team played poorly, no one would go, but if the team put in an effort, the place was packed. It didn't matter if the Jets won or lost, as long as the effort was there, people went to the games.
That's what Chipman seems to forget. The on ice product matters. Why would I want to spend a couple of hundred bucks to go see a team that's just going through the motions? If they're playing like they care, then I'll care. It really is just that simple. Just like when the Jets 2.0 came back, the results weren't great, but the team put in the effort and the crowd was electric. It makes all the difference in the world. At least that's my humble opinion anyway...
tbcwpg
Moderator
- Jan 25, 2011
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We don't know the level of involvement Chipman has in hockey ops, but even if he steps back and it's at 0, the team is still going to have it's seasons where the team is not good. Unlike 2011-2017, there's no honeymoon period to fill the building just because there's a team.
The cap is going to go up by a good amount in the next couple of years once all the escrow stuff is done, and there's going to have to be a balance between "blue collar" prices and a price that will be able to put a competitive product on the ice. They already have the 3rd lowest average attendance in the league, and even at 100% capacity, they'd still be in the bottom 5.
I work for a Fortune 500 company that used to have a Corporate Suite for the Moose games. When the Jets came back, the company had Season Tickets in the Bud Zone. Then corporate policy changed and we are no longer able to give tickets away as incentives to our clients. This sucked for me, because the year of the change, the employees were given the tickets instead, and I was able to see a couple of games...
As for fans buying tickets, I go back to the Jets 1.0 era. If the team played poorly, no one would go, but if the team put in an effort, the place was packed. It didn't matter if the Jets won or lost, as long as the effort was there, people went to the games.
That's what Chipman seems to forget. The on ice product matters. Why would I want to spend a couple of hundred bucks to go see a team that's just going through the motions? If they're playing like they care, then I'll care. It really is just that simple. Just like when the Jets 2.0 came back, the results weren't great, but the team put in the effort and the crowd was electric. It makes all the difference in the world. At least that's my humble opinion anyway...
The proff is in the pudding. You see it with how the crowd reacts at games. When the team busts its ass the crowd is into it and tends to give the team a standing ovation. When the team is listless you can hear a pin drop.
The blue collar mentality comes into play with how the fans expect the team to play. I think most are ok paying the prices if they feel the team is providing value.
cbcwpg
Registered User
Apr 2023: Jets co-owner Chipman assures fans that ticket-buying campaign not a threat to leave city
Winnipeg Jets co-owner Mark Chipman stickhandled through fear and anger Wednesday over what some fans perceived as a veiled threat the team could leave the city without a boost in ticket sales. “I don’t want people to be alarmed or concerned,” Chipman said in a sit-down interview with the Free...
www.winnipegfreepress.com
“I don’t want people to be alarmed or concerned,” Chipman said in a sit-down interview with the Free Press.
“That is the last thing that this is. I know (that kind of reaction) is unavoidable and I know that the history is deeply ingrained, but we are not going anywhere.”
Chipman acknowledged there was plenty of concern about navigating the reaction the fan base might have to a pitch for more support. But he said rather than a threat to the future of the franchise, the campaign is just the normal course of affairs for a commercial entity with 300 full-time employees dealing with the cyclical nature of business.
They figure the pandemic cost the team about 2,000 subscribers and then they lost another 1,000 — about 10 per cent of their base — through the normal churn rate.
DannyGallivan
Your world frightens and confuses me
Not to mention addicts and panhandlers have made the downtown disgusting, shady and unsafe. The city is pushing out people/ families with expendable income away as they tip toe around the addict and beggar problem. Portage Abe is supposed to be the highlight of the city, now look at the area in front of the Air Canada building… it’s enough to keep anybody away from that area.
scelaton
Registered User
- Jul 5, 2012
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Agree with these sentiments but the key is defining what is value. In the early years, it was mostly just having an NHL-calibre hockey team, but watching the GST line really appealed to Wpg blue-collar values. Over the ensuing 12 years, we have come to expect that the GST work ethic from a more skilled lineup should translate into better results. When we stopped seeing the effort, that's when the value proposition turned sour and fans turned away.
Maurice walked away when he realized he could not get that out of one or two of the team's key players. He had stopped trying to do so a year or two earlier. Bowness has struggled mightily this year to do it consistently.
As a fan, I still hope they go on a playoff run, but after the season is over, there needs to be a reckoning. And it does not start with the fan base or business. It starts with Chipman looking in the mirror and asking the hard questions:
"What prevented us from seeing this coming and, when it did, what prevented us from acting? Was it the GM? Or was it me...?"
Well said. To me it's like complacency settled into all aspects of the org. We saw it on the ice, in hockey opps etc.
You have to continue to try to improve amd it seemed like everyone just rested on their laurels after our run in 2018.
So that is Mark's challenge, he needs to figure out how he can put a hungry product on the ice and keep it engaged. Thay inturn will keep fans engaged.
tbcwpg
Moderator
- Jan 25, 2011
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That only gets you so far. Effort without winning gets old pretty quick.
Jetfaninflorida
Southernmost Jet Fan
Not sure if this whole Forever Winnipeg campaign was a complete PR screw up, or exactly the reaction that they wanted. It doesn't take a genius to see that this line:
Our commitment to keeping the Jets in Winnipeg, forever, has never been stronger. But it takes all of us.
Would trigger reaction.
The strategically placed 'BUT' (that I underlined and italicized) creates the condition to 'Our commitment to keeping the Jets in Winnipeg'
They could have softened it using 'And', or they could have separated this into two sentences. As stated, the word 'But' basically negates or conditions the first part of the sentence with the second. So now they are in the press saying hey this is just a normal season ticket drive. Nothing to see here.
