Ticket/Attendance Discussion: The Sequel

[Tom ServoMST3K]

They really need to expand and improve the Skywalk system to have a feasible "arena district" in our climate.

Can do what LA did, Vegas and others....but we can't do it outside when half the games are played during a season when almost no one wants to be outside.

Ultimately think this will be key to get people living downtown too. The more you can do (get to your car, get to work, get to the game, get to a restaurant) without having to step outside and wait to cross at 3-4 intersections in -30 the more likely people will be to head downtown.

If the city can make transit options more attractive to people living in the city, I think that will do a lot to help people who have to drive to the game as well. Less pressure on parking and a better downtown environment.

 

[Brominator]

I'm a little shocked at the suggestion that the arena shouldn't be downtown and even back at polo park. That was freaking disaster getting out after a game, walking across wide open parking lots mid-winter. Downtown is a far superior location. Central, with lots of options in the skywalk system to get into the building and more routes in different directions cutting down on traffic. Everytime I've been its been smooth sailing once we're out of one of the underground lots. Sure the arena itself is a little cramped, but IMO downtown is the way to go

Agree 100%. Been a season ticket holder since day one... I've been to well over 150 games. I think I've paid for parking twice ever. I park on the street downtown within close walking distance of a building attached via skywalk. Getting into and out of the game is always easy, comfortable, and traffic flows nicely once I'm driving. Downtown is definitely the best place for this arena.

 

[pegcity]

Once again, we come back to the main issue; ticket prices.

Not everyone will be happy with the arena location.
The product is fine this year.
They've improved the concourse considerably and continue to do so.
I'm not sure what you could do about pre-game entertainment when it's cold outside.

It's amazing to me that the business model of selling the same event 41 times a year at concert ticket prices works.

 

[GaryPoppins]

Once again, we come back to the main issue; ticket prices.

Not everyone will be happy with the arena location.
The product is fine this year.
They've improved the concourse considerably and continue to do so.
I'm not sure what you could do about pre-game entertainment when it's cold outside.

It's amazing to me that the business model of selling the same event 41 times a year at concert ticket prices works.

My family and I make over the median household income and life feels like death by a thousand cuts financially. Everything, and I mean EVERYTHING has gone up. Went and bought a stick of deodorant and it was almost $10.

Inflation is kicking out butts and results in us not having nearly as much play money so tickets are low on the list, likely the same scenario for many.

 

[DannyGallivan]

Went to my first game in about four years this afternoon. Bought two tickets off a buddy for face value (172 bucks for the two of them). 14 dollars for a bag of popcorn and an ice tea. 10 bucks to park. That’s almost 200 bucks for me and my son and I didn’t even have a beer! For comparison, my latest hydro bill is 140 bucks.

I could have accepted that if it weren’t for the abysmal effort the Jets put out in the first period against the Ducks. Fortunately they turned things around, or who knows when I ever would have returned.

If the Jets expect middle class folks to spend a minimum of 200 bucks for a couple of seats, they can’t afford to mail in poor efforts. Ever.

 

[DannyGallivan]

My family and I make over the median household income and life feels like death by a thousand cuts financially. Everything, and I mean EVERYTHING has gone up. Went and bought a stick of deodorant and it was almost $10.

Inflation is kicking out butts and results in us not having nearly as much play money so tickets are low on the list, likely the same scenario for many.

It may be as simple as this. Going to one game is like a once in a year event for most families. And what if a family of four went to that Columbus fiasco at a minimum of 500 bucks? When would you see them again?

 

[DeepFrickinValue]

They should allow superstore to manage ticket prices.

 

[Buffdog]

I'm sure TNSE is aware of the role inflation is having on people's spending patterns. Rising interest rates must be putting a dent into Birchwood's new car sales.

$9 for three heads of lettuce. This trend isn't feeling transitory either. BUT at least all the markets are in a similar boat

 

[WpgSteve]

I went this afternoon. Bought tickets 14 rows up just off center ice for $100 each on Fans First. Upper bowl seats were listed in the $30 range. People can't complain about that.

 

[Tom ServoMST3K]

Yeah, Stubhub 300s for the Panthers are around 40 bucks - A few listed for under 35.

It's weird for me, because I watch at least 2 junior hockey games a week for work, so I really don't feel like dropping any money to watch hockey, lol. And I would feel better about risking stubhub if I didn't have to drive an hour to get to the game.

But the value option is out there for people to take.

 

[JetsNut]

Been a season ticket holder since they came back. The prices suck. The parking sucks. The concourse sucks. The food sucks. The bathrooms suck. The people who crowd me and lord over my seat suck.

I much prefer watching the games at home. Short of a new arena, not sure how to fix it, either.

Novelty glossed over a lot of those issues, but novelty is long gone. Seriously considering not renewing next year.

My 2 cents.

Been to other arenas and honestly we

Been a season ticket holder since they came back. The prices suck. The parking sucks. The concourse sucks. The food sucks. The bathrooms suck. The people who crowd me and lord over my seat suck.

I much prefer watching the games at home. Short of a new arena, not sure how to fix it, either.

Novelty glossed over a lot of those issues, but novelty is long gone. Seriously considering not renewing next year.

My 2 cents.

Been to several arenas in Canadá including Bell Centre. I can tell you that ours is oretty good comparatively. Without our support, we will be facing a Save The Jets campaign in the future.

 

[cbcwpg]

Anyone who thinks attendance is a Winnipeg problem needs to broaden their news gathering. It's happening everywhere.

Over the last 10 seasons the NHL has averaged 10 -13 cities having 100% capacity every season. This season... there are 4 teams that have 100% capacity... just 4. Wash, Nash, Vegas, and Seattle. And of those 4 teams, 2 still have that new car smell. Take Seattle and Vegas out of the equation and you have just 2 long term franchises at 100% capacity. None of the original six are at 100% capacity.

Attendance trends from 2012-13.

Major League Baseball (MLB): minus-5.88%
National Basketball Association (NBA): plus-2.59%
National Football League (NFL): minus-1.98%
Major League Soccer (MLS): plus-17.56% * mainly from expansion
National Hockey League (NHL) : minus-1.28%

The cost of just being able to live keeps going up, so the first place where people are going to cut costs are entertainment costs. It's no surprise attendance is down.

 

[Gordon112358]

I was part of a season ticket group and was buying 10 single seats each year. I decided to drop out this year as everything around me was going up and I just wasn't comfortable putting out $88 a seat for an upper bowl ticket.
I have been going since the inception but don't have a strong desire to go now. I still enjoy it but it's not something I NEED to do now.
Unfortunately NHL ticket prices are for the upper class. Always have been. I don't see that changing either. You either pay or you don't go. This team will survive long term since the owner is the wealthiest man in Canada and the wealthiest owner in the league.
I worry about this team only if it has several years of poor results. We are fortunate that they have been good enough the last few years to at least ice a competitive team. Just imagine if we went through what Edmonton had to endure with 10 years of no playoff hockey. That's a litmus test I really don't want to have to go through.

 

[jetsmooseice]

Once again, we come back to the main issue; ticket prices.

Not everyone will be happy with the arena location.
The product is fine this year.
They've improved the concourse considerably and continue to do so.
I'm not sure what you could do about pre-game entertainment when it's cold outside.

It's amazing to me that the business model of selling the same event 41 times a year at concert ticket prices works.

This is the bottom line, really. All of those quibbles about arena location, tight seats, crowded concourses, etc. are probably not a big deal if you are paying $40 a ticket. But when you're paying $150, $200 or more a pop, those things gnaw at you. Let's face it, when you're dropping $400+ on a night out for a couple, you are probably sensitive to those kinds of annoyances.

People can cloak it in all kinds of different concerns, but it always boils down to cost/value for money. I mean, we'd all love to have centre ice season tickets, but how many of us can afford it without having to think too hard about it? Maybe 1% of the population? And not all of the people in that segment of the population are that into hockey to the point where they are willing to spend thousands of dollars a year on tickets.

Anyone who thinks attendance is a Winnipeg problem needs to broaden their news gathering. It's happening everywhere.

Over the last 10 seasons the NHL has averaged 10 -13 cities having 100% capacity every season. This season... there are 4 teams that have 100% capacity... just 4. Wash, Nash, Vegas, and Seattle. And of those 4 teams, 2 still have that new car smell. Take Seattle and Vegas out of the equation and you have just 2 long term franchises at 100% capacity. None of the original six are at 100% capacity.

Attendance trends from 2012-13.

Major League Baseball (MLB): minus-5.88%
National Basketball Association (NBA): plus-2.59%
National Football League (NFL): minus-1.98%
Major League Soccer (MLS): plus-17.56% * mainly from expansion
National Hockey League (NHL) : minus-1.28%

The cost of just being able to live keeps going up, so the first place where people are going to cut costs are entertainment costs. It's no surprise attendance is down.

Yeah, that's a good point. Although it has been pointed out that a 100% sell out crowd tells the team owners that tickets are underpriced. Consistent 95-99% crowds tell you that you are probably extracting the maximum amount of revenue out of the audience. Which is, for the owners, what it's all about... despite what they may say about the Stanley Cup

 

[Gm0ney]

Jets @ 15,000 x $100/ticket x 42 home games = $63,000,000
Jets @ 13,000 x $100/ticket x 42 home games = $54,600,000

Just ball-park, but the difference is relatively insignificant if it's 13k vs 15k in the arena - not even $10M/season (and I'm not accounting for ticket price and concession increases which exceeded inflation for at least 10 of the last 12 years, so they're making more at the gate now than in 2011-12...probably similar in 2001 dollars, not including CDN vs USD devaluation since then).