Basically they have now laid down the public 'I told you so' if they decide to move the team in the future. Not that I think that is that plan. They are making all kinds of investments around the arena and the Jets are the anchor tenant.
And so that's where I am on the fence here - was this a screw up, or are they getting exactly the response/noise/discussion/attention that they wanted?
Our commitment to keeping the Jets in Winnipeg, forever, has never been stronger. But it takes all of us.
Would trigger reaction.
The strategically placed 'BUT' (that I underlined and italicized) creates the condition to 'Our commitment to keeping the Jets in Winnipeg'
They could have softened it using 'And', or they could have separated this into two sentences. As stated, the word 'But' basically negates or conditions the first part of the sentence with the second. So now they are in the press saying hey this is just a normal season ticket drive. Nothing to see here.
Basically they have now laid down the public 'I told you so' if they decide to move the team in the future. Not that I think that is that plan. They are making all kinds of investments around the arena and the Jets are the anchor tenant.
And so that's where I am on the fence here - was this a screw up, or are they getting exactly the response/noise/discussion/attention that they wanted?
Not as old underachieving floaters get. All you can ask of any person is to try their best and work hard. Can that be said of this team ?
Model the Bruins. I know we are in a different situation but I believe that model is likely to be more successful in this market than a skilled soft perimeter team.
Having every home game on TV , even though the Jets get TV revenue, is also a factor. People can sit at home, not go out in -30c weather and not spend any money. It's definitely a factor in my mind but Covid and the economy is the main issue. One thing i do hate is how you are locked inside once you go in , i know it's winter but we do have some nice mild days in the winter and going out to get some air would be nice .
tbcwpg
Moderator
- Jan 25, 2011
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Yeah, we should model the Bruins. All we have to do is draft a full line of Hall of Fame talent, find another Hellebuyck, and then have other top end talent waive NTCs to come here and sign team friendly contracts.
The Bruins model works in a place like Boston, not Winnipeg. And if you meant play style - they aren't the big bad Bruins anymore.
- Jun 8, 2011
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The heart of the team left with Big Buff, and Chipman and company have yet to figure out how to get it back. True North should have given #33 a stake in the team for doing their job for them.
scelaton
Registered User
- Jul 5, 2012
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Our talent level is fine, our contracts are reasonable and we have Helle. Most of the posts above are merely asking that the effort level and intensity be consistent. Better results will follow. Perhaps you are just being devil's advocate, but it is really not much to ask.
The customers are right in this case, so it's hardly the time to insinuate that THEY have to try harder.
You are missing the point. The Bruins have model and they live and die by it. Plus they aren't exactly big players in the trade or ufa market.
They find and draft players that fit their model. Everyone seems to shake their heads at Bruins draft picks but they sure seem to do well. They play and having been playing structured 2 way hockey for over a decade.
So what is our model ? Soft perimeter hockey that only works when its a soft perimeter game. That is our top players style. We love drafting them roslo, petan, ehlers,Connor,Lambert just name a few. Its not working.
We are very unlikely to be able to build a high skill, high scoring team in this market. Because as you say we cant sign or trade for them. We need to play a solid structured game like the Bruins and find players that fit the model.
tbcwpg
Moderator
- Jan 25, 2011
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We have Hellebuyck for one more year. We'll see how much longer we have him for.
The effort is bad, sure. People keep framing this as an either/or situation when it's not. People don't want to see a bad team, sure. My suspicion is that they won't pay to see a bad team for years either, no matter the effort level.
Also the customer is always right is not true. TNSE will have to find a way to navigate through this.
The Bruins aren't big players in the trade or UFA market? They haven't needed to with all the talent they have up front and on the backend, but they've traded for Hampus Lindholm (who re-signed for 8 more years), Taylor Hall, just this year they got Orlov.
The Bruins didn't have a model and draft for it. They drafted hall of fame level talent and made it work. We don't have anyone close to Marchand-Pastrnak-Bergeron. No one has shaken their heads at the Bruins since the Connor draft, and they still got DeBrusk from it.
We're getting into the weeds here but you're significantly underselling the freedom the Bruins had by having that top line for years and years.
kanadalainen
A pint of dark matter, please.
Yep, especially in bargain-mad Winnipeg.
But -> the current paradigm is very different than it was even 10 years ago wrt to gate revenue. Streaming live games (every game of the year for every team) is widely available, ubiquitous should everyone choose to use it. The old notion of a local blackout is essentially dead and/or becoming completely irrelevant.
More than ever, every market needs to sell the idea that *attending* games is much more fun and a richer experience than it is watching at home.
It would be cool if they could shut down one of the blocks beside the arena during game nights and use it as an expanded outdoor patio for eating/drinking/getting some air on not-abysmally-cold nights. Sometimes the arena just feels too cramped.
I wouldn't put Ehlers in the soft perimeter player category, not even close actually, Connor yes. I think the Jets have done a good job with drafting , coaching has a factor in how they play. Bowness just might have found the right lines now because we were anything but soft in that Minnesota game.
LA has this, i know weather is a factor but you could put some heaters all-around this area. The one in LA was unreal, music, drinks, it was like a Manitoba social out there.
They could just lower ticket prices.
All these complaints are minor compared to the main issue; the $115.00 minimum it costs for two people to see the same entertainment event that happens 41 times a year.
All these complaints are minor compared to the main issue; the $115.00 minimum it costs for two people to see the same entertainment event that happens 41 times a year.
Downtown has been that way forever.
It was dodgy as hell even before Portage Place opened.
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