Anyway, the NHL is slowly moving closer to the NFL model of not really needing a single fan in the stands to break even. If the NHL business model allows the Coyotes to survive for a few years in a 5000 seat college rink, I think the Jets will be okay.

 

[blues10]

It may be as simple as this. Going to one game is like a once in a year event for most families. And what if a family of four went to that Columbus fiasco at a minimum of 500 bucks? When would you see them again?

That was a disaster. Took the wife kids and in laws. Spent about $840 on tickets. We do it just once per season so will will be back next year. I am still a season ticket holder with 2 shared seats. I find the popcorn and beer discount pretty good and have been buying extra tickets to games at season seat holder prices.

 

[Tom ServoMST3K]

Anyone who thinks attendance is a Winnipeg problem needs to broaden their news gathering. It's happening everywhere.

Over the last 10 seasons the NHL has averaged 10 -13 cities having 100% capacity every season. This season... there are 4 teams that have 100% capacity... just 4. Wash, Nash, Vegas, and Seattle. And of those 4 teams, 2 still have that new car smell. Take Seattle and Vegas out of the equation and you have just 2 long term franchises at 100% capacity. None of the original six are at 100% capacity.

Attendance trends from 2012-13.

Major League Baseball (MLB): minus-5.88%
National Basketball Association (NBA): plus-2.59%
National Football League (NFL): minus-1.98%
Major League Soccer (MLS): plus-17.56% * mainly from expansion
National Hockey League (NHL) : minus-1.28%

The cost of just being able to live keeps going up, so the first place where people are going to cut costs are entertainment costs. It's no surprise attendance is down.

Teams have decided to prioritize gate revenue over sellouts/atmosphere.

 

[BigZ65]

Once again, we come back to the main issue; ticket prices.

Not everyone will be happy with the arena location.
The product is fine this year.
They've improved the concourse considerably and continue to do so.
I'm not sure what you could do about pre-game entertainment when it's cold outside.

It's amazing to me that the business model of selling the same event 41 times a year at concert ticket prices works.

This is an industry wide issue. I’ve been to MLB and NFL games in a few markets just before Covid and in the year “after” so to speak.

NFL game it’s basically $300 USD to set foot in the stadium per person.

MLB you can find some steep discounts depending on the city/day of the week but the basic prices are absurd and clearly too much.

 

[jetsmooseice]

NFL game it’s basically $300 USD to set foot in the stadium per person.

Totally depends on where. $300? Dallas, maybe. But I just checked a random NFL city (Indianapolis) on Stubhub and tickets start at $32 Canadian.

 

[DeepFrickinValue]

I went tobogganing with my kid and his friends by my house yesterday and the went to the arena to watch 10 year olds play.

My kids had far more fun watching the game and playing in the stands then they would’ve at any NHL game.

The parents enjoyed it as well just chitchatting the whole time. $3 French fries and $1.50 drinks.

 

[Jets 31]

Going tomorrow night 56 bucks with a beer, upper deck but there really isn't a terrible seat in the Arena because of it not being too big. 56 bucks with a beer is a great deal considering the beer alone is 20 bucks. I asked for a white russian instead of the beer but the cheap bastards wouldn't go for it.

 

[Eyeseeing]

I went tobogganing with my kid and his friends by my house yesterday and the went to the arena to watch 10 year olds play.

My kids had far more fun watching the game and playing in the stands then they would’ve at any NHL game.

The parents enjoyed it as well just chitchatting the whole time. $3 French fries and $1.50 drinks.

Did anyone get pushed down any stairs

 

[BigZ65]

Totally depends on where. $300? Dallas, maybe. But I just checked a random NFL city (Indianapolis) on Stubhub and tickets start at $32 Canadian.

Through re-sale for a crappy opponent maybe. Cheapest I could find for Indy is $55 USD to sit in the last half of the 600 level.

I couldn't believe how expensive games were in Glendale and Minneapolis while attending. And many of the people in there had paid for seat licenses too.

And then MLB has such high basic prices but such deep discounts. The Jets are kind of heading that way. Not really sure the incentive to be a STH anymore unless the team is great with priority for playoffs. Feel like most games I'm paying double what the single gamers around me are paying, when realistically to keep me engaged as a STH it should be reversed.

 

[DeepFrickinValue]

Did anyone get pushed down any stairs

No but the one kid did pretend he was the Iron Sheik, and tried to give The Paw.

 

[Zhamnov5GoalGame]

Gave up my seats during the 2020 shutdown. Half my share partners bailed on me and we couldn’t get them replaced by the deadline to keep the tickets. I had a son in 2019 so the wife is all on board for not spending money on 20’ish tickets a season.

The key is for ticket groups to expand. If your 2/4/6/8 group of people can’t sustain the costs try to expand to double that number. If I ever buy back into a group it will be for less tickets.

We don’t need 15k people going to 40+ games, we need a couple of hundred thousand people dividing that up.

I’m surprised that Boston isn’t seeing full houses with their hot home streak